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Tensa
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Posted - 2008.12.12 13:57:00 -
[1]
I have made this argument before(about a year ago) and the facts cannot be disputed. So I'm bringing up the problem again because it's still not fixed. I will quote myself from a previous posting to start:
"Ok, here's my argument:
Ogre I need and benefit from(damage-wise) heavy drone operation, drone interfacing
Garde I(gallente sentry drone) benefit from sentry drone interface and drone interfacing
Ogre II need and benefit from heavy drone operation, drone interfacing, and gallente drone specialization
Garde II benefit from sentry drone interface and drone interfacing..... wait a second...something is missing.
CCP please fix. It only makes sense and it should be simple. Also don't forget to make gallente drone specilization part of the requirements too. Of course this problem is far all the t2 sentry drones. Discuss.
*Dons flame ******ent gear*"
For the whole story and weak retorts others have already done: here's the original posting: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=573258
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Poba
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.12.12 15:37:00 -
[2]
/signed
drones need love and drone users need more options to increase drone effectiveness. here is a small list of improvements they need
implants that affect drones damage/rof module for ships removal of drone targeting (they are ordinace, should have to be attacked with smartbombs) removal of NPCs attacking drones( no one is going to use faction drones when NPCs pop a bil+ of them on your first DC while NPCing)
pretty much they need to be brought inline with all the other weapon typs in terms of ability to improve aside from base skills. drone specialized ships suffer from split bonuses to drones and guns, give us a pure droneboat (and try not to kill it like u did the myrm)
~Welcome to the internet, where the men are men, the women are men, and the children are FBI agents~ |
Kalintos Tyl
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.12.12 18:06:00 -
[3]
i think t2 willl bring ship parts for drone boats
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Straight Chillen
Gallente Solar Wind
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Posted - 2008.12.12 22:05:00 -
[4]
But you missed something here. You can use ALL T2 sentry drones by having sentry drones to 5. whereas T2 heavys u need to respective racial drone spec to.
and quite frankly i prefer it this way. It seems to me you just want more damage out of the sentries.(+2% from racial spec) Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Washell Olivaw
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Posted - 2008.12.13 08:37:00 -
[5]
Let sleeping dogs lie.
They'd probably reduce the base damage of the sentries by 10% when they tack the spec skills on them.
Originally by: Signature Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
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Tensa
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Posted - 2008.12.13 09:51:00 -
[6]
No its not about the damage. I want sentry drones fixed. Why do T1 heavy drones do less damage than t1 sentries, but t2 heavy drones do more damage than t2 sentries? Because it's broken. It would be a very simple fix.
Make t2 sentries require the racial drone spec along with sentry drone 5. Doing this gives the extra damage from specialization like it does for heavy drones.
T2 sentries are large drone types requiring 25m3 bandwidth, so it should require racial drone spec 4, like their t2 heavy drone counterparts. Easy.
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Odizzido
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Posted - 2008.12.13 14:54:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Odizzido on 13/12/2008 14:56:07
Originally by: Poba /signed
drones need love and drone users need more options to increase drone effectiveness. here is a small list of improvements they need
implants that affect drones damage/rof module for ships removal of drone targeting (they are ordinace, should have to be attacked with smartbombs) removal of NPCs attacking drones( no one is going to use faction drones when NPCs pop a bil+ of them on your first DC while NPCing)
pretty much they need to be brought inline with all the other weapon typs in terms of ability to improve aside from base skills. drone specialized ships suffer from split bonuses to drones and guns, give us a pure droneboat (and try not to kill it like u did the myrm)
As a drone user and a mission running, it is 100% true I will never ever use really expensive drones on missions because on the first disconnect they will all die.
However I can't agree with getting rid of being able to target them. However if you can target drones, you should also be able to target other weapons systems as well. Of course we couldn't actually destroy them as that would upset eve way too much....but perhaps disable them and require them to be repaired or something. Also NPC's should never attack weapons systems because then all you would do is fly back to stations repairing during a mission and that would just be annoying.
I am on the fence with NPC's attacking drones though. If they were to make it so that drones are not attacked on disconnect, perhaps this would be enough for people to use more expensive ones(are there even more expensive ones out there?...that are better I mean).
edit---------- Just thought that in PVP if two people attacked eachothers weapons till only one person had any left, there is no way they would be able to out damage even a weak tank with like 1-2 weapons left. You would need to be able to target other modules as well.
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Mes Ren
No Trademark Notoriety Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.13 15:56:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Odizzido Edited by: Odizzido on 13/12/2008 14:56:07
Originally by: Poba /signed
drones need love and drone users need more options to increase drone effectiveness. here is a small list of improvements they need
implants that affect drones damage/rof module for ships removal of drone targeting (they are ordinace, should have to be attacked with smartbombs) removal of NPCs attacking drones( no one is going to use faction drones when NPCs pop a bil+ of them on your first DC while NPCing)
pretty much they need to be brought inline with all the other weapon typs in terms of ability to improve aside from base skills. drone specialized ships suffer from split bonuses to drones and guns, give us a pure droneboat (and try not to kill it like u did the myrm)
As a drone user and a mission running, it is 100% true I will never ever use really expensive drones on missions because on the first disconnect they will all die.
However I can't agree with getting rid of being able to target them. However if you can target drones, you should also be able to target other weapons systems as well. Of course we couldn't actually destroy them as that would upset eve way too much....but perhaps disable them and require them to be repaired or something. Also NPC's should never attack weapons systems because then all you would do is fly back to stations repairing during a mission and that would just be annoying.
I am on the fence with NPC's attacking drones though. If they were to make it so that drones are not attacked on disconnect, perhaps this would be enough for people to use more expensive ones(are there even more expensive ones out there?...that are better I mean).
edit---------- Just thought that in PVP if two people attacked eachothers weapons till only one person had any left, there is no way they would be able to out damage even a weak tank with like 1-2 weapons left. You would need to be able to target other modules as well.
Sure thing, just give turret and missile users a button to "assign" their weapons to someone else to use when we get jammed. ________________________
No Trademark -- Mes Ren, Mes Builder -- -- CEO --
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Poba
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.12.13 21:49:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Mes Ren
Originally by: Odizzido Edited by: Odizzido on 13/12/2008 14:56:07
Sure thing, just give turret and missile users a button to "assign" their weapons to someone else to use when we get jammed.
fail troll assist/guard are by no means a equal tradeoff for all the options gun/missle users have.
i simply think that for drone users(specifically ppl who use drones as primary weps) there should be more options for upgrading drones performance aside from just skilling up higher.
and destructable drones leave a drone specialized ship with zero offensive power in situations where you have to make a hasty retreat or when ppl attack drones that doesnt happen when your flying a turret/missle ship as you bring your weps with you, try locking a missle while its flying, you cant, i just think drones should be the same way. their hitpoints are already rediculously low light drones can barely handle 1-2 rounds of a large smart bomb anyways
~Welcome to the internet, where the men are men, the women are men, and the children are FBI agents~ |
Random Womble
Minmatar Master Miners
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Posted - 2008.12.14 03:25:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Random Womble on 14/12/2008 03:29:17 Edited by: Random Womble on 14/12/2008 03:26:42 Edited by: Random Womble on 14/12/2008 03:25:30
Originally by: Poba
Originally by: Mes Ren
Originally by: Odizzido Edited by: Odizzido on 13/12/2008 14:56:07 ........
Sure thing, just give turret and missile users a button to "assign" their weapons to someone else to use when we get jammed.
fail troll assist/guard are by no means a equal tradeoff for all the options gun/missle users have.
i simply think that for drone users(specifically ppl who use drones as primary weps) there should be more options for upgrading drones performance aside from just skilling up higher.
and destructable drones leave a drone specialized ship with zero offensive power in situations where you have to make a hasty retreat or when ppl attack drones that doesnt happen when your flying a turret/missle ship as you bring your weps with you, try locking a missle while its flying, you cant, i just think drones should be the same way. their hitpoints are already rediculously low light drones can barely handle 1-2 rounds of a large smart bomb anyways
Hence why drone ships have bigger drone bays to hold spares, oh and dont forget dominix and ishtar actually have enough space to fit 5 sentrys, 5 heavys, 5 mediums, 5 lights + (if in a domi or with HAC 5) 50m3 for other spares of your choice. how many other ships can choose to fit close range, long range, anti small ship and anti med ship as they want during combat. Oh and dont forget you have auto aggro so atleast if you jammed or damped theres some chance of you being able to kill something. Drones can be shot but missiles can have defenders shoot them down (in theory i know its never used but still) and turrets can get totally screwed over by tracking disruptors.
Plus those free high slots you guys have to fit with remote reps, smartbombs, nos/neut or god forbid guns as you wish without sacrificing you main portion of damage.
Drones have their own unique advantages and disadvantages the are fine i fly drone ships, turet ships and missile ships alot of my friends are gallente and heavy drone users they have no problems with them infact they seem to agree the damage and tracking on T2 sentrys is pretty awesome allthings considered.
Third edit after sorting out the mess of quotes: Why the hell are you shooting BSs (must be that or caps as you mention a LARGE smartie) with light drones anyway unless your in a smaller drone boat eg a vexor or something in which case your not likely to be killing a BS solo anyway.
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Poba
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.12.14 21:56:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Random Womble Edited by: Random Womble on 14/12/2008 03:29:17
Third edit after sorting out the mess of quotes: Why the hell are you shooting BSs (must be that or caps as you mention a LARGE smartie) with light drones anyway unless your in a smaller drone boat eg a vexor or something in which case your not likely to be killing a BS solo anyway.
because my handy ishtar you decided to bring up lost its 5x sentries to a warping out 5x heavies to ppl shooting at them and 5x meds from the smartbomb just previous to it
reguardless of the size of the smart bomb it doesnt take too long to pop a wave of drones of the corresponding size (eg med drones & med smart bomb) and its a fact large SBs can 1-2 shot light drones so i dont see the issue there, are you saying if your only option for drones is lights that you shouldnt attack a BS i hope you try that when your in that situation
i know drones are perfecty fine and happy in "perfect case scenario world" (or hi-sec only space more likely) which is obviously where you are basing all point of view, but in actual use 1 or 2 bad situation leaves drone users severely gimped and/or completely ineffective.
just because people are using them effectively doesnt mean they are inline with the rest of the damage types zealot worked before but CCP realised it needed balancing issues and took care of it. drones should be put inline more and have more options, arguing that they dont need more options is rediculous with all the attribute enhancing options you have for turrets
also, with the addition of dronebandwidth there was supposed to be a increase in drone capacity for drone spec ships to increase variety of drone usage issues, however when it came out all it really did is stealth nerf eos/ishkur/myrm
~Welcome to the internet, where the men are men, the women are men, and the children are FBI agents~ |
Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2008.12.14 22:03:00 -
[12]
Drones and especially sentry drones do not need a boost, especially with QR. ----------------------------------------- [Video] The Neverending Story |
BiggestT
Caldari Resurrection Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.12.15 10:16:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Tensa No its not about the damage. I want sentry drones fixed. Why do T1 heavy drones do less damage than t1 sentries, but t2 heavy drones do more damage than t2 sentries? Because it's broken. It would be a very simple fix.
Make t2 sentries require the racial drone spec along with sentry drone 5. Doing this gives the extra damage from specialization like it does for heavy drones.
T2 sentries are large drone types requiring 25m3 bandwidth, so it should require racial drone spec 4, like their t2 heavy drone counterparts. Easy.
Be careful what you wish for, CCP may give you what u ask for but by nerfing heavies instead lol EVE history
t2 precisions |
Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
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Posted - 2008.12.15 10:22:00 -
[14]
you forgot there is a sentry drone damage rig while there is not heavy drone damage rig ...
--- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed ! |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.12.15 10:40:00 -
[15]
Tread cairfully, I think sentry drones are actually too good when you start taking tracking and optimals into consideration. . .t2 sentry drones are quite powerful right now. . . ----
ECCM is a Counter-measure not a defense. |
Dirtee Girl
Omega Enterprises 0mega Factor
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Posted - 2008.12.16 06:01:00 -
[16]
i would rather see devs tackle drone issues like despite being set to focus fire the sometime pull a " you go there ill go here " or "the return to drone bay fail to dock and sit there like a lump of coal"
or yeah get us some drone implants for the love of .....
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