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Sedious Bloke
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Posted - 2009.01.05 20:39:00 -
[61]
I'm under a week old and have been working on nothing but learning skills the entire time and i can still bring in 10mill in a few hours Eve is harsher than wow in every way, if you miss wow so much mebe you should go back and hug a gnome or two?
to sum it up lrn2play or give me your stuff?
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Ecky X
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2009.01.05 20:49:00 -
[62]
Originally by: agroculture two i remember the times i buy 90day for 350mil before, now i can play 1month with that much ISK.
I know your pain, I quit paying for GTCs with isk. However, it's also somewhat easier to make isk now than it was then, too.
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agroculture two
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Posted - 2009.01.05 20:51:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Sedious Bloke I'm under a week old and have been working on nothing but learning skills the entire time and i can still bring in 10mill in a few hours Eve is harsher than wow in every way, if you miss wow so much mebe you should go back and hug a gnome or two?
to sum it up lrn2play or give me your stuff?
ok English is not my first language and i have difficulties to explain... i compared that i need to spend 65% of my playtime in EVE in farming and only 20% in WOW (to play for GTC and PVP) i love that "eve is harsher in every way",but i hate that i must spend 65%of my time in eve farming... its crapy boring.
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Killer Kelly
Allied Tactical Unit Brutally Organized Ruthless Gangsters
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Posted - 2009.01.05 20:57:00 -
[64]
Most of the older players in my corp rave about playing the market to make money. I can't figure it out. Of course, I don't want it to be mindless. I would enjoy having those good deals. I would love to be able to remember the time I got a killer deal on 25 Apocs and then resold them at a high price and made out like a bandit. I haven't got the hang of it yet but I don't want it to be easy. I enjoy the challenge. (I made 10 million carting around t2 ammo from major markets the other day. Baby steps.) Your problem is that you're stuck in the WoW/GW/etc. mindset of MoneyEarned=Timespent*gold/hour. Intelligence can be substituted for dedication in this game. Of course, both together makes the great players. I have a friend in GoonSwarm who made three billion over a week with trade. His subscription is paid this month.
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Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2009.01.05 20:58:00 -
[65]
Originally by: agroculture two
ok English is not my first language and i have difficulties to explain... i compared that i need to spend 65% of my playtime in EVE in farming and only 20% in WOW (to play for GTC and PVP) i love that "eve is harsher in every way",but i hate that i must spend 65%of my time in eve farming... its crapy boring.
WE GET IT.
If you can't afford it then don't play. If you don't have the time then don't play. I don't feel that you need to farm much, I pvp all the time in fully rigged and T2 fit hacs/recons/BS/capital ships.
You choose to pay via GTC. You choose to grind to get that money. You don't have the time, so stop playing and stop the whining ffs. We aren't going to RUIN the game by having missions give out 10 times more isk or set a max price on GTC so people go back to using illegal methods just so you can pay to play EVE better. Stop being so selfish, gd. --
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
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agroculture two
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Posted - 2009.01.05 21:09:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Originally by: agroculture two
ok English is not my first language and i have difficulties to explain... i compared that i need to spend 65% of my playtime in EVE in farming and only 20% in WOW (to play for GTC and PVP) i love that "eve is harsher in every way",but i hate that i must spend 65%of my time in eve farming... its crapy boring.
WE GET IT.
If you can't afford it then don't play. If you don't have the time then don't play. I don't feel that you need to farm much, I pvp all the time in fully rigged and T2 fit hacs/recons/BS/capital ships.
You choose to pay via GTC. You choose to grind to get that money. You don't have the time, so stop playing and stop the whining ffs. We aren't going to RUIN the game by having missions give out 10 times more isk or set a max price on GTC so people go back to using illegal methods just so you can pay to play EVE better. Stop being so selfish, gd.
i dont ask anyting from CCP or from you, i dont want this game to change... i just wanted opinions and explanations, to see am i wrong, where i m wrong, is there some other way to fix my problem. you r selfish if u think i should not allow myself to ask this questions. sofar there are many constructive replies with some good suggestions so pls dont reply if u dont want to help
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Ecky X
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2009.01.05 21:16:00 -
[67]
You might want to hit up the market or industry sections of the forum. Trade requires practically zero SP to make good isk, but isn't as easy as industry - which can also be very profitable, but requires a few weeks' training time.
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Captain Pompous
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:03:00 -
[68]
I think you should prove me right
Think about it!
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Le Skunk
Low Sec Liberators Chubby Chuppers Chubba Chups
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:06:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Asestorian CCP don't even particularly like people paying for the game with GTCs instead of credit cards or other normal ways.
CCP make 3 million dollars a year from gtcs. They would lose maybe 80% of this if they got rid of them
they LOVE gtcs
SKUNK
Originally by: CCP Navigator
People who think I am joking or talking big are going to understand very quickly that there will be order
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Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:11:00 -
[70]
Originally by: agroculture two
i dont ask anyting from CCP or from you, i dont want this game to change... i just wanted opinions and explanations, to see am i wrong, where i m wrong, is there some other way to fix my problem. you r selfish if u think i should not allow myself to ask this questions. sofar there are many constructive replies with some good suggestions so pls dont reply if u dont want to help
No, your first post was fine. However, after that you started to whine and whine and whine about the prices of GTC.
Wah, I used to get a 90 day for 350m, wah GTC prices are so high. These are your whining posts. You are whining. You are not asking questions anymore. No one can help you, I don't have a magic "radically change how the universe works so that one person can play EVE online cheap" button and I am fairly certain no one else has such a button. We gave you all the options you can have and yet you still whine.
STOP WHINING. --
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
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Kweel Nakashyn
Minmatar Kernel of War Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:15:00 -
[71]
Originally by: agroculture two Edited by: agroculture two on 05/01/2009 20:57:47 Edited by: agroculture two on 05/01/2009 20:24:35 Edited by: agroculture two on 05/01/2009 16:45:55 edit: this post is not about me or for the high GTC prices, the real question is "Does this game involves too much PVE farming? Do u feel bored farming to cover the expenses like i do?"
The reason I m posting this ôwall of textö is because I m hoping that someone will read it and maybe prove me wrong , I m really looking for a reason to convince myself not to quit EVE.
I played most of the popular MMOs(at least on trials) and EvE online is definitely the best game. Its more mature and hardcore, also extremely complex and PVP oriented comparing to other MMOs. But I cant play it anymore because of simple reason, I cant pay for the game and GTC with ISK prices are simply stupid. Now I will make some explanations first:
1. I donÆt know the real reason why the GTCs r so expensive now but my theory is that the world economy crisis lowered the amount of GTC sellers (simply they cant afford it anymore) also the demand increased resulting in increase of the GTC prices. However I think that realmoney isk sellers donÆt mind if the price is this high because they use exploits and macro miners to make isk, also I believe they donÆt pay with real money to play so they will buy GTC even the price is over a billionà this way the good players that play with ISK are eliminated(I consider myself as good player to this game society). 2. I have work, I earn little more than the average but the average salary here is 120euros, so if I pay 15euros/month for a video game that is 12.5% of my total salary. So make some math(open calc, type your salary-12.5%=eve subscription monthly) and u will how I feel about paying the game with real money. 3. So I need 11mil/day for GTC +30mil/day for PvP(I m PvP player, on every MMO I play strictly PvP), I can make 20mil/hour doing lvl4s in Golem t2 fitted so I need to farm 2hours/day to cover expensesà but my average time online is 3hours/day(checked with Visual TimeAnalyzer) thatÆs 65% of my online time in farming! I hate farming! And there r days that I donÆt farm atall I just log, chat, check stuff and logoutà I cant play hardcore like few years ago, I have too much RL obligations.
ThatÆs ok life is hard :D , now the real reason why I m thinking to quit EVE: I played WOW,AOC,LOtR and tons of more MMOs but when I discovered EVE I said, there is the game I will play until It exists. However most of my RL friends still play WoW and yesterday we had a conversation and I made some statistics:60day GTC In WOW now cost ~4k gold(buying GTCs with gold in WOW its not legal but no one I know got banned, I played 3years like that) I need to make 66gold/day for GTC, every player can do daily quests(same as doing missions) at lvl80 and make minimum 250g/hour I wonÆt be under 300g/hour. ThatÆs 7.3% of my total playtime spent for farming, lets add some for repairs and expenses lets say 20%. Yes I know WoW Is kiddish and crapy compared to EVE but 65% of the time spend in doing lvl4sà no not WOW, minesweeper sounds more fun. Lately I just log and when I realize how much ISK I need to farm I just pres ctrl+q, I m really disappointed.
CCP should find some strategy to fix this because I believe that many good players will leave the game.
edit:i calculated 12.5% from the average salary, for me is 10.7% but still to much to pay. edit:i come from country where the average salary is 120euros(that is not my average, its for the whole country)
Demand > Offer. End of story.
Complained about oil price last summer ? Did it change something ? No. Now Demand got nerfed, did it changed something ? Yes. Fetchez la vache !
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agroculture two
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:21:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Originally by: agroculture two
i dont ask anyting from CCP or from you, i dont want this game to change... i just wanted opinions and explanations, to see am i wrong, where i m wrong, is there some other way to fix my problem. you r selfish if u think i should not allow myself to ask this questions. sofar there are many constructive replies with some good suggestions so pls dont reply if u dont want to help
No, your first post was fine. However, after that you started to whine and whine and whine about the prices of GTC.
Wah, I used to get a 90 day for 350m, wah GTC prices are so high. These are your whining posts. You are whining. You are not asking questions anymore. No one can help you, I don't have a magic "radically change how the universe works so that one person can play EVE online cheap" button and I am fairly certain no one else has such a button. We gave you all the options you can have and yet you still whine.
STOP WHINING.
hmmm... r u selling GTCs? because i think u r whining not me
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Kweel Nakashyn
Minmatar Kernel of War Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:23:00 -
[73]
Where do you live ? Fetchez la vache !
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Clinical Experiment
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:27:00 -
[74]
Originally by: agroculture two ok English is not my first language and i have difficulties to explain... i compared that i need to spend 65% of my playtime in EVE in farming and only 20% in WOW (to play for GTC and PVP) i love that "eve is harsher in every way",but i hate that i must spend 65%of my time in eve farming... its crapy boring.
Umm...i didn't know you could buy gametime in WoW with gold.
Actually only way to do it would be to...you know...sell gold
In aaaany case.
GTC is 300mil max. 1 hour/day for every working day, 20 days, is 15mil/hour.
Ok, bit rough to do 15mil/hour(for some), so let's give you every day.
30 days/month, 1 hour a day, you need 10mil/hour to do so.
That's one, maybe two level 4 missions+loot.
You say you can play 3hours/day, that's 33% to gather the ISK for your gametime.
I'd say that's pretty darn cheap.
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Asestorian
Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:30:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Le Skunk
Originally by: Asestorian CCP don't even particularly like people paying for the game with GTCs instead of credit cards or other normal ways.
CCP make 3 million dollars a year from gtcs. They would lose maybe 80% of this if they got rid of them
they LOVE gtcs
SKUNK
What I meant more was that they prefer people to pay with credit cards. They even said so themselves somewhere.
*shrug*
---
Originally by: CCP Atropos Destiny Balls
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Gorefacer
Caldari Resurrection Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:35:00 -
[76]
I don't understand the complaint.
Is it that you can't afford something you want? Or that CCP should change the game to cater to people that can't afford to pay the subscription fee?
Sorry if your in a country/situation where your struggling. Doesn't sound like the problem is with EVE though.
Also I liked how many used this thread as a springboard to brag about their monthly salary, hubris over the internet is always good fun.
To answer your question, no I don't think there is too much "grinding required". You can fly as cheap ships as you'd like. It's up to you how much you spend or risk.
Personally I'm lucky enough to be able to afford the subscription costs. As such I don't "need" to make a certain about of ISK/day to keep playing the game. Also I've come across a good mix to maximize PVP playtime. I use trading for passive income while I actively do what I enjoy in the game. To do this effectively I actually use an alt account so this may not be a viable option for you unfortunately.
Doesn't sound like there is an easy solution for what you want. Options are there but they either require money or time and it sounds like you don't have enough of the first and don't like spending the other (at least in the quantity required doing PVE stuff).
In an attempt to be useful check out Combat Arms. It's a free to play internet FPS game with instant action. I often play while waiting for gangs to form up and wait to hear the word on TS so I can quit and resume EVE.
"You can't reason someone out of a belief they haven't reasoned themselves into" - Prometheus |
Kweel Nakashyn
Minmatar Kernel of War Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2009.01.05 22:38:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Sheriff Jones Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 05/01/2009 22:28:32
Originally by: agroculture two ok English is not my first language and i have difficulties to explain... i compared that i need to spend 65% of my playtime in EVE in farming and only 20% in WOW (to play for GTC and PVP) i love that "eve is harsher in every way",but i hate that i must spend 65%of my time in eve farming... its crapy boring.
Umm...i didn't know you could buy gametime in WoW with gold.
Actually only way to do it would be to...you know...sell gold
In aaaany case.
GTC is 300mil max. 1 hour/day for every working day, 20 days, is 15mil/hour.
Ok, bit rough to do 15mil/hour(for some), so let's give you every day.
30 days/month, 1 hour a day, you need 10mil/hour to do so.
That's one, maybe two level 4 missions+loot.
You say you can play 3hours/day, that's 33% to gather the ISK for your gametime.
I'd say that's pretty darn cheap.
Basically, you need to "farm" isk 30 hours/month with a 10mil/hour income.
He was counting +33% because of the ships he used to lost in pvp. Fetchez la vache !
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Faife
Federation of Freedom Fighters
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Posted - 2009.01.05 23:29:00 -
[78]
1 billion per GTC get!
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agroculture two
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Posted - 2009.01.05 23:34:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Kweel Nakashyn Where do you live ?
in the anus of the world :P
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Gut Punch
Shade. Penumbra Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.05 23:41:00 -
[80]
This isn't Battlefield, Call of Duty, or Unreal Tournament...
Quote: "Does this game involves too much PVE farming? Do u feel bored farming to cover the expenses like i do?"
The answer is no. 1) You need to feel pain for purchasing new things and/or dying and having to repurchase after one goes BOOM. You shouldn't be able to respawn and recycle back into a fight with a T2 ship. Thats what makes the game "mature and hardcore" as you put it. 2) As someone with a little bit of training time invested in my character, I want people to have to suffer and toil just like I did when I tried to move up in the game. Older players would feel a bit screwed, to put it lightly, if newer people could shortcut thought purchasing the next level of books and ships and gear.
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Kazang
Gallente Arbitrary Freedom
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Posted - 2009.01.06 00:13:00 -
[81]
Yes eve contains alot of pve grind for the weaker and less skilled players, if you dont lose alot of ships in pvp its quite cheap to maintain your fleet. Everything in eve revolves around pvp, the market trading, mining and transport are all forms of pvp, controlled by or in control of the ebb and flow of battle. The competition to earn isk is just as tough as winning a fight. Its extremely easy for the skilled trader to make vast amounts of isk without even playing the game except to set buy and sell orders, if a player has that ability.
For the most part i do agree with you. It takes alot of work and time to get enough money to pvp for most players (most players are terrible at pvp and lose alot) let alone grind the isk to pay for a GTC. Cheaper and ships and less grind would be double bonus for me, i would have more to spend on ships and (hopefully) more targets to shoot at because people would be more inclined to take make risks and venture into the shady world of pvp. But i dont think the effort to reward ratio is that far out in terms of the prices of modules and ships. 4 or so hours earning L4 grinding will pay for a fitted tier 1 battleship, domi for instance.
The price of items is all related to mining and the manufacturing of components, if ccp increased the ore/hour yield of miners the prices of modules would drop, GTC prices would also drop as a result. Its a complex thing and its very difficult to keep the economy balanced so its not quite as straight forward as upping mining yield, but thats the general idea The prices of ships and components in eve is as low as its ever been. Losing a t2 fit battleship 2 or 3 years ago was a huge deal, now its merely a small set back. So if anything its getting easier to earn money every day, for instance level4s are getting more profitable and easier as time goes on. T2 is getting ever cheaper as more players get into invention. So hopefully we are on the right track.
How this continues to progress and what T3 is going to do to the economy will be interesting to see. Less grind would make everything so much more fun
Kazang
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Tiirae
The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2009.01.06 04:16:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Sedious Bloke I'm under a week old and have been working on nothing but learning skills the entire time and i can still bring in 10mill in a few hours Eve is harsher than wow in every way, if you miss wow so much mebe you should go back and hug a gnome or two?
to sum it up lrn2play or give me your stuff?
Shut up. At a week old you shouldn't even be allowed to post. You can't have experienced even 1% of what this game has to offer. And here you are telling someone who's been playing for years to 'lrn2play' ?
Get out.
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Tiirae
The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2009.01.06 04:24:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Originally by: agroculture two
ok English is not my first language and i have difficulties to explain... i compared that i need to spend 65% of my playtime in EVE in farming and only 20% in WOW (to play for GTC and PVP) i love that "eve is harsher in every way",but i hate that i must spend 65%of my time in eve farming... its crapy boring.
WE GET IT.
If you can't afford it then don't play. If you don't have the time then don't play. I don't feel that you need to farm much, I pvp all the time in fully rigged and T2 fit hacs/recons/BS/capital ships.
You choose to pay via GTC. You choose to grind to get that money. You don't have the time, so stop playing and stop the whining ffs. We aren't going to RUIN the game by having missions give out 10 times more isk or set a max price on GTC so people go back to using illegal methods just so you can pay to play EVE better. Stop being so selfish, gd.
Stop being so selfish? The guy lives in a 3rd world country and has to live for a month on what most people here earn in a day. You're calling him selfish? What an ass you are. Having lived and worked in some 3rd world countries myself, I can promise you that the idea of 'selfishness' doesn't even exist. Nor laziness. In order to be selfish you must first have something to be selfish with. Can you even comprehend what life is like for this guy?
I wish some of the people in this thread could swap places with agro culture for a few months. Then we'd hear some real whining. The arrogance and childishness on display here is breathtaking.
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2009.01.06 04:42:00 -
[84]
I buy my game time with ISK. I spend most of my time running missions, mining, and experimenting with different ships and fittings. I don't care why GTC are so expensive. It's the challenge to meet that goal every month that actually keeps me playing.
I've ragequit twice already (just ask the CCP folks), but I came back after realising that I enjoy the game that I'm playing.
So now I'm setting myself goals - raise DPS to get mission times down. Improve tanking to reduce the risk of ship loss when accidentally killing triggers. I expect to have money left over this month so I can actually engage in some light PvP.
Yes, GTC are hideously expensive. For me it's a challenge to overcome - the $15/month subscription fee is just two day's lunch money for me, it's not the money that I care about, it's meeting the challenge of having my characters buy their own game time.
One other way of making money is to become a recycler who buys trash T1 modules from mission runners in hubs, refines them and sells the minerals on the market. Alternately you could train in manufacturing, invest in a highly-researched ammunition BPC and go into the business of manufacturing ammunition for mission runners. The two businesses have a synergy - you buy modules, reprocess them, sell them back to mission-runners as ammunition!
Plenty of ways to make ISK, some even help you make ISK when you're not logged on!
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Roy34543
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Posted - 2009.01.06 05:13:00 -
[85]
This thread has been somewhat screwed... Honestly my suggestion is to do investment, In whatever you want if your in the game for the long term, get BPO's and make copies and you can pay for the game indefinatly after a period of time for no work. Problem is it takes a lot of upfront cash.
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yourdoingitwrong
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Posted - 2009.01.06 05:26:00 -
[86]
TO THE OP: YOU SHOULD HAVE BEEN SPAT
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Yalezorn
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.06 05:30:00 -
[87]
If you can't afford $15 a month, I suggest you stop wasting 3 hours a day on video games and do something with your life.
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Tulisin Dragonflame
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Posted - 2009.01.06 05:43:00 -
[88]
Edited by: Tulisin Dragonflame on 06/01/2009 05:44:22 Take those two hours a day and open a lemonade stand. At a quarter a cup you'll only need to sell 60 cups a month to pay for your account, 2 cups a day, or a cup of lemonade an hour. Of course, you'll have to cover the cost of your sign "Lemonaide, no grilz aloud!!1", but you can probably get the lemons and sugarwater free from mom.
Or, like, go outside and look on the ground for that much change, seriously. 25 cents an hour.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2009.01.06 05:53:00 -
[89]
Edited by: Akita T on 06/01/2009 05:57:01
Originally by: agroculture two So I need 11mil/day for GTC +30mil/day for PvP(I m PvP player, on every MMO I play strictly PvP), I can make 20mil/hour doing lvl4s in Golem t2 fitted so I need to farm 2hours/day to cover expenses… but my average time online is 3hours/day(checked with Visual TimeAnalyzer) that’s 65% of my online time in farming! I hate farming!
You farm half an hour for "free game" purposes and you farm one and a half hours (three times as much) for PvP consumption purposes. If the need for farming ISK (i.e. "wasting time") would be severely reduced, so would your "thrill factor" also reduce (from investments into PvP ships you lose), which would lead to you either simply losing more ships (or more expensive ships) and still farming one and a half hours a day to pay for them.
I think you just inadvertedly answered your own question : no, there's not too much mandatory farming, you just do suck at PvP "ISK effectiveness". Try to fly cheaper ships or lose them less often in the future. Probably the "fly cheaper ships" option would be a good start - downsize your ship class one level.
_ Create a character || Fit a ship || Get some ISK |
Tiirae
The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2009.01.06 05:59:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Yalezorn If you can't afford $15 a month, I suggest you stop wasting 3 hours a day on video games and do something with your life.
/facepalm
I have to laugh. You can't beat forums. You're lucky if people read half the OP, let alone the 4 pages of discussion following it. Even if I explain it all too this guy as well, another idiot will come along, read 2 lines and then post something similar, and similarly worthless.
/emote waves white flag
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