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Kaya Divine
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.15 11:49:00 -
[1]
Well my CNR just sit in station, because I hear rumors about it can be juicy target.
I was wondering for answer from CNR pilots, how much it makes your life easier or problematic. How juicy are you if you lets say, use only named and t2 mods, without extravagance of faction or higher meta`s? How much of you survived gank, or got ganked in CNR or more expensive ships like rattlesnake or nightmare?
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Loaby
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Posted - 2009.01.15 11:57:00 -
[2]
never got ganked
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NoNah
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Posted - 2009.01.15 12:13:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Kaya Divine
Well my CNR just sit in station, because I hear rumors about it can be juicy target.
I was wondering for answer from CNR pilots, how much it makes your life easier or problematic. How juicy are you if you lets say, use only named and t2 mods, without extravagance of faction or higher meta`s? How much of you survived gank, or got ganked in CNR or more expensive ships like rattlesnake or nightmare?
The value of the ship means nothing. There's really only two reasons to gank someone. First one is less common but it's to inflict damage on the target. If you don't have any major enemies through empire, this won't be an issue.
Second is to gain isk on it. As of quantum rise it's quite expensive to gank someone, concord hurts a bit more and the sec status hit is tougher. What you have to ask yourself is if ships worth less than half the value of your ship(half the modules blow up) can gank you, and if they can is the margin enough for it to be worth the sec status hit and the logistics/waiting?
Basically, named/t2 is fine, no-one will ever gank you for that. Cheap faction modules such as BCU's, maybe even launchers will keep you safe. What won't keep you safe however is a deadspace xl booster, officer/deadspace harderners and that sort of thing. That said, there's really no reason to put more than some 40-50 mil isk on the tank - ever.
If you really have to pimp your missionboat do it by crystal implants, tech 2 rigs, faction ammo and that sort of thing rather than defence. |
Ralitge boyter
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.01.15 12:13:00 -
[4]
The ship is never the target the modules and cargo are...
Would you ever be a gank target for having a CNR? No. Are you more likely to have expensive modules fitted on a CNR than on say a Raven or a Ferox? Yes. Do the expensive modules make you a possible target? Yes.
Is it likely? Not really, taking a battleship down is not an easy task and requires quite a bit of cheap firepower all of which will be destroyed by Concord. With only a chance of getting the best modules in your wreck instead of seeing them explode.
I would say look around you how many CNR's do you see running missions? If it was a risky business you would see far less of them because most people are not very much in favor of loosing their ships or modules. |
Les Grossman
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:30:00 -
[5]
Battleship suicide attacks are a myth. They don't happen. I've flown full officer fit bs's a year everywhere in high sec and have had many 'threats' that I'll be suicide ganked but it's practically impossible to suicide gank a ship with that many effective hp's.
Don't keep it docked, CNR wants to fly! |
FT Diomedes
Gallente Ductus Exemplo
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:00:00 -
[6]
They certainly used to happen more frequently, but only if the ship was pimped enough to make it worth the ISK needed to kill it. I have not heard or seen a suicide gank since QR. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome. |
DIN0SAUR JUNIOR
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:02:00 -
[7]
There are so many CNR's flying around (always 1-2 on my overview at every gate/starbase) and I'm not even near Jita/Motsu, I can think of a couple possibilities.
1) The risk of gankage is lower than the victims may lead you to believe. 2) If you have enough ISK you don't care. 3) Both.
A couple years ago the CNR wasn't as prevalent. I imagine that these days you have to fly a Pirate Faction BS (like Nightmare or Rattlesnake) to attract any attention.
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1200 baud
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:47:00 -
[8]
They do happen, I recently had a corp mate lose a Vargur to 7 ravens. He did have a bunch of Gist SH hardners/booster/boost Amps. Lost the Booster and Boost Amp, the hardners dropped and he bought them back. That lose was about 2 Bill by the time everything was replaced. |
brocksamson316
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:58:00 -
[9]
What system did that happen in? |
DIN0SAUR JUNIOR
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Posted - 2009.01.15 16:09:00 -
[10]
The ship itself is of little value to gankers, considering what it takes to suicide a BS class ship, try not to have a lot of single modules that add up to significantly more value than 7+ gank Ravens. If you fly a flashy ship you will get scanned. Period. Expect it. Take steps to reduce your risk without jeopardizing your ability to run missions quickly (as obviously this was the reason you're not just flying a Drake/Raven).
1) Decide what level of tank is actually needed to do most missions. You don't need to perma-tank 2000dps. 2) Get a Crystal set. It can't be scanned, it doesn't drop. 3) Realize that DPS, not tank, is what gets you through the missions faster and faction damage mods aren't worth that much. Tank only allows you to be lazier. 4) You obviously make a lot of ISK. Can you afford to GTC an logistic flying alt account? May not be possible for everyone, especially if they can't dual account on their PC but a Scimitar is going negate the need for an A-Type booster.
Assume you will be scanned, work the system.
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Hyveres
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.01.15 16:14:00 -
[11]
If your fit is multiple billion isk and have more than 1 module worth a few hundred mill you are a worthy target.
If not .. not so worthy.
Suicide ganking a battleship takes time , effort and multiple players ganking up on you. "Subtlety is a thing for philosophy, not combat. If you're going to kill someone, you might as well kill them a whole lot." - Vulcan Raven, The Last Days Of Foxhound |
Steve Celeste
Caldari Moonbow.
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Posted - 2009.01.15 16:37:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Steve Celeste on 15/01/2009 16:37:32
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Vietone
Gallente Mercury Industries
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Posted - 2009.01.15 17:03:00 -
[13]
It wont happen often because its never worth it ISK wise.
Even with a fully faction CNR worth 3+ bil, you would be getting maybe 1.5bil in drops if you are able to destroy the ship before concord arrives.
Most BS class PvE ships can tank a lot of damage over a period of time. So yeah, it would take several battleships to take one down before concord would get ya. And most mission runners have a high sec status as well so the sec status hit to the gankers would be higher.
I have a CNR, 7x Caldari Cruise Launchers, 2x Caldari Invul fields, Caldari XL shield booster, 2x caldari shield boost amps i got on the cheap and I have never been a target, Why? Because my tank is quite strong and it would be all too easy to warp out of a mission if I see a couple battleships warpping in on me. More than likely, not all several battleships will be getting in at the same time.
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Srioghal moDhream
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Posted - 2009.01.15 17:28:00 -
[14]
Omni tank will make you a much harder target. If you do mission specific hardeners (especially caldari missions) your raven, cnr, golem will drop like a fly.
The cost of the ganking ships are never a consideration as they will at most cost the ganker 20 mill net. The sec hit is the only consideration now, so they have to make the attack worth it as they cannot do it as often anymore.
TLDR: Fit an omni tank (CN invulns while expensive give great protection) and if you are really afraid of getting ganked a DCU II is also a great deterrant.
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Traska Gannel
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Posted - 2009.01.15 19:04:00 -
[15]
Hi ...
I've flown a CNR in a mission running hub for more than a year with no sign of suicide gankers. They need to be motivated to attack you either for personal reasons or possible profit. As mentioned, fitting billions of ISK in officier/faction gear will make you a possible target. On the other hand, typical faction modules like specific damage type hardeners, BCU, CN shield booster and CN launchers won't usually make you a sufficiently worthwhile target.
In addition, by fitting your ship with certain modules you can make it much harder to destroy and thus much less of a target. For a CNR this typically means: 1) Fit an EM shield hardener and possibly an invulnerability field in addition to mission specific hardeners 2) Fit a DCU II in one of the lows.
Finally, activate your hardeners/DCU when traveling to and from your mission, use warp to zero, don't hang around afk in space, and keep and eye open for a fleet sitting near a gate - the odds of getting successfully ganked go down under these circumstances :)
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Battleclash
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Posted - 2009.01.15 21:55:00 -
[16]
What the **** is the point of owning a ship if you never fly it? |
Ghoest
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Posted - 2009.01.15 22:02:00 -
[17]
No one is going to gank a CNR fitted with T2 gear unless they just hate you personally.
I doubt anyone is going to gank a CNR fitted with LP reward faction gear. It would not be worth the coordinated effort just to get 600 mill or so gear.
Maybe if you equip it with expensive deadspace and officer gear you might get hit but even that seems unlikely anymore. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.01.15 23:48:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Vietone It wont happen often because its never worth it ISK wise.
Even with a fully faction CNR worth 3+ bil, you would be getting maybe 1.5bil in drops if you are able to destroy the ship before concord arrives.
Most BS class PvE ships can tank a lot of damage over a period of time. So yeah, it would take several battleships to take one down before concord would get ya. And most mission runners have a high sec status as well so the sec status hit to the gankers would be higher.
I have a CNR, 7x Caldari Cruise Launchers, 2x Caldari Invul fields, Caldari XL shield booster, 2x caldari shield boost amps i got on the cheap and I have never been a target, Why? Because my tank is quite strong and it would be all too easy to warp out of a mission if I see a couple battleships warpping in on me. More than likely, not all several battleships will be getting in at the same time.
your reasons for not getting ganked are way off...
it is all mods from the caldari lp stores... not worth the isk to gank. suppose before qr I would consider taking a crack at it, but now meh. it is probably right around the break even point, maybe even less, I would look for another target over you.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.01.15 23:49:00 -
[19]
Originally by: FT Diomedes They certainly used to happen more frequently, but only if the ship was pimped enough to make it worth the ISK needed to kill it. I have not heard or seen a suicide gank since QR.
only takes 3 t1 cruisers to kill a hulk
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Villain
Caldari Elite Armaments Co..
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Posted - 2009.01.16 00:19:00 -
[20]
I recently had 7 Ravens try and gank my CNR during a mission. They watched me for ages waiting for the shields to get down to a level they considered low enough to kill me. They miscalculated somewhat and I picked up 7 Ravens worth of loot.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.01.16 01:38:00 -
[21]
cnr all level 5 skills, 2 cn invluns, and dc has 105,447 ehp according to eft, lowest with em 98,572
just under a 5sec rof on an overloaded torp raven, with around 6.5k alpha with rage torps, 5.9k with caldari navy. they should get 2-3 volleys
surprisingly easy to do...
oh and a 2 cn invlun, and dc golem has 82,576 ehp, just over 72k em.
looking at some of my game logs it looks like about 18 seconds for concord to show up and start shooting at a cruiser sized ship in a 0.5. now as I was sub -5.0 at the time the caldari navy actually showed up way before concord. it took them 6 seconds from my first shot. and heh, the faction police killed me, concord had just gotten their warp scrams on me, and disabled drones. |
Ghoest
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Posted - 2009.01.16 05:45:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton cnr all level 5 skills, 2 cn invluns, and dc has 105,447 ehp according to eft, lowest with em 98,572
just under a 5sec rof on an overloaded torp raven, with around 6.5k alpha with rage torps, 5.9k with caldari navy. they should get 2-3 volleys
surprisingly easy to do...
oh and a 2 cn invlun, and dc golem has 82,576 ehp, just over 72k em.
looking at some of my game logs it looks like about 18 seconds for concord to show up and start shooting at a cruiser sized ship in a 0.5. now as I was sub -5.0 at the time the caldari navy actually showed up way before concord. it took them 6 seconds from my first shot. and heh, the faction police killed me, concord had just gotten their warp scrams on me, and disabled drones.
Could your rewrite that with sentences? Or even just do reasonable job of relaying your train of thought?
If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.01.16 06:06:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Chainsaw Plankton on 16/01/2009 06:12:23
Originally by: Ghoest
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton cnr all level 5 skills, 2 cn invluns, and dc has 105,447 ehp according to eft, lowest with em 98,572
just under a 5sec rof on an overloaded torp raven, with around 6.5k alpha with rage torps, 5.9k with caldari navy. they should get 2-3 volleys
surprisingly easy to do...
oh and a 2 cn invlun, and dc golem has 82,576 ehp, just over 72k em.
looking at some of my game logs it looks like about 18 seconds for concord to show up and start shooting at a cruiser sized ship in a 0.5. now as I was sub -5.0 at the time the caldari navy actually showed up way before concord. it took them 6 seconds from my first shot. and heh, the faction police killed me, concord had just gotten their warp scrams on me, and disabled drones.
Could your rewrite that with sentences? Or even just do reasonable job of relaying your train of thought?
In short: If someone wants to gank you they will, as for the break even point, I don't honestly care so much, as well I won't get around to suicide ganking anything but miners for a while, and I haven't even ganked a miner in a while.
apologies for the **** post, eh, it looks mostly readable till the very end where I start rambling.
**** I'm doing the "I don't need a new sentence I can just put a comma there" again... |
glassmanipulator
Lucian Alliance Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.17 05:12:00 -
[24]
proper CNR gank crews always fit large energy neuts. Your tank go's down real fast when your hardeners and shield booster shut off. Oh and this happens more than you think, and I think its hilarious :-) |
Shadowsword
Epsilon Lyr Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2009.01.17 08:27:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Les Grossman Battleship suicide attacks are a myth. They don't happen. I've flown full officer fit bs's a year everywhere in high sec and have had many 'threats' that I'll be suicide ganked but it's practically impossible to suicide gank a ship with that many effective hp's.
Don't keep it docked, CNR wants to fly!
You might want to ask Picman about his officer-fitted nightmare. Tons of effective HP didn't save him... |
Bunds
PILGRIMS Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.17 09:46:00 -
[26]
ad guess its maybes not best to say what u have fitted to your cnr here.
generally if your careful i think you will be alright some common sense goes along way. |
glassmanipulator
Lucian Alliance Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.17 11:33:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Shadowsword
Originally by: Les Grossman Battleship suicide attacks are a myth. They don't happen. I've flown full officer fit bs's a year everywhere in high sec and have had many 'threats' that I'll be suicide ganked but it's practically impossible to suicide gank a ship with that many effective hp's.
Don't keep it docked, CNR wants to fly!
You might want to ask Picman about his officer-fitted nightmare. Tons of effective HP didn't save him...
lol do you have the km ?
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2009.01.17 16:28:00 -
[28]
Originally by: glassmanipulator
Originally by: Shadowsword
Originally by: Les Grossman Battleship suicide attacks are a myth. They don't happen. I've flown full officer fit bs's a year everywhere in high sec and have had many 'threats' that I'll be suicide ganked but it's practically impossible to suicide gank a ship with that many effective hp's.
Don't keep it docked, CNR wants to fly!
You might want to ask Picman about his officer-fitted nightmare. Tons of effective HP didn't save him...
lol do you have the km ?
Yes were all impressed that you consider yourself some sort of insider on the high sec gank scene. |
Vikarion
Caldari White Rose Society
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Posted - 2009.01.17 17:37:00 -
[29]
For crying out loud, just t2 fit it. T2 works fine, and avoids the problem altogether, because unless you've really ****ed someone off, they aren't going to gank you for t2. |
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.01.17 20:45:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Vikarion For crying out loud, just t2 fit it. T2 works fine, and avoids the problem altogether, because unless you've really ****ed someone off, they aren't going to gank you for t2.
…an even then, they're not going to gank you for the T2 — they're going to gank you because you've ****ed them off, and it doesn't really matter what ship you're in or what's fitted on it. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki |
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