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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Windryder
Caldari BlackScope Black Scope Project
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Posted - 2009.01.20 21:38:00 -
[151]
Originally by: Altridge McAltpherson
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Ix Forres
Originally by: Avon Well, my laptop is now junk.
Thanks a lot.
Please send replacement to the address on my account details. Thx.
If you're running a laptop without SM2, time to upgrade. My EeePC can do SM2.
If you are paying I am happy to upgrade.
Otherwise I'll just spend the money on my mortgage, bills, and just generally surviving if that is okay with you.
If you can't afford a new ú300 laptop then frankly you should have bigger concerns than computer games.
No I think the point is that we have perfectly good laptops that can still run everything BUT the new EvE client.
Yes I'm also one of those gameplay>graphics people who will be losing an eve-capable laptop that we used to use for running our freighter-pilot/cyno-alt/pos-monkey/scan-alt/leadership-booster while we did stuff on our main.
I think getting us to junk our old laptops during an economic meltdown is only going to hurt CCP in the long run as people drop accounts they can no longer fully utilise because they are unable to use otherwise viable hardware.
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Dentad
Price of Progress Cry Havoc.
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Posted - 2009.01.20 22:30:00 -
[152]
Originally by: Grigori Black So how do you check to see if your computer runs Shader Model 2?
Run utility http://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/ Look in DirectX Support box. |
AonChilo
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.20 23:33:00 -
[153]
I plan to upgrade after Windows 7 is released. For now I have WinXP with a SM v2.0b card: ATI Radeon X800 Pro 256mb RAM. This card is very sufficient to run my computer. Of course I can always temporarily cancel my game subscription of CCP cannot wait for Win 7 to release. |
Morgaaan
Gallente Silver Snake Enterprise
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Posted - 2009.01.21 00:28:00 -
[154]
Originally by: Mika Meroko Edited by: Mika Meroko on 20/01/2009 00:15:25
Originally by: Katana Seiko
Originally by: Mika Meroko I guess I wont be renewing my sub for my 3 remaining accounts either.
Can I have your stuff?
Seriously... Upgrading a PC to SM3 capability is 20$ - not 300... And I just got an answer from a friend of mine - he'll take the rig that I currently use as a server (worth about 100$) - add a new Graphics card and it's absolutely SM3 capable.
I don't think that EVE Lite will take much more resources than EVE Classic - people with an SM2 capable rig will even see an advancement in speed since the client will loose quite some weight.
PS: Question: where do you find 20$ (canadian) cards in stores? ... the cheapest I seen are about 60 dollars atleast.
and no... ordering over the net wouldnt help... Canadian customs are nasty, last card I ordered over the net for cheap I ended up paying import fees/taxes to the point where is cheaper to buy local.
meh...
http://www.ncix.com/
Goto that link if yer Canadian and lookin for good deals for web shopping.No customs to worry about,the store is in BC and if you live outside BC then you pay 0% sales tax.(which in alot of cases can more than cover air freight).They also have forums so you can ask some guru for an opinion on something if your not sure.
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Tweakalvos
Your Cute When You Scream
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Posted - 2009.01.21 01:07:00 -
[155]
Well I'll say this we are getting an unproven product with premium lite. I for one am one of those that will be left out in the cold. These changes in my opinion were not only rushed but more of a modernization. I can understand this but as many have put premium atm isn't stable. We still have bugs with the classic client. The new one will be unproven if not anything not well bug tested like many of the products that have been put forth. QR patch for weeks had bugs. We still stick with you ccp because of your game is great. I will upgrade as soon as I can. But still think this is something that should have been given more time for the folks that need to upgrade. Instead of 1 month of yeah you need to upgrade because it cost you too much to maintain the old client. I can understand these things. But in the end after my argument i can understand and am willing to press on. It is a game. I will be hopefully purchasing a new computer soon. If not I will be out due to these changes. My only wish is that these changes could have been pushed more toward summer. But these things are understandable. |
Shereza
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Posted - 2009.01.21 02:47:00 -
[156]
Can you please fix the problems with Premium graphics and ATI cards before discontinuing the Classic graphics?
The Classic graphics package is, so far, the only one that has not given my computer a BSoD. Premium graphics did it back with the May release of ATI's drivers whenever my nightmare was loaded, video BSoD when logging in with me in it and a hard drive BSoD of all things when I switched to the nightmare after logging in.
In addition, with the December release, at least, of ATI drivers mouse clicks in the graphics window crash EVE when running in Premium graphics.
Both problems are solved by using Omega drivers but that creates severe client instability when running 3 clients that often causes my computer to lock up solid without even giving me a BSoD or crash message of any sort.
It's been over a year since the last Omega ATI drivers were released and so much can change in a year that I'm questioning using them, but when Premium graphics is so horribly unstable with the official drivers from ATI I'm not sure what to do except ask that these issues be removed from the Premium graphics engine before you phase out the Classic engine.
I'm not against phasing out the Classic engine, though it will make it harder to get a second EVE machine going (one computer I was looking at can't fit a full height AGP card), but I am against phasing out the most stable and compatible graphics engine in favor of something that reacts badly (crashes, BSoDs, etc.) to official drivers. |
Myntelle NicAtoch
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Posted - 2009.01.21 02:52:00 -
[157]
Edited by: Myntelle NicAtoch on 21/01/2009 02:54:29
My laptop claims graphics claims to be run by an ATI Radeon Mobility 7500. I don't think that even has Shader 2. My desktop is slighty better, being AGP with an NVidia 5700LE. A few years ago, I used to run five accounts simultaneously across the pair of machines. Even when running ONE account, I don't WANT the fancy graphics in normal game play. If there was a graphics option to reduce down to Braben and Bell's Elite level, I would almost always use that. I deduce from this that despite my five accounts, I do not fit the profile of customer that CCP are chasing. Or am I wrong?
Myn |
Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2009.01.21 03:08:00 -
[158]
CCP can remove the need for SM3.0 by providing an option to render EVE using wireframe or untextured, gaussian shaded polygons. Think of "Battlezone" or "Elite"
CCP could then require SM3 or SM4 for people who want to have fancy textures, allowing everyone else to do their skill swaps, hauling and mining with ships that look like paper cutouts.
A "send my graphics card details to CCP" option in the Graphics options should help somewhat.
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MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
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Posted - 2009.01.21 03:36:00 -
[159]
Originally by: Mara Rinn CCP can remove the need for SM3.0 by providing an option to render EVE using wireframe or untextured, gaussian shaded polygons. Think of "Battlezone" or "Elite"
CCP could then require SM3 or SM4 for people who want to have fancy textures, allowing everyone else to do their skill swaps, hauling and mining with ships that look like paper cutouts.
A "send my graphics card details to CCP" option in the Graphics options should help somewhat.
you and your 5 accounts are not the kind of customer CCP is chasing after. |
Borgholio
Minmatar Borgholio's Collective Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2009.01.21 04:49:00 -
[160]
Originally by: MotherMoon
you and your 5 accounts are not the kind of customer CCP is chasing after.
If CCP wasn't chasing after multi-account users, why do they keep offering Power of Two deals? |
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MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
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Posted - 2009.01.21 06:48:00 -
[161]
Edited by: MotherMoon on 21/01/2009 06:48:44
Originally by: Borgholio
Originally by: MotherMoon
you and your 5 accounts are not the kind of customer CCP is chasing after.
If CCP wasn't chasing after multi-account users, why do they keep offering Power of Two deals?
I'm sorry but what part of that reads power of 5?
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Axium Cog
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Posted - 2009.01.21 06:51:00 -
[162]
Personally the Shader3 would kill me. I fall into the laptop group and while I can support Shader2 the 3 upgrade would bump me from Eve permanently. Im a college student and I cant just upgrade on a whim to continue playing a game. Its my opinion that there should be a distinct difference between light and premium. It allows a window for more players those that want the eye candy can always upgrade to the premium package, and those that simply dont want a graphics intensive version or cant afford it can play around with the light. Why alienate players simply because they cant afford to buy a new computer?
Here's to hoping i dont get forced out in a year due to sysreq changes.
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Thrymren
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Posted - 2009.01.21 07:30:00 -
[163]
Originally by: Axium Cog Personally the Shader3 would kill me. I fall into the laptop group and while I can support Shader2 the 3 upgrade would bump me from Eve permanently. Im a college student and I cant just upgrade on a whim to continue playing a game. Its my opinion that there should be a distinct difference between light and premium. It allows a window for more players those that want the eye candy can always upgrade to the premium package, and those that simply dont want a graphics intensive version or cant afford it can play around with the light. Why alienate players simply because they cant afford to buy a new computer?
Here's to hoping i dont get forced out in a year due to sysreq changes.
oh my... we aretalking about shader2! if u do have a computer that supports any agp/pcie graphics cards go into a store and spend 20$ on a 'new' graphics card... i'd be surprized if theres anyone out there playing eve who can't afford that! at least there are 15$ monthly subscription fees... u finance your account by isk? the go buy 2 PLEX and trade them in forum for a new graphics card that supports the 'new' shader, i'm pretty shure there will be someone willing to trade :)
for the 'hope not to be out in a year' part i'll take a look into my magic mirror... aaah! it sais by the time ccp changes eve onlines minimum graphic requirements again the graphics cards to support it will be 20$ maximum...
;)
regards thrym
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Halvus
Minmatar Wolfington Industries Vanguard.
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Posted - 2009.01.21 07:31:00 -
[164]
This is excellent news. I have two Dell laptops that are just a year old, both of which support SM2 only. Its good to know that I can continue to play eve :)
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Borgholio
Minmatar Borgholio's Collective Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2009.01.21 07:33:00 -
[165]
Originally by: MotherMoon
I'm sorry but what part of that reads power of 5?
You miss the point. Regardless of the actual number of accounts, CCP deliberately tries to get their customers to subscribe to multiple accounts. Whether it's only two or something ridiculous like five is irrelevant. The point is that since CCP wants people to get multiple accounts, it is a reasonable assumption that one would be allowed to play more than one instance of EVE the same time on a single computer. ----------------------------------- You will be assimilated...bunghole! |
Halvus
Minmatar Wolfington Industries Vanguard.
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Posted - 2009.01.21 07:34:00 -
[166]
Originally by: Thrymren
Originally by: Axium Cog Personally the Shader3 would kill me. I fall into the laptop group and while I can support Shader2 the 3 upgrade would bump me from Eve permanently. Im a college student and I cant just upgrade on a whim to continue playing a game. Its my opinion that there should be a distinct difference between light and premium. It allows a window for more players those that want the eye candy can always upgrade to the premium package, and those that simply dont want a graphics intensive version or cant afford it can play around with the light. Why alienate players simply because they cant afford to buy a new computer?
Here's to hoping i dont get forced out in a year due to sysreq changes.
oh my... we aretalking about shader2! if u do have a computer that supports any agp/pcie graphics cards go into a store and spend 20$ on a 'new' graphics card... i'd be surprized if theres anyone out there playing eve who can't afford that! at least there are 15$ monthly subscription fees... u finance your account by isk? the go buy 2 PLEX and trade them in forum for a new graphics card that supports the 'new' shader, i'm pretty shure there will be someone willing to trade :)
for the 'hope not to be out in a year' part i'll take a look into my magic mirror... aaah! it sais by the time ccp changes eve onlines minimum graphic requirements again the graphics cards to support it will be 20$ maximum...
;)
regards thrym
You can't change the graphics card in a laptop if its built onto the board. e.g. with the intel GMA900 chips.
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Pammie Anderson
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Posted - 2009.01.21 07:42:00 -
[167]
Can we have a wireframe and market version of Eve please with no graphics at all?
Trade, Mining and multiple clients |
Shereza
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Posted - 2009.01.21 08:02:00 -
[168]
Something more important than the "Power of two" campaign to look at when considering that CCP wants multiple account users is the simple fact that despite not "officially" supporting multiple accounts they still put in fixes in one of the recent patches to boost dual client performance.
That aside, I'd be up for a wire-frame graphics option. That was one of the coolest features when playing MechWarrior 2. Nevermind the fact that it also made the game *much* more playable, it looked awesome. |
Mrs Yutty
Janeway's Corp
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Posted - 2009.01.21 08:02:00 -
[169]
This is a great decision. I have only just recently brought a Radeon Graphic card that can also run 4.0 shader. However on playing eve If I try running it on shader 3.0 it crashes my PC on a hourly basis. ive tried every thing and its some problem that only happens with eve. So until it is sorted forcing Radeon users to crash on a hourly basis is not really a valid option. So im stuck with shader 2.0 for the forseeable future. I noticed im not the only one looking at this discussion thread.
I quote" "Can you please fix the problems with Premium graphics and ATI cards before discontinuing the Classic graphics?" |
Calranthe
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Posted - 2009.01.21 08:12:00 -
[170]
I am very happy about this and btw a desktop capable of running the premium client can be put together (minus mouse/keyboard/monitor) for ú200 |
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Calranthe
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Posted - 2009.01.21 08:14:00 -
[171]
Originally by: Mrs Yutty This is a great decision. I have only just recently brought a Radeon Graphic card that can also run 4.0 shader. However on playing eve If I try running it on shader 3.0 it crashes my PC on a hourly basis. ive tried every thing and its some problem that only happens with eve. So until it is sorted forcing Radeon users to crash on a hourly basis is not really a valid option. So im stuck with shader 2.0 for the forseeable future. I noticed im not the only one looking at this discussion thread.
I quote" "Can you please fix the problems with Premium graphics and ATI cards before discontinuing the Classic graphics?"
Sorry to double post but what problem, I have as my second pc a mitac laptop with an ati 1600 256mb card and haven't seen any problems with the premium client. |
Shereza
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Posted - 2009.01.21 09:55:00 -
[172]
Originally by: Mrs Yutty This is a great decision. I have only just recently brought a Radeon Graphic card that can also run 4.0 shader. However on playing eve If I try running it on shader 3.0 it crashes my PC on a hourly basis. ive tried every thing and its some problem that only happens with eve. So until it is sorted forcing Radeon users to crash on a hourly basis is not really a valid option. So im stuck with shader 2.0 for the forseeable future. I noticed im not the only one looking at this discussion thread.
I quote" "Can you please fix the problems with Premium graphics and ATI cards before discontinuing the Classic graphics?"
For the sake of confirmation, you have played other games on your machine that use Shader 3.0 and they did not crash, correct? And the crashing with EVE is just a program crash and not a complete system crash, correct?
I had a problem last year where my machine would crash, BSOD style of badly, whenever I ran games that used a specific Shader version, 2.0 I believe. 1.1 and 3.0 games ran fine, but 2.0 games like Hellgate London and Titan Quest gave me flashbacks to DOS. This problem was likely the result of ATI drivers becoming corrupt and their installation/uninstallation software being ****-poor and not properly deleting and/or overwriting driver files thus leaving the damaged files intact between a couple of reinstalls. I eventually solved it by installing Omega Radeon drivers and when I next installed ATI Radeon drivers the problem was no longer there. |
Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ursa Stellar Initiative
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Posted - 2009.01.21 10:51:00 -
[173]
Originally by: Mara Rinn CCP can remove the need for SM3.0 by providing an option to render EVE using wireframe or untextured, gaussian shaded polygons. Think of "Battlezone" or "Elite"
It's all about the APIs, not prettiness.
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Franga
Gristle Industries
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Posted - 2009.01.21 11:14:00 -
[174]
As promised:
MOAR DEV BLOGS |
CyberGh0st
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.01.21 11:29:00 -
[175]
Originally by: Lisaveta Ivanovna I'm not sure about what to think about these changes yet, however I do have a suggestion which may or may not have been suggested many times:
-Some kind of chat, market, skill changing, map client. Make it a text-based terminal if you have to, but something to help the eve junkies log into their world remotely to some degree. (by remotely, I mean away from our home 'Control Center')
My main beef here is with this l337 eve community who troll every CCP update with "Fail" as if this were a bloody YouTube video. It seems that most of the people who threatened to quit playing EVE when they said they were going to in a juvenile attempt to get CCP to change their mind (as if anyone cares), are right back here at the next update pitching the same fit every subsequent update later. EVE is the only mmo I'd ever seriously consider playing because no other mmo even grazes the sheer amount of complexity and depth that EVE has. On top of that, EVE is the ultimate dynamic environment. CCP has always been adding, removing and modifying mass amounts of critical content to the game to even the fields, provide more stimulation and even dimentions to the game. Every change that has come along has been met with SO much opposition in these forums and in-game discussions, but yet for the most part, EVE continues to maintain a huge group of long-time loyal subscribers who continue playing it despite their pre-pubescent ways of showing disapproval. IMHO, I see ccp as artists who don't compromise a 'good-idea' with what the consumer says he wants. They make their game exactly the way they see it in their minds, and the consumers flock to it because it surpasses their original expectations. So even though I may never get the dual-client thing down, and I may need to spend $20 on a new video card for my old computer on ebay, I will be enjoying the update like most of you.
Well said !
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Lord Timelord
Point of No Return
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Posted - 2009.01.21 11:34:00 -
[176]
I am glad that you are going to keep Shader 2.0 compatibility for the foreseeable future. I can continue to run my 2nd account on my laptop!
When you eventually make the switch to Shader 3.0 or better... the laptop will have to be replaced. However I now know about this forehand, which will give me considerable time to save my cash for a better laptop. Looks like any of us that will be upgrading their laptops will have to get one that can do Shader 4.0, which will no doubt cost some serious cash.
Time to start researching those newer 'modular' laptops where you build them yourself and can switch video card modules down the road as needed! |
Astria Tiphareth
Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2009.01.21 11:34:00 -
[177]
Originally by: Axium Cog Personally the Shader3 would kill me.
Originally by: AonChilo I plan to upgrade after Windows 7 is released. For now I have WinXP with a SM v2.0b card: ATI Radeon X800 Pro 256mb RAM. This card is very sufficient to run my computer. Of course I can always temporarily cancel my game subscription of CCP cannot wait for Win 7 to release.
You're missing the point of the dev blog. Your PC will continue to run the EVE client, because you have Shader Model 2 support. They are not dropping SM2 support.
Originally by: Shereza It's been over a year since the last Omega ATI drivers were released and so much can change in a year that I'm questioning using them, but when Premium graphics is so horribly unstable with the official drivers from ATI I'm not sure what to do except ask that these issues be removed from the Premium graphics engine before you phase out the Classic engine.
It may be small comfort, but the multinational software firm I work with is even partnered with Nvidia and ATI, along with the likes of Microsoft, and we can rarely get ATI or Nvidia to a) admit their drivers have bugs and b) fix the darned things. It's also quite difficult to work around driver bugs when you're using a higher level API from OpenGL or Microsoft that (deliberately) obscures the low-level driver accesses. I have sympathy for both your and CCP's positions.
The real 'solution' is for everyone having issues that are clearly linked to drivers to repeatedly bug the hell out of ATI/Nvidia, whether directly or indirectly via the programs that crash. I've always found it ironic that no matter what card I choose, I just know from our own crash reports at work that something somewhere won't work properly with it. |
CyberGh0st
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.01.21 11:36:00 -
[178]
Originally by: Hell March Edited by: Hell March on 20/01/2009 12:14:57 So! How am I supposed to run 5 clients from my old crap rig eh? x300 ati card and 1.5 gigs of ram and a 2.8 gig processor. Yes I do run 5 clients at the same time. Not fun when you get disconnected or crash by any means. Not to mention I have to start all the clients before actaully logging in each charecter or again I crash. So this beeing the case how much can I actaully strip eve down graphically? No I am not to well concerned with eye candy. I play games that are well past there age. Some of them go back 10 or even 15 years. Also how is this going to effect me running say just 1 client during large scale battles? If I cant run at least 4 clients at the same time then there goes a large source of my income which really kills my desire to even play. Most of the peple I am sure you read use multible accounts. Are we going to get alot of options to strip downt he graphics and i dont mean just hitting check marks. I used to play half life mods where I woudl run in 400x300 ona pentium 2 and from the games console I could tone down the texturing size to practailly nothing and I did to turning preety much all graphical features off. THing is I could still kill you just as easily even though my crosshair would take up half the screen LOL.
Basiclly I want to have as many options as absolutely possible to save on graphics cpu and any other system resource that I possibly can.
Also if you really consider most of the people complaining about the graphics switch are the 1's runnign multible clients such as myself
lol, if you run 5 clients you can afford an upgrade :p
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CyberGh0st
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.01.21 11:39:00 -
[179]
Originally by: AonChilo I plan to upgrade after Windows 7 is released. For now I have WinXP with a SM v2.0b card: ATI Radeon X800 Pro 256mb RAM. This card is very sufficient to run my computer. Of course I can always temporarily cancel my game subscription of CCP cannot wait for Win 7 to release.
Read the blog ... your card will do fine
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John plissken
Caldari Terminal Logic NIght's Dawn
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Posted - 2009.01.21 12:02:00 -
[180]
are there any near future plans for the support of pixel shader 4.0 / 4.1? while it is respectful to think of the people with older pc's, & make sure they have the capability to run eve, it seems a shame that the people with decent pc's have to take a step down from their gpu's true potential. almost seems like the people with older pc's are holding eve back.
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