Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Whitehound
177
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 22:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am going to put this idea out, knowing quite well how some will hate it, but it is something I want CCP to consider.
Create a sub forum, which is only accessible to players who are paying for their game with a subscription or by buying GTCs. More precisely, make the sub forum inaccessible to players who only play EVE with PLEX.
What is the point? Only players who pay for their game with money also show an actual and believable interest in the company's financial success and only such players shall be heard on this sub forum.
I know it is a harsh idea, but seeing how some players do absolutely everything only to play for free (including botting) and yet voice their ideas and opinions everywhere might it be a good idea when there is a sub section on the forum where CCP can get at least the guarantee that everything said comes from players who have paid them money. It might give CCP a better picture of what players want and what they are willing to pay for.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Ai Shun
710
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 22:41:00 -
[2] - Quote
Getting their feedback is still useful. CCP will be able to tell how a player is subscribed. Whether they check this or if it is even relevant to them is another matter EVE Ambulation and Avatars as a separate game - see here |
mxzf
Shovel Bros
1299
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 22:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Eve already has paying-customer-only forums. They're every forum other than the Trial Accounts forum. CCP actually gets a tiny bit more from PLEXed accounts rather than credit card accounts due to the fact that PLEX cost more than $15. Trying to break people up into a caste system is just stupid. |
Whitehound
180
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 23:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
mxzf wrote:Eve already has paying-customer-only forums. They're every forum other than the Trial Accounts forum. CCP actually gets a tiny bit more from PLEXed accounts rather than credit card accounts due to the fact that PLEX cost more than $15. Trying to break people up into a caste system is just stupid. It is not a caste system. You simply have to pay for getting access to it. Such a sub forum might even have its own atmosphere different from the rest of the forum. It is at least worth a try and should not fall victim to total liberalism. We have not been heard enough by CCP in the past and it seems only fair and logical to have a sub forum without people who do not pay.
I would then not hesitate to place the entire CSM related part into it to give further meaning to the CSM. People have been complaining about Goonswarm making it to CSM or that the CSM would only represent minorities, because they think it makes the CSM a joke. Whatever the reasoning behind these complaints are do I find a CSM elected only by paying customers much more attractive than anything else.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Misanthra
Alternative Enterprises
53
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 23:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
umm, you do know scammers plex accounts quite easily, right? the dark side of eve of eve has little to no issue running the main and the forum alts full plex.
Since you say goons...here's how mittens got votes 3-4 at a time. Cap main, 2-3 cyno alts with the "jita" alt for scams/trading on it.. Cap mian spams havens, "jita" alts does the gimme 1 bil and I'll get you in goons, and spams 0.0 incurisions and finds the occassional ratter with shinies. All the isk needed to plex several accoutns right there. Or runs 0.0 PI if not enough.
If you want true paid only access....can't be plex. has to be 100% cc hit the account management screen per month. Plex....you have no quality control of member ship in the exclusive forum. All the mittens, snotshots, even derek chu's of eve....generally have no issues plexing and would be in the club as it were.
If you want quality control gonna have to leave these boards. Go to places like failheap. If you can deal with the ban 11's, the minimal post count before you even get to post in some forums....gratz you found your exclusive forum home. You get some good posts from people who don't even play the game since oddly enough...the more eve changes the more it stays the same in some regards. |
Whitehound
184
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 00:14:00 -
[6] - Quote
Misanthra wrote:umm, you do know scammers plex accounts quite easily, right? the dark side of eve of eve has little to no issue running the main and the forum alts full plex.
Since you say goons...here's how mittens got votes 3-4 at a time. Cap main, 2-3 cyno alts with the "jita" alt for scams/trading on it.. Cap mian spams havens, "jita" alts does the gimme 1 bil and I'll get you in goons, and spams 0.0 incurisions and finds the occassional ratter with shinies. All the isk needed to plex several accoutns right there. Or runs 0.0 PI if not enough.
If you want true paid only access....can't be plex. has to be 100% cc hit the account management screen per month. Plex....you have no quality control of member ship in the exclusive forum. All the mittens, snotshots, even derek chu's of eve....generally have no issues plexing and would be in the club as it were.
If you want quality control gonna have to leave these boards. Go to places like failheap. If you can deal with the ban 11's, the minimal post count before you even get to post in some forums....gratz you found your exclusive forum home. You get some good posts from people who don't even play the game since oddly enough...the more eve changes the more it stays the same in some regards. Maybe I was not clear enough. Only accounts that are being paid with subscriptions or GTCs will have access to the sub forum. Accounts that are being run with PLEX bought through ISKs will have no access. If you pay with a subscription, but use a PLEX to avoid the cost for a month will you also lose access to the sub forum for the same duration.
What people then say on this sub forum may or may not be be different from the rest of the forum, but it will come from players who are paying for the game and are getting recognized as such by CCP, which will likely lead to a better relationship between us.
People have used their subscription to voice their opinion in the past, including me. This should stay a single incident and not become the normality and such a sub forum could be of help here to identify problems sooner.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
655
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 00:27:00 -
[7] - Quote
I hate to ruin a good idea, but I would begin paying for this account with IRL money should this go through. Just so I can make sure you don't make more stupid threads like it in the exclusive subforum.
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Whitehound
184
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 00:31:00 -
[8] - Quote
Simi Kusoni wrote:I hate to ruin a good idea, but I would begin paying for this account with IRL money should this go through. Just so I can make sure you don't make more stupid threads like it in the exclusive subforum. No. You just hate it, but you are not ruining anything. You make my point even when you do not want to. Or what is the point of paying with money when you would not want to do this for CCP, but just to stop others from posting? It is this kind of logic that I would like to see being shut out.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
655
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 00:36:00 -
[9] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Simi Kusoni wrote:I hate to ruin a good idea, but I would begin paying for this account with IRL money should this go through. Just so I can make sure you don't make more stupid threads like it in the exclusive subforum. No. You just hate it, but you are not ruining anything. You make my point even when you do not want to. Or what is the point of paying with money when you would not want to do this for CCP, but just to stop others from posting? It is this kind of logic that I would like to see being shut out. Because:
A) I was partly joking, I already pay for one account by direct debit.
B) Terrible ideas like this spam the forums, ruin discussion for everyone, and bury the few decent threads that crop up.
C) Stupid people don't deserve to be sheltered from the opinions of smarter people.
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Stigman Zuwadza
Repercussus RAZOR Alliance
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 01:01:00 -
[10] - Quote
I'm inclined to agree...with myself.
You'd probably find you'd be double posting if there was a private / public setup of forums, you'd only miss out on all the good posts, ideas and discussion being had on the public front.
CCP could by all means create a private forum but it would only be to humor such paying customers as you. CCP would not want the public voice quelled, quashed or diminished in any way, shape or form.
Its also a little foolhardy to think that those paying with PLEX are not as committed to Eve as you, I think every Eve player that makes it past the trial is hooked ...well maybe a little longer.
Have a good one. o7
|
|
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
1348
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 01:23:00 -
[11] - Quote
Yes, that's what this forum needs: divisive elitism. "Hurr durr we deserve special treatment because we don't plex."
Why do you want to punish me for 1) being good enough at eve that I can afford PLEX, and 2) being frugal enough to save my hard-earned money? It's time to put an end to CCP's war on piracy. Fight your own battles and stop asking CCP to do it for you. |
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
105
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 01:23:00 -
[12] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:I am going to put this idea out, knowing quite well how some will hate it, but it is something I want CCP to consider.
Create a sub forum, which is only accessible to players who are paying for their game with a subscription or by buying GTCs. More precisely, make the sub forum inaccessible to players who only play EVE with PLEX.
What is the point? Only players who pay for their game with money also show an actual and believable interest in the company's financial success and only such players shall be heard on this sub forum. So, you clearly don't have any plan how the PLEX system works. Do you? |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
248
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 02:18:00 -
[13] - Quote
CCP should make a subforum where only OPs who use bold text are allowed. The entrance fee should be one million US dollars, to be delivered in un-marked, out-of-sequence, one-dollar bills. Or gold bullion. Only people who have their own superyacht should be able to post, the others should be read-only. For reference, if it isn't big enough to have its own helipad, it's not a superyacht. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
1246
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 02:48:00 -
[14] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Create a sub forum, which is only accessible to players who are paying for their game with a subscription or by buying GTCs. More precisely, make the sub forum inaccessible to players who only play EVE with PLEX.
What is the point? Only players who pay for their game with money also show an actual and believable interest in the company's financial success and only such players shall be heard on this sub forum.
I would support this idea if it meant us freetards were able to build block lists of all the entitled elitists who post in those exclusive forums only accessible to players who are not smart enough to pay for their game time in PLEX.
The first rule of investment applies here too: only ever spend other people's money. |
Katerwaul
The Scope Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 03:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
People who play the game enough to earn a plex for their character have no idea what constitutes fair/fun/creative gameplay?
Those same people don't invite friends & enrich the game for others and as such can have no game enriching ideas?
You feel entitled to have your own soap box to stand on while threatening not to pay any more money if you don't get your way in front of everyone else who pays money?
It might be number 3. Working with everyone to improve New Eden -- Internet Spaceships Iz Serious Business. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
820
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 03:09:00 -
[16] - Quote
Toasting in horrible elitist idea thread. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Alain Kinsella
104
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 08:46:00 -
[17] - Quote
Not going to work. In fact its likely to encourage *more* grief, since you've now created a forum that is not searchable by Google et al (therefore immune to most corporate and other background searches).
The original Second Life forum (circa 2004-2007) was setup this way, that only residents who had payment data on-file could access it. Nothing I've seen here even comes close to what I've seen over there (in particular their GD - which was eventually scrapped, after two attempts to revive it).
I may have come here from Myst Online, but that does not make me any less bloodthirsty than the average Eve player.
Just more subtle.
|
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 08:47:00 -
[18] - Quote
Katerwaul wrote:People who play the game enough to earn a plex for their character have no idea what constitutes fair/fun/creative gameplay? You would still be able to post into the regular forums. Only what people have to say who pay for their game with money and who enabled you to play for free would not be visible to you when they post in this sub forum. They can also choose to post into the regular threads. And if the fun of EVE is important to you, then why not pay for the game?
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Toasting in horrible elitist idea thread. Paying with money for a game you like is now elitist?
Seeing the other "arguments" against the idea gives a small picture of what we might get rid off when we would have such a sub forum.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 08:54:00 -
[19] - Quote
Your idea is dumb and based on "omg, all plex users are botters!!!!!". Some of us actually simply know the game very well to make isk the easy way, so they should probably listen to us more than mere subscribers. Also, you realise that people who use plex actually net CCP more income? I propose that people who use subs are only allowed to pot in a specific S(cr)ub forum. |
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 09:18:00 -
[20] - Quote
Vilnius Zar wrote:Also, you do realise that people who use plex actually net CCP more income? No, they do not. The people who buy GTCs and who sell them in game as PLEX do. It is these players who shall be heard, and without the voices of those who cannot afford to pay for the game. CCP is a company and as such needs to make money and have a growth. While giving everyone a voice here on the forum, which you will continue to have, should one also respect the interests of CCP as a company. I, as a paying costumer then do not wish to be treated like a "cashcow" or a "freeloader" by CCP only to be forced to voice my opinion with my wallet in the end.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
|
Reaver Glitterstim
Resurrected Darkness
119
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 09:20:00 -
[21] - Quote
What if I just happen to notice one day that I have an awful lot of isk I'm not using, and plex my account a few times to save money? Do I lose access to the forums? -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
663
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 09:24:00 -
[22] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:No, they do not. The people who buy GTCs and who sell them in game as PLEX do. It is these players who shall be heard, and without the voices of those who cannot afford to pay for the game. And if richer players didn't buy PLEX with ISK, poorer players wouldn't have bought PLEX with real money. The PLEX market would crash, and everyone would return to paying CCP directly or RMTing.
Whitehound wrote:CCP is a company and as such needs to make money and have a growth. While giving everyone a voice here on the forum, which you will continue to have, should one also respect the interests of CCP as a company. I, as a paying costumer then do not wish to be treated like a "cashcow" or a "freeloader" by CCP only to be forced to voice my opinion with my wallet in the end. This is the point you don't understand, the PLEX market is a massive source of income for CCP, especially since they get slightly more from those buying plex than from those paying by direct debit.
The fact that you aren't smart enough to buy PLEX with in game money, doesn't mean you have some innate understanding of Eve's core game mechanic's, or that you are more interested in what is "good for the game". Conversely, I'd argue that those among us too stupid to earn large amounts of ISK probably have a much weaker understanding of the game, and their opinion is probably of less value.
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 09:32:00 -
[23] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:What if I just happen to notice one day that I have an awful lot of isk I'm not using, and plex my account a few times to save money? Do I lose access to the forums? Yes. You will have to take this into consideration when you want to stop paying CCP for their game and instead choose to play for free.
An alternative for you could be to create an alt account with your ISKs/PLEX, but keep paying for at least one (your main) account and thereby to keep your voice on such a particular sub forum.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 09:34:00 -
[24] - Quote
Simi Kusoni wrote:This is the point you don't understand, the PLEX market is a massive source of income for CCP, especially since they get slightly more from those buying plex than from those paying by direct debit. Nothing about PLEX would change. It would keep giving CCP money.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
663
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 09:42:00 -
[25] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Nothing about PLEX would change. It would keep giving CCP money. It is about creating a sub forum with limited access. It is not going to affect your game in a bad way. Only the people who pay for the game can cause the game harm and therefore should be recognized and heard exclusively in a special sub forum. You just don't get it do you.
What happens if we who buy lots of PLEX, stop buying PLEX? The price of PLEX plummits? You space poor guys stop buying it, thereby paying less money to CCP, and CCP is hurt.
We are buying game time, and we are buying it through you. If I were to unsub the six accounts I pay for with PLEX, and leave only my main, this is not "good" for CCP. We drive the PLEX market, the PLEX market makes CCP money.
Understanding yet?
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 09:57:00 -
[26] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Vilnius Zar wrote:Also, you do realise that people who use plex actually net CCP more income? No, they do not. The people who buy GTCs and who sell them in game as PLEX do. It is these players who shall be heard, and without the voices of those who cannot afford to pay for the game. CCP is a company and as such needs to make money and have a growth. While giving everyone a voice here on the forum, which you will continue to have, should one also respect the interests of CCP as a company. I, as a paying costumer then do not wish to be treated like a "cashcow" or a "freeloader" by CCP only to be forced to voice my opinion with my wallet in the end.
1 If we don't buy your plex, you have no one to sell them to 2 subscriptions are cheaper than using plex
Those two combined means that us plex subs are GOOD for EVE while also being good for you as you wouldn't be able to buy isk otherwise, and would probably turn to RMT. You really don't understand how this whole thing works. Then again, looking at your BC entries you don't seem to understand the game as a whole.
Stop voicing your thoughts. |
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 10:25:00 -
[27] - Quote
Vilnius Zar wrote:1 If we don't buy your plex, you have no one to sell them to 2 subscriptions are cheaper than using plex
Those two combined means that us plex subs are GOOD for EVE while also being good for you as you wouldn't be able to buy isk otherwise, and would probably turn to RMT. You really don't understand how this whole thing works. Then again, looking at your BC entries you don't seem to understand the game as a whole.
Stop voicing your thoughts. Why not buy a subscription when they are cheaper than PLEX? The answer is simple. You do not want to pay at all, but you want others to pay it for you. You do not care that those who allow you to play for free have to pay more for it than a subscriber does, but it serves you as an argument for your own cause, which is to get as much for free as possible. This is the kind of attitude I wish to see being shut out by having a sub forum for paying customers only.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 10:42:00 -
[28] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Vilnius Zar wrote:1 If we don't buy your plex, you have no one to sell them to 2 subscriptions are cheaper than using plex
Those two combined means that us plex subs are GOOD for EVE while also being good for you as you wouldn't be able to buy isk otherwise, and would probably turn to RMT. You really don't understand how this whole thing works. Then again, looking at your BC entries you don't seem to understand the game as a whole.
Stop voicing your thoughts. Why not buy a subscription when they are cheaper than PLEX? The answer is simple. You do not want to pay at all, but you want others to pay it for you. You do not care that those who allow you to play for free have to pay more for it than a subscriber does, but it serves you as an argument for your own cause, which is to get as much for free as possible. This is the kind of attitude I wish to see being shut out by having a sub forum for paying customers only.
God you're dumb and annoying. Time to do an activity check on your whole alliance.
|
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
664
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 10:45:00 -
[29] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Vilnius Zar wrote:1 If we don't buy your plex, you have no one to sell them to 2 subscriptions are cheaper than using plex
Those two combined means that us plex subs are GOOD for EVE while also being good for you as you wouldn't be able to buy isk otherwise, and would probably turn to RMT. You really don't understand how this whole thing works. Then again, looking at your BC entries you don't seem to understand the game as a whole.
Stop voicing your thoughts. Why not buy a subscription when they are cheaper than PLEX? The answer is simple. You do not want to pay at all, but you want others to pay it for you. You do not care that those who allow you to play for free have to pay more for it than a subscriber does, but it serves you as an argument for your own cause, which is to get as much for free as possible. This is the kind of attitude I wish to see being shut out by having a sub forum for paying customers only. And you do not want to play the game, and earn ISK like the rest of us. This is exactly the kind of attitude I would like to see shut out of the game.
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 10:50:00 -
[30] - Quote
Simi Kusoni wrote:And you do not want to play the game, and earn ISK like the rest of us. This is exactly the kind of attitude I would like to see shut out of the game. What makes you say that? I have ISKs and I pay for a subscription.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
|
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
1351
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 10:52:00 -
[31] - Quote
You never answered my question. Why should I be excluded for choosing to use plex?
Either you're a decent troll, or someone who lacks a fundamental understanding of how the whole system works. It's time to put an end to CCP's war on piracy. Fight your own battles and stop asking CCP to do it for you. |
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 10:56:00 -
[32] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:You never answered my question. Why should I be excluded for choosing to use plex? I did answer your question. You are being excluded because of the choice you make. It is a concept we are all very familiar with.
Answer me a question, what does money mean to you and why do you choose not to give some to CCP?
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Whitehound
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 12:08:00 -
[33] - Quote
Vilnius Zar wrote:God you're dumb and annoying. I get that you are being mad, but you should have some more trust in those players who pay for their game. Before there was PLEX were there only paying players and without them would EVE not have grown to a size to all for a free-to-play. What reasons do you really have to hate them?
If it is of any value to you then know that I do not buy PLEX with ISKs nor do I speculate with PLEX to make more ISKs, but that I stick entirely to my subscription. I leave PLEX to those who like to play for free and take no advantage of these players through market manipulations.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Verity Sovereign
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
160
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 12:18:00 -
[34] - Quote
Quote:why do you choose not to give some to CCP?
Because I know CCP is getting its money anyway. If I paid $15 for a one month sub, then someone doesn't pay $17 for a plex to sell to me.
Some people like PvPing in faction BS's, (or whatever other reason, maybe having a T2 BPO and a Titan fleet gives them a hardon), and need ISK, lots of it. I help supply that ISK to them. If people like me didn't plex, they wouldn't be buying Plex. They then wouldn't be able to play the game the way they want to. They would either turn to RMT (where someone other than CCP gets their money), which would eventually get them banned, or they would stop playing. CCP would go from having * 1 person paying $15 per month + $17 for a PLEX to sell, to having one of the following:
* Best case scenario: 2 players paying $15 per month * 1 Player paying $15 per month, the Plex seller quite because he doesn't want to do the ISK making things, he wants to use expensive stuff he could only afford by selling PLEX * 1 player paying $15 per month, the PLEX buyer quit because IRL he's on a budget, and his wife/GF targetted his "space WOW" as the first thing to get cut) * 0 players, PLEX seller quit because he couldn't play the way he wanted, PLEX buyer quite because he couldn't justify payng $180 per year for a game
Which scenario is best for CCP? Oh, I know you'll suggest the PLEX seller can just directly pay for in game ISK * It screws up the ingame economy as ISK is being created, not transfered - It is not set by the "free market" - but fixed by CCP, one of the draws of EVE is the player driven economy - EVE is derided as Pay-To-Win - subscriptions plummet - congratulations, you just killed EVE
PLEX is one thing EVE did right... I'm considering stopping PLEXing, simply because coming up with >1 billion ISK each month is getting to be a bit hard given my time constraints (and I took a break from incursioning after CCP's server gank resulted in the loss of my nightmare, they reimbursed the ship and destroyed modules upon a petition, but I still lost half a Billion in modules, plus the Incursioning had gotten my corp some nuisance wardecs, and I became a gank target in my home system, so my incursion boat+fitting has been a hangar queen for the last month or two).
When I had time earlier, I was becoming space rich even as I stockpiled 10 PLEXes, and had 3 faction BS's, and multiple faction Frigs + deadspace and faction modules. Now my "new additions" have slowed to a halt, and I find myself just trying to maintain my PLEX stockpile.
Paying *too much* for PLEX might be bad for CCP, as the seller may get all the ISK they want from.. lets say 4 plexes instead of 5 - they thus pay CCP less. PLEX is self regulating, and gets CCP more money.
So, you are asking me why I participate in a system that gets CCP more money than if I didn't participate, and then telling me that its a sign I don't care about the game. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
203
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 12:31:00 -
[35] - Quote
why do you think that "paying customers" are better posters?
What did trick you into the belief someone who recently paid his trial account can compete with people playing for years and earned enough ISK to pay their accounts with, in terms of their posting quality? |
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 12:48:00 -
[36] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:What did trick you into the belief someone who recently paid his trial account can compete with people playing for years and earned enough ISK to pay their accounts with, in terms of their posting quality? Why should a veteran not pay for his game when it means something to him?
Veterans with a lot of ISKs, who have stopped paying for EVE, have placed CCP into a tricky spot in the first place. CCP needs to listen to the economy before everything else and when the money then only comes from rookies what reasons then remain to treat such veterans like paying customers?
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
665
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 13:18:00 -
[37] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Why should a veteran not pay for his game when it means something to him?
Veterans with a lot of ISKs, who have stopped paying for EVE, have placed CCP into a tricky spot in the first place. CCP needs to listen to the economy before everything else and when the money then only comes from rookies what reasons then remain to treat such veterans like paying customers? CCP is not in a "tricky spot", the money comes "only from rookies", who pay for a service that results in wealth being redistributed from richer, smarter players. Were PLEX to be removed, the poor players would merely turn to RMT. Or they'd quit because they can't afford x,y,z and aren't patient enough to grind for it.
Besides, you're wrong in your assumption that only rookies buy plex, and that only vets can afford them. Plenty of "young" players can afford plex, and plenty of older ones are too stupid or lazy to have worked out how to make a decent amount of ISK yet.
And for another thing, you fail to understand the nature of plex. If poor players didn't buy plex, rich players wouldn't spend real money on it. If rich players unsubscribe from Eve, poor players stop buying and selling plex. If rich players unsubscribe from Eve, CCP loses money.
Are you understanding this yet?
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Buzzy Warstl
The Strontium Asylum
126
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 13:22:00 -
[38] - Quote
The OP is proof that having money does not make one a useful poster. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
822
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 13:33:00 -
[39] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Petrus Blackshell wrote:Toasting in horrible elitist idea thread. Paying with money for a game you like is now elitist? Seeing the other "arguments" against the idea gives a small picture of what we might get rid off when we would have such a sub forum. Great profiling, bro. I do not pay for my subscription with PLEX, regardless of how bad you may think my posting is.
The only thing this idea would get rid of is the stupid posts claiming that Eve is F2P, and that if you pay for it you are doing it wrong. Those posts are few enough that fracturing the community over them really isn't worth it. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 13:37:00 -
[40] - Quote
Simi Kusoni wrote:Besides, you're wrong in your assumption that only rookies buy plex, and that only vets can afford them. Plenty of "young" players can afford plex, and plenty of older ones are too stupid or lazy to have worked out how to make a decent amount of ISK yet.
And for another thing, you fail to understand the nature of plex. If poor players didn't buy plex, rich players wouldn't spend real money on it. If rich players unsubscribe from Eve, poor players stop buying and selling plex. If rich players unsubscribe from Eve, CCP loses money.
Are you understanding this yet? The assumption you are talking off was a response to Robert Caldera, who mixed player experience with money. It simply does not mix and any logic based on it will fail. How PLEX works or even if I fail to understand it is of no relevance for creating a sub forum. Try not too read too much into it. It still is only a suggestion to create a sub forum exclusively for paying customers.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO 'Mr. Nice' Hilmar |
|
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
1353
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 13:37:00 -
[41] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Answer me a question, what does money mean to you and why do you choose not to give some to CCP? This is where your ignorance shines through.
Why do people buy PLEX? Because they want to trade them for isk.
Who buys PLEX from those poeple? People like me.
*I* give PLEX its value. Without me and thousands others like me, there would be no market for PLEX and CCP could not sell them. My contribution to CCP's wallet is adding to the demand which motivates others to buy enough PLEX to cover my subscriptions. They get their subscription fees from me, it's simply generated by a different means.
As for what money means to me: it's a way to get stuff I want. I'm able to get Eve without it, allowing me to put that money to other purposes. But my frugality offends you somehow, and you believe you are entitled to special treatment because you spend a whopping $15 a month to play and have no understanding of the economics of the game. It's time to put an end to CCP's war on piracy. Fight your own battles and stop asking CCP to do it for you. |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
669
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 13:52:00 -
[42] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:The assumption you are talking off was a response to Robert Caldera, who mixed player experience with money. It simply does not mix and any logic based on it will fail. How PLEX works or even if I fail to understand it is of no relevance for creating a sub forum. Try not too read too much into it. It still is only a suggestion to create a sub forum exclusively for paying customers. You fail to understand the nature of plex. If space rich players didn't buy plex, poor players wouldn't spend real money on it. If rich players unsubscribe from Eve, poor players stop buying and selling plex. If rich players unsubscribe from Eve, CCP loses money.
Are you understanding this yet? People who buy plex are paying customers. Other than creating a sub-forum for people who don't understand enough of Eve's game mechanics to spend 500m ISK a month, your idea achieves nothing.
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
mxzf
Shovel Bros
1307
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:09:00 -
[43] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Simi Kusoni wrote:bla bla bla No. You fail to understand that this is of no relevance. Just like a sack of rise falling over somewhere in China is of no relevance to the creation of a sub forum. Are you working to be this stupid or does it come naturally? Please stop, sit down for a bit, and try to think through the economic implications of the PLEX system yet. If the stuff these posters doesn't suddenly click, you haven't thought about it hard enough.
Here's a few simple points for you: PLEX cost ~$17, subscriptions cost $15 For every PLEX bought, it has to be used by someone, otherwise it's worthless People use PLEX for their accounts because they have RL financial commitments or know the game well enough to make the ISK for PLEX Knowing the game well enough to make 500M/month doesn't make you a bad poster, quite the opposite Elitism, on any level, is a bad thing in societies. And is a particularly stupid idea in this case because most of the worst posters are paying with their credit cards
Here's the sort version for you: CCP makes more money for every PLEX player than it does for every credit card player. |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
340
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:18:00 -
[44] - Quote
This is a dumb idea.
Someone's method of paying for the game does not appreciably change the opinions they express on the forum. My own forumwarrioring has not changed significantly in the last two months that I have begun paying in PLEX rather than real money. You are not special.
I could make a very similar argument for creating a PLEXers-only forum (we play the game enough/are knowledgable enough to pay for our sub in ISK), but it would be similarly elitist and pointless. |
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:33:00 -
[45] - Quote
Kahega Amielden wrote:I could make a very similar argument for creating a PLEXers-only forum (we play the game enough/are knowledgable enough to pay for our sub in ISK), but it would be similarly elitist and pointless. This is the same idea, only will you have to make all the existing forum sections inaccessible. It is not what I am suggesting.
I understand the objections and your fears that you would be missing out on something. It is however necessary to give a voice to the paying players who with their money carry the company and with it the game.
Any free-to-play arguments are of no use, because the game existed long before there was a free-to-play and as we have learned is at risk of growing further, because of the protest by paying customers.
|
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
205
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:42:00 -
[46] - Quote
still a terribad idea. No class system for players should be introduced to forums, everyone who plays matters equally regardless how they pay their playtime.
This "paying customer" is a massive bullshit anyways, everyone who plays is one because its how PLEX come into game - a PLEX is always paid by someone with RL money. So if I've got enough ISK I dont know where to spend anyways, why then not save RL money and let someone else with less ISK pay for me, this doesnt make me less relevant. On the other hand there are enough people who simply cant afford spending RL money on the game, so they grind their ISK and buy PLEX for ISK - those people arent less releavant either.
-> awful idea is awful. |
Astroniomix
EliteTroll
56
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:50:00 -
[47] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Kahega Amielden wrote:I could make a very similar argument for creating a PLEXers-only forum (we play the game enough/are knowledgable enough to pay for our sub in ISK), but it would be similarly elitist and pointless. This is the same idea, only will you have to make all the existing forum sections inaccessible. It is not what I am suggesting. I understand the objections and your fears that you would be missing out on something. It is however necessary to give a voice to the paying players who with their money carry the company and with it the game. Any free-to-play arguments are of no use, because the game existed long before there was a free-to-play and as we have learned is at risk of growing further, because of the protest by paying customers. Actualy the majority of us paying customers have no qualms about people who pay with plex. I actualy encourage people to try to plex their accounts. (I don't plex my accounts but only because I like imaginary space money more than RL money) |
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:52:00 -
[48] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:still a terribad idea. No class system for players should be introduced to forums, everyone who plays matters equally regardless how they pay their playtime. Which is how we all became cashcows and freeloaders, because one can matter only so much.
It is the way of the industry. It may not be like this with games, but the opinions of shareholders to a company do get recognized. It does not mean they are always right. However, companies had to learn the hard way that ignoring those people who take a financial interest in them also posses power over them.
What do you suggest to avoid players from protesting with their wallets? Or do you not care?
|
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
822
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:52:00 -
[49] - Quote
Astroniomix wrote:Actualy the majority of us paying customers have no qualms about people who pay with plex. I actualy encourage people to try to plex their accounts. (I don't plex my accounts but only because I like imaginary space money more than RL money) I, too, support the idea that more people should by PLEX with ISK. Make the prices go up even higher, so when I buy PLEX with RL money, I get more bang for my buck (literally). Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Liam Mirren
458
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:53:00 -
[50] - Quote
Stop trying to reason with this clown, just wardec him and his fail alliance and tell him he can buy it off by giving you a plex. Then ask him if this transaction was good or bad for CCP. Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
My guides: http://mirren.freeforums.org |
|
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
205
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:58:00 -
[51] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:still a terribad idea. No class system for players should be introduced to forums, everyone who plays matters equally regardless how they pay their playtime. Which is how we all became cashcows and freeloaders, because one can matter only so much. It is the way of the industry. It may not be like this with games, but the opinions of shareholders to a company do get recognized. It does not mean they are always right. However, companies had to learn the hard way that ignoring those people who take a financial interest in them also posses power over them. What do you suggest to avoid players from protesting with their wallets? Or do you not care?
but for everyone who buys PLEX for ISK, REAL MONEY HAS FLOWED! If players protest with their wallets and dont buy PLEX anymore, those who paid RL money for them with intentions of selling them for ISK, suddenly dont get any ISK, get pis*ed and dont buy PLEX anymore for real money. In the same time those who are protesting with the wallets, would have to buy gametime for themselves and spend money on it. So what is the problem exactly? |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
822
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 14:59:00 -
[52] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:So what is the problem exactly? OP doesn't get to feel smug and superior for being wealthy IRL. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:04:00 -
[53] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:So what is the problem exactly? You try to fight what has not happened yet. I try to fight what did happen.
You want me to believe that it is worth to stop playing EVE by not buying PLEX with ISKs, because you cannot get access to a new forum section?
|
Liam Mirren
460
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:07:00 -
[54] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:So what is the problem exactly?
It's based on the false premise that subs are better for CCP than plex paid accounts, which they're not. Another premise is that people who pay RL cash somehow are more knowledgeable on EVE and thus should have their voice heard more. Thing is OP clearly pays with RL cash but is an ingame idiot, I pay with plex and know wtf I'm doing so using these two samples it's obvious that this premise is completely wrong.
OP has no case, is an idiot and doesn't want to learn logic, that's the exact problem. Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
My guides: http://mirren.freeforums.org |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
205
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:14:00 -
[55] - Quote
Liam Mirren wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:So what is the problem exactly? It's based on the false premise that subs are better for CCP than plex paid accounts, which they're not. Another premise is that people who pay RL cash somehow are more knowledgeable on EVE and thus should have their voice heard more. Thing is OP clearly pays with RL cash but is an ingame idiot, I pay with plex and know wtf I'm doing so using these two samples it's obvious that this premise is completely wrong. OP has no case, is an idiot and doesn't want to learn logic, that's the exact problem.
agree |
Astroniomix
EliteTroll
56
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:19:00 -
[56] - Quote
Liam Mirren wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:So what is the problem exactly? It's based on the false premise that subs are better for CCP than plex paid accounts, which they're not. Another premise is that people who pay RL cash somehow are more knowledgeable on EVE and thus should have their voice heard more. Thing is OP clearly pays with RL cash but is an ingame idiot, I pay with plex and know wtf I'm doing so using these two samples it's obvious that this premise is completely wrong. OP has no case, is an idiot and doesn't want to learn logic, that's the exact problem. Inbound wardec? |
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:25:00 -
[57] - Quote
Astroniomix wrote:Inbound wardec? I am a trader. The alliance and corporation is all my own. I can sit out any war dec, just so you know.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO "Mr. Nice" Hilmar |
Liam Mirren
464
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:29:00 -
[58] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:I am a trader. The alliance and corporation is all my own.
Thanks for that extra info, I figured the corp that joined you recently wasn't affiliated but it's good to know that they are. Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
My guides: http://mirren.freeforums.org |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
671
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:30:00 -
[59] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Astroniomix wrote:Inbound wardec? I am a trader. The alliance and corporation is all my own. I can sit out any war dec, just so you know. For a trader your grasp of economic theory is shocking.
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Verity Sovereign
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
161
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:31:00 -
[60] - Quote
so your toon never undocks? Or you have a bunch of alts that you pay for with RL money?
If you fly industrials as part of your trading, you'd better watch out. |
|
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:40:00 -
[61] - Quote
Liam Mirren wrote:Thanks for that extra info, I figured the corp that joined you recently wasn't affiliated but it's good to know that they are. Impress me and support my suggestion, or war dec me and see if I am serious about my suggestion. Your call.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO "Mr. Nice" Hilmar |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
672
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:47:00 -
[62] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Liam Mirren wrote:Thanks for that extra info, I figured the corp that joined you recently wasn't affiliated but it's good to know that they are. Impress me and support my suggestion, or war dec me and see if I am serious about my suggestion. Your call. Option C) Stop giving a crap about this terrible thread, and begin trolling it like the rest of us have for the past 3 pages.
When your threads reach three pages in length, without finding a single supporter, its generally a bad sign.
--Will Support Your Terrible Forum Thread For ISK-- |
Liam Mirren
465
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 15:49:00 -
[63] - Quote
Why should I support a suggestion that's based on false info and broken logic?
If you're calling my bluff, that's very much a bad idea unless you never undock and don't have alts that do, cause I will find out. Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
My guides: http://mirren.freeforums.org |
Whitehound
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 16:01:00 -
[64] - Quote
Liam Mirren wrote:Why should I support a suggestion that's based on false info and broken logic? Because it is not about that. It is about giving CCP a second view on the player base. One with all players and the other with only paying players. If anything comes up on the exclusive sub forum can CCP address it independently and possibly avoid another **** storm like the last one.
Just so you know, I was not happy when I read that 20% of CCP's staff had been fired and it was not what I wanted to see disappear when I stopped my subscription. It made me wiser and to try and find a better way to voice my opinion when there is something I do not want to pay for.
No more crappy expansions!-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired!" - CEO "Mr. Nice" Hilmar |
Liam Mirren
465
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 16:02:00 -
[65] - Quote
You're a moron, I like morons and I love evewho. Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
My guides: http://mirren.freeforums.org |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
1358
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 16:08:00 -
[66] - Quote
In honor of this thread, I just plexed all my accounts again. It's time to put an end to CCP's war on piracy. Fight your own battles and stop asking CCP to do it for you. |
Liam Mirren
466
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 16:13:00 -
[67] - Quote
FU Grimpak Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
My guides: http://mirren.freeforums.org |
|
ISD Rontea
Community Communications Liaisons
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 18:52:00 -
[68] - Quote
Thread locked at the OP's request. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |