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Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3039
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:16:00 -
[181] - Quote
TWHC Assistant wrote:Goons... You cannot own someone for what they do not care for.
I studied mathematics at a university about 20 years ago. What do you think of that?! I just do not care for it any more.
You want to own me... You have no idea what you are going to get, kid. i think you're about as good at retorts as you are at math
TWHC Assistant wrote:Weaselior wrote:please to be explaining the need for additional powergrid that is not simply adding more tanking The choice you have in fitting the Hulk and the mining ships in general are pretty thin. Giving them more PG allows for them to fit not only shield extenders, but you can fit ABs and MWDs, too.
so you get mods that are tank mods, and...mods that are useless in every situation unless you want to afk speed-tank as well
so yes you're just bleeting for more afk tank |
TWHC Assistant
48
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:23:00 -
[182] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:i think you're about as good at retorts as you are at math I do not care for them either.
Quote:so you get mods that are tank mods, and...mods that are useless in every situation unless you want to afk speed-tank as well
so yes you're just bleeting for more afk tank You can also fit a cap battery or a shield booster. It is irrelevant what you do with the PG. You can always choose to fit nothing and people will do just that. It is not your decision to make. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3039
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:27:00 -
[183] - Quote
as it turns out demolishing your terrible attempts to pretend you're not just looking for a buff to afk mining is what i do well
like all ships, the hulk is limited through slot layout and cpu/pg to have specific limits on what it can do
"afk mine in perfect safety" is outside those limits for a reason
you're fooling no one with your pathetically bad attempts to pretend a pg buff is anything but a pure "give me more shields im bad at this game" |
Elinarien
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:30:00 -
[184] - Quote
Would love to hear from gankers on their experiences of trying to / actually taking down a tanked Hulk. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3039
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:48:00 -
[185] - Quote
Elinarien wrote:Would love to hear from gankers on their experiences of trying to / actually taking down a tanked Hulk. it's a pain in the ass, fortunately most hulk people can't figure out how to tank a hulk at all
if a hulk is well-tanked i usually just gank the other guys in the system who aren't, no reason to slow down the murdering to kill the one guy who knows what a DCII is |
TWHC Assistant
48
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:50:00 -
[186] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:as it turns out demolishing your terrible attempts to pretend you're not just looking for a buff to afk mining is what i do well
like all ships, the hulk is limited through slot layout and cpu/pg to have specific limits on what it can do No. You are only terrible at understanding the issues. Of course, people will use the extra PG for more tank. You do this with every ship, but not all will do so and you can continue to gank miners and to teach them a lesson. Only those who have learned their lesson will be harder for you to gank. Giving the Hulk more eHP directly would change this learning process too much. Leaving it the way it is makes the reward for learning the lesson not worth it. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
904
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:58:00 -
[187] - Quote
TWHC Assistant wrote: No. You are only terrible at understanding the issues. Of course, people will use the extra agility for getting out before getting shot. You do this with every ship, but not all will do so and you can continue to gank miners and to teach them a lesson. Only those who have learned their lesson will be harder for you to gank. Giving the Hulk more eHP directly would change this learning process too much. Leaving it the way it is makes the reward for learning the lesson not worth it.
FTFY. I like my idea better, it achieves the same result, and requires more user input and interaction (which is what a game is supposed to do, eh?) Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3039
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Posted - 2012.05.03 17:59:00 -
[188] - Quote
TWHC Assistant wrote:Weaselior wrote:as it turns out demolishing your terrible attempts to pretend you're not just looking for a buff to afk mining is what i do well
like all ships, the hulk is limited through slot layout and cpu/pg to have specific limits on what it can do No. You are only terrible at understanding the issues. Of course, people will use the extra PG for more tank. You do this with every ship, but not all will do so and you can continue to gank miners and to teach them a lesson. Only those who have learned their lesson will be harder for you to gank. Giving the Hulk more eHP directly would change this learning process too much. Leaving it the way it is makes the reward for learning the lesson not worth it. nonsense: adding more powergrid allows you to fit a stronger tank without gimping your yield it is a pure gift to afk miners
miners who are not basically legally botting can always escape |
Elinarien
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.05.03 18:33:00 -
[189] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:Elinarien wrote:Would love to hear from gankers on their experiences of trying to / actually taking down a tanked Hulk. it's a pain in the ass, fortunately most hulk people can't figure out how to tank a hulk at all if a hulk is well-tanked i usually just gank the other guys in the system who aren't, no reason to slow down the murdering to kill the one guy who knows what a DCII is
Thanks for the feedback. |
TWHC Assistant
48
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Posted - 2012.05.03 18:53:00 -
[190] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:nonsense: adding more powergrid allows you to fit a stronger tank without gimping your yield it is a pure gift to afk miners
miners who are not basically legally botting can always escape No, you post nonsense. You act like Hulkageddon is going to die. Start thinking about the extra loot you will get from a Hulk. |
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Jason Aya
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.05.16 01:36:00 -
[191] - Quote
CCP has made Hulks a joke.
They do what the do well but have been made too easy to kill. Don't cry to me that it is a mining ship not a fighting ship. You don't have an argument or an IQ.
A Hulk tanks like a pinata. A Hulk with full t2 defense modules tanks like a pinata with a condom pulled over its head. A Hulk with officer/faction modules tanks like a pinata with a condom pulled over its head that has been ribbed for ganker's pleasure.
When I last looked, Hulkageddon has cost the miners of EVE 1.2 Trillion isk.
FIX IT CCP. This is bullcrap.
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Kuyomi
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.05.21 02:08:00 -
[192] - Quote
How about you stop using hulks in hisec if they're ganked so easily? How about moving to nullsec? Maybe wormholes interest you? Consider just using a coveter. If you don't like the hulk, don't use the hulk. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
1023
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Posted - 2012.05.21 03:10:00 -
[193] - Quote
Are you serious? We're necroing this? Really?
Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Drakarin
Omnitech Corporation Wonder Kids
7
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Posted - 2012.05.21 06:36:00 -
[194] - Quote
Immortis Vexx wrote:The hulk does NOT need more tank! The ship is built for ONE thing and ONE thing only. Mining. When you have a specialty ship that's built to do something it SUCKS at everything else. That's the reason they call it a SPECIALIZED ship. The description states that it is able to handle the rigors of deep space and it truly can. You can easily tank a hulk to handle low sec rats. The hulk is in NO way a pvp ship nor should it be. Ever.
Vexx
Sorry, but what are you talking about?
No one is saying the Hulk should be a PvP ship. It merely should not be possible to take it out with 2 moderately trained pilots using destroyers when in high sec.
Yes, you can avoid it, but let's be serious here, a ship that expensive should not be THAT vulnerable. |
Katran Luftschreck
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
9
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Posted - 2012.05.21 07:39:00 -
[195] - Quote
Drakarin wrote:Yes, you can avoid it, but let's be serious here, a ship that expensive should not be THAT vulnerable.
Which brings us to the obvious solution: CCP needs to simply bring the price down on Hulks.
That way the gankers won't pee their diapers over the idea of a Hulk that actually takes more than two destroyers to gank.
The miners (who probably built those destroyers in the first place) won't end up bankrupted every time some ganker uses them as a punching bag to make up for their lack of a sex life.
It's really that simple. Just bring the cost of Hulks down in line to it's actual performance (read: very low). A Hulk currently costs more than your average battleship - twice as much in some cases. They average five times the cost of the Covetor that it's based off of, which is actually the safer ship to fly because of Hulkageddon. This is absurd.
CCP should simply bring down the number of specialty (read: moon) materials needed to build a Hulk and thus bring the overall price down. Because in reality, if it is going to be little more than a suped-up Covetor with a giant bullseye on it, then it shouldn't break the bank to replace.
The loss of a Hulk should be a setback, not the cause of people wanting to unsub. Just drop the build materials to a more sensible level. More people will be building them and the price will drop to something more balanced with their actual (pathetic) self-defense abilities.
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Saladinae
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
12
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Posted - 2012.05.21 08:11:00 -
[196] - Quote
Wuxi Wuxilla wrote:As I said before, there is no possible way to destroy a tanked Hulk solo in a Catalyst (and much less in a Thrasher), even with max fittings - We're talking about a fit you need AWU V for here. It isn't even possible for a single Tornado, unless he gets lucky, you are in 0.5 and even then he needs max skills - BC V, max gunnery support and AWU V.
You know that catalysts can easily hit 650 dps, which can be raised further with cheapo implants to 720. Using t2 mods and expensive implants (you don't' lose pod to concord) will get you to 790 dps. I daresay what you can achieve with a Talos instead of a Catalyst.
You may ask how does one each 650+dps in a cata?
Lows: Mag Sab II x2 Meds: 1MN afterburner + Warp scram Highs: Light Ion Blaster x8 + void ammo (overheat) Rigs: Small Hybrid Burst and Collision Drone: Hob 2
So how do you get to 700+ dps all the way out the 790? Well you need to drop prop and tackle mods and a have an alt/friend in 1 tier one fitted merlin or punisher to hold the point.
Then you equip the following: Lows: Mag Stab x 2 Meds: NONE Highs: Light Neutron Blaster x 8 + void (overheat) Rigs: Small Hybrid burst and collision Drone Hob 2 Add any level of implants you want all the way to 790 dps as CONCORD won't pop your pod. Winmatar > Everything else |
Ayame Tao
22
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Posted - 2012.05.21 09:44:00 -
[197] - Quote
Assuming you can fly all that, given that it requires a bunch of IV & V skills which many disposable gank-alts rolled up for Hulkageddon don't have. Considering a 20 second response time for CONCORD, less if you're in a higher sec system, a Catalyst fitted for that much gank can put out ~14,000 damage in that time. A well tanked Hulk sits at ~25,000+ EHP (with 80% resists to kinetic/thermal too)
Meaning that a well tanked Hulk is beyond a solo Catalyst, even with extreme fittings and a head full of ISK.
No doubt Catalysts can put out some amazing DPS for their size and cost. No debate about that.
The point is that many in this thread and others have been upset that a single destroyer can gank 'such an expensive ship' and the counterpoint here was to show that isn't possible unless you choose to allow it (by fitting no tank or by being AFK etc)
A well tanked Hulk requires gankers to bring friends - for extra DPS or to hold points etc. If 2 Catalysts and a tackle frigate suddenly show up on your d-scan, and you don't dock up your expensive gank-magnet, then I (and some other contributers) believe that you don't get the luxury of demanding nerfs/buffs/chees&whine.
Thanks for the extreme Catalyst fit though, I didn't think it could get up to nearly 800 dps Nerf The Catalyst!
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
242
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Posted - 2012.05.21 10:47:00 -
[198] - Quote
dont mine in high sec, go to 0.0. Hulk is fine. |
Ynot Eyob
Nisroc Angels The Obsidian Front
190
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Posted - 2012.05.21 11:10:00 -
[199] - Quote
Alot of the ganking issues would be solved if the Hulk pilots just tanked their hulks instead of flying them with 3 cargo Exspanders, and cargo rigs and hardly any tank in the mids as they dont have any CPU left.
Iv seen hulk take down 3 gank Cruisers at once (With concord help) leaving the field in armor, because it was tanked propper.
Its nice to have 17k or cargo space, but im pretty sure the Hulk wernt ment to be fitted like that. Its posible, but then you take the risk, for not tanking your ship. Nisroc Angels Nisroc - Angel of Freedom Nisroc is known as "The Great Eagle".
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