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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Miyamoto Uroki
Caldari Katsu Corporation
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Posted - 2009.04.09 10:18:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Miyamoto Uroki on 09/04/2009 10:19:39 What Ralle said. As a german player I use the eve-online.de forum a lot, as it's the main source of information for the german community (apart from this forums obviously). It is infact maintaned by a private person, afaik a member of X-Trading company.
They only ask for the limited API key (which cannot be used for scams...) when you wanna post on the caod forums there. It's to prevent alt trolls from posting **** and sueing at other players and is a great idea imho. Prevents peeps to hide behind alt chars.
It would be a good suggestion for this forum aswell to have it ^^
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Ka Jolo
The Tuskers
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Posted - 2009.04.09 11:30:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Grupsni Hexe So if I would want to create some scam-stuff I would do best do create a eve-online.org (or so) domain and ask for ppl's API-key without identifying myself?
I'm not sure how you could scam someone equipped merely with their API key.
My corporation requires a strong API from each account owned by an applicant. I have found people to be one of three types (from most to least common):
- The typical person who understands what an API key is, and supply it without comment.
- Naive people who just want to get in, and supply not only their API key but account name as well. Unscrupulous people would then only need to guess their password to have total access to the account.
- Paranoid people who think their ISK and ships can be looted by someone with an API key, who call us names for asking for it, then stomp off in a huff.
I supply my API keys freely, to EVEMon, EFT, EVE-Metrics, EVEMEEP, Battle Clinic, and anyone else that will add value to my EVE experience. I've not been scammed yet.
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Towelieban
Minmatar D00M.
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Posted - 2009.04.09 11:42:00 -
[33]
i dont really see why people are so scared about the use of the limited api key.
all it shows is what characters you have on the account and the amount of isk you have.
so for a site as eve-online.de it makes it possible to actually verify that the person owns the actual character.
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Torlin Valric
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.04.12 09:16:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Ka Jolo
My corporation requires a strong API from each account owned by an applicant.
How would you know if they gave the api for all their accounts, if they don't send money between them you wouldn't know.
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Ordais
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Posted - 2009.04.12 09:46:00 -
[35]
Well, tbh there is something to mention about the site:
*ATTENTION HEARSAY* There was a little scandal once when ppl form there used the information from the site (comparing IPs or something) to compare the data to another forum and so they caught a spy in their corp/alliance (ok, the spy was rather dumb to not mask his info but ok).
I mention that just to make clear that its a FANSITE made by PRIVATE ppl and you should treat them as such. Just assume they will missuse the information from the limited-api key, if you are still ok with it (as there isnt much they can do) then go ahead.
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Pan Crastus
Anti-Metagaming League
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Posted - 2009.04.12 10:05:00 -
[36]
It is extremely bad practice on behalf of CCP to allow such fan site domains / designs that look "official" (esp. having CCP shown in the imprint!). Some people are going to be misled into trying to login with their EVE account info (just like you do on eve-o) and it's up to the site owners (and whoever has access to the servers) to use that as they please...
How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
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Ivy Scorn
Amarr Nethro Ore Conglomerate
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Posted - 2009.04.12 12:28:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Pan Crastus It is extremely bad practice on behalf of CCP to allow such fan site domains / designs that look "official" (esp. having CCP shown in the imprint!). Some people are going to be misled into trying to login with their EVE account info (just like you do on eve-o) and it's up to the site owners (and whoever has access to the servers) to use that as they please...
Nonsense. It's a german site that states in big red letters (and in german obviously, it's a german site ffs!) "Die Webseite wird von Spielern gepflegt und aktuell gehalten." - meaning something along the lines of 'a fan site by players for players'. And as I already said before, they even give you the standard "not in any way affiliated with"-speach in english.
All the CCP-references are required by CCP because the website refers to their intellectual property.
I don't know how they could make it any more obvious short of painting the website purple and replacing the spaceship background with pictures of cute little kittens.
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Pan Crastus
Anti-Metagaming League
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Posted - 2009.04.12 15:20:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Pan Crastus on 12/04/2009 15:22:56 Edited by: Pan Crastus on 12/04/2009 15:20:20
Originally by: Ivy Scorn
Originally by: Pan Crastus It is extremely bad practice on behalf of CCP to allow such fan site domains / designs that look "official" (esp. having CCP shown in the imprint!). Some people are going to be misled into trying to login with their EVE account info (just like you do on eve-o) and it's up to the site owners (and whoever has access to the servers) to use that as they please...
Nonsense. It's a german site that states in big red letters (and in german obviously, it's a german site ffs!) "Die Webseite wird von Spielern gepflegt und aktuell gehalten." - meaning something along the lines of 'a fan site by players for players'.
That changes nothing, as it's in the Impressum and not on the main page where the login box is. Also, the text has a crappy contrast and is easy to overlook even on the Impressum when all the other text on the page is bright white - web design fail.
Quote:
And as I already said before, they even give you the standard "not in any way affiliated with"-speach in english.
This is in tiny text, way below CCP's address and still does not change the main problem of the site, which is that it copies the EVE logo and has an official-looking domain.
Quote:
I don't know how they could make it any more obvious short of painting the website purple and replacing the spaceship background with pictures of cute little kittens.
Easy: use a domain that looks like it's a fan site and not "EVE's page for Germany" and put the warning text on the front page in a readable color.
PS. it's pretty hilarious how people try to deny these issues and then CCP has to put warnings all over the place about account theft - no wonder. There's probably several sites out there that are a lot more obvious "fan sites" and people are still using their EVE account info to log on ...
How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
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SentryRaven
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2009.04.12 23:03:00 -
[39]
On the other hand, why would CCP need to hold the player's hands again?
If you fail to read the Impressum, then you fail.
And to be honest.... eve-online.de does not look similar to the original site in the slightest, apart from the logo in the top left corner.
The rest is about the same as comparing apples and pears. --------
EBANK Forum Manager | KIA Recruiting Director
Please resize sig to a maximum file size of 24000 bytes - Mitnal |
Pan Crastus
Anti-Metagaming League
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Posted - 2009.04.13 00:31:00 -
[40]
Originally by: SentryRaven On the other hand, why would CCP need to hold the player's hands again?
If you fail to read the Impressum, then you fail.
And you fail at understanding that every intentional and unintentional case of "phishing" costs CCP time and money because people will need customer service.
Quote:
And to be honest.... eve-online.de does not look similar to the original site in the slightest, apart from the logo in the top left corner.
If you had any clue about running web sites, you'd understand that people have always been and will always be "guessing" domain names (eve-online.com is the official US/english-language web page for EVE, then eve-online.de is the official german language web page for EVE) and basing their estimate of validity on the similarity to the "main" domain name. This is why phishing works, why companies with an important web presence try to grab all domains with country-codes in markets where they operate etc. etc.
How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
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SentryRaven
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2009.04.13 08:23:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
And you fail at understanding that every intentional and unintentional case of "phishing" costs CCP time and money because people will need customer service.
I am well aware, but CCP says in every corner and place that you should not use your EVE account details for any other 3rd Party website.
And for all those that do, Darwin eventually will visit them.
Quote:
If you had any clue about running web sites, you'd understand that people have always been and will always be "guessing" domain names (eve-online.com is the official US/english-language web page for EVE, then eve-online.de is the official german language web page for EVE) and basing their estimate of validity on the similarity to the "main" domain name. This is why phishing works, why companies with an important web presence try to grab all domains with country-codes in markets where they operate etc. etc.
Right, and it remains this. An estimate. If they yet again fail to do their research and homework, then they are simply kicked in their bottocks by their own lazyness/stupidity.
On a side note, is www.eve-online.com still the official domain, or is it www.eveonline.com now? --------
EBANK Forum Manager | KIA Recruiting Director
Please resize sig to a maximum file size of 24000 bytes - Mitnal |
StephDog
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Posted - 2009.04.13 08:49:00 -
[42]
The site eve-online.de is an EVE-Online fansite since 2002. The site is for german-speaking players and for those it is explained in several locations that it is a fansite. The biggest one is in the top of the imprint(impressum) in font-size 24 red letters. So if you can read and understand german there should be no misunderstandings, if not the site is not for you because you canÆt read the content of the site.
We donÆt want to bother players with a javscript window in the middle of the screen that says ôHi, we are a fansiteö only because some players donÆt read a new site before the try to login or canÆt read german.
That CCP is linked in the imprint is a request from CCP(fair use policy) and the german law. Furthermore, there are direct links to CCP FAQ and [email protected] which helps players to find the right way.
And at least the API Key, well it makes things much easier for the moderators of our forum. The important point is that we can kick real accounts instead of trying all 5 minutes to kick out the same person with hundreds of NC alts. Especially we see no problem there, because only the write access of two forums (CAOD style) is limited by the API Key. Before that we had a fair use policy, poster should name the ingame chars the want to post with, but that not worked well. Thanks to CCP with the API Key we have a way to make it easier for both sites. And to say it again and again: It is your choice to input the API Key or not.
In general: Some people will always have concerns about the fansite, API Key or the moderators but we try to make the site for normal players. We canÆt consider every hint and problem, so if you donÆt like our site you have three choices. Help to make the site better, make an own site or use another site.
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Ivy Scorn
Amarr Nethro Ore Conglomerate
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Posted - 2009.04.13 12:08:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Pan Crastus Easy: use a domain that looks like it's a fan site and not "EVE's page for Germany" and put the warning text on the front page in a readable color.
Dude, that site looks nothing like the original page. Their webdesign is, as you already admitted, even more crappy than that of the official site here (no offense, there are much more important things about a fansite than how cool it looks - not everybody is a professional webdesigner).
Originally by: Pan Crastus PS. it's pretty hilarious how people try to deny these issues and then CCP has to put warnings all over the place about account theft - no wonder.
I'm not a user of that site. I just understand the language and if you'd too, it would be plain obvious to you that it's a fansite. Simply put, there is nothing to deny as there is no issue. Also note: Such was not the concern of the OP. This topic isn't about LOGIN-data but API-data, which is something most people a) don't even know what it's for and b) completely overrate in its importance and security implications mainly for the reason of a).
Originally by: Pan Crastus There's probably several sites out there that are a lot more obvious "fan sites" and people are still using their EVE account info to log on ...
And how is that the fault of fansites which often even advise you NOT to use your eve online login data?
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Feilamya
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.04.13 14:13:00 -
[44]
I know this thread has drifted in a different direction, but...
I think what would be nice to have is a "weak weak" API key, which allows the holder to only see the character name (for one character, not all characters on the same account), his corp and his alliance.
Such an API key would be sufficient in scenarios as we have on eve-online.de. After all, it has been stated before (by an eve-online.de admin?) that the main purpose was to be able to ban "real accounts" instead of forum alts if posters fail to read the forum rules.
In the current situation, it's a choice everyone has to make for themselves. I considered being allowed to post on the German CAOD board not worth giving away the names of my alts and my skills or anything that can be used as intel vs. me and my corp or alliance. It's not paranoia, it's simply risk vs. reward, and although the risk is almost nonexistent, the reward (being allowed to post in CAOD) is even less. If I was a diplomat or some other person who had to post on CAOD every now and then, it would be a different story.
And I think that's the real point: If you have no business posting on the German politics and alliance forums, it's not worth the hassle. This keeps the trolls out. So the "weak API key" is actually a bad idea. On the contrary, CCP might consider requiring the API key on their CAOD forum too...
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The Djego
Minmatar Hellequin Inc.
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Posted - 2009.04.13 22:03:00 -
[45]
It is a fanside.
All but 2 sub forums don¦t require the API key to post in it.
The main reason the API Key is required in the Politic sections is that the mods got bored of heavy moderation and forum bans against people that simply created a new forum account and started all over again.
A lot of trashposting stoped with this and the mods adimited that this cut down her time for moderation on the forum quite a bit.
---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
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