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Mister Gone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 13:18:00 -
[1]
Hi all
Apologies if this has already been answered somewhere, browsing the posts and search didn't flag up anything I could find.
Was something changed with the recent patch that caused ships to no longer be cap stable?
Example being my dominix, a few days ago it could run 2 reps, DC2 and 3 hardeners non-stop without the cap dropping below 60%. When I used it yesterday the cap would eventually run dry even with a single repper/defenses active.
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AstroPhobic
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.04.19 13:34:00 -
[2]
overtanked much?
Plug your fit into EFT, make sure it's actually cap stable.
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Xapharia
WOLIMAZO INC
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Posted - 2009.04.19 13:38:00 -
[3]
I think they actually lowered cap recharge on some ships in the last patch as my Drake was cap stable before but now it only lasts a bit over 1 hour. _________________________
Originally by: CCP Whisper Boo hoo. Cry some more.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.04.19 13:41:00 -
[4]
Several corp mates complained that their Drake was using more cap latly.
Take it to eh game development forum and ask there.
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Stuart Price
Caldari The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates
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Posted - 2009.04.19 13:54:00 -
[5]
Drake's have a capacitor?
I always thought it was as fuel gauge for the MWD. None of my other fitted mods seem to affect it all that much. Putting the 'irate' into 'Pirate' |
JonnyKay
Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.04.19 13:57:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Xapharia I think they actually lowered cap recharge on some ships in the last patch as my Drake was cap stable before but now it only lasts a bit over 1 hour.
only 1 hour?
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Mister Gone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:01:00 -
[7]
Thanks for the replies
I've already run it through eft and it's still showing cap stable at around 60-65%, maybe it's out of date or something I'll have to check when I get the chance.
1hr of cap would be great but it's currently showing 4mins in the fitting window and that feels about right for the amount of drain I'm getting.
The thing that didn't make sense was that I always use the same setup, the domi never gets parts changed except the hardener dmg types..so I doubted it was the setup causing the problem.
Anyway is there such a thing as overtanked for a domi?
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:03:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Stuart Price Drake's have a capacitor?
I always thought it was as fuel gauge for the MWD. None of my other fitted mods seem to affect it all that much.
hehe, you are more or less correct ^^.
Tho, on my PvP Drake I go scrm, web and teo invuls :P. Not noticed anything wrong yet tho, but I buffer, not passive tank it.
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Xapharia
WOLIMAZO INC
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:21:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Xapharia on 19/04/2009 14:24:14
Originally by: JonnyKay
Originally by: Xapharia I think they actually lowered cap recharge on some ships in the last patch as my Drake was cap stable before but now it only lasts a bit over 1 hour.
only 1 hour?
Yes Belt tanking etc requires permatanks you know. For missions it works fine as you're likely never out in space for that amount of time.
Originally by: Mister Gone 1hr of cap would be great but it's currently showing 4mins in the fitting window and that feels about right for the amount of drain I'm getting.
Drake and Domi tanks a bit different though You actively boost to get your armor back while in the Drake you only have the hardeners draining cap (assuming mission/ratting setup with no scram/web/mwd). _________________________
Originally by: CCP Whisper Boo hoo. Cry some more.
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AstroPhobic
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:22:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Mister Gone Anyway is there such a thing as overtanked for a domi?
6 slot/2 rep tank is far too much.
[Dominix, Large guns] Large Armor Repairer II Armor EM Hardener II Armor EM Hardener II Armor Thermic Hardener II Armor Thermic Hardener II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Omnidirectional Tracking Link I Omnidirectional Tracking Link I
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L Drone Link Augmentor I
Capacitor Control Circuit I Sentry Damage Augmentor I Capacitor Control Circuit I
Garde II x5
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Xapharia
WOLIMAZO INC
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:26:00 -
[11]
Originally by: AstroPhobic 6 slot/2 rep tank is far too much.
For some things you need the second repper Permarunning 2 reps shouldn't be needed though.
_________________________
Originally by: CCP Whisper Boo hoo. Cry some more.
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Zanon Xiu
The Gemini Factor Chaotic Evolution
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:31:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Mister Gone Hi all
Apologies if this has already been answered somewhere, browsing the posts and search didn't flag up anything I could find.
Was something changed with the recent patch that caused ships to no longer be cap stable?
Example being my dominix, a few days ago it could run 2 reps, DC2 and 3 hardeners non-stop without the cap dropping below 60%. When I used it yesterday the cap would eventually run dry even with a single repper/defenses active.
you sure you have the same setup as before.
after the patch my mission running tank has not changed at all i run 2 large reppers perm with my hardners and dcu. havent noticed andy changes what so ever.
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Atsuko Ratu
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:34:00 -
[13]
Asking eft wouldn't do much, as it's not updated yet.
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AstroPhobic
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.04.19 14:54:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Xapharia
Originally by: AstroPhobic 6 slot/2 rep tank is far too much.
For some things you need the second repper Permarunning 2 reps shouldn't be needed though.
I disagree. With the amount of DPS that setup puts out (almost 800 at 30ish KM), 340 DPS tank vs angels or 550 vs sansha, you have plenty. I run a ~400 DPS tank on my CNR and do significantly less DPS than the domi, and have no issues with any mission, not even sansha blockade.
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Mister Gone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 15:29:00 -
[15]
I don't have a huge amount of skill points yet so I need the 2nd repper to compensate for the extra dmg I'm taking inside wormholes, a single rep is easily enough for running my missions though yeah.
I've been playing around with eft and it looks like I need to upgrade rigs to 3xCCC2's and swap out the cap booster for another recharger2 to hold it cap stable now whereas the booster used to be a last resort I've yet to use.
I'm definately on the same setup as always, same setup that eve fitting tool was showing as stable. The low sp issue means I don't really use guns much on it, just drone dmg and salvager/tractors in the high slots.
Cheers for all the help, it's only a 2day job training up for the new rigs so I can live with that..just a case of not being so lazy with the setup and switching it around more as needed.
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AstroPhobic
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.04.19 15:32:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Mister Gone I don't have a huge amount of skill points yet so I need the 2nd repper to compensate for the extra dmg I'm taking inside wormholes, a single rep is easily enough for running my missions though yeah.
I've been playing around with eft and it looks like I need to upgrade rigs to 3xCCC2's and swap out the cap booster for another recharger2 to hold it cap stable now whereas the booster used to be a last resort I've yet to use.
I'm definately on the same setup as always, same setup that eve fitting tool was showing as stable. The low sp issue means I don't really use guns much on it, just drone dmg and salvager/tractors in the high slots.
Cheers for all the help, it's only a 2day job training up for the new rigs so I can live with that..just a case of not being so lazy with the setup and switching it around more as needed.
I wouldn't be so hasty. Go ingame and check the total cap and base recharge and compare it to the figures in EFT. This might just be a CCP mistake... was there any mention at all of these changes in the patch notes?
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Murina
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2009.04.19 15:36:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Mister Gone I don't have a huge amount of skill points yet so I need the 2nd repper to compensate for the extra dmg I'm taking inside wormholes, a single rep is easily enough for running my missions though yeah.
I've been playing around with eft and it looks like I need to upgrade rigs to 3xCCC2's and swap out the cap booster for another recharger2 to hold it cap stable now whereas the booster used to be a last resort I've yet to use.
I'm definately on the same setup as always, same setup that eve fitting tool was showing as stable. The low sp issue means I don't really use guns much on it, just drone dmg and salvager/tractors in the high slots.
Cheers for all the help, it's only a 2day job training up for the new rigs so I can live with that..just a case of not being so lazy with the setup and switching it around more as needed.
Can you not fit NOS in your highs to help compensate?.
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Dexton
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.04.19 15:43:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Mister Gone I don't have a huge amount of skill points yet so I need the 2nd repper to compensate for the extra dmg I'm taking inside wormholes, a single rep is easily enough for running my missions though yeah.
I've been playing around with eft and it looks like I need to upgrade rigs to 3xCCC2's and swap out the cap booster for another recharger2 to hold it cap stable now whereas the booster used to be a last resort I've yet to use.
I'm definately on the same setup as always, same setup that eve fitting tool was showing as stable. The low sp issue means I don't really use guns much on it, just drone dmg and salvager/tractors in the high slots.
Cheers for all the help, it's only a 2day job training up for the new rigs so I can live with that..just a case of not being so lazy with the setup and switching it around more as needed.
Wormholes = sleepers, sleepers = nos/neuts. There is your problem.
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Mister Gone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 16:09:00 -
[19]
EFT Base Cap: 5000 Recharge Rate: 246.2s
In-Game Base Cap: 5000 Market Dominix: 1087.50s My Dominix: 232.52s
I think those are the right figures.
The problem I had with NOS's was range, I've rarely had sleepers coming in close enough to use them. They seem happy sitting at 30-50k and sniping away. I use the ship like a swiss army knife so I've got my probe launcher/cloak in highs. Being solo 99% of the time there's no way I'm losing the cloak, it's saved me and my ship more times than I can count. Pirates love an easy kill and I don't pay ransoms. The remaining slots are my money makers being salvager/tractor gear.
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AstroPhobic
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.04.19 16:20:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Mister Gone EFT Base Cap: 5000 Recharge Rate: 246.2s
In-Game Base Cap: 5000 Market Dominix: 1087.50s My Dominix: 232.52s
I think those are the right figures.
Compare the base recharge rates, not the ones with a setup. EFT shows a 1087.5 recharge rate as well (unskilled), so it looks like the difference may be skills (update yours for sure), or perhaps implants, make sure the setups are indentical, including ammo. Using antimatter requires more cap than lead.
If you're cap stable at 60%, that's a ridiculously large amount of overcharge. Sounds like the problem is nos/neut, sleepers may be using them from those ranges without you knowing.
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Mister Gone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 16:38:00 -
[21]
I didn't know even ammo can affect the cap..this game is brutal with the minutia.
The stability wasn't even taking me being nos'd/neut'd into account..that was purely based on running every module while floating outside a station. I've just added a spare cap recharger II (x5 now) to the ship as a test, in-game fitting now says I'm stable at 38.2% though cap hasn't dropped below 50% for 10mins now with every module minus the highs running.
If knowledge is power I'm feeling like a AAA battery in eve.
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4 LOM
United Gamers
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Posted - 2009.04.19 18:39:00 -
[22]
Edited by: 4 LOM on 19/04/2009 18:40:27
Originally by: Dexton
Wormholes = sleepers, sleepers = nos/neuts. There is your problem.
He said the in game fitting widow is showing that its not cap stable... but good work jumping in with an opinion when you did not read everything to find out what the actuall issue was.
Originally by: Mister Gone
1hr of cap would be great but it's currently showing 4mins in the fitting window and that feels about right for the amount of drain I'm getting.
Originally by: Twilight Moon of course you have nice hair. That pod goo, is actually VO5 conditioner.
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Shereza
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Posted - 2009.04.19 18:54:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Atsuko Ratu Asking eft wouldn't do much, as it's not updated yet.
If EFT and EVE use the same numbers they would show no discrepency in a setup's cap stability therefore using EFT with updated numbers would be pointless in determining whether or not there was something screwy with your ship's cap stability.
If there were no official changes to ship capacitor properties (amount, regen, base formula, etc.) between Apocrypha and now then the pre-Apocrypha release of EFT should be completely accurate in determining how cap-stable a setup is. As such if a setup shows as cap stable in an older (but not too old) version of EFT and it doesn't show up as cap stable in EVE then one could believe that Something Is Wrong.
Personally, if your ship is cap stable by a large amount (40%+) in EFT and it isn't in the game then it seems like there might be a problem somewhere.
__________
As for comments on a dual-rep dominix.. Heh. I use a six, sometimes seven, slot tank on my dominix and most of the time I actually do need it. Most of the time I have to tank a whole room or multiple waves so that my support ship can salvage, assign drones, and/or fire guns without being molested.
A single rep. tank with proper rigs, however, should be more than sufficient for a solo player who can afford to micromanage their mission running. ____________________
Minmatar in Fantasy or Duct Tape Goes Medieval. |
Atsuko Ratu
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 19:23:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Shereza
If EFT and EVE use the same numbers they would show no discrepency in a setup's cap stability therefore using EFT with updated numbers would be pointless in determining whether or not there was something screwy with your ship's cap stability.
If there were no official changes to ship capacitor properties (amount, regen, base formula, etc.) between Apocrypha and now then the pre-Apocrypha release of EFT should be completely accurate in determining how cap-stable a setup is. As such if a setup shows as cap stable in an older (but not too old) version of EFT and it doesn't show up as cap stable in EVE then one could believe that Something Is Wrong.
Personally, if your ship is cap stable by a large amount (40%+) in EFT and it isn't in the game then it seems like there might be a problem somewhere.
Some people suggested that the patch changed a value. All eft will tell you is if they changed any base values of the ship, but won't show any formula changes. I was just saying that it was a dumb suggestion to ask EFT.
If the same setup was working then is no longer working now, a value has changed. If the EFT value and the Eve values are still the same before the EFT update, a formula has changed. If the values are different, then you know the issue. In either case, EFT will be useless in finding a new cap stable setup.
I'm willing to bet he changed his setup without realizing it, though.
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Dede Dumdedum
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.04.19 19:29:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Mister Gone Hi all
Apologies if this has already been answered somewhere, browsing the posts and search didn't flag up anything I could find.
Was something changed with the recent patch that caused ships to no longer be cap stable?
Example being my dominix, a few days ago it could run 2 reps, DC2 and 3 hardeners non-stop without the cap dropping below 60%. When I used it yesterday the cap would eventually run dry even with a single repper/defenses active.
were you in a wormhole with cap effects ? or perhaps finish another level of repair systems operation and your reps are running faster now...
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Mister Gone
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Posted - 2009.04.19 20:36:00 -
[26]
What do you mean by "wormhole with cap effects"? I know the rep skill hasn't finished recently, that happened weeks ago..only recent one is cruisersV but I don't see how that'd effect a dominix or cap.
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Salpad
Caldari Carebears with Attitude
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Posted - 2009.04.21 05:07:00 -
[27]
Is there an issue or not? Has CCP changed the cap recharge formula?
-- Salpad |
Great Smirnov
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Posted - 2009.04.21 09:55:00 -
[28]
Originally by: AstroPhobic
Originally by: Mister Gone Anyway is there such a thing as overtanked for a domi?
6 slot/2 rep tank is far too much.
lol, go try angel extravagansa with bonus pocket or world collide.
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Mad Bomber
Amarr Fromage Frais Industries Imajiaca
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Posted - 2009.04.21 10:56:00 -
[29]
I dont know if the cap formula have changed, but since you say your in WH space, I have noticed this too. The sleepers seem to neut/nos alot more or its actually works now, than before the patch. |
Silverphlame
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.04.21 11:48:00 -
[30]
From the patch notes ...
"Multiple fixes and changes have been implemented in the capacitor display and information on the fitting screen. These fixes and changes will ensure that cap stability messages, cap capacity and recharge time messages are all displayed correctly in all tooltips."
Thought this was the case ... couple of my ships that had been 'cap-stable' now show that they will cap out in a couple of minutes. Have found though that that will only happen if EVERY cap using module is active at the same time (for the ships I'm using at the moment, I have equip that are used exclusively to each other, eg salvager isnt running while the AB is). Best bet is to suck it and see.
Other thing thats bugging me about the fitting screen is that adding resist mods doesnt seem to effect the reported EHP, unless the resist mod directly alters the weakest resist. So adding an extra thermal resist mod to a 60% resist doesnt change the EHP if the Exp resist is 50%. That may just be me though not understanding how people are working out EHP fits.
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