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Anatal Klep
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Posted - 2009.04.20 22:31:00 -
[1]
I just threw out 5 Garde IIs for primary thermal damage in an L4 mission at a target 50 Km away. They locked on but did no damage at all for nearly a minute and I had to swap in Wardens (secondary damage) which worked fine on the same target & distance, killing it in about 15 seconds. Similarly, close up the Hammerhead IIs were working just fine, so I had the right primary damage.
I had 2 drone links so I normally shoot things well in excess of 80 Km that way with my skills. It seems like the drone links weren't working for the Garde IIs. This is the first time I've had this happen and it seems really odd that it would only affect one type of sentries. Has anyone else experienced this sort of flakiness lately?
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.04.20 22:37:00 -
[2]
errm, you should really look at the range on the garde IIs......
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Crope
Minmatar Federal Noob Mercs
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Posted - 2009.04.20 23:06:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Crope on 20/04/2009 23:09:28 Edited by: Crope on 20/04/2009 23:07:53 Drone link Augmentors only change the distance at which you can set your drones on something, Garde II's have 30km optimal + 12km Falloff with maxed skills so likely won't hit very often at 50km. Look at the stats on each type of sentry drone, they all have differant optimal and falloff ranges.
You can boost the optimal range (and tracking) of your sentries by using Omnidirectional Tracking Links.
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Anatal Klep
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Posted - 2009.04.21 19:33:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Crope Edited by: Crope on 20/04/2009 23:09:28 Edited by: Crope on 20/04/2009 23:07:53 Drone link Augmentors only change the distance at which you can set your drones on something, Garde II's have 30km optimal + 12km Falloff with maxed skills so likely won't hit very often at 50km. Look at the stats on each type of sentry drone, they all have differant optimal and falloff ranges.
My initial gut reaction was that we are talking about sentry drones, not scout drones. For scouts controlling the range means physically moving them after launch to a point where they are at their inherent base optimal range of the target. If you increase the distance you can move them, you increase their effective range.
But sentries can't physically move after launch so the only way to augment their effective range is by modifying their base optimal range. So to provide another 20 KM range the drone link needs to increase the base optimal range of the sentries by 20 Km.
That being said, I think you are right -- the drone links are actually useless for sentries. The reason is that I was able to blow away the BC @ 50 Km with Wardens in a few seconds. But by the logic above the maximum damage zone with two links would be 70 Km to 130 Km for Wardens. Since falloff works in both directions, they should not have been able to waste the BC so quickly. But if the links had no effect 50 Km would be well within their inherent 30 Km to 90 Km effective damage zone. Conversely, no hits with the Gardes is also consistent with the links being a no-op.
So I think CCP has a bug in either their documentation of what drone augmentation links <don't> do for sentries (i.e., that sentries don't have a "control range") or in the software for not increasing the range as <intuitively> advertised.
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Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
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Posted - 2009.04.21 20:05:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Tippia on 21/04/2009 20:16:14
Originally by: Anatal Klep That being said, I think you are right -- the drone links are actually useless for sentries.
Not entirely. They don't make much difference for the shorter-range sentreis, but they allow the longer-range versions to actually make use of their optimal+falloff range — without the link, some of that effective range is wasted.
For instance, Warden II + Drone Sharpshooting V gives you an optimal range of 75km and an additional 60km of falloff range, giving you the ability to do some kind of damage at up to 135km range. Without drone links, you're not even able to use half of that(!)
Perhaps the best way to "solve" the problem would be to rename the term "control range" to "engagement range" — for both mobile and sentry drones, it describes how close a target must be in order for you to be able to tell the drones to engage that target. Whether or not they can actually reach that target is a different matter, as is it if they can be controlled outside this range. It's an equally poor description for non-sentries as well: scout drones sent after a target will happily follow and shoot that target even if it moves way outside "control range." These drones can still be controlled and will still follow orders — they just won't engage ships (on their own) that are that far away. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki |
New Soi
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Posted - 2009.04.21 21:09:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Anatal Klep That being said, I think you are right -- the drone links are actually useless for sentries. The reason is that I was able to blow away the BC @ 50 Km with Wardens in a few seconds. But by the logic above the maximum damage zone with two links would be 70 Km to 130 Km for Wardens. Since falloff works in both directions, they should not have been able to waste the BC so quickly. But if the links had no effect 50 Km would be well within their inherent 30 Km to 90 Km effective damage zone. Conversely, no hits with the Gardes is also consistent with the links being a no-op.
Just correcting a big mistake here: fall-off only works after the optimal, not in both directions. From 1m to optimal range, you have 100% chance of hitting factor by range (there is still the tracking factor), and after that it decreases to approx ~50% chance at optimal+falloff, and nearly 2% or so at optimal+2xfalloff. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.04.21 22:22:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Anatal Klep
Originally by: Crope Edited by: Crope on 20/04/2009 23:09:28 Edited by: Crope on 20/04/2009 23:07:53 Drone link Augmentors only change the distance at which you can set your drones on something, Garde II's have 30km optimal + 12km Falloff with maxed skills so likely won't hit very often at 50km. Look at the stats on each type of sentry drone, they all have differant optimal and falloff ranges.
My initial gut reaction was that we are talking about sentry drones, not scout drones. For scouts controlling the range means physically moving them after launch to a point where they are at their inherent base optimal range of the target. If you increase the distance you can move them, you increase their effective range.
But sentries can't physically move after launch so the only way to augment their effective range is by modifying their base optimal range. So to provide another 20 KM range the drone link needs to increase the base optimal range of the sentries by 20 Km.
That being said, I think you are right -- the drone links are actually useless for sentries. The reason is that I was able to blow away the BC @ 50 Km with Wardens in a few seconds. But by the logic above the maximum damage zone with two links would be 70 Km to 130 Km for Wardens. Since falloff works in both directions, they should not have been able to waste the BC so quickly. But if the links had no effect 50 Km would be well within their inherent 30 Km to 90 Km effective damage zone. Conversely, no hits with the Gardes is also consistent with the links being a no-op.
So I think CCP has a bug in either their documentation of what drone augmentation links <don't> do for sentries (i.e., that sentries don't have a "control range") or in the software for not increasing the range as <intuitively> advertised.
errm, you are doing it wrong....
you are looking for the omni-directional tracking link, ya know the thing that modifies drones tracking and optimal ranges.
with the drone link augmentor it is increasing their control range so yes they can shoot at stuff 70km away, but their optimal and fall off is still 30km and 12km or something. and with wardens you need one so they can be controlled far enough out to even hit stuff at their optimal |
Lochmar Fiendhiem
Caldari International Multi-Player Consortium
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Posted - 2009.04.21 23:37:00 -
[8]
3x omni directional with t2 sentries on a domi is;
garde II 17-49km
warden II 50-130(140)km
Have never tried a fourth omni, or drone rigs.
Originally by: Halkin bob is dead, goons are great, cheese is cheesy, there we go no need for any more threads
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