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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 14 post(s) |
OutCast EG
Very Industrial Corp. Legion of xXDEATHXx
5
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Posted - 2012.05.11 04:19:00 -
[61] - Quote
Stop. **cking. Messing. With. PLEX. For. God's. Sake. k ty bye.
ps Kil2 yay! |
ThisIsntMyMain
Republic University Minmatar Republic
99
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Posted - 2012.05.11 04:47:00 -
[62] - Quote
Cap Tyrian wrote:I'm absolutely sure that all those PLEX are given to the winners instead of the usual 50B , it would be bad publicity if that was not the case.
You fail at reading comprehension.
Quote:So why PLEX instead of ISK? Quite simply, PLEX is just much easier to manage and allows us to create some revenue to fund this and future tournaments. As we intend to stream all four weekends, we obviously incur additional costs. Using PLEX allows us to provide a top quality stream and production throughout the entire event.
Those PLEX are to pay the real costs of the tournament. Setting up a TV stream, getting commentators to iceland etc. If you want an alliance tournament somebody has to pay for it. In this case, its the competitors. |
Raimo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
46
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Posted - 2012.05.11 05:46:00 -
[63] - Quote
CCP Loxy wrote:Duncan Tanner wrote:CCP Loxy wrote:Raivi wrote:
Would other teams with similar specific concerns be able to contact you via some official channel to discuss it?
Yes you can contact us at [email protected] if anyone would like to discuss an alliance entry ahead of time. We sent an inquiry to this e-mail and haven't received a response for over a week now. Has anyone else received a response? Sorry we've had a few of these and I should have gotten back to you but we're going to investigate these issues after sign ups and then take action.
So you want alliances to fork up a decent sum of "RL money" before letting them know if all is ok with them trying to sign up in the 1st place? Sounds like that could be illegal in some parts of the world, at least for a RL event. |
Aidamina Omen
Aperture Harmonics K162
15
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Posted - 2012.05.11 05:50:00 -
[64] - Quote
Am I the only person that sees a bit of a conflict here?
Alliance Tournament is an event that generates free publicity through player content. (It's not like we're playing on sisi and the ship losses don't count)
On top of that they want us to pay to participate. I find this distasteful, a proper ad campaign would cost CPP hundreds of thousands of dollars, instead they get it for free*, and they still want to squeeze those that participate.
Not cool.
* I do realize costs are involved, but you can't put that on the people that spend weeks if not months preparing for this. Seems extremely unfair. |
hottest jita alt
State War Academy Caldari State
16
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Posted - 2012.05.11 06:06:00 -
[65] - Quote
yep, CCP is just getting greedier and greedier by the year. the jita riot and CSM breathing down their necks was the only thing that stopped them from MTA'ing up EVE like every other game.
Now they're making it CERTAIN that not the best, but the richest, alliances get to compete in an "alliance tournament". regardless of whether or not 10 plexes/5bn isk is a lot or not, increasing the money associated with competing in an e-sport is just sad.
Then again, I hear Icelandic people know their economy really well................ |
malaire
402
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Posted - 2012.05.11 06:21:00 -
[66] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:Rrama Ratamnim wrote:For the LOVE OF GOD, how do you CEO's not know that you can buy plex's for isk and reverse-redeem them back to the redeem system, you dont need to "buy" plex's for cash for this I wasn't aware you could reverse redeem. What exactly is the point of that? edit: aside from this, (for the first time), instance. Reverse redeemed PLEX can be used to pay for any services in Account Management which can be paid with PLEX, e.g. character transfer, activating account (if you run out of gametime), fanfest tickets.
New to EVE? Don't forget to read: The Manual * The Wiki * The Career Options * and everything else |
malaire
402
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Posted - 2012.05.11 06:23:00 -
[67] - Quote
Raimo wrote:So you want alliances to fork up a decent sum of "RL money" before letting them know if all is ok with them trying to sign up in the 1st place? Sounds like that could be illegal in some parts of the world, at least for a RL event. No RL money is needed.
1) Buy 10 PLEX ingame with ISK 2) reverse redeem them 3) enter Alliance Tournament and win it 4) profit
EDIT: I could afford this, but I don't have an alliance. ... nor needed PvP skills New to EVE? Don't forget to read: The Manual * The Wiki * The Career Options * and everything else |
Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
40
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Posted - 2012.05.11 07:28:00 -
[68] - Quote
raukosen wrote:Grats, you made the entry cost a barrier of entry. I hope that's what you wanted.
10 plex = 5 bliion ISK (or there abouts)
If an alliance is not able to scrounge 5 bil it is a fail alliance waiting to be dissolved by the next pirate to give them the evil look. Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene V - Moon 4 - Duvolle Laboratories Factory. Hybrid charges, Projectile ammo, Missiles, Drones, Ships, Need'em? We have'em, at affordable prices. Pop in at our Ammo Shop in sunny Alentene. |
IceGuerilla
Poseidon's Wingmen Perihelion Alliance
12
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Posted - 2012.05.11 07:29:00 -
[69] - Quote
Wow, with the amount of whingers in this thread, I hope that none of you guys apply and make it easier for the rest of us to get in. Incidentally, could we please be told the total amount of alliances that have applied before the auction? |
Damir Delon
Tribe of One Tribal Conclave
0
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Posted - 2012.05.11 08:52:00 -
[70] - Quote
Zastrow wrote:Let's say that you have an alliance of the minimum size to even have a full team: 12. That's LESS THAN 1 PLEX PER PILOT. And its refunded if you don't get in. If anything it'll create somewhat of a barrier to stupid gimmick alliances applying. coming from a guy in an alliance with eve win button(tech moons)
if first you dont succeed try again and again and again and so on and so forth because you got the isk |
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Ciar Meara
Virtus Vindice
646
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Posted - 2012.05.11 08:53:00 -
[71] - Quote
Rrama Ratamnim wrote:For the LOVE OF GOD, how do you CEO's not know that you can buy plex's for isk and reverse-redeem them back to the redeem system, you dont need to "buy" plex's for cash for this
at last a voice of reason, buy plexes on the market for isk.
parasite wrote:10 plexes is 175 euro and the icelandic kr+Śna is 163 which means as an alliance leader ill have to spend 28.500,- Kr to apply to the Alliance tourney.
you guys are freakin insane and have lost all concept of money.
unless you buy em with isk (see above) and if you can't afford it, your better not applying because it takes more then 5 billion in ships to compete in the AT. - [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow] |
Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
434
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Posted - 2012.05.11 09:19:00 -
[72] - Quote
If 5 billion, which is returned if your bid is unsuccessful, is too much spacemoney how you gonna afford all the tourney setups and ****? |
Jowen Datloran
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
410
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Posted - 2012.05.11 09:24:00 -
[73] - Quote
Meh, I could afford entry into the alliance tournament. Multiple times, even. Mr. Science & Trade Institute, EVE Online Lorebook-á |
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CCP Loxy
C C P C C P Alliance
89
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Posted - 2012.05.11 09:26:00 -
[74] - Quote
Ok to be clear, you can reverse redeem plex using this simple guide here, that means you don't have to spend any real life money if you don't want to and continue to fund your tournament team purely with isk.
For reference the current cost into the random draw at 10 PLEX is (rough number) 5 billion, this is up from 2 billion in previous years and should be no issue for any team taking the tournament seriously. Video Producer |
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Tosh Lines
Omniscient Order
0
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Posted - 2012.05.11 09:38:00 -
[75] - Quote
CCP Loxy wrote:Ok to be clear, you can reverse redeem plex using this simple guide here, that means you don't have to spend any real life money if you don't want to and continue to fund your tournament team purely with isk. For reference the current cost into the random draw at 10 PLEX is (rough number) 5 billion, this is up from 2 billion in previous years and should be no issue for any team taking the tournament seriously.
There is absolutely no logical reason for having the entry fee in PLEX other than to increase demand and therefore the price. It would simply be much easier to have it paid in ISK as normal.
While microtransactions with Aurum may have died a death, the marketing thinking behind it lives on as strong as ever.
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Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
70
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Posted - 2012.05.11 09:51:00 -
[76] - Quote
Tosh Lines wrote:CCP Loxy wrote:Ok to be clear, you can reverse redeem plex using this simple guide here, that means you don't have to spend any real life money if you don't want to and continue to fund your tournament team purely with isk. For reference the current cost into the random draw at 10 PLEX is (rough number) 5 billion, this is up from 2 billion in previous years and should be no issue for any team taking the tournament seriously. There is absolutely no logical reason for having the entry fee in PLEX other than to increase demand and therefore the price. It would simply be much easier to have it paid in ISK as normal. While microtransactions with Aurum may have died a death, the marketing thinking behind it lives on as strong as ever.
Or maybe CCP has decided that they need to recoup some of the costs of running an event like this, you know like they said in the damn dev blog, and asking for the entry in PLEX is the simplest way to do that. Take your tinfoil off and actually think about it from a business perspective for once. |
Tosh Lines
Omniscient Order
0
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Posted - 2012.05.11 10:03:00 -
[77] - Quote
Darek Castigatus wrote:Tosh Lines wrote:CCP Loxy wrote:Ok to be clear, you can reverse redeem plex using this simple guide here, that means you don't have to spend any real life money if you don't want to and continue to fund your tournament team purely with isk. For reference the current cost into the random draw at 10 PLEX is (rough number) 5 billion, this is up from 2 billion in previous years and should be no issue for any team taking the tournament seriously. There is absolutely no logical reason for having the entry fee in PLEX other than to increase demand and therefore the price. It would simply be much easier to have it paid in ISK as normal. While microtransactions with Aurum may have died a death, the marketing thinking behind it lives on as strong as ever. Or maybe CCP has decided that they need to recoup some of the costs of running an event like this, you know like they said in the damn dev blog, and asking for the entry in PLEX is the simplest way to do that. Take your tinfoil off and actually think about it from a business perspective for once.
That makes no sense, I am looking at it from a business perspective.
You can still pay entirely with ISK, but you have to convert it to PLEX and take 10 PLEX of the market per alliance. Thus increasing the demand - when 60+ alliances enter thats 600+ plex bought up in Jita, it has an effect on supply which appears to be the entire point of the exercise. Prices go up, people see the generous ISK return for PLEX and are more interested in buying ISK CCPs legal way.
It's unnecessary and along with fanfest tickets for plex, graphics cards for plex etc... is part of a growing trend. How many player rebellions do CCP need to understand this? |
Kalar Freno
The Riot Formation Get Off My Lawn
1
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Posted - 2012.05.11 10:31:00 -
[78] - Quote
Tosh Lines wrote:It's unnecessary and along with fanfest tickets for plex, graphics cards for plex etc... is part of a growing trend. How many player rebellions do CCP need to understand this?
Because there were huge riots over being able play for fanfest tickets with plex, and that graphics cards for plex thing was really unpopular also - amirite?
Maraner wrote:Well Goons have money to burn Jita with..... the point I'm making is that CCP is asking people to pay for a chance to fight in the tournament. I've no doubt that we will have no issues getting 10 Plex to enable us to take part in the auction, but how much is it likely to cost to buy a slot?
Can anyone remember how much last years slots went for?
I don't know what the official figures were, but the internet says:
White Noise. - 20bil GoonSwarm - 19bil The R0NIN - 15.7bil Outbreak - 15.1bil |
Raivi
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
107
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Posted - 2012.05.11 11:51:00 -
[79] - Quote
Kalar Freno wrote:Tosh Lines wrote:It's unnecessary and along with fanfest tickets for plex, graphics cards for plex etc... is part of a growing trend. How many player rebellions do CCP need to understand this? Because there were huge riots over being able play for fanfest tickets with plex, and that graphics cards for plex thing was really unpopular also - amirite? Maraner wrote:Well Goons have money to burn Jita with..... the point I'm making is that CCP is asking people to pay for a chance to fight in the tournament. I've no doubt that we will have no issues getting 10 Plex to enable us to take part in the auction, but how much is it likely to cost to buy a slot?
Can anyone remember how much last years slots went for? I don't know what the official figures were, but the internet says: White Noise. - 20bil GoonSwarm - 19bil The R0NIN - 15.7bil Outbreak - 15.1bil
Here's the source. |
Rivqua
Omega Wing The Veyr Collective
3
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Posted - 2012.05.11 12:29:00 -
[80] - Quote
The year before there were 16 auction slots (half of today) and most of them went for the base cost (~2bil). It was only higher last year due to the limited number (4).
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Ciar Meara
Virtus Vindice
647
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Posted - 2012.05.11 15:06:00 -
[81] - Quote
Tosh Lines wrote: That makes no sense, I am looking at it from a business perspective.
No you are not. Otherwise you'd be cheering. (businesslike)
Tosh Lines wrote:You can still pay entirely with ISK,
Then stop complaining
Tosh Lines wrote:but you have to convert it to PLEX and take 10 PLEX of the market per alliance. Thus increasing the demand - when 60+ alliances enter thats 600+ plex bought up in Jita, it has an effect on supply which appears to be the entire point of the exercise.
Hence the business side comment of smartness.
Tosh Lines wrote:Prices go up, people see the generous ISK return for PLEX and are more interested in buying ISK CCPs legal way. Business: b : a commercial or sometimes an industrial enterprise; also : such enterprises you really don't get that. (I left that last part in for you)
Tosh Lines wrote:It's unnecessary and along with fanfest tickets for plex, graphics cards for plex etc... is part of a growing trend. How many player rebellions do CCP need to understand this?
Maybe, but you know what, its good business. And I rebelled , shot an cancelled out of Aurum, not out of plex, nobody in their right mind would oppose plex and expect to have posse behind him. - [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow] |
steave435
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
65
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Posted - 2012.05.11 15:20:00 -
[82] - Quote
Last year: CCP: We can't broadcast the 5 man matches because it would cost too much Players: That sucks, we'd be willing to pay PLEX to get them broadcasted as well
This year: CCP: Ok, we'll broadcast everything, but to fund it we'll have to change the entrance fee from isk to PLEX Players: WAAAH, we don't wanna pay!
Running a broadcast like this requires multiple camera operators, both in the studio with real cameras and in the game showing the action. In addition to that, you need a producer to decide what camera feeds are sent out at any given time and technicians to make sure everything keeps running smoothly. Add in the light and audio technicians handling those parts, Soundwave and Sunset in the studio/commentators booth, all other devs that show up to visit in the studio, whoever is the judge in game this year and the GMs that handle getting people into system and checking their fits and pilots. That's a pretty large team that need to be paid, and despite that, it's just the minimum. They probably have other people there handling other parts I forgot about, or special roles like watching the forums and other channels for feedback/questions.
The costs are not limited to just that though. The camera equipment used in studio environments is very expensive and is only needed twice a year, for the AT and Fanfest, the work hours spent finding and making deals with the different potential providers and the time spent testing to make sure it all works and the pure broadcasting cost itself, a broadcasting service that needs to support tens of thousands of people watching is not free.
All in all, it really is very expensive to run, so if they want to pass on at least some of the costs to the participants, just like any other RL sports event, then that's perfectly fine. Stop whining and just don't sign up if you can't afford it. |
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CCP Soundwave
C C P C C P Alliance
946
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Posted - 2012.05.11 16:25:00 -
[83] - Quote
Hey guys!
Let me quickly delve into the PLEX issue:
The alliance tournament started out as something the community ran, with backing from CCP. Over the years, it became a very expensive project that was eventually shut down for financial reasons. Seeing that a lot of the early crew had started working for CCP somewhere along the road, a group of us picked it up again.
The first "new" tournament was really bare-bones, limited coverage just to prove we could do it at a smaller budget. Since then, we've wanted to scale up; multiple weekends, broadcasting the entire time, flying experts out to cover etc. The truth is that unless we find ways of funding the tournament ourselves, it just won't happen and certainly not at the same standard we've been going towards. The idea of using PLEX came up because it allows us to generate money going directly into the show/tournaments production, letting us do what we want while also letting players chose to pay their entry fee with ISK, by buying PLEX off the market.
That's the short version of it |
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Damir Delon
Tribe of One Tribal Conclave
1
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Posted - 2012.05.11 16:27:00 -
[84] - Quote
steave435 wrote: All in all, it really is very expensive to run, so if they want to pass on at least some of the costs to the participants, just like any other RL sports event, then that's perfectly fine. Stop whining and just don't sign up if you can't afford it.
1. I thought TV rights were sold to countries in RL sports. 2. I thought in RL sports players who compeat and make the sport get paid. 3. I thought the viewers going to the games to watch paid the fee, not the players entering the field |
Cathrine Kenchov
Ice Cold Ellites
7
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Posted - 2012.05.11 16:58:00 -
[85] - Quote
CCP Soundwave wrote:Hey guys! Let me quickly delve into the PLEX issue: The alliance tournament started out as something the community ran, with backing from CCP. Over the years, it became a very expensive project that was eventually shut down for financial reasons. Seeing that a lot of the early crew had started working for CCP somewhere along the road, a group of us picked it up again. The first "new" tournament was really bare-bones, limited coverage just to prove we could do it at a smaller budget. Since then, we've wanted to scale up; multiple weekends, broadcasting the entire time, flying experts out to cover etc. The truth is that unless we find ways of funding the tournament ourselves, it just won't happen and certainly not at the same standard we've been going towards. The idea of using PLEX came up because it allows us to generate money going directly into the show/tournaments production, letting us do what we want while also letting players chose to pay their entry fee with ISK, by buying PLEX off the market. That's the short version of it
I think its a cool idea. It literally doesn't cost the alliance any more than before, and lets you guys have a nice budget for it (of which i cannot complain, the AT is one of my more favorite things about eve)
You should have done it sooner |
Tosh Lines
Omniscient Order
0
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Posted - 2012.05.11 17:12:00 -
[86] - Quote
"hey guys, we want each team that wants to play to pay $175 USD for the privillege, it's ok though, we've got a great way of disguising it. btw get premium stream for just 3 plex, get your limited edition ingame "I watched EveTV" T-shirt for 2 plex - check www.plex.com inbetween bouts for more outstanding offers"
Hi CCP, I play your game therefore it's your business duty to extract absolutely every single dime possible from me. Don't worry about broken mechanics, carrier/orca docking for example, you can fix those in 2018, it'd only take 5 minutes anyway so really no point doing it now. |
Lazarus Telraven
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
6
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Posted - 2012.05.11 17:35:00 -
[87] - Quote
Tosh Lines wrote:"hey guys, we want each team that wants to play to pay $175 USD for the privillege, it's ok though, we've got a great way of disguising it. btw get premium stream for just 3 plex, get your limited edition ingame "I watched EveTV" T-shirt for 2 plex - check www.plex.com inbetween bouts for more outstanding offers" Hi CCP, I play your game therefore it's your business duty to extract absolutely every single dime possible from me. Don't worry about broken mechanics, carrier/orca docking for example, you can fix those in 2018, it'd only take 5 minutes anyway so really no point doing it now.
CCP has been completely up front about the reasons they switched to plex and it makes 100% sense for them to do this, 1. The AT needs to be Self-sustaining 2. Players can still use ISK to gain entry 3. Previously the tournament entry fee was to low for the amount of isk currently in the game and moving it to PLEX increased the entry cost as well as helped them take care of #1.
In RL sporting events the venues charge an admittance fee or they charge vendors a fee to help cover the costs of the event but in the 10 years of EVE ONLINE the AT has remained free for anyone wanting to watch the action. So why change that when the application fees needed to be raised anyways and 99% of the teams will be using ISK to buy the plex off of the JITA market.
As many have said in this thread 5Billion ISK is nothing in regards to outfitting a tournament team when you start looking at your ships/hardwirings/skillbooks etc
All of the rule changes were needed and some more then others are going to make this tournament even better then those in the past. Just to list my two favorite is the raise of the ship limit from 3 of the same ship to 4 and max number of participants on the field at a given time from 10 to 12 is going to be INCREDIBLE. I expect some bloody bloody fights with how the points have been tweaked and the addition of the T3 Battlecruisers and new modules to this event!
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Tosh Lines
Omniscient Order
0
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Posted - 2012.05.11 17:44:00 -
[88] - Quote
You've misunderstood Lazarus.
It's the artificial inflation of PLEX prices by CCP that is growing wearysome.
600 PLEXes disappearing from market in one swoop will keep PLEX artificially high and there will be plenty more "offers" at regular intervals keeping them high. It's not about the cost for tournament entry, I don't care if CCP want to charge $175 by the back door for it. Don't like it don't enter. What I don't like is them shifting it also into inflated PLEX prices
This makes it more attractive to those who wish to $=>ISK. Something I've never agreed with in the first place and now it's littered with madcap schemes and offers.
Meanwhile relatively simple things that need fixing are completely ignored.
The Orca thing I mentioned kinda ruins low sec, people camp in Tech3s ontop of an orca. If they don't like their odds they just dock in the orca and have it jump safely into highsec where it cannot be attacked, except by suicide squad. It's totally safe, protects expensive ships and skill loss. I wouldn't be surprised if CCP don't even know what I'm talking about, but I'm damned sure they can correctly tell me the price of Plex in Jita down to the 2 decimal places. |
Zastrow
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
61
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Posted - 2012.05.11 17:48:00 -
[89] - Quote
Have you missed that the AT is on the weekends and isnt interrupting game development time at all ? |
Tosh Lines
Omniscient Order
0
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Posted - 2012.05.11 18:09:00 -
[90] - Quote
Zastrow wrote:Have you missed that the AT is on the weekends and isnt interrupting game development time at all ? No I haven't. Why is it that you might think I had?
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