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Fool jibberjabber
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Posted - 2009.05.18 13:17:00 -
[1]
Just interested in the state of the Amarr vs Matari FW.. we see lots of well documented reports on here regarding Federation (notably Wolfy's adventures) and Caldari (Pervs still have the best corp name ever), but nothig on the 'other' fight.
Any opinions?
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Mitch Taylor
Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.18 15:05:00 -
[2]
the minmatar and amarr side appears to have people who just 'get on with it', the gal caldari teams certainly enjoy talking about playing the game a lot :)
The Dark is Rising... Fight my Brute! |
Veshta Yoshida
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.18 16:09:00 -
[3]
Talking was tried and diplomatic efforts were made, but the shroud the totalitarian Shakor regime has pulled over the collective Matari eyes seems impenetrable.
Until such a time when the Minmatar realise that Shakor is a traitor to their beloved republic, we shall hold the line against the naked aggression of the malevolent demagogue.
Our most exalted Empress tried showing goodwill by emancipating a fraction of the slaves within the Empire, but still the propaganda oozes from the bowels of the Shakorite dictatorship. Imagine if our most glorious Empress had not foreseen the turmoil in the Republic and had released ALL slaves. The token amount emancipated ended up internment camps due to the Republics inability to accommodate them .. nothing says "Welcome Home" like barbed wire and shanty towns.
Open your eyes, see Shakor for what he is and what he has done to the once proud people of Matar.
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Intigo
Amarr Endemic Aggression Exalted.
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Posted - 2009.05.18 16:16:00 -
[4]
Oh God, roleplayers.
On that note, if you can be bothered to sit through the "My Amarrian God is leading me down this path to bring the ruthless Minmatarians under our control again!" nonsense there's apparently quite a bit of info on the Intergalactic Summit forum. *shudders*
It's just FW, don't take it too seriously. Go shoot stuff. ___________________
ENEMA, much love. <3 |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.18 17:52:00 -
[5]
Quote:
Just interested in the state of the Amarr vs Matari FW.. we see lots of well documented reports on here regarding Federation (notably Wolfy's adventures) and Caldari (Pervs still have the best corp name ever), but nothig on the 'other' fight.
Any opinions?
Caldaris do it on the forums, Amarrs do it in game.
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Gin G
Halls Of Valhalla
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Posted - 2009.05.18 18:01:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Veshta Yoshida Talking was tried and diplomatic efforts were made, but the shroud the totalitarian Shakor regime has pulled over the collective Matari eyes seems impenetrable.
Until such a time when the Minmatar realise that Shakor is a traitor to their beloved republic, we shall hold the line against the naked aggression of the malevolent demagogue.
Our most exalted Empress tried showing goodwill by emancipating a fraction of the slaves within the Empire, but still the propaganda oozes from the bowels of the Shakorite dictatorship. Imagine if our most glorious Empress had not foreseen the turmoil in the Republic and had released ALL slaves. The token amount emancipated ended up internment camps due to the Republics inability to accommodate them .. nothing says "Welcome Home" like barbed wire and shanty towns.
Open your eyes, see Shakor for what he is and what he has done to the once proud people of Matar.
arr goto love CVA bunch of utter nuts shall i get the white padded room ready
but IMO the amarr are the best as ive heard almost nothing about them must mean they do there thing instead of just talk about it unlike the calamari
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crockett EXE
Minmatar Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.05.18 18:13:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Gin G
but IMO the amarr are the best as ive heard almost nothing about them must mean they do there thing instead of just talk about it unlike the calamari
umm go read the role playing forum.. They chest thump in there all the time..
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Intigo
Amarr Endemic Aggression Exalted.
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Posted - 2009.05.18 18:21:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Gin G
Originally by: Veshta Yoshida Talking was tried and diplomatic efforts were made, but the shroud the totalitarian Shakor regime has pulled over the collective Matari eyes seems impenetrable.
Until such a time when the Minmatar realise that Shakor is a traitor to their beloved republic, we shall hold the line against the naked aggression of the malevolent demagogue.
Our most exalted Empress tried showing goodwill by emancipating a fraction of the slaves within the Empire, but still the propaganda oozes from the bowels of the Shakorite dictatorship. Imagine if our most glorious Empress had not foreseen the turmoil in the Republic and had released ALL slaves. The token amount emancipated ended up internment camps due to the Republics inability to accommodate them .. nothing says "Welcome Home" like barbed wire and shanty towns.
Open your eyes, see Shakor for what he is and what he has done to the once proud people of Matar.
arr goto love CVA bunch of utter nuts shall i get the white padded room ready
but IMO the amarr are the best as ive heard almost nothing about them must mean they do there thing instead of just talk about it unlike the calamari
...
(S)He's in PIE. That's not CVA.
Jeez. >_> ___________________
ENEMA, much love. <3 |
Esna Pitoojee
Amarr TalCorp Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.05.18 18:33:00 -
[9]
From what I understand, the Amarr had an advantage in FW due to there being existing Amarrian RP corps. Minmatar, on the other hand, has U'K an EM (both alliances, and thus not applicable for FW).
Once the coordination between the major Amarrian FW corps and assistance from corps/alliances outside of FW (read: CVA and friends) was gained, they had numbers and assets.
Minmatar, on the other hand, had to build their side from scratch. Oh, sure, U'K and EM sometimes provide support for the FW corps, but without experienced PvP'ers in the corps their assistance has largely gone to waste.
I think that one other thing has dogged the Minmatar FW'ers, and that is their continued 'alliance' with Heretic Militia, who seem to be continually leading around as 'allies' while pirating minnie FW people. Don't really get why people in the TLF tolerate them, but Heretics and the infighting they create practically represent a second front for the Minnie FW'ers. ----------------------------------------------
Say "Amarr ships suk, lol." I dare you.
My statments do not represent the opinions, views, or actions of my corp. |
Gin G
Halls Of Valhalla
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Posted - 2009.05.18 18:44:00 -
[10]
Originally by: crockett EXE
Originally by: Gin G
but IMO the amarr are the best as ive heard almost nothing about them must mean they do there thing instead of just talk about it unlike the calamari
umm go read the role playing forum.. They chest thump in there all the time..
i would rather not do that to many role players around
and if PIE isnt CVA you might want to look into getting into CVA you sound like the rght type for them
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Lokia Enroch
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Posted - 2009.05.18 19:13:00 -
[11]
PIE inc. is the founder of CVA. I have an alt in the FW for Matar vs Amarrian. Like many fights that do not rely on taking and holding ground. It's an elaborate dance of who can catch who with their pants down. If one is too heavy, then they cannot catch anyone smaller. If they are too small, they will be unable to keep the larger ships from jumping, or docking. The fact that the Heretics used to be in the militia means nothing. They have naps with some corps, and the the great TLF they are simply pirates since they cannot be set blue by the NPC corps. Besides, you join FW to shoot at people, more targets is rarely a bad thing.
And to be fair, while the 24th may have some CVA support, Star Faction has done the Republic a great service by countering the heavy support CVA might bring in by threatening it with their own forces.
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Snake O'Donell
Gallente Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.18 20:50:00 -
[12]
Well so far most of my time in Minnie/Amarr has been spent listening to people crying about the "tics". I think I have spent more time hearing people cry than anything else.
Ferocious FeAr > Heretics have been terrorising minmatar all day long Deryk Blacke > Mitch, when it comes to killing Tics - many of us, would even have the Goonies in here.... SplashDown > dude wtf you ganked jodie for trying to help militia get rid of heretics..thats messed up and we dun do that backstabbin crap Kazzzi > backstabbin? he shot a war target croakroach > tics were killing both amarr and minmatar so we went to kill them croakroach > dark rising didnt care and shot at the amarr BS fleet :) Ferocious FeAr > we formed up a fleet with gunship dip croakroach > so now they volunteered to remove tics frm amamake
OMG YOU GUYS THE TICS
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crockett EXE
Minmatar Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.05.18 21:06:00 -
[13]
Amarr also get support from CVA and easy access to 00 ratting to pay for their BS blobs. Not to mention I've heard CVA helps support them via isk and likely lets some Amarr corps plant POS's out in providence.
Minmatar get support on the battle field from Star Fraction in the form of blue status and we have one or two other groups we are blue too. However these groups tend do their own things most of the time, but we don't easy 00 access or support like CVA gives Amarr.
It's a unfair advantage for the Amarr, but Minmatar still seem to do ok considering. However one can only hope CCP continues to keep the null sec alliances from joining FW, because it would really screw up the battle field if they ever let them in.
The average Militia pilots wouldn't be able to compete with the amount of ships null sec alliances could afford to throw away.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.18 21:22:00 -
[14]
Quote:
It's a unfair advantage for the Amarr,
Why? They are in a *war*, they use what they manage to put together to win. There's nothing forbidding a similar help coming off for Minnies if someone bothered to do it.
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Nur AlHuda
Amarr Callide Vulpis
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Posted - 2009.05.18 21:28:00 -
[15]
Originally by: crockett EXE Amarr also get support from CVA and easy access to 00 ratting to pay for their BS blobs. Not to mention I've heard CVA helps support them via isk and likely lets some Amarr corps plant POS's out in providence.
Minmatar get support on the battle field from Star Fraction in the form of blue status and we have one or two other groups we are blue too. However these groups tend do their own things most of the time, but we don't easy 00 access or support like CVA gives Amarr.
It's a unfair advantage for the Amarr, but Minmatar still seem to do ok considering. However one can only hope CCP continues to keep the null sec alliances from joining FW, because it would really screw up the battle field if they ever let them in.
The average Militia pilots wouldn't be able to compete with the amount of ships null sec alliances could afford to throw away.
You are wrong most of the amarr corporations in militia are not blue to the CVA. Only reason why CVA helps militia is that there are minmatars and Star Fraction around.
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Veshta Yoshida
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 07:34:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Nur AlHuda You are wrong most of the amarr corporations in militia are not blue to the CVA. Only reason why CVA helps militia is that there are minmatars and Star Fraction around.
To quote one of the ancient proverbs "And the Truth shall set you free".
CVA and Holders do NOT support the Amarr militia, this was publicly stated some time ago as they refocused their attention to the pirate scourge within Amarr borders, and rightly so. The only Providence presence in the area lately has been anti-SF/Pirate, so not directly related to the war.
Providence is as far as I am aware open for ratting to any pilot, provided said pilot has not committed acts of violence against the Empire and her assets, that naturally excludes the Minmatar Militia.
Bottom line; Amarr Militia members do not get any special treatment from the Providence residents and are subject to the same regulations as everyone else who visit Providence.
The propaganda emanating from within the Republic should not be taken at face value, indeed one should subject it to multiple sessions of critical scrutiny.
What you should ask yourselves is why Shakor is stifling public debate and has all but disbanded the Parliamnt. The true enemy of the Minmatar people is not to be found outside of the Republic.
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Gin G
Halls Of Valhalla
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Posted - 2009.05.19 09:26:00 -
[17]
What you should ask yourselves is why Shakor is stifling public debate and has all but disbanded the Parliamnt. The true enemy of the Minmatar people is not to be found outside of the Republic
please stop PLEASE i mean really PLEASE STOP IT with the RP crap please
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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.05.19 11:04:00 -
[18]
Heretic Nation continues to have diplomatic relations with some Corporations in the Minmatar Militia.
To put it bluntly every militia is 95% dross; derive from that what you will.
Heretic Nation does not fire on blues unless they initiate hostilities. If you believe one of our pilots to have been in error contact one of our diplomats, AFTER talking to your CEO and setting your own house in order.
Heretics is not a militia corporation, Heretic Nation is not an Alliance dedicated to FW. We do however take pleasure in crushing the gaudily clad coffins the Amarrian oppressor languishes in, even as your own Militia cowers in the bosom of Highsecurity space.
On a related aside Heretics has been amused and continues to be amused by the deeds and words of some in the Minmatar Militia for whom the insight that individuals deeply involved in the Amarr Militia have infiltrated and now bend them to the will of the Ammarian aggressor, has not been realized.
'There is a Stranger in your house'
What is more this stranger seeks to use the militia to their own end, in a somewhat farcical and emotionally compromised personal vendetta against Heretics.
Knowing is half the battle and Love is a battlefield~
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
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Rovain Sess
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Posted - 2009.05.19 12:33:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Rovain Sess on 19/05/2009 12:34:29 Edited by: Rovain Sess on 19/05/2009 12:33:42 Tell you what - If u really wanna know - then come visit the front lines.
I'll give you my thoughts. The nature of the flict btween teh Amarr and teh Minmitards has changed. When I first started getting in fleets - we did alot of plexing (fighting at plex acel gates and in plexes) and roaming gangbangs.
Then frakkin Yars started camping in bigger plexes and ganking solo's (which is Eve). Then we statred roaming in bigger fleets and taking advantage of targets of op (we'd engage whenever we could - and if the tardo's didn't run)..
Gate camping was never huge in my FW experience - rather, locate, hold and smack em down. Then Several FW corps went postal - became mercs and or pirates and stared raping folks. In addition - SF joined and began war decing the more active Militia factions.
Lately its been their Carriers sitting under important stations and basically making life hell on anyone who wants to undock.
In addition - the minnies have just had another major corp sign on, and they are getting up large fleets. We also took down some POS's.. Which added a neat break from the norm.
All in all - it waz a blast - but lately its been increasingly frustrating... Im not complaining tho - cuz all is fair in love and EVE. If this isn't your experience thus far - so be it. I can only tell you what I saw and did..lol... I'll also say this - FW really teaches you skrimish warfare, and hit and run tactics...IMO
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Havohej
Minmatar Du'uma Fiisi Integrated Astrometrics
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Posted - 2009.05.19 13:26:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Intigo It's just FW, don't take it too seriously. Go shoot stuff.
Roleplaying in a video game is still playing a game. Same as not roleplaying in a video game. Some non-RP folks take stuff like killboard stats WAY too seriously. Some RP folks take the RP itself WAY too seriously. To assume that ALL RP folks take the entire game (or just FW, even) too seriously would be a mistake. Some people just want a little "flavor text" to go along with the pewpew to make it more interesting than simply "lol i pwn u," which by itself gets a little boring after a while.
"You can still steal their stuff." - CCP Explorer |
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Veshta Yoshida
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 14:43:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Havohej <sage comment>
Indeed. The reason the genre even exists is peoples desire to "get away" by indulging in roleplaying. A full 50% of the genres name is dedicated to the RP aspect, if you get annoyed by RP then you made a poor choice of game. Without the MMORPG the "regular" multiplayer games would be the only social/online escapism .. personally never got into the whole FPS thing, too limited in scope, so I am content
I just wish that CCP would throw some more resources the RP'ers way. The occasional news item doesn't really do much .. hope springs eternal.
And yes Mitch, it is very much a matter of "getting on with it". The whole thing has turned into quite the grudge match, good fun for all involved I think
Spice is good, RP adds spice, hence RP is good. QED.
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Picado Pitviper
Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.19 14:49:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Rovain Sess Edited by: Rovain Sess on 19/05/2009 12:34:29 Edited by: Rovain Sess on 19/05/2009 12:33:42
In addition - the minnies have just had another major corp sign on, and they are getting up large fleets.
I wonder what Corp that was.......
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 14:51:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Rodj Blake on 19/05/2009 14:56:53
Originally by: Esna Pitoojee From what I understand, the Amarr had an advantage in FW due to there being existing Amarrian RP corps. Minmatar, on the other hand, has U'K an EM (both alliances, and thus not applicable for FW).
Once the coordination between the major Amarrian FW corps and assistance from corps/alliances outside of FW (read: CVA and friends) was gained, they had numbers and assets.
Minmatar, on the other hand, had to build their side from scratch. Oh, sure, U'K and EM sometimes provide support for the FW corps, but without experienced PvP'ers in the corps their assistance has largely gone to waste.
I think that one other thing has dogged the Minmatar FW'ers, and that is their continued 'alliance' with Heretic Militia, who seem to be continually leading around as 'allies' while pirating minnie FW people. Don't really get why people in the TLF tolerate them, but Heretics and the infighting they create practically represent a second front for the Minnie FW'ers.
An interesting version of events. However, the Mnnies got off to a decent start in FW, steam-rollering the Amarrians day after day and taking system after system.
Since then though, the Amarrians first stabilised things, and the recaptured all of their systems. As things stand, the Amarrians are a system up.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.05.19 14:55:00 -
[24]
Minnie's seemed pretty uninterested in Plexing last i saw and took far greater interest in getting fights.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
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BattleStar Crusader
Amarr Absinthe Brothers Consortium
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:00:00 -
[25]
Edited by: BattleStar Crusader on 19/05/2009 16:00:39 Fights which they repeatedly lose, And a few station camps that turned on them and camped them into the station they were once camping.
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me bored
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:21:00 -
[26]
Edited by: me bored on 19/05/2009 16:24:30 I've only been at it for a couple weeks but it seems pretty stagnant. The mini are fairly dominant but don't give a damn about plexing or conquering territory so they spend a lot of their time camping the main amarr hub. Now and then the amarrians will sally forth with a blob of their own to clear it out but they aren't that competent and usually require a significant numerical advantage before they feel brave enough.
Jericho are a load of station hugging blow hards who don't do much except play docking games while trash talking in local and I've never seen CVA in FW space.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:42:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 19/05/2009 16:45:26
Originally by: me bored Jericho are a load of station hugging blow hards who don't do much except play docking games while trash talking in local and I've never seen CVA in FW space.
Our war-record seems to disagree with you. What is true however is that we've decided to adapt our tactics to out-station-game the Amarrians and their legion of out of FW logistics alts. Its not glorious but we are in the process of purging Amarrian heavy ship presence from Kamela system and forcing the 24th Crusade to decentralize. If this continues to work then it'll aid our Matari allies by providing more bite-sized amarrian fleets to attack.
Course by "docking-games" I'm guessing you mean US outside the station repeatedly forcing Amarrians to dock / undock / dock / undock until one of them gets unlucky and instanuked at which point the rest stay sullenly trapped inside until we go to sleep.
I haven't ever seen a 24th Crusade fleet capable of suppressing US back into the station in 6 months of fighting.
But if you don't think we can fight away from stations at all then we invite more wardecs - allow us to educate you further
Of the CVA - best think of them as an on-tap hotdrop entity that can be called in by the 24th Crusade in any POS fight or capital engagement that lasts longer than 20 minutes.
Several 24th Crusade corps are prepared to sacrifice their own battleships and losses to the CVA KOS list to invite CVA capital intervention when they feel they need it.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Opethian Obiri
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:45:00 -
[28]
The Minmatar get zero support from Ushra'khan, extremely limited support (50 million isk a week as a plexing prize) from Electus Matari and blue status with Star Fraction, which leads to very, very rare help in fights, but that's it.
The Amarr generally win most fights, and the war in general, because the Minmatar lack decent fc's who actually have a clue. Most are completely incompetent, and I'm sure if you've ever fought on the Minmatar side you'll know who I'm thinking of in particular, *cough* nasty1 *cough*. To give the Amarr FC's their due, they are decent guys who know how to play and frequently out maneuvre the Minmatar. Also, I've found Amarr ships to just be all round better than the Minmatar equivalent once you progress past frigates, especially at BC and BS level.
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Esna Pitoojee
Amarr TalCorp Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:50:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Rodj Blake Edited by: Rodj Blake on 19/05/2009 14:56:53
An interesting version of events. However, the Mnnies got off to a decent start in FW, steam-rollering the Amarrians day after day and taking system after system.
Since then though, the Amarrians first stabilised things, and the recaptured all of their systems. As things stand, the Amarrians are a system up.
I attribute this to an odd side-effect of there being an existing command structure among the Amarrian corps at the start of FW:
PvPers, as an overall tendency, prefer to fly under FCs and with people they already know. Hence, at the start, the various Amarr FW corps had problems coordinating inter-corp efforts. Minmatar, on the other hand, could simply yell "X up for raiding blob!" and everyone would scramble. ----------------------------------------------
Say "Amarr ships suk, lol." I dare you.
My statments do not represent the opinions, views, or actions of my corp. |
Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:53:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 19/05/2009 16:54:11
Originally by: Opethian Obiri The Minmatar get zero support from Ushra'khan, extremely limited support (50 million isk a week as a plexing prize) from Electus Matari and blue status with Star Fraction, which leads to very, very rare help in fights, but that's it.
The Amarr generally win most fights, and the war in general, because the Minmatar lack decent fc's who actually have a clue. Most are completely incompetent, and I'm sure if you've ever fought on the Minmatar side you'll know who I'm thinking of in particular, *cough* nasty1 *cough*. To give the Amarr FC's their due, they are decent guys who know how to play and frequently out maneuvre the Minmatar. Also, I've found Amarr ships to just be all round better than the Minmatar equivalent once you progress past frigates, especially at BC and BS level.
I think you are being overly harsh to the Minmatar side. They have many disadvantages in the form of spies and agent provocateurs - issues with pirates - infiltration and sabotage from the Amarrian bloc. Yet there are good corps and individuals in the Minmatar militia still trying hard to fight this war.
Plex mechanics currently favour the after down-time numbers the Amarrians can muster which typically means that the critical systems are secured early in the day before the Minmatar come to strength and pvp for its own sake is the only thing on the menu afterwards.
Also something few people outside the conflict realize is that the CVA is directly aiding the organization and administration of the 24th Crusade in the provision of forums, killboards, logistics and financial support and many alt characters from run of the mill complexers to fc's and organizers. This in addition to the overwhelming hot-drop capability that can be called in by the 24th Crusade to counter any Minmatar cap ship deployment.
This all adds up. And yet the Minmatar are still in the fight and generally win a decent number of battles and provide a fun environment for those pilots who can keep out of the political intrigues and external feuds that occassionally threaten to derail the whole organization.
I liken the whole thing to a resistance movement of idealistic freedom loving heroes opposing a well organized occupying power backed by a neighbouring superpower. 24th Crusade has numbers and fleet experience, spies and sabateurs, strategic weaponry and support pacts with its proxy master in Providence.
The Tribal Liberation Core has guts and will to fight.
I know which side I'm glad to help out!
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 17:14:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Havohej
Roleplaying in a video game is still playing a game. Same as not roleplaying in a video game. Some non-RP folks take stuff like killboard stats WAY too seriously. Some RP folks take the RP itself WAY too seriously. To assume that ALL RP folks take the entire game (or just FW, even) too seriously would be a mistake. Some people just want a little "flavor text" to go along with the pewpew to make it more interesting than simply "lol i pwn u," which by itself gets a little boring after a while.
An important thing to realize is that when you are roleplaying this conflict - ie your character is speaking as your character would speak in local, it does provide a level of abstraction between the conflict and the person behind the screen. Sometimes this abstraction is all the difference between hot-tempered abuse and smacktalk and just enjoying the war.
I've yet to visualize a roleplayer losing their temper and hammering the keyboard with their knuckles in anger at a ship loss in the Bleaklands and Devoid - but I have seen many anti-roleplayers saying silly things in local and reacting with a great deal of emotional intensity and obvious rage.
When my character describes Amarrians as "dogs" and "worms" and "spineless gutless wastes of skin" in local or on the IGS I'm roleplaying this conflict. I won't even recognize out of character replies in the main since I don't want to muddy the waters and start confusing the enemy avatars (who generally are gutless doglike worms :) and the players (many of whom will be decent enough people to talk to out of game and out of character.
The funny thing about eve is that roleplay doesn't require consensuality. All the players involved with Amarrian faction warfare are already consenting to me considering them witless pawns of decadent imperialist regression and blowing up their ships when the opportunity arises. I don't need their permission to roleplay with them and force them to accept the consequences of their roleplayed affiliations with the slavers.
Maybe this does sound a bit heavy to some - but its the thing that means Star Fraction pilots can have a great laugh on our out of character voice comms blowing up enemies, indulging in IC discussions and smackdowns in local chat, and generally ignoring the ooc sensibilities and whining of our enemies.
We don't lose our ooc tempers when our IC ships are blown up.
There is a lesson to be learned there I think.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Nur AlHuda
Amarr Callide Vulpis
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Posted - 2009.05.19 17:18:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Jade Constantine Edited by: Jade Constantine on 19/05/2009 16:45:26
Originally by: me bored Jericho are a load of station hugging blow hards who don't do much except play docking games while trash talking in local and I've never seen CVA in FW space.
Our war-record seems to disagree with you. What is true however is that we've decided to adapt our tactics to out-station-game the Amarrians and their legion of out of FW logistics alts. Its not glorious but we are in the process of purging Amarrian heavy ship presence from Kamela system and forcing the 24th Crusade to decentralize. If this continues to work then it'll aid our Matari allies by providing more bite-sized amarrian fleets to attack.
Course by "docking-games" I'm guessing you mean US outside the station repeatedly forcing Amarrians to dock / undock / dock / undock until one of them gets unlucky and instanuked at which point the rest stay sullenly trapped inside until we go to sleep.
I haven't ever seen a 24th Crusade fleet capable of suppressing US back into the station in 6 months of fighting.
But if you don't think we can fight away from stations at all then we invite more wardecs - allow us to educate you further
Of the CVA - best think of them as an on-tap hotdrop entity that can be called in by the 24th Crusade in any POS fight or capital engagement that lasts longer than 20 minutes.
Several 24th Crusade corps are prepared to sacrifice their own battleships and losses to the CVA KOS list to invite CVA capital intervention when they feel they need it.
I hope this is is offcial pep talk for each minmatar fleet that looses a fight. How long goes the war? One year? In that time SF was unable of anythink bigger then wardeclaring few corporations and killing people who stayed behind or destroying a corp fleet operation. That in a one year timeframe is too small achievment.
And about station camps i never saw in my 3 months in militia any station games performed by amarr milita but i saw a lot of times watching SF carriers undock and then dock when situation got serious and they were unable to help minmatar allies.
And I like it that way how it is couse in future months still SF will be only able to provide occasional intel for minmatar or play station games.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 17:40:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Nur AlHuda And about station camps i never saw in my 3 months in militia any station games performed by amarr milita but i saw a lot of times watching SF carriers undock and then dock when situation got serious and they were unable to help minmatar allies.
Don't bother lying on an out of character forum thats just sad ...
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Nur AlHuda
Amarr Callide Vulpis
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Posted - 2009.05.19 17:56:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Nur AlHuda And about station camps i never saw in my 3 months in militia any station games performed by amarr milita but i saw a lot of times watching SF carriers undock and then dock when situation got serious and they were unable to help minmatar allies.
Don't bother lying on an out of character forum thats just sad ...
I dont need to lie. If someone would not belive me he is free to join minmatar milita and see how little support they are recieving from SF and actualy thy are loosing more in a way.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 18:01:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Nur AlHuda I dont need to lie. If someone would not belive me he is free to join minmatar milita.
They might do better to hang around Kamela station and see the Amarrians performing the same "docking games" everybody else does if they want to catch you out in this very silly falsehood.
Once again. Drop the IC propaganda - its ridiculous on an ooc forum.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Nur AlHuda
Amarr Callide Vulpis
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Posted - 2009.05.19 18:14:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Nur AlHuda on 19/05/2009 18:18:35 Edited by: Nur AlHuda on 19/05/2009 18:17:10
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Nur AlHuda I dont need to lie. If someone would not belive me he is free to join minmatar milita.
They might do better to hang around Kamela station and see the Amarrians performing the same "docking games" everybody else does if they want to catch you out in this very silly falsehood.
Once again. Drop the IC propaganda - its ridiculous on an ooc forum.
Only one who is doing chest beating propaganda is you. No corporation or alliance involved around lowsec faction warfare has made so much threads and so much cheastbeating with so little performance as you.
SF is not even a member of recognized militias and posts around as it would involve you. More impact on warfare has a random Dark-Rsing or Tribal Core FC who can raise a fleet and lead minmatars to battle. Sf can attack some ships in highsec that are in war and claims impact on faction warfare? Those threads are from you not from me btw. If you would attack any non war target milita member you would get poped by concord. If you fire on militia members in lowsec you get fire from sentry guns. So your actions are limited by game mechanic.
And with that thing joining minmatar militia i was dead serious. i would have more war targets and they would see the truth so it would be win-win situation. One thing is what they read from you on the forums and second what happens when they actualy join.
And yes this was a rant.
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Veshta Yoshida
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 18:20:00 -
[37]
Wow there are a lot of misconceptions.
Originally by: Jade Constantine Our war-record seems to disagree with you. What is true however is that we've decided to adapt our tactics to out-station-game the Amarrians and their legion of out of FW logistics alts.
I know of one. Some Caldari and other faithfuls stop by from time to time. If we had that "legion" you refer to I doubt the Matari would hold any systems at this point.
Originally by: Jade Constantine ...If this continues to work then it'll aid our Matari allies by providing more bite-sized amarrian fleets to attack.
They take such small bites as it is, you are going to be here for a long long time if that is the goal.
Originally by: Jade Constantine I haven't ever seen a 24th Crusade fleet capable of suppressing US back into the station in 6 months of fighting.
Why waste energy on you when you have marginal impact as it is? You are just one of many neutral entities in the area, the fact that you can single handedly lag out an entire constellation by launching fighters at a station does not give you any special priority ..
Originally by: Jade Constantine Of the CVA...
There are some shared channels, but no special connections that I know of, not beyond friendship and being brothers in arms. It is worth mentioning that they seem to be willing to drop anything they are doing if the chance to kill SF presents itself .. that kind of "love" is rare.
Originally by: Jade Constantine <Lot's of outdated intelligence>
Amarr have gone through the in-fighting phase, we have spies oozing everywhere, doom-sayers and nay-sayers, we have our local pirates etc. etc. You learn to work through and around problems.
I have no idea who handles payment for forums, kill board and such but I am sure the Minmatar have similar benefactors. If not I'll be happy to help with ISK for their killboard.
The Minmatar have the same numbers as we do in the post-dt bracket, this they have proven time and time again. Problem is that if we are able to match their numbers they generally end up squashed so they just don't (usually) bother unless they have a clear advantage .. C'est la Guerre ..
CVA does not support the militia any more, that has been the case ever since their announcement several months ago. Even before that, the Providence presence in the area was negligible, you are putting far too much weight on the whole Amarrian Bloc idea.
Originally by: Jade Constantine I liken the whole thing to a resistance movement of idealistic freedom loving heroes opposing a well organized occupying power backed by a neighbouring superpower.
That is one description I suppose, but you need to mention that the "heroes" started the war by breaking every international treaty signed, attacked cross-border peace keeping forces (Concord) and wrecked immeasurable havoc on civilian populations.
Originally by: Jade Constantine I know which side I'm glad to help out!
Once a terrorist, always a terrorist .. your allegiance needs no excuses nor explanations at this point.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 18:21:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Nur AlHuda Only one who is doing chest beating propaganda is you. No corporation or alliance involved around lowsec faction warfare has made so much threads and so much cheastbeating with so little performance as you.
We certainly seem to have riled you up something fierce But once again I'll urge you to discover the difference between IC and OOC propaganda.
Quote: SF is not even a member of recognized militias and posts around as it would involve you. More impact on warfare has a random Dark-Rsing or Tribal Core FC who can raise a fleet and lead minmatars to battle. Sf can attack some ships in highsec that are in war and claims impact on faction warfare?
We impact your game NurAlHuda. The 24th Crusade appears obsessed with us. And why not really? We've moved wholesale into your once "capital system" and prevent you forming fleets with your chosen FC's in battleships. I understand it annoys you that we can also travel freely and interdict reinforcements on the way from Amarr, we can hunt your allies support and missioning infrastructure and yes, without significant counteraction from the Amarrian nationalists we likely are never going away. But thats the game isn't it? More targets are fun - new tactical challenges are what we all seek. I never really understand why you'd be ooc upset about it.
Quote: Those threads are from you not from me btw.
On an IC forum where such things are meant to be. If you can't tell the difference its your problem not ours.
Quote: And yes this was a rant.
Not a very good one
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.05.19 20:29:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Veshta Yoshida we have our local pirates etc. etc.
Really. Name some names.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
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crockett EXE
Minmatar Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:01:00 -
[40]
Originally by: RedSplat Minnie's seemed pretty uninterested in Plexing last i saw and took far greater interest in getting fights.
We have been doing plexes from time to time, but never just to "do" a plex for the sake of plexing, at least not most of us. Most times we use it as a tool to get a fight or to force the other side to ship down if we can't match their fleet at the given time.
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Intigo
Amarr Endemic Aggression Exalted.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:04:00 -
[41]
Great job guys. Bring frickin' Jade Constantine to Warfare & Tactics.
Bloody morons. ___________________
ENEMA, much love. <3 |
Shun Makoto
Caldari 22nd Black Rise Defensive Unit
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:07:00 -
[42]
The Amarr can't seem to get their act together cut a swath into Minmatar space like the Caldari have into Gallente.
Strange really since I usually see the Amarr taking systems.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:14:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Intigo Great job guys. Bring frickin' Jade Constantine to Warfare & Tactics. Bloody morons.
Hey Intigo - I heard you were a bit upset when we blew up your ship the other night?
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
crockett EXE
Minmatar Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:16:00 -
[44]
Edited by: crockett EXE on 19/05/2009 21:18:06
Originally by: Shun Makoto The Amarr can't seem to get their act together cut a swath into Minmatar space like the Caldari have into Gallente.
Strange really since I usually see the Amarr taking systems.
That's because the fight between the Amarr and Minmatar is about blowing up internet space ships, not playing capture the flag like you girls do up there in Jita spam land.
I think there is a fairly small group of Minmatar whom run plexes and like doing it but most of us are here for PVP. Seems the same for the Amarr, I think PIE's do a lot of plexing but other than that most of them don't seem to be too interested in it either.
btw if there are any Minmatar supporters my wallet is always accepting donations...
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Micia
Minmatar Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:17:00 -
[45]
I was googling "RP in EVE" and it led me to this thread.
'sup, warriors!
_______
Should we fall before the dawn, Say this at our pyre, "They died Matari warriors, Their faces to the fire." |
Intigo
Amarr Endemic Aggression Exalted.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:18:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Intigo Great job guys. Bring frickin' Jade Constantine to Warfare & Tactics. Bloody morons.
Hey Intigo - I heard you were a bit upset when we blew up your ship the other night?
Hey Jade - I heard you're absolutely horrendous at PvP.
And no, I'm never upset when I lose ships, I just like smacktalking people who are terrible (this is you).
You're a laughing stock in all of EVE. I whole-heartedly enjoy hearing the STIM guys tell stories. :D ___________________
ENEMA, much love. <3 |
Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 22:43:00 -
[47]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 19/05/2009 22:45:30
Originally by: Intigo Hey Jade - I heard you're absolutely horrendous at PvP. And no, I'm never upset when I lose ships, I just like smacktalking people who are terrible (this is you).
And yet we still blew up your ship?
As for my pvp skills, well, I'm neither the best nor the worst in eve but I can already tell from your posting that I'm a hellova lot better than you are.
Quote: You're a laughing stock in all of EVE. I whole-heartedly enjoy hearing the STIM guys tell stories. :D
STIM guys? Saying things about me? I'm shocked! Shocked I tell you. Who would have thought it.
Still, can't be that much of a failure when I've got a good bunch of friends to fly with every night and try out wild and crazy eve plans with while all you get to do is die on your lonesome in frigates like jonny-no-friends at the special loner disco night.
Have a nice day! (and maybe consider joining a corp with more actual ship kills than pos component kills on the front page before criticising somebody elses (PvP and thats for Player vs Player ... activity there guy).
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Unfamed II
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Posted - 2009.05.19 23:35:00 -
[48]
Civilians...
Originally by: Sandslinger of CA
So this wasn't a straightoff logoffski from our point of view, rather a tactical manoeuvre
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me bored
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Posted - 2009.05.20 01:12:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Jade Constantine HOW DARE YOU INSULT MY IMAGINARY SPACE SHIP. DO YOU THINK THIS IS SOME KIND OF A GAME???
This is exactly what I was talking about. All smack, no skill, and they constantly embarrass themselves with this drivel both in and out of game. Fly through kamela and you'll witness them beating their chests within docking range and arguing with week old alts about how great they are.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.20 01:25:00 -
[50]
Originally by: me bored
Originally by: Jade Constantine HOW DARE YOU INSULT MY IMAGINARY SPACE SHIP. DO YOU THINK THIS IS SOME KIND OF A GAME???
This is exactly what I was talking about. All smack, no skill, and they constantly embarrass themselves with this drivel both in and out of game. Fly through kamela and you'll witness them beating their chests within docking range and arguing with week old alts about how great they are.
And you are? I don't think we've been introduced. Obviously you weren't in Kamela earlier this evening
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.20 07:07:00 -
[51]
Quote:
The Amarr can't seem to get their act together cut a swath into Minmatar space like the Caldari have into Gallente.
Strange really since I usually see the Amarr taking systems.
I prefer Amarr to Caldaris.
They want more pew pew and more direct confrontation.
I play very little FW (compared to some of my corp mates) because I just perma desync at the first sign of blob (but not in 0.0, so I prefer that) but...
... when I was in Gallente FW, it was boring and borderline frustrating having to be in definite minority yet to not find willing enemies. It was 3 of us in T1 frigs (plexing) vs 6 T2 ships or else they'd not engage and would only boast their past downtime PvE.
Little we could do, as we all come back from work after 4+ hours after downtime anyway.
Plus TBH I prefer looting an Amarr ship (armor tank mods, lasers for my minny and Amarr ships) than just another score of missiles / charges.
I think Wolfy would have much more fun here than in Gallente, here there's appropriate fights.
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BattleStar Crusader
Amarr Absinthe Brothers Consortium
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Posted - 2009.05.20 07:24:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Jade Constantine
And you are? I don't think we've been introduced. Obviously you weren't in Kamela earlier this evening
And Who are you jade??? chest beating, role playing on the forums is one thing, but to say that (note above) and then continue to thrash out long winded excuses and not so whittey retorts and still not be part of this war, and part of anything in general. Well i think that rests the case.
Goodbye jade
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Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.05.20 07:43:00 -
[53]
The only docking games I play are in character and out of game.
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Veshta Yoshida
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 08:04:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Micia I was googling "RP in EVE" and it led me to this thread. 'sup, warriors!
'Sup Micia. We have finally managed to get the discussion to a civil level and on topic. Some regurgitated hostility had to be cleared away first
Originally by: crockett EXE That's because the fight between the Amarr and Minmatar is about blowing up internet space ships, not playing capture the flag like you girls do up there in Jita spam land.
Not really, it is a matter of numbers. To take a system you need a presence in an area 24/7 and prevent defenders from taking any .. neither of our two sides has the absolute numerical superiority so we just tug our respective ends of the rope and kill each other.
Originally by: crockett EXE ..I think PIE's do a lot of plexing but other than that most of them don't seem to be too interested in it either.
For most of the day there is not much else to do to be honest. There is either the OMgWTBlob disrupting traffic or the rabbit chase when the blob is on the other foot. Should be noted that my plexing makes me a billion a month or more at present. The new probing makes for an excellent past time while waiting for timers .. exploration doesn't add a lot, but it does add up. If it wasn't for the new probes I probably wouldn't even be here anymore. Plexing on its own is boring and combat can be hard to find even after I went into mad-dog killer mode (up to 700+ FWStats Kills .. not bad for a plexing carebear \o/)
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha ... when I was in Gallente FW, it was boring and borderline frustrating having to be in definite minority yet to not find willing enemies...
You'll find though that this frontline does not have the same heavy ship focus but is rather more about the frigate/cruiser hulls. Both sides have a lot of newer players and keeping it "small" allows everyone a place at the table.
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha I think Wolfy would have much more fun here than in Gallente, here there's appropriate fights.
If history has shown anything, then it is the bigger the numbers discrepancy becomes the response speeds up and looses weight (fast and light). Amarr/Minmatar are at a good spot now I think. We have lots of mid-size engagements as well as small gang roams, with the weekend slugfests. If the population gap widens the mid-size will be lost and you have t2 frigates pecking away at the immovable blobs that seem to follow numbers.. guerilla warfare.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 09:53:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Esna Pitoojee
Originally by: Rodj Blake Edited by: Rodj Blake on 19/05/2009 14:56:53
An interesting version of events. However, the Mnnies got off to a decent start in FW, steam-rollering the Amarrians day after day and taking system after system.
Since then though, the Amarrians first stabilised things, and the recaptured all of their systems. As things stand, the Amarrians are a system up.
I attribute this to an odd side-effect of there being an existing command structure among the Amarrian corps at the start of FW:
PvPers, as an overall tendency, prefer to fly under FCs and with people they already know. Hence, at the start, the various Amarr FW corps had problems coordinating inter-corp efforts. Minmatar, on the other hand, could simply yell "X up for raiding blob!" and everyone would scramble.
That's probably a fair assessment.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 10:06:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Shun Makoto The Amarr can't seem to get their act together cut a swath into Minmatar space like the Caldari have into Gallente.
Strange really since I usually see the Amarr taking systems.
One thing to bear in mind is that the Caldari have something like a 20% numbers advantage over their Galleante adversaries, whilst the Amarrians are generally outnumbered. I think that in the early days the Minnies had something like 50% more pilots than us, although things are more equal than that nowadays.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 10:23:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Rodj Blake on 20/05/2009 10:30:42
Originally by: Jade Constantine
I liken the whole thing to a resistance movement of idealistic freedom loving heroes opposing a well organized occupying power backed by a neighbouring superpower. 24th Crusade has numbers and fleet experience, spies and sabateurs, strategic weaponry and support pacts with its proxy master in Providence.
I prefer to to liken the TLF to a band of no-hope dead-enders who hate the Empire for its success in civilising a large chunk of the cluster, but that's the beauty of RP
Regarding the 24th Crusade having a numbers advantage, we currently have 2736 pilots compared to the Minmatar militia's 3192. Of course, if you're suggesting that each of ours is worth two of theirs, then you might have a point!
As for spies, it's not as one sided as you make out. We've discovered a few undercover Minnies in our time and our militia channel is still considered to be the last place to post fleet movements. I'd like to take this opportunity to re-affirm PIE's adversion to using alt spies and state that we will not have anyone in our ranks who uses them. Since when did SF become so anti-spy, anyway?
Finally, I think you over-estimate the CVA's impact on the war. Whilst a few of us do have long-standing agreements with them, most of the militia corps do not, and battlefield assistance from them is the exception rather than the rule. Indeed, on occasions the appearance of holder alliances in the are has caused a few headaches for us! Personally, I'd like to see less capital ships in FW rather than more - lets not make FW into the cap-fest that 0.0 often turns into!
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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Booby Trap
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Posted - 2009.05.20 10:36:00 -
[58]
Minmatar shouldn't get too excited by the arrival of dark rising. As soon as they lost a few fleet fights against caldari they left the gallents claiming to be bored. How long before they have recruited all the minmatar pvpers and leave them too. |
crockett EXE
Minmatar Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.05.20 11:16:00 -
[59]
Edited by: crockett EXE on 20/05/2009 11:18:15
Originally by: Rodj Blake Personally, I'd like to see less capital ships in FW rather than more - lets not make FW into the cap-fest that 0.0 often turns into!
Yes, this I can agree with. It's why I hope there is a way to keep the null sec alliances out and to keep their impact at a min. FW from what I've seen is a ISK sink, but it can still be done on the cheap side to an extent as it is now.
Personally, I wish we could keep it all T1 cruisers down. Not just because I can't fly a BS mind you, but more so because it becomes too much of a weapons race once the BS/BC blobs start coming out. Once that happens, typically the only way a fight happens is by accident, that and they tend to be lag fests.
If I was in charge and was to redo FW.. one of the things I'd do, is to remove the acceleration gates at plexs. That would mean gank fleets couldn't sit on the gates to stop the T1 frig cruiser battles inside the plexes. The way it is now, it's always the race into the plex to and to get the gank fleet set up out side, which kills the entire theory behind them.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.20 12:04:00 -
[60]
Quote:
I prefer to to liken the TLF to a band of no-hope dead-enders who hate the Empire for its success in civilising a large chunk of the cluster, but that's the beauty of RP
"Civilising" what?
If aggressively submitting and enslaving other populations is "civilising", how comes that slavery IRL is seen as a very negative thing of a bloody past to be forgotten?
Quote:
Finally, I think you over-estimate the CVA's impact on the war
Heh, CVA teached me how noob at the game I am.
I started the game as Minnie because I don't like lasers, nor drones nor missiles (so, no "min max" afterthought a la Caldari). I picked a red headed stepchildren alike character (see portrait) because I liked the overall looks not because of some inferiority complex or "political inclination". I wondered about how good an alliance had to be, to survive as NRDS entity, moreover heavy on roleplay (which I love).
I even thought asking joining them, as they looked like "the good, roleplay guys in an universe of treachery and no-laws competition".
And what do I end up reading?
That I am supposed to be their slave, that CVA kill those who 3 years before happened to join (a now defunct) KOS corp and then joined another neutral one (but the "sin" has been done). And that they are twisted evils aiding those slavers my corp put to pew pew against.
*Sighs*
Quote:
Minmatar shouldn't get too excited by the arrival of dark rising. As soon as they lost a few fleet fights against caldari they left the gallents claiming to be bored.
We were not bored, we just happen not to be really tied to FW, but are following a gradual plan posted on our forums since January. That plan includes "steps", and when we achieve the required pre-conditions the next step is engaged. If it involves moving in another system, then we pack our stuff and move.
If you check the systems we started from (Villore, then OMS, then Esesier, now Taff), you should exactly see what the program is and where's leading to and why.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 12:19:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Rodj Blake on 20/05/2009 12:33:31 Edited by: Rodj Blake on 20/05/2009 12:21:52 Edited by: Rodj Blake on 20/05/2009 12:20:35
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Quote:
I prefer to to liken the TLF to a band of no-hope dead-enders who hate the Empire for its success in civilising a large chunk of the cluster, but that's the beauty of RP
"Civilising" what?
If aggressively submitting and enslaving other populations is "civilising", how comes that slavery IRL is seen as a very negative thing of a bloody past to be forgotten?
Well, I did say I was RPing, and that sort of attitude wouldn't have been out of place when slavery was alive and kicking ("The White Man's Burden", for example)
Just as Jade RPs someone who sees themselves as a freedom fighter, I RP someone who sees himself as fighting for law and order, God, and the advancement of civilsation. It may surprise you to learn that I don't neccessarily hold identical views to my character.
The thing is, people who do evil seldom see those things as evil and will use all means neccessary to justify them to themselves and others. RL wars of aggression and acts of genocide are often justified as being for the greater good or for the good of the victims ("We're invading to spread democracy", or "we had to destroy the village in order to save it").
Whilst it's fair to say that slavery is evil, it wouldn't be very realistic if all Amarrian slavers went around cackling manically like pantomime villains and telling everyone that they're evil.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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T 2
Minmatar Tribal Core
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Posted - 2009.05.20 12:40:00 -
[62]
Edited by: T 2 on 20/05/2009 12:45:24 I'll just skip the drama and the bashing of individuals here - if that is ok with everyone..
Originally by: Fool jibberjabber Just interested in the state of the Amarr vs Matari FW.. we see lots of well documented reports on here regarding Federation (notably Wolfy's adventures) and Caldari (Pervs still have the best corp name ever), but nothig on the 'other' fight.
Any opinions?
State of Amarr vs Matari FW. In order to understand the present you should understand the history of how it all has come to this. But writing the history of Amarr vs. Matari Fw.. It would take a few days and would be a real wall-of-text.
I'll write a quick and dirty review on how things are looking on the Matari side.
Internal issues This is a real epic drama stuff. I actually changed minmatar militia website logo due to all the drama going on there. It feels really like we are in a MILITIA with different tribes going at each other internally. This drama and strong opinions on some issues have broken the militia a bit. Some fleet are broken in mid flight due to these issues. However - we strive forward.
InternetSpaceShips and fighting the Amarr As for support from the Minmatar minded alliances. Some Amarr seem to claim that we get a lot of support. I'd like to say that too - however the support is somewhat minimal. U'K has its own agenda against CVA in nulsec and I have not seen any U'K pilots in FW space since I got involved. E'M has a fund for plexing that gives out some isk every week to the corp that did the most Victory Points. Star Fraction has been the most present in the FW zone - they actually get their hands dirty and kick Amarr every day.
We are very grateful for E'M and SF for their support - keep it coming - we need it!
One of the biggest problems - and I'm sure its the same with the other factions too - is the lack of FC's. Should we have more FC's -> the fun would be exponential.
Solar System control I'd say that due to the role playing majority in amarr militia, namely PIE - they do get more victory points and more plexes. This is a problem within the Minmatar Militia. We do not have enough people that realize that by doing plexes - there is a good opportunity for some good PvP action.
This and the fact that the plexing spawning system was bugged for a long time so PIE and amarr managed to capture majority of plexes right after downtime for 3-4 months has lead to the situation that Matari is fighting hard to keep their systems. Lately we have had some success in this department and we are slowly starting to get some more plexes and perhaps in the future entire solar systems :-)
Summary CVA support gives and edge for Amarr in BS / capital fights and it results in Amarr being the "superpower" and Minnies are the small and fast rebels that keep on fighting.
All in all a tight fight with fleet PvP fights and plexing is also pretty close - no real overrunning on either side atm.
Hopefully this actually answers the original question.
Best Regards, T 2, co-ceo of Tribal Core
EDIT: Forgot to mention the spies. I have not heard a single peace of "spy" intel about Amarr flee movements - all the intel we have had has been actual ships in space following them (not alts!!). Making alts to spy on anyone is pathetic IMHO. ----------- Member of Tribal Core - fighting for Minmatar Militia. Death to Amarr; long live the Minmatar Nation.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.20 14:33:00 -
[63]
Originally by: BattleStar Crusader And Who are you jade??? chest beating, role playing on the forums is one thing, but to say that (note above) and then continue to thrash out long winded excuses and not so whittey retorts and still not be part of this war, and part of anything in general. Well i think that rests the case. Goodbye jade
Well it might surprise you to realise that I actually care 100x more what our allies in the warzone think our participation and involvement actually is than what our enemies might try to claim it is. We'll continue to use IC venues to roleplay this conflict and all the weapons at our disposal to aid the Minmatar cause. I think you might enjoy it more if you didn't let it get so personal. At one level we're all just gamers enjoying a good old space war. Don't get bitter - just rig up another ship and cherish the challenge!
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.20 14:46:00 -
[64]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 20/05/2009 14:46:43
Originally by: Rodj Blake
Regarding the 24th Crusade having a numbers advantage, we currently have 2736 pilots compared to the Minmatar militia's 3192. Of course, if you're suggesting that each of ours is worth two of theirs, then you might have a point!
Well lets be honest about it. The Minmatar side has had a huge problem with internal drama and pirate corps feuding in and out of its colours and this has led to many fleets being used for personal agendas not the pursuit of the common war aims. This has a massive impact on actual numbers in the warzone. I'll also say here on this ooc forum that I think the Amarrian fleets are effective for purpose and generally suggest better synergy and organization (which isn't a surprise given the superior unity of the Amarrian bloc). For all my in-character derision for the light frigate gangs the 24th crusade use they are effective in getting kills against the Minmatar and they do limit interdiction ability.
On general assessments of numbers I don't really care what the bulk numbers say - I see this conflict in space every night - I follow the killboards and large engagements and I'll say currently in my estimation the Amarrians have far bigger participation in the large fleets at specific musters and more reliable participation in the after downtime plex bonanza and euro tz light gangs. Still just because its this way now doesn't mean it has to stay this way in the future. Eve is there to be won :)
Quote: As for spies, it's not as one sided as you make out. We've discovered a few undercover Minnies in our time and our militia channel is still considered to be the last place to post fleet movements. I'd like to take this opportunity to re-affirm PIE's adversion to using alt spies and state that we will not have anyone in our ranks who uses them. Since when did SF become so anti-spy, anyway?
We really aren't. But its not a priority either. Reality is theres nothing that a spy could find out about 24th Crusade movements that we couldn't (and indeed do) ourselves discover by shadowing fleets with scouts. SF is certainly not adverse to infiltration if it helps - but in this warzone it literally doesn't.
The impact of spying to the Militias though is more through paranoia and provoking rage and frustration. I've seen several Minmatar fleets disrupted by the Amarrian's reposting fleet commands gathered through their alts in the mini fleets in local. Virtually impossible to stop the spies joining the fleets if you have open joining from the militia npc corp of course. And as I said largely irrelevant operationally.
But - it does cause massive disruption to junior or first time FC's to know their commands are relayed instantly to the enemy and then boasted about in local. Its psyops and mental propaganda and designed to spread fear and distrust and sap the will to fight.
I'm not going to judge the tactic either way since on one level I even admire it from its cruel efficiency - but it would be wrong for you to conclude this kind of thing doesn't have a huge impact on the ability for inexperienced FC's to get the confidence to engage and deploy their forces.
Quote: Finally, I think you over-estimate the CVA's impact on the war. Whilst a few of us do have long-standing agreements with them, most of the militia corps do not, and battlefield assistance from them is the exception rather than the rule.
Not at all. The CVA's impact is that any time any enemy of the 24th Crusade deploys dreadnaughts there is a huge threat of a counter drop. Any time carriers are used we're on the clock for CVA intervention. And time a large fleet battle happens in prime time we are all alert for CVA cynos. These are massive factors and really can't be overestimated. Nobody is complaining about this - its war. But it would be completely wrong to write-off the tactical impact.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Jade Constantine
Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.20 14:55:00 -
[65]
Originally by: crockett EXE Yes, this I can agree with. It's why I hope there is a way to keep the null sec alliances out and to keep their impact at a min. FW from what I've seen is a ISK sink, but it can still be done on the cheap side to an extent as it is now.
I think you are a bit misled here really particularly in this conflict. CVA IS already involved. The current barring of alliances is primarily hurting the Ushra'khan and Electus Matari who are prevented from deploying conventional forces in the warzone that they would dearly love to.
And on the capital ships - well one thing that carriers do is give a smaller force the chance to engage against the numbers and be competitive. Many times SF (for example) has undocked 2-3 carriers to fight against a 50 man "blob" and gone on to skirmish for hours. Its a force multiplier that would otherwise simply not exist.
I've watched the TLF deploy a carrier onto a contested major and turn the fight from an Amarrian walkover to a hard fought Minmatar victory.
Its one of those beautiful things about eve - watching a friendly cyno go up and seeing a cap ship come through with logistics support and waves of fighters raises the stakes and changes the dynamic. I find it all very Battlestar Galactica and dramatic and I absolutely love helping outnumbered Minmatar Ruptures win fights they would otherwise have lost with direct logistics support from the capital remote reps
Ultimately I don't forsee faction warfare would ever turn into the 0.0 cap blobs though because there simply isn't enough money in it. Organizations prepared to deploy multi billions of capital ships in hazardous situations for pure roleplay or grudge are relatively few. SF deploy caps because we're playing outnumbered and often outgunned freedom fighters that hate leaving the field to superior numbers. CVA deploy cap ships because they'd cross the universe for a chance to kill SF cap ships :)
But beyond these feuds there aren't that many rare moons of importance to faction warfare and lowsec is a far more dangerous environment than 0.0 for typical cap ship engagements.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
me bored
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Posted - 2009.05.20 16:37:00 -
[66]
Edited by: me bored on 20/05/2009 16:39:18 Are there any greasemonkey scripts floating around that allow you to filter out the posts of certain players on the eve-o forums? I know there are ones like that for phpbb.
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BattleStar Crusader
Amarr Absinthe Brothers Consortium
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Posted - 2009.05.20 18:22:00 -
[67]
Hats off to you jade, your last two posts were really good, and an interesting read. its a better side of you.
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Mitch Taylor
Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.05.20 18:44:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Booby Trap Minmatar shouldn't get too excited by the arrival of dark rising. As soon as they lost a few fleet fights against caldari they left the gallents claiming to be bored. How long before they have recruited all the minmatar pvpers and leave them too.
were being picked on in three different forums at once... halp!
The Dark is Rising... Fight my Brute! |
crockett EXE
Minmatar Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.05.20 19:21:00 -
[69]
Edited by: crockett EXE on 20/05/2009 19:22:30
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: crockett EXE Yes, this I can agree with. It's why I hope there is a way to keep the null sec alliances out and to keep their impact at a min. FW from what I've seen is a ISK sink, but it can still be done on the cheap side to an extent as it is now.
I think you are a bit misled here really particularly in this conflict. CVA IS already involved. The current barring of alliances is primarily hurting the Ushra'khan and Electus Matari who are prevented from deploying conventional forces in the warzone that they would dearly love to.
And on the capital ships - well one thing that carriers do is give a smaller force the chance to engage against the numbers and be competitive. Many times SF (for example) has undocked 2-3 carriers to fight against a 50 man "blob" and gone on to skirmish for hours. Its a force multiplier that would otherwise simply not exist.
I've watched the TLF deploy a carrier onto a contested major and turn the fight from an Amarrian walkover to a hard fought Minmatar victory.
Its one of those beautiful things about eve - watching a friendly cyno go up and seeing a cap ship come through with logistics support and waves of fighters raises the stakes and changes the dynamic. I find it all very Battlestar Galactica and dramatic and I absolutely love helping outnumbered Minmatar Ruptures win fights they would otherwise have lost with direct logistics support from the capital remote reps
Ultimately I don't forsee faction warfare would ever turn into the 0.0 cap blobs though because there simply isn't enough money in it. Organizations prepared to deploy multi billions of capital ships in hazardous situations for pure roleplay or grudge are relatively few. SF deploy caps because we're playing outnumbered and often outgunned freedom fighters that hate leaving the field to superior numbers. CVA deploy cap ships because they'd cross the universe for a chance to kill SF cap ships :)
But beyond these feuds there aren't that many rare moons of importance to faction warfare and lowsec is a far more dangerous environment than 0.0 for typical cap ship engagements.
Yes I do understand they are already involved, but what I'm looking at is Minmatar are often way out numbered as it is, with the BS blobs. Sure maybe we can match the fleet size numbers at times, but most of the time they can out ship class us, if they can't they don't fight.
However what happens when or if CVA can start hot dropping 30 or 50 capitals into a fight anytime the Minatar get a good fleet going or at any imporant battle? Can you match that? I think things would become very stale fast and it would end up being blob warefare.
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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.05.20 23:12:00 -
[70]
If CVA drop 30 capitals in Lowsec surrounding Rens they would not be unopposed.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
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Grim Asse
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Posted - 2009.05.21 13:10:00 -
[71]
To sum up the history of Amarr vs Minmatar, it started with Minmatar steamrolling the Amarr Militia from day one. Victory point requirements for taking systems were rather low and bunkers had less hp, so they managed to take quite a few systems and it only changed when ccp changed the requirements after a week or so, which saved the Amarr from losing more systems, but also made it way harder to retake the lost systems later on.
When first coordination started to form on the Amarr side, vent/TS servers were sabotaged by trolls continuously logging on and off and the overabundance of spies led to the very few established pvp corps Amarr had at the time (I think pie was the only one) to stick to themselves.
Minmatar outnumbered Amarr 2:1 in militia members, 0utbreak completely ruled the field and whilst they didn't blob themselves too much, they were followed by a huge militia blob wherever they went, regardless if they wanted them to or not.
Slacker industries were the only corp within the Amarr militia that did relatively well, but their presence hurt Amarr more than it helped, as they were the reason why 0utbreak had come at all. Also, they primarily were pirates and soon started wardeccing some of the newly formed corps within the Amarr militia and were the reason why there soon started to be first shootouts between militia fleets and the very few CVA gangs that were operating in the area.
From within the initial chaos, a few corps started to emerge - foremost it was Armada who formed around wraithstorm, Series of tubes forming around angelonico and a few good men who rallied around blunter, which were the three most decent Amarr FC's outside slackers at the time.
Angelonico led quite a lot of militia fleets that were so suicidal, I still think he was an 0utbreak alt made for the sole purpose of leading militia sheep to the slaughter, whereas blunter and wraith started sticking to themselves as soon as their corps reached big enough numbers to form corp-only gangs.
Over time, weaker Amarr players either left the militia or grew better to an extent where they were confident enough to take on a militia twice their size and they started to break even with Minmatar in kills and VP despite the numerical advantage unchanged, so they actually performed a lot better on a per player basis. The older Amarr FW corps had quite some infighting going, leading to TUBES disbanding and AFEW as well as AMDA going to nullsec, but smaller FW corps like Gunship Diplomacy and Absinthe Brothers took over, soon to be backed up with TDRS who basically were ex-AFEW.
When 0utbreak left, it became apparent that most of the rest of the minmatar militia weren't as good as they may have thought and their seemingly good performance was merely due to them sneaking on better peoples kilmails, so the Minmatar militia literally imploded, which led to discontent, accusations and infighting.
Heretics (foremost mirrorgod) managed to keep a few well performing fleets going, but their impact on the TLF were probably comparable to that of slackers on the 24th IC, plaing their part in leading to the sorry state the Minmatar are currently in.
The impact of SF on militia operations is rather negligible for 24th IC members like me who can't be wardecced by them, and it seems the coprs they have wardecced are unaffected by it as well. Looking up the kills of the corp they have wardecced the longest (ABC) for example, you'll find that their kills rose by over 50% after the wardec, further increasing in the second month, whereas their losses didn't increase considerably.
Moreover, the claims of CVA support are ridiculous and most of the leading FW corps are KOS to CVA and ratting in providence is a no-go for them. The only incidences I can recall lately was CVA jumping in cap fleets to engage SF and the united cap fleets.
Not really comparable to the 30 cap heavy fleet UK & friends jumped in to take down an AMDA POS last year.
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Hardin
Amarr Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.21 13:15:00 -
[72]
I think everyone is overestimating the CVA's impact on FW and our willingness/ability to drop caps into FW fights at short notice.
If we were dropping caps in to FW fights on a daily or even weekly basis then maybe it would be a major consideration - however our involvement has not been anywhere near that frequent.
Yes enemies of Amarr need to take the 'possibility' of a CVA hotdrop into account but they really shouldn't be any more paranoid about it than anyone else who chooses to put their Dreads into siege.
There are a lot of other organisations (Cry Havoc comes to mind) who will hot drop at the 'drop of a hat' if they get the chance to kill Capitals. ANYONE putting caps in siege should be paranoid but to use 'fear of CVA hotdrop'as an excuse for Minmatar Militia failings really doesn't wash.... ----- Alliance Creation/Corp Expansion Services
http://internetspacewars.blogspot.com/ |
Ezra Tair
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Posted - 2009.05.21 13:18:00 -
[73]
I scan for complexes every time I get a chance, just so I might get a small one that I don't have to worry about facing a more skilled (SP wise) opponent. But, they just don't seem to spawn sometimes. When I am fleeted, and there is a complex explosed, most FC's would rather camp a gate or station for 20 mins than an objective. Perhaps they are adverse to the irreversible standings hit with Amarrian and Caldari empires.
I don't mind the whole Heritics as an extra target thing either. I don't hold grudges against corps that have non aggression agreements with them either. Its a prudent move when you want to focus on advancing your agenda against a numerically superior enemy. It also causes mixed fleets, which I think is a good thing because of the lab, and the boring nature of large fleet warfare.
One thing, far above anything else I have seen. Is that Amarrian forces, that are not of the 24th Crusade, are far more apt to bring advanced ships to the fight than it appears the Matar militia are. Or perhaps, being in the TLF I am with the true irregulars, and corp ran fleets are just a likely to bring the T2 as the next guy. e Regardless, it's a pretty balanced fight. Although its quickly apparent that most Amarrian forces' prime time is slightly before Minmatar forces prime time.
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nasty1
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Posted - 2009.05.25 23:57:00 -
[74]
The situation as I see it in the most simplest way.
Look at the kill boards, take the kills on the amarr kill board and the kills on the mini kill board and compare them. statistically there is only one outcome, do your own homework.
our presence in the war zone dominates (every day we complain about not finding any WTs to kill at certain times of the day)
We are in your systems much more than you are.
We will fight if we are outnumbered if we think it would be a good fight, we do not run like cowards, the amarr run if they think they can't win, that's the real difference.
amarr are game players just like the mini's and I do not condone racial hatred and verbal abuse and try and discourage it
Regarding my FC'ing,
I think I FC for the longest each day and when amarr blob should I run? or stand and fight with everything we can muster.
amarr have had some great fights with us even though we have been outnumbered, extremely enjoyable even though we may have lost some, but we stand and fight and have one some epic fights.
Jade pointed out one and I know they are more.
SF are true warriors just like us mini's.
If you so need links to the epic fights and can't be bothered to do your own homework I will link some, one can be found in my bio of my character.
Nasty
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Hayaishi
Gallente Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2009.05.26 05:47:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Intigo
Originally by: Gin G
Originally by: Veshta Yoshida Talking was tried and diplomatic efforts were made, but the shroud the totalitarian Shakor regime has pulled over the collective Matari eyes seems impenetrable.
Until such a time when the Minmatar realise that Shakor is a traitor to their beloved republic, we shall hold the line against the naked aggression of the malevolent demagogue.
Our most exalted Empress tried showing goodwill by emancipating a fraction of the slaves within the Empire, but still the propaganda oozes from the bowels of the Shakorite dictatorship. Imagine if our most glorious Empress had not foreseen the turmoil in the Republic and had released ALL slaves. The token amount emancipated ended up internment camps due to the Republics inability to accommodate them .. nothing says "Welcome Home" like barbed wire and shanty towns.
Open your eyes, see Shakor for what he is and what he has done to the once proud people of Matar.
arr goto love CVA bunch of utter nuts shall i get the white padded room ready
but IMO the amarr are the best as ive heard almost nothing about them must mean they do there thing instead of just talk about it unlike the calamari
...
(S)He's in PIE. That's not CVA.
Jeez. >_>
mmm, pie...
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