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Miilla
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Posted - 2009.05.26 20:16:00 -
[1]
If so what's a good fit?
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Dirk Magnum
Royal Hiigaran Navy SCUM.
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Posted - 2009.05.26 20:18:00 -
[2]
No. There is no viable active tanking option for structure, and the buffer tank (while effective in the very short-term) requires a long period of repairing (or a very expensive bill in the station) to get back to full strength.
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Miilla
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Posted - 2009.05.26 20:19:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Dirk Magnum No. There is no viable active tanking option for structure, and the buffer tank (while effective in the very short-term) requires a long period of repairing (or a very expensive bill in the station) to get back to full strength.
What about passive?
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Veliria
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Posted - 2009.05.26 20:19:00 -
[4]
Only as potential bait I suppose. Generally you'll have to use all your lowslots (usually atleast 6+) to get a useable hull tank. Armageddon or similar ship with lots of lowslots might work as bait with Reinforced Bulkheads and a DC II.
They do however slow you down a lot and (again) take up all your lowslots.
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Dirk Magnum
Royal Hiigaran Navy SCUM.
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Posted - 2009.05.26 20:27:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Miilla
Originally by: Dirk Magnum No. There is no viable active tanking option for structure, and the buffer tank (while effective in the very short-term) requires a long period of repairing (or a very expensive bill in the station) to get back to full strength.
What about passive?
Passive tanks are for shields. Inactive armor, structure, and some shield tanks are buffers. But this is a bit semantic perhaps.
The passive/buffer structure tank requires most if not all low slots to be taken up by reinforced bulkheads and a damage control. This will give you a lot of HP, but kill your mobility. Since all hull reppers (remote and direct) repair pretty minimal amounts of HP repairs take a long time unless you refit with multiple hull reppers at a station. Structure repairs are also the most costly type of repair at station shops, so if you don't want to rep yourself you may need a lot of ISK, especially if you're flying a battleship. And on that note, battleships are a lot better and structure buffering than anything smaller due to base structure HP and more low slots.
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Bronson Hughes
ADVANCED Combat and Engineering
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Posted - 2009.05.26 20:28:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Miilla
Originally by: Dirk Magnum No. There is no viable active tanking option for structure, and the buffer tank (while effective in the very short-term) requires a long period of repairing (or a very expensive bill in the station) to get back to full strength.
What about passive?
Bolded your answer for you. When talking about armor/structure, there is no 'passive' tanking in the strictest sense of the term, only buffer tanking. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.05.26 20:29:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Furb Killer on 26/05/2009 20:29:58 I think the only ship where it is really a viable (not saying the best, but viable) option is the dominix. It has many lows which it doesnt need for damage mods. There are no trimarks/cdfe's for hull, but you wouldnt want them anyway, so the domi can stay nice and cheap. And the PG of a domi is terrible, and with a hull tank your entire tank costs 1 PG.
And a domi doesnt need to be fast (of course it is still nice to be faster, but if you just make a neut domi you dont need to get inside blaster range like a mega for example.
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Beverly Sparks
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Posted - 2009.05.26 21:48:00 -
[8]
The only ship I would even think about hull tanking would be a Vexor.
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Potrero
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.26 21:59:00 -
[9]
I think I saw a fit for the Armageddon (or was it the Apoc? I get those two ships confused).
- 7x Bulkhead II - 1x Damage Control II (or faction)
I don't remember the rigs.
Fill up the highs with neuts and nos. Fill up the mids with web and scram and you've got a great bait ship.
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Julia Venatrix
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Posted - 2009.05.26 22:07:00 -
[10]
My Google-fu is weak, but ISTR a video of a hull-tanked Navy Mega as a bait ship. Not something to do often, but great if it works. --- Some days you are the pigeon, and some the statue. |
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Chris Liath
Gallente Nex Exercitus Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2009.05.26 23:42:00 -
[11]
Basically, CCP has gone through every possible means to make structure tanking a bad idea. However, always fit a DCU II.
"Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic. |
Alowishus
the united Negative Ten.
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Posted - 2009.05.29 14:37:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Dirk Magnum No. There is no viable active tanking option for structure, and the buffer tank (while effective in the very short-term) requires a long period of repairing (or a very expensive bill in the station) to get back to full strength.
Repair? The idea behind a hull buffer is not to make it out with your ship. It's a suicide camp crasher. I just saw someone do this the other day, it was hilarious.
Dominix
High: Nuets
Mid: Heavy Injector LSE IIs Invul II Point
Low: DCU II Reinforced Bulkhead IIs
Drones: Set of Ham IIs Set of Ogre IIs Set of ECM Drones
Strategy: 1) Locate gate camp 2) Jump in 3) Pwn some people 4) Laugh maniacally as your ship goes down
This particular fellow tagged a Hyperion, Pilgrim and some sort of HAC I believe.
/makes fart noise |
Jotobar
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Posted - 2009.05.29 14:41:00 -
[13]
orca dc2
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Lrrp
Minmatar The Graduates Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2009.05.29 17:18:00 -
[14]
Always remember...real men hull tank
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RC Denton
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Posted - 2009.05.29 21:34:00 -
[15]
Edited by: RC Denton on 29/05/2009 21:37:04
Originally by: Dirk Magnum
Originally by: Miilla
Originally by: Dirk Magnum No. There is no viable active tanking option for structure, and the buffer tank (while effective in the very short-term) requires a long period of repairing (or a very expensive bill in the station) to get back to full strength.
What about passive?
Passive tanks are for shields. Inactive armor, structure, and some shield tanks are buffers. But this is a bit semantic perhaps.
The passive/buffer structure tank requires most if not all low slots to be taken up by reinforced bulkheads and a damage control. This will give you a lot of HP, but kill your mobility. Since all hull reppers (remote and direct) repair pretty minimal amounts of HP repairs take a long time unless you refit with multiple hull reppers at a station. Structure repairs are also the most costly type of repair at station shops, so if you don't want to rep yourself you may need a lot of ISK, especially if you're flying a battleship. And on that note, battleships are a lot better and structure buffering than anything smaller due to base structure HP and more low slots.
Actually passive shield tanking is a very different animal from buffer tanking. You can buffer tank a shield ship also and in that sense a buffer shield tank is equivalent to an armor buffer tank.
A passive shield tank is one that has its shield recharge rate maximized through increasing the total # of hitpoints and mods that reduce the total sec to recharge the shield such as shield power relays and purger rigs.
Buffer tanks are characterized by having a huge amount of EHP that you have to chew through but no or almost no recharge. A passive shield tank has a large amount of EHP to chew up but also has a high recharge rate. In fact on ships such as the drake the passive tank recharge is better than an active tank using a shield booster.
As for the OP hull tankers can make really good bait ships. But the absense of efficient local reppers and the fact that hull remote reps have crappy stats in terms of hp/s means that it's not a very viable solution overall. You can get stupidly large amounts of EHP out of one though with enough lows. Check out a structure tanked carrier like a thanatos or Archon. Fun to do on sisi.
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adriaans
Amarr Ankaa.
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Posted - 2009.05.29 22:49:00 -
[16]
It's THE most fun way to bait gatecamps with -sig- Support the introduction of Blaze crystals for Amarr!
Originally by: UMEE if ure another fotm re-roller, then dont pvp. you'll fail.
QFT! |
foobarx
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Posted - 2009.05.29 23:26:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Alowishus
Originally by: Dirk Magnum No. There is no viable active tanking option for structure, and the buffer tank (while effective in the very short-term) requires a long period of repairing (or a very expensive bill in the station) to get back to full strength.
Repair? The idea behind a hull buffer is not to make it out with your ship. It's a suicide camp crasher. I just saw someone do this the other day, it was hilarious.
Dominix
High: Nuets
Mid: Heavy Injector LSE IIs Invul II Point
Low: DCU II Reinforced Bulkhead IIs
Drones: Set of Ham IIs Set of Ogre IIs Set of ECM Drones
Strategy: 1) Locate gate camp 2) Jump in 3) Pwn some people 4) Laugh maniacally as your ship goes down
This particular fellow tagged a Hyperion, Pilgrim and some sort of HAC I believe.
But wouldn't you do just as well with a big armor buffer?
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.05.29 23:45:00 -
[18]
Don't know if it was mentioned, but modules will take damage when you hull tank, so it isn't practical.
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Caggers
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Posted - 2009.05.30 00:09:00 -
[19]
Use 2 Battleships, one with 8 low slots, one with 8 high slots.
The one with 8 low slots mounts 7 Reinforced Bulkhead II's and a DCU II
The one with 8 highs mounts 8 Large Remote Hull Repair System I's and enough cap mods/rigs to support them (Activating all 8 will use 488 cap/sec with level 5 in remote hull repping)
The hull tanking battleship will then be able to tank 640 dps.
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Shade Millith
International House of PWNCakes Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.05.30 00:43:00 -
[20]
It is usable, but generally not the best.
(According to EFT with lvl5 skills) A mega using a 5 slot tank, no rigs:
Hull Tank - 4 Bulkheads II, 1 DC II = 83,927 EHP - Weakest Thermal at 83,336 EHP/Highest Kinetic at 87,033 EHP
Armor Tank - 2 1600mm Rolled Tungstan, 2 EANM II, 1 DC II = 91,497 EHP - Weakest Explosive at 83,049 EHP/Highest EM at 107,668 EHP
With rigs however the Armor tank goes much higher.
(Funnily enough, if you have low armor skills, a hull tank is far better than a armor tank)
But as others have said, a hull tank slows your ship down alot, compairing the above two, 96m/s for hull, 131m/s for armor.
And yes, I'm really really really bored --------------------------------------------
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Hatsumi Kobayashi
Balls Deep Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.30 04:47:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Lrrp real men hull tank
It says so in the certificates! It must be true! ______
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