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BigJohnG
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Posted - 2009.06.03 12:55:00 -
[1]
Hi all,
What is your preferred Assault Ship and why?
I have started using a Harpy, but was wondering of there is a better one.
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Rip Minner
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Posted - 2009.06.03 12:59:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Rip Minner on 03/06/2009 12:59:05 It's looking like the new stealth bombers are going to be the be new end all of tech 2 frig ship dps. They put out battle ship dps with battle ship weapons and battle ship range with good defences and speed. Pluse you can sneak up on your target and get all ready before they even know your there.
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arbiter reborn
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Posted - 2009.06.03 12:59:00 -
[3]
Edited by: arbiter reborn on 03/06/2009 12:59:40 people still havnt realised that these ships still suck, but a wolf if i have to i like the crazy fallof, but id never buy one, just fly a cruiser
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Psiri
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Posted - 2009.06.03 13:00:00 -
[4]
I wish I could fly a Jaguar, whilst it's a bit weaker in brute force it's flexible and can fit pretty much everything you need with its abundance of mids.
Harpy is a nice 15km tackler, Ishkur isn't bad at this job but I hate drones personally. Ishkur however is the best multi-purpose AF IMO.
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Cmndr Griff
Capitalistic Tendencies Red Dwarf Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.03 13:03:00 -
[5]
Wolf or Jaguar at the moment, with my Ishkur a close second. If the Retribution had its hi-slot moved to the mids then it would be a different story though. Or if Rockets didn't suck...
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Kane Starkiller
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Posted - 2009.06.03 13:06:00 -
[6]
The Ishkur is arguably the best af. Great tank and great DPS. Fielding five light drones is an amazing advantage for a frigate. Plus it has a great slot layout.
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SuiJuris
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Posted - 2009.06.03 14:29:00 -
[7]
I like the vengeance, its probably the best secondary tackler in the game, Can permatank like 90 dps while sporting up to 15k ehp with a frigate sized sig radius. If you let one of them get a hold of you its going to be a while before you can get him off. --- Its like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one." |
Mukutep
Gallente The Centurions
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Posted - 2009.06.03 14:43:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Kane Starkiller The Ishkur is arguably the best af. Great tank and great DPS. Fielding five light drones is an amazing advantage for a frigate. Plus it has a great slot layout.
I agree with that. I really like the Enyo too. It as well has a good tank and good dps. However, only having 2 midslots makes it not as useful. But the Ishkur is still my favorite.
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Lisento Slaven
The Drekla Consortium
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Posted - 2009.06.03 15:12:00 -
[9]
Retribution
I love popping T2 ships without a point. They never expect it. Also have the highest DPS in most roaming frig/t2 frig gangs. Really helps when fighting those larger targets. ---
Put in space whales!
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Spectre3353
Gallente The Python Cartel.
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Posted - 2009.06.03 15:15:00 -
[10]
Ishkur ----- The Python Cartel - My Pirate Blog |
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Anyura
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Posted - 2009.06.03 15:22:00 -
[11]
Could actually use some AF advice myself.
I'm about 1 day away from stepping into the big scary world of Assault Frigs and I don't know which would be the most effective for solo work. I live out 0.0, corpless and generally running away from most fights if I can (I live in Stain, so its a pretty safe bet that *everything* is out to get me). I spend my time running L1 & L2 missions, so the AF in question needs to be good for missioning but a reasonable level of PvP survival.
My current weapon skills are in small lasers, with a amount in small projectiles (<3 my AC punisher). I'm not adverse to the idea of a major reskilling if rockets would be advantagous but then again, I've been told often that rockets are a bad move.
So, given what I've said, would a Retri or Venge be the better option and if you could include a build/link to builds, I'd be grateful =)
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arbiter reborn
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Posted - 2009.06.03 15:22:00 -
[12]
seriously buy cruisers
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Noisrevbus
Caldari Breams Gone Wild
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Posted - 2009.06.03 15:43:00 -
[13]
It should also be noted that they still have the same core problems they always did.
While the speed and sig changes post-QR were good for AF's overall, none of the issues were wholesomely adressed. So even if they fare better today than last year, they still suffer when comparing them both to Interceptors and (tech one-) Cruisers. Interceptors gain alot of "free" performance out of it's core physics while an AF do not. Since they are both frigates, they have recieved similar slots and grid/cpu but an AF rely more on it's slots and thus suffer more in it's grid and cpu. Leaving them with fitting issues, and inability to fully utilize it's bonuses in such a comparison.
For example, an AF is not faster than a Cruiser on MWD with just an AB. Fitting an MWD and still fitting towards it's bonuses (tank, gank) on an AF is troublesome. You usually either tank it with an AB or MWD it without a sufficient tank (a tank even remotely comparable to the survivability of an Interceptor, or Cruiser). The lower damage compared to a Cruiser is fair and can be attributed to the smaller size of weapons providing other benefits (tracking et. al.). There's really no logic as to why it should suffer both grid issues and slot issues giving it a lesser tank, all things involved.
I remember many of the old suggestions for the AF revolving around those two core issues: either a physics overhaul (speed, agility) or a bracket overhaul (slots, grid etc.) and possibly pushing the AF up into the Destroyer class instead where it would have more natural slots and grid to effectively put it's bonuses to use. Considering how they scale, even with frigate-sized modules.
As they stand now, better than before but still much of a nische choice and still not worth taking over either an Interceptor or a tech one Cruiser, in any situation really. Well, aside from taste then. EAS still have similar problems as well. There's really no reason using them unless you bring out a Frigate gang only because you want to fly a Frigate for 'RP' reasons. You want the nische, not the performance .
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Xailz
Godless Horizon.
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Posted - 2009.06.03 15:50:00 -
[14]
Personally i love the Harpy has very nice DPS, Speed, EHP and Tank but it's dangerous coming in close on bigger targets and can't defend itself very well against light drones
I'd have to go with Jaguar and Ishkur being the best and my bias says Jaguar overall it can shoot down drones and has a very nice passive tank which is more than enough to take out Ishkurs
But don't fool yourself just because it's T2 doesn't mean it can kill Cruisers etc a well fitted Cruiser will take you out easily so choose your targets wisely
As said above it would be very different however if the Retribution had more Meds and Rockets weren't terrible
Xz ------ I came, i saw, i posted **** ITT.
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Weeka
Lyonesse. KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.03 16:02:00 -
[15]
An ishkur with a tracking disruptor. ---
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Kane Starkiller
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Posted - 2009.06.03 16:18:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Weeka An ishkur with a tracking disruptor.
This.
But then again I rarely fly my Ishkur anymore since a fully t2 fit Vexor is better in almost every way and is still cheaper than an Ishkur hull. (Make that considerably cheaper)
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4THELULZ
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Posted - 2009.06.03 16:52:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Rip Minner Edited by: Rip Minner on 03/06/2009 12:59:05 It's looking like the new stealth bombers are going to be the be new end all of tech 2 frig ship dps. They put out battle ship dps with battle ship weapons and battle ship range with good defences and speed. Pluse you can sneak up on your target and get all ready before they even know your there.
However soloing in them is laughable. If solo is what you meant - please do feel free to attack me anytime in yours, I love free kills.
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Grek Forto
Malevolent Intentions
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Posted - 2009.06.03 16:58:00 -
[18]
Iskhur, not flying it very much though. Grek Forto Yarring Blog |
Dirk Magnum
Royal Hiigaran Navy SCUM.
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Posted - 2009.06.03 17:13:00 -
[19]
<3 assault ships (before they tripled in price)
These were the first T2 ships I trained for, even though at the time I was training for them I didn't have the skills to T2 fit them
tbh I like them all. Now that I finished my Amarr Dread training I've got some time to hit up some skills I've been meaning to train for awhile, like Caldari Frigate 5 (already have Caldari Cruiser 5 for some reason.) Once that's finished I'll be able to use everyone's T2 frigates. In today's New Eden the Ishkur is my favorite AF for PvE, thanks to its hellacious DPS and tank for its size. For gang PvP I'll go with the Retribution because it's actually quite versatile in the lows despite its obvious lack of mid slots. For solo PvP both of the Minmatar AF's are very nice, thanks to their speed and resists. I can also claim one decent PvP kill with the Vengeance, which can permarun two SAR II's with good skills (I defy any other frigate to do the same), even though its DPS is just appalling.
The Enyo however was my first experience with AF's. It's a monstrous PvE ship relative to its size. Unfortunately I lost mine right after the moon mining trouble because I put a hornet drone in my drone bay instead of an EC 300 drone . I hope you're happy, 22nd Black Rise Crow Pilot. I have yet to find a justification to replace this ship since it now costs around five times the price I originally bought it for. Nonetheless I think that if you're a more active player with a bigger wallet you should consider the Enyo for gang PvP ops, where its lack of midslots doesn't matter as much.
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Phantom Slave
JUDGE DREAD Inc.
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Posted - 2009.06.03 18:38:00 -
[20]
I personally love the Vengeance because of its nasty tank. Makes for a great tackler, but boy does its dps suffer. Retribution is another fun little ship. Fit some beams and tracking enhancers, hit out to 35km still doing 100 dps. Its lack of mid slots sucks for solo, but it's a good lvl 1 and 2 (even 3) mission runner.
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Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2009.06.03 18:43:00 -
[21]
Quote: I can also claim one decent PvP kill with the Vengeance, which can permarun two SAR II's with good skills (I defy any other frigate to do the same)
Cap boosted rifter.
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Ravcharas
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Posted - 2009.06.03 19:45:00 -
[22]
AFs need a role bonus. A la marauders. Bumping either speed or damage or both.
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SwindonBadger
0utbreak KrautbreaK
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Posted - 2009.06.03 20:01:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Rip Minner Edited by: Rip Minner on 03/06/2009 12:59:05 It's looking like the new stealth bombers are going to be the be new end all of tech 2 frig ship dps. They put out battle ship dps with battle ship weapons and battle ship range with good defences and speed. Pluse you can sneak up on your target and get all ready before they even know your there.
if the bombers warp at the sampe speed/ with the same amount of cap then there will alywas be a role for the af in fast roaming gangs, many a time we where slowed as if waiting for a bs by the bad capacity of the bomber.
as for af types,
ishkur for pve to pvp cant really be faulted, only for long range sniping , in which the harpy can fit 150 rails x 4 + 2 damage mods and hit for long range. Harpy can also be fitted for close range pvp and still kill officers in fountain ^^
Eat Them all, let the digestion sort em out |
Kessiaan
Minmatar MicroFunks
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Posted - 2009.06.03 20:41:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Kessiaan on 03/06/2009 20:43:22 Enyo. It can do 300+ DPS like a Harpy, but it tanks better and is better at shooting down drones, and it locks fast enough to catch everything but pods and shuttles at a station undock, barring instawarp BMs of course.
Granted it's complete crap in any fight that doesn't start within scram range, but I got a covops alt.
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McCreary075
Gallente Noir.
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Posted - 2009.06.04 02:41:00 -
[25]
I think AF's should have a role bonus (or the fourth bonus) to AB speed. 25% total for the role bonus, or make it 5% tied to the level of Assault ships.
Having said that, I love my Enyo to death. You can spit out ******ed DPS while still tanking a good amount. I wouldn't call it a solo ship, however. For soloing, I'd use an Ishkur, as others have noted.
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Anyura
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Posted - 2009.06.04 08:40:00 -
[26]
The way I'm reading this, it does seem as though AFs and especially Amarr AFs are sadly lacking, especially for solo work.
However, as I'm not exactly swimming in money, it looks as though a BC isnt an option, so a Venge is pretty much my only option. How would you fit one for solo PvP but more importantly, why would you fit it that way? I'm slowly learning about different ship fittings through experimenting with my Punisher but experimenting is not really something I can afford to much of on a T2 frigate.
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Lachious
Caldari Dark Star Cartel
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Posted - 2009.06.06 19:27:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Kane Starkiller The Ishkur is arguably the best af. Great tank and great DPS. Fielding five light drones is an amazing advantage for a frigate. Plus it has a great slot layout.
Agreed, I hate coming up against this ship in my Crow or any frigate or cruiser for that matter. Good ship. |
Velin Shade
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Posted - 2009.06.06 20:01:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Anyura The way I'm reading this, it does seem as though AFs and especially Amarr AFs are sadly lacking, especially for solo work.
People keep saying this, and yet, how often do you find yourself soloing in an AF? I love flying my retribution in small frigate gangs, which is where AFs really shine imo.
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Lonzo Kincaid
Duty.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 20:40:00 -
[29]
Jagabond, tis awesome. ----------------------
Quote: The rule of thumb is you have to outnumber them 2:1 before you even think about engaging them
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.06.06 21:55:00 -
[30]
my favourite AF's are the wolf and retribution because they have amazing dps and amazing tanks. no point in flying a t1 cruiser, honestly. the afterburner is the best tank you can get, and lots of small guns = tons of damage. |
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