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Dia'Sarbator
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Posted - 2009.06.05 23:50:00 -
[1]
I was talking with some of my fellow co-workers and we came up with an idea that actualy sounded great.
With the new game mechanic of 2x training time till you hit 1.6 million sp. We were wondering why would couldn't be able to approach a school in game, and purchess "tutering". There were two Ideas of how to impliment this that we came up with.
The first method would be to puchessing a set amount of 2x training time. This game mechanic is already implimented and would be easy to impliment. The price for these 2x training times would be progressive in nature. So the first training might cost 1 million isk. The second training might cost 10 million isk. third might cost 25 million isk. So on and so forth. It's mearly a suggestion on the pricing for that mechanic.
the second mechanic which isn't exactly in game is to have them purchess a tutored course, A different skill book or a skill book that enhances the currnet skill. This would unlock 2x training time on that skill and only that skill. This mechanic would involve alot more coding and is not as user friendly as the previous mechanic.
The reason i suggest this is due to how the game plays it takes about 2 - 3 months to get into the fun aspects of the game. Using these "tutor" mechanics i do not feel it will take away from the feel of the new player experience. I feel it would add to all players new and old. Due to the progressive nature of buying the training time it is not possible to "buy" your charicters skills. Though this would provide a manner for new players who want to work harder to get to the meat and patatoes of EVE a way to get those skills faster.
Thoughts Anyone ?
~Dia~ |
Dia'Sarbator
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Posted - 2009.06.05 23:51:00 -
[2]
~ to CCP ~ Sorry if i am posting this under the wrong thread. Please move if i am in error.
Thanks
~ Dia ~ |
Tressin Khiyne
Minmatar The Ronin Syndicate
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:03:00 -
[3]
Not a good idea. |
Dia'Sarbator
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:10:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Tressin Khiyne Not a good idea.
Care to Elaberate ?
With the progressive costs of purchessing the training time i don't see where the flaw in the system would be. a 100 mil charicter might not see the value of this, though a 30 mil charicter or even a 10 mil charicter would see great benifet with this. New players often get fustrated with the Time to progress through the initial skills. this will Offset that by offering Goals to the new players to enhance there training times.
I don't see any downsides to this due to the fact every player new and old would have access to this. |
Darknesss
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:11:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Darknesss on 06/06/2009 00:12:42 I think new players these days have it easy enough. Essentially your talking about purchasing skillpoints for isk, this is unlikely to really help veteran players much, we've already spent years training these skills up, however you are saying new players can do it in half the time.
Since I started, NPC's are worth far more, there are level 4/5 missions. There are complex's, there is the greater SP starter character, there is as you say the double SP training time for new players.
I think new players have had enough attention, the game is supposed to take time to get into, as someone who has been a paying customer for 5 years I would be highly annoyed if they made a change like this, it would have made half my subscription pointless in effect.
I understand its frustrating for newer players, but understand that veterans went through the same process. For me when i started the dream was getting into a battleship, it seemed impossible and it took me MONTHS to get into one. These days it takes 1 day, if that. |
Admiral Perimeter
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:16:00 -
[6]
Learning skills already exist. Implants already exist. This idea is redundant. Sorry. |
Lothros Andastar
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:36:00 -
[7]
It's already far too easy to Buy isk, and newbies have it FAR easier than they EVER have. I will have to say no. If you want an advantage for cash, you have it. it's called GTC |
ThrashPower
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:40:00 -
[8]
It would imo just be another mandatory isk sink, just like clones( seriously the price on clones is insane)... There's always the option to buy a character from the character bazar if you want a headstart. |
Dia'Sarbator
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:42:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Dia''Sarbator on 06/06/2009 00:46:09
Originally by: Darknesss Edited by: Darknesss on 06/06/2009 00:12:42 I think new players these days have it easy enough. Essentially your talking about purchasing skillpoints for isk, this is unlikely to really help veteran players much, we've already spent years training these skills up, however you are saying new players can do it in half the time.
Since I started, NPC's are worth far more, there are level 4/5 missions. There are complex's, there is the greater SP starter character, there is as you say the double SP training time for new players.
I think new players have had enough attention, the game is supposed to take time to get into, as someone who has been a paying customer for 5 years I would be highly annoyed if they made a change like this, it would have made half my subscription pointless in effect.
I understand its frustrating for newer players, but understand that veterans went through the same process. For me when i started the dream was getting into a battleship, it seemed impossible and it took me MONTHS to get into one. These days it takes 1 day, if that.
I compleatly understand where your coming from though you havn't given a reason why it shouldnt' be implimented other then you would be annoyed.
This system is more or less a system that everyone new and old can benifet from. The progressive costs only make it feasible for older charicters to afford the multiple rounds of this training.
As for the changes since eve's release, those are content changes. They are going to release content to the majority of the player base or gear it to the players they are trying to attract.
Using the mentality of "I had to go through it, So should you" is a self defeating arcaic way of looking at the issue of keeping players in eve.
When looking at a new player... How many SP would you say is required to really be able to play the game. to run in a fleet of friends. Telling them to equip a webber and warp scram isn't exactly the peak of interest since your the number one target for the enimies. With the Inflation of the market and the average player sp Much higher then what it was at release, Why wouldnt' you want eve to attract as many new players to the game. This is mearly and incentive system to allow new players to further there training.
Now you state it would have nocked years off your training. I don't see how. On average a developed charicter is training at 2200 - 2600 sp an hour.
Using the 2200 as the bases for comparison. the charicter would only be gaining 9.46 days of training.
Giving access to all charicters to use this system makes it possible so there is no benifet to just new players. |
Ms Delerium
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Posted - 2009.06.06 00:47:00 -
[10]
You cant, I repeat you cant expect to buy SP with isk.
"it's not fair"
there are 2 worlds in this game, the economic (isk) and the knowledge (SP) you can't come here and say tou want to buy one with the other.
besides this idea has been suggested millions of times.
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Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.06.06 01:58:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Ms Delerium besides this idea has been suggested millions of times.
Underestimation of the month tbqfh ___________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
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Kathryn Sanderson
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.06.06 02:00:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Kathryn Sanderson on 06/06/2009 02:03:43
Originally by: Darknesss Edited by: Darknesss on 06/06/2009 00:12:42 I think new players these days have it easy enough. Essentially your talking about purchasing skillpoints for isk, this is unlikely to really help veteran players much, we've already spent years training these skills up, however you are saying new players can do it in half the time.
Since I started, NPC's are worth far more, there are level 4/5 missions. There are complex's, there is the greater SP starter character, there is as you say the double SP training time for new players.
I think new players have had enough attention, the game is supposed to take time to get into, as someone who has been a paying customer for 5 years I would be highly annoyed if they made a change like this, it would have made half my subscription pointless in effect.
I understand its frustrating for newer players, but understand that veterans went through the same process. For me when i started the dream was getting into a battleship, it seemed impossible and it took me MONTHS to get into one. These days it takes 1 day, if that.
Logical Fallacy Detected. Let me explain why. Old players would then be able to train Titan V in 1/2 the time. It's not a BOOST just to new players. It would be a training boost to ALL players. Even so, I disagree with the idea myself. As has been stated by others, there are already training skills and implants.
Kathy
I Have a ****, He sits on the couch and drinks beer all day. |
Quantar Raalsken
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.06 02:03:00 -
[13]
story based reason why NOT to: when u train skill s its actually uploading to ur brain kinda like in the Matrix
doing this sort of thing will over load ur brain and ur head goes splat
the reason why new players get this is cause they are young still and can absorb more info fast like babies IRL
as for explanation as to why it suddenly drops off at a certain point.....well, dont u do that in school too? :P ======= Homeworld Hamachi Network
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Ki Tarra
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2009.06.06 02:27:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Dia'Sarbator Thoughts Anyone ?
This would only widen the SP gap further. New players cannot easily afford to buy training acceleration. Vetern players would simply dump isk into such a feature to ramp up their training. |
Kessiaan
Minmatar MicroFunks
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Posted - 2009.06.06 02:43:00 -
[15]
Just get a second account. Dual-boxing in this game is popular for a reason - you'll be far more effective with two characters with minimally-overlapping skillsets that you can have logged in simultaneously than you will ever be with a single character with twice as many skillpoints.
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Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.06.06 03:01:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Dia'Sarbator I was talking with some of my fellow co-workers and we came up with an idea that actualy sounded great.
With the new game mechanic of 2x training time till you hit 1.6 million sp. We were wondering why would couldn't be able to approach a school in game, and purchess "tutering". There were two Ideas of how to impliment this that we came up with.
The first method would be to puchessing a set amount of 2x training time. This game mechanic is already implimented and would be easy to impliment. The price for these 2x training times would be progressive in nature. So the first training might cost 1 million isk. The second training might cost 10 million isk. third might cost 25 million isk. So on and so forth. It's mearly a suggestion on the pricing for that mechanic.
the second mechanic which isn't exactly in game is to have them purchess a tutored course, A different skill book or a skill book that enhances the currnet skill. This would unlock 2x training time on that skill and only that skill. This mechanic would involve alot more coding and is not as user friendly as the previous mechanic.
The reason i suggest this is due to how the game plays it takes about 2 - 3 months to get into the fun aspects of the game. Using these "tutor" mechanics i do not feel it will take away from the feel of the new player experience. I feel it would add to all players new and old. Due to the progressive nature of buying the training time it is not possible to "buy" your charicters skills. Though this would provide a manner for new players who want to work harder to get to the meat and patatoes of EVE a way to get those skills faster.
Thoughts Anyone ?
~Dia~
Ignore the naysayers.
They don't like the idea because they feel EVERYONE should slug it out just like they did. Well, personally I don't like the present training scheme and ANYTHING to make it easier/faster is a welcomed idea.
The one area where EVE fails is that you don't get any better at anything by use, but rather by just waiting/training. That sucks. Of course it's $15 per month while you are waiting, so EVE is not really a game about playing, but investing time and money.
I hope CCP implements some changes in the future. |
Mya ElleTerego
The Hull Miners Union Gentlemen's Club
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Posted - 2009.06.06 03:32:00 -
[17]
This is the worst idea ive seen yet. You do realize that anyone competitively playing this game would be compelled to do this, thus making near the norm. Which would really only penalize the poor people, and create a disparity in the minorty population of the game, while just doubling the cost to play the game for normal players. Wtf are you a CCP accountant? **** off. Alliance Recruit thread Alliance Homepage/Killboard |
The Jackhammer
Unity Thru Aggression Unity Thru Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 03:42:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Mya ElleTerego This is the worst idea ive seen yet. ...
Even worse than the Warp Core Stab fitted PVP ship?
Mmmmm,
The Jackhammer
Banners and Signatures by: Kalen Vox
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SpaceSquirrels
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.06.06 03:44:00 -
[19]
LOL at all the people who want others to have the same misery as they did.
While I like the idea..... I feel that it wouldn't be fair based on a "buy with money" aspect. People should have to say earn it with FW, Missions, or something so the pvper's can get it as well. Money alone would throw off balance, and screw the little guy. _________________________ EVE has the biggest haters out of any MMO...
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The Jackhammer
Unity Thru Aggression Unity Thru Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 03:44:00 -
[20]
BTW ... BAD idea ... sucks for you to be a newer player and have to try to play catch up.
I've been a faithful subscriber for 5 years now AND should have some benefits ...
Level the playing field? ... got to WOW and skill up
Mmmmm,
The Jackhammer
Banners and Signatures by: Kalen Vox
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Gran Frondre
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Posted - 2009.06.06 03:49:00 -
[21]
no |
Skaggz
Hooride Raiders
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Posted - 2009.06.06 03:55:00 -
[22]
About a month or so ago, someone was pushing this exact same idea. He made FOUR threads on the plan and got shot down every time. Please don't follow in his footsteps. Just give up on this now. |
Netacq
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Posted - 2009.06.06 06:49:00 -
[23]
Why not buy a completly skilled character? Not for ISK - for RL-money...
I assume, it will be a nice business for CCP. Ok., the game will die - but maybe it is time for another game?
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 07:13:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Originally by: Dia'Sarbator I was talking with some of my fellow co-workers and we came up with an idea that actualy sounded great.
With the new game mechanic of 2x training time till you hit 1.6 million sp. We were wondering why would couldn't be able to approach a school in game, and purchess "tutering". There were two Ideas of how to impliment this that we came up with.
The first method would be to puchessing a set amount of 2x training time. This game mechanic is already implimented and would be easy to impliment. The price for these 2x training times would be progressive in nature. So the first training might cost 1 million isk. The second training might cost 10 million isk. third might cost 25 million isk. So on and so forth. It's mearly a suggestion on the pricing for that mechanic.
the second mechanic which isn't exactly in game is to have them purchess a tutored course, A different skill book or a skill book that enhances the currnet skill. This would unlock 2x training time on that skill and only that skill. This mechanic would involve alot more coding and is not as user friendly as the previous mechanic.
The reason i suggest this is due to how the game plays it takes about 2 - 3 months to get into the fun aspects of the game. Using these "tutor" mechanics i do not feel it will take away from the feel of the new player experience. I feel it would add to all players new and old. Due to the progressive nature of buying the training time it is not possible to "buy" your charicters skills. Though this would provide a manner for new players who want to work harder to get to the meat and patatoes of EVE a way to get those skills faster.
Thoughts Anyone ?
~Dia~
Ignore the naysayers.
They don't like the idea because they feel EVERYONE should slug it out just like they did.
Ignore the proponents - they feel that they shouldn't have to progress through the game like everyone else did.
Here's a tip: your fun does not increase with your SP. You dont "have to get to level 80 to compete".
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Shade Millith
International House of PWNCakes Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 08:24:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Nooma K'Larr Ignore the naysayers.
They don't like the idea because they feel EVERYONE should slug it out just like they did.
Damn right they should.
When I started I was told the bare minimum. It then threw me to the sharks.
Starting characters already have a much better tut, and the mission arc nets them quite a bit of money, several frigates/mods/skillbooks and twice the training speed.
Not to mention this idea is poorly thought out. HOW the hell is this gonna help the newbies? The new guys are gonna spend the 1st 1 mil lesson on something like Frigate V, the second 10 mil lesson on gunnery V. Old characters are gonna spend it on Battleship V, or Carrier V.
Who is it gonna help more? --------------------------------------------
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.06 08:27:00 -
[26]
Quote: there is the greater SP starter character
No there isnt
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Darknesss
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 09:14:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Furb Killer
Quote: there is the greater SP starter character
No there isnt
Your too new to realise, but yes there is. When i started the game i started with less than 100k skillpoints, it took a few weeks to train up to be able to fly a battleship. The game was online long before late 2007.
You are saying my thoughts are old fashioned, and its not me being vindictive, the simple fact is you are too impatient to train the skills, you like all the other new characters want to be able to compete with veterans almost immediately I think you are asking far too much. This system does not benefit older players anywhere near as much because according to the OP you are making it more expensive the more SP you have, aswell as that, i've already trained pretty much everything i want to level 5. Its taken me YEARS to do so.
Alot of you are new and dont actually realise what the game was like 4-5 years ago, its NOTHING like it is today. CCP have greatly speeded up how fast newer players can get involved and imo the balance is just about right. You can get into a battleship within a day if you are determined enough.
So as you can already do far more than older players could in their day. You have complex's you have missions that go above level 3, you have cheaper and higher grade implants than we did. You have the new races of character which train a bit faster, you have tutorials (we didnt really get ANY tutorials beyond "this is how you move your ship"). So I think, have newer players not been given enough?
Yes. You have. So take the advantages you have been given and train up your skills patiently like the rest of us have had to do over the last 2-3-4-5-6 years. What makes this game so great is its depth, how long it takes you to specialise and train. It makes it a long term game, if you dont like it go play battlefield or COD. |
Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
|
Posted - 2009.06.06 09:24:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Darknesss
Originally by: Furb Killer
Quote: there is the greater SP starter character
No there isnt
Your too new to realise, but yes there is. When i started the game i started with less than 100k skillpoints, it took a few weeks to train up to be able to fly a battleship. The game was online long before late 2007.
You are saying my thoughts are old fashioned, and its not me being vindictive, the simple fact is you are too impatient to train the skills, you like all the other new characters want to be able to compete with veterans almost immediately I think you are asking far too much. This system does not benefit older players anywhere near as much because according to the OP you are making it more expensive the more SP you have, aswell as that, i've already trained pretty much everything i want to level 5. Its taken me YEARS to do so.
Alot of you are new and dont actually realise what the game was like 4-5 years ago, its NOTHING like it is today. CCP have greatly speeded up how fast newer players can get involved and imo the balance is just about right. You can get into a battleship within a day if you are determined enough.
So as you can already do far more than older players could in their day. You have complex's you have missions that go above level 3, you have cheaper and higher grade implants than we did. You have the new races of character which train a bit faster, you have tutorials (we didnt really get ANY tutorials beyond "this is how you move your ship"). So I think, have newer players not been given enough?
Yes. You have. So take the advantages you have been given and train up your skills patiently like the rest of us have had to do over the last 2-3-4-5-6 years. What makes this game so great is its depth, how long it takes you to specialise and train. It makes it a long term game, if you dont like it go play battlefield or COD.
You realised they nerfed the starting SP down to 50-100~k again, Rite? |
Darknesss
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2009.06.06 09:30:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Blane Xero
Originally by: Darknesss
Originally by: Furb Killer
Quote: there is the greater SP starter character
No there isnt
Your too new to realise, but yes there is. When i started the game i started with less than 100k skillpoints, it took a few weeks to train up to be able to fly a battleship. The game was online long before late 2007.
You are saying my thoughts are old fashioned, and its not me being vindictive, the simple fact is you are too impatient to train the skills, you like all the other new characters want to be able to compete with veterans almost immediately I think you are asking far too much. This system does not benefit older players anywhere near as much because according to the OP you are making it more expensive the more SP you have, aswell as that, i've already trained pretty much everything i want to level 5. Its taken me YEARS to do so.
Alot of you are new and dont actually realise what the game was like 4-5 years ago, its NOTHING like it is today. CCP have greatly speeded up how fast newer players can get involved and imo the balance is just about right. You can get into a battleship within a day if you are determined enough.
So as you can already do far more than older players could in their day. You have complex's you have missions that go above level 3, you have cheaper and higher grade implants than we did. You have the new races of character which train a bit faster, you have tutorials (we didnt really get ANY tutorials beyond "this is how you move your ship"). So I think, have newer players not been given enough?
Yes. You have. So take the advantages you have been given and train up your skills patiently like the rest of us have had to do over the last 2-3-4-5-6 years. What makes this game so great is its depth, how long it takes you to specialise and train. It makes it a long term game, if you dont like it go play battlefield or COD.
You realised they nerfed the starting SP down to 50-100~k again, Rite?
No i didnt know that, but good. |
Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.06.06 09:39:00 -
[30]
Indeed. It came in with Apocrypha, same time as the training speed buff. ___________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
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