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kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.24 20:14:00 -
[1]
I have noticed alot of people complaining about ninja salvagers and have seen very little input into what a pilot can do to avoid them. There are a couple things I do that seem to reduce the amount of ninja salvagers in my missions and i will post them below.
Also i am curious to see what methods other pilots use to help to reduce the problem of ninjas in there missions, so please post your tips.
1.Keep the directional scanner open, set to 360 degrees and set to max range. With the directional set up right you can pick up combat probes that may be narrowing in on you mission. If you pick up 3 or more combat probes on your directional scanner the odds are fairly good they are narrowing in on your mission. If you catch probes zeroing in on your mission grab what loot you have go sell and kill sometime in a station. Rember if your ship isnt were they started to zeroing in they cant lock your ships sig if you leave the area.
2.Fly a smaller sig ship. I know whenever i am using the combat scanner the bigger ships are the the strongest signal. Thus the reason why level 4 missions being ran with BS's are picked up so easily.
3. Carebear tears are the fuel of the ninja salvager it seems . If one makes it into your mission and you smack talk or give them hell over salvaging the wrecks, you just made yourself a target for future ninja's. If they try to open a convo with you really have one of 3 choices:
a. ignore it
b. be cordial this really trips some of them out
c. be beligrant and make yourself a target for future ninja's. In the event you make the mistake of smack talking them change the name of your ship. If i recall the ships name is how they can id your ship when they use there directional scanner and i believe the same goes for probes when they get like a 80% hit or somewere around there if i rember correctly.
4. Salvage the larger wrecks as you go. I know this is a pita but it all depends on how bad they iritate you. If they bother you to the point of sacrificing a couple high slots to a salvager and tractor go for it. Personally I try to just grab the good loot off the wrecks as I go and dont worry about the salvage til the end of the mission.
5. Fit a warp scrambler and a web and kill them as soon as the oppurtunity opens up, then hide out till your agro timer ticks down. This is a little riskier since you are opening yourself up to getting your 700 million isk CNR blown up. Also since the ninjas were bold enough to loot from your wrecks and trip the aggresion counter the odds are pretty good there out for a fight anyhow and you just gave them what they wanted.
Thats all I can think of atm, but I would love to see what tactics the rest of you use to avoid ninjas so post em here.
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ArdMinBG
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Posted - 2009.08.24 20:31:00 -
[2]
Edited by: ArdMinBG on 24/08/2009 20:32:12
best thing is to wait for the ninja to approch the wreck and then shoot the wreck :) and continue doing so till he is there.
second is to try fly out and let him have the aggro :)
third is to do missions during time of the day when there are not so many people in the system. My experience is that ninjas are comming if people in the system are about 120 and more
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JordanParey
Minmatar
Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2009.08.24 20:42:00 -
[3]
Well..
Not all of this is correct. Sometimes we hunt you. We may be ninjas, but there are several of us with good enough standings to a corp to get locator agents. Some of the more attentive ninjas will pay attention to what systems you frequent and when.
And the thing about 120+ people in system? Try 70. If it turns out that there are 70 missioners in a system, running L4 agents, a ninja will eventually find his way in there. Your best bet is to go a few systems off the beaten path or find agents on the opposite end of space.
That said, while this wasn't a whine, I think it would have been better to just post this in the 9 PAGE THREAD instead of making yet another topic about ninjas.
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kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.24 20:48:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: ArdMinBG
Edited by: ArdMinBG on 24/08/2009 20:32:12
best thing is to wait for the ninja to approch the wreck and then shoot the wreck :) and continue doing so till he is there.
yea but i have a sneeking feeling this dont bother them as much as you think especailly if there not there to make isk and just collect buckets of tears.
Quote:
second is to try fly out and let him have the aggro :)
i have had this one backfire but only missions when it requires you to retrive a certain item. Thats only when i havent gotten to the objective
Quote:
third is to do missions during time of the day when there are not so many people in the system. My experience is that ninjas are comming if people in the system are about 120 and more
this works well if you can do it.
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kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.24 20:54:00 -
[5]
Originally by: JordanParey
Well..
That said, while this wasn't a whine, I think it would have been better to just post this in the 9 PAGE THREAD instead of making yet another topic about ninjas.
Personally I dont see how this really compares to the epic whine thread posted below. Also I have no doubt alot of people would love to see threads like this buried in a 9 page wall of text.
As a side note I have no probelms people going out and ninja salvaging wrecks. If thats how they get there kicks more power to em. As many pointed out it is a part of game mechanics and thats what part of what you accept when you pay that 15 dollar a month sub fee
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FOl2TY8
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2009.08.24 21:09:00 -
[6]
Originally by: ArdMinBG
second is to try fly out and let him have the aggro :)
Yes, do this every time please.
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This post brought to you by the worst PVP'er in Eve |
Captain Yifan
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Posted - 2009.08.24 21:12:00 -
[7]
Most important:
Treat those wrecks as they are anybody's instead of yours. This means:
*Dont give them the tear or emorage, thats what makes them happy
*If you can fit Salvagers and Tracktors on while still finishing the mission at a decent rate (e.g. drone-dependant instead of turrent ship), then do it
*Get a marauder
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Tulisin Dragonflame
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Posted - 2009.08.24 21:14:00 -
[8]
Hiding in a station is economically unsound. Wanting to spite someone who annoys you is not a real justification for bringing profits to zero.
The key to deterring ninja salvagers is continuing to grab as much profit as you can, while taking away all of their incentive. Ninja salvagers aren't in it for the loot unless they're really new players. You were on the right track with simply denying them tears.
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kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.24 21:32:00 -
[9]
I have had pretty good luck watching the directional and cooling my heels if I pick up more then a couple combat probes on it. The down side to this is as Tulsin was kind enough to point out puts a serious dampner on your profit margine.
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Natasha Maraska
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Posted - 2009.08.24 21:42:00 -
[10]
Yay! Another identical thread (minus the shining...so far) to the others!
You know another good way to avoid these guys?
A. take away their cool names.  They aren't ninjas. they aren't sneaking in and stealing anything (unless they loot) unnoticed. They are salvagers. Period.
/me looks around for real ninjas, slitting grandmothers' throats and poisoning warlords...in space
Other ideas? See all the other threads on the same subject.
Just remember, there are enough people out there NOT salvaging on purpose, and all those wrecks are just floating in space, eating up my server space and causing lag. So, salvagers, go eat up that lag!!!
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Afrodita B
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Posted - 2009.08.24 21:51:00 -
[11]
You forgot the most drastic and effective way to avoid a ninja salvager.
To become one of them
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g0ggalor
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Posted - 2009.08.24 21:57:00 -
[12]
The best way is simply to not mission in a mission hub.
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Guillame Herschel
Gallente
NME1
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Posted - 2009.08.24 23:01:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Natasha Maraska
Just remember, there are enough people out there NOT salvaging on purpose, and all those wrecks are just floating in space, eating up my server space and causing lag. So, salvagers, go eat up that lag!!!
Do you really think that if wrecks could be found in open space after the mission was turned in that anyone would bother to scan down your mission deadspace?
Do you really think CCP are unaware how much salvagers would love to be able to find wrecks in open space? Hell, I bet most mission runners would go for wreck scanning if that were possible.
But no, CCP designed the system so that the only way to find a wreck to salvage, is to find the mission runner actively running his mission in deadspace.
What does that tell you?
-- The crazy tree blooms at every moment of liberal ascendancy.
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kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.24 23:12:00 -
[14]
Originally by: g0ggalor
The best way is simply to not mission in a mission hub.
and this is a viable option as well. as long you can find a place were supplies are available within a few short jumps.
My goal starting this thread is not to complain about "salvagers" but to make people aware that CCP provided the players with the tools to choose this career but they have also provided players with the tools needed to avoid "salvagers".
There has been some very good input even from the "salvagers" I would to thank everyone for there positive input.
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kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.24 23:19:00 -
[15]
Edited by: kliknik on 24/08/2009 23:20:23
Originally by: Guillame Herschel
Originally by: Natasha Maraska
Just remember, there are enough people out there NOT salvaging on purpose, and all those wrecks are just floating in space, eating up my server space and causing lag. So, salvagers, go eat up that lag!!!
Do you really think that if wrecks could be found in open space after the mission was turned in that anyone would bother to scan down your mission deadspace?
Do you really think CCP are unaware how much salvagers would love to be able to find wrecks in open space? Hell, I bet most mission runners would go for wreck scanning if that were possible.
But no, CCP designed the system so that the only way to find a wreck to salvage, is to find the mission runner actively running his mission in deadspace.
What does that tell you?
I was curious about this as well. My scanning skills are fairly good but i have not yet found the motivation to take astrometrics to 5. I have wondered in the past if the deepspace scan probe has these capabilities. If not maybe some of the changes to salvage that was hinted at in this dev blog may include this as well. The curret mechanics behind scanning for wrecks in deep space is lackluster at best considering your not scanning for wrecks but rather players.
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BlindBleu
Gallente
BOOMers Inc
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Posted - 2009.08.24 23:36:00 -
[16]
Also you can fit ECCM for your ships racial type that will reduce the signal strength for scanning purposes.
But rather than fly a battle ship fly something smaller Battle Cruisers/Heavy Assault Cruisers etc with ECCM.
Also mission run in a Fleet, one note if different fleet members are from different corps only the corp members that killed the wreck can shoot it with out Concord getting involved.
Have one or more Fleet members fitted out in PvP ships that can take out the Salvager's small fast ship(s). Also have more Fleet members waiting in the wings with PVP ships that can dish it out.
One Note a Salvager Response one time, was a T3 Cruiser.
End Result if the Mission Runner Fleet is successful, Salvagers lose lots of ships, and begin having to be more careful who they cause agro with.
Every Plan lasts until the first shot is fired.
"I have a Plan, a good one." Generally means it is not.
If Yellow it get a Fellow Killed |
kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.24 23:47:00 -
[17]
I edited my OP to reflect some of the suggestions made. this is some really good stuff!!
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kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.25 00:00:00 -
[18]
Originally by: BlindBleu
Also you can fit ECCM for your ships racial type that will reduce the signal strength for scanning purposes.
Now this is intresting. I had no idea scan probes worked off signal strength. I was always under the impression it was sig radius. If this is the case wouldnt an ECCM actually increase your signal strength? I thought that was how they worked when put up against an ECM. I am going to have to do some testing tonight with this.
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BlindBleu
Gallente
BOOMers Inc
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Posted - 2009.08.25 00:30:00 -
[19]
Originally by: kliknik
Originally by: BlindBleu
Also you can fit ECCM for your ships racial type that will reduce the signal strength for scanning purposes.
Now this is intresting. I had no idea scan probes worked off signal strength. I was always under the impression it was sig radius. If this is the case wouldnt an ECCM actually increase your signal strength? I thought that was how they worked when put up against an ECM. I am going to have to do some testing tonight with this.
Target size is calculated as sig radius / sensor strength.
[Guide] Making your ship immune to scan probes
http://www.eve-search.com/thread/1119841/page/1
Every Plan lasts until the first shot is fired.
"I have a Plan, a good one." Generally means it is not.
If Yellow it get a Fellow Killed |
kliknik
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Posted - 2009.08.25 01:06:00 -
[20]
Very informative BlindBleu thank you for the information that post was very informative!! Adding ECCM to my lil list up top.
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g0ggalor
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Posted - 2009.08.25 03:59:00 -
[21]
Edited by: g0ggalor on 25/08/2009 04:00:36
Originally by: kliknik
Originally by: g0ggalor
The best way is simply to not mission in a mission hub.
and this is a viable option as well. as long you can find a place were supplies are available within a few short jumps.
There has been some very good input even from the "salvagers" I would to thank everyone for there positive input.
Coming from someonw who ninja's and missions, this is imo the best way. There are plenty of good agents in uncluttered systems near decent trade hubs. When I first started ninjaing, I used eve-agents.com to search for where the best agents that would give the best salvage, and when I went to those systems, half of them barely had 50 people in them. As a MR, I know what criteria to look for in an agent, yet here were these great systems that very few people use.
Instead people just ask, "Where is the mission hub" and mission for the corp that will get them there. Well, that is where all the ninjas are! If you want to avoid ninjas you simply need to mission somewhere else because you will always, no matter if you have a friend/corpmate/alt salvage with you, or use a marauder to salvage as you go, you will have to deal with ninjas none the less. If that doesn't bother you (and it really shouldn't) then stay where you are. If it does bother you, then find a new system.
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FroschForscher
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Posted - 2009.08.25 04:25:00 -
[22]
there are thousands of good quality agents in nice truesec systems outside of dodixie and motsu. i cant understand why somebody would do missions in those hubs. everybody doing so should have a fleet of ninjas in his pocket
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Arthamel
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2009.08.25 06:15:00 -
[23]
That wont work for everyone, scanner range is 14 au, and since Didoxie is system spammed with ninjas, you will see plenty of probes everytime you hit it. So better move range to 2-3 au to be sure we're scanning you, not guy who got mission near you.
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Vhiskey
Caldari
Imperial Forces
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Posted - 2009.08.25 06:40:00 -
[24]
whoever run missions in dodixie should be forced to do courier missions in a freighter
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TheMaster42
Lobster Gazelle Unicorn
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Posted - 2009.08.25 06:59:00 -
[25]
ya i wnat to chim in that donig missuns wit a buddy is asurefir way to deterr ninjas
me in my ravne and buddy in another BS (i hav a lot fo buddys so they culd be in natyhing) wit our t1 mods and t1 drones, wenever we see a ninja we shoot the @#$% out of him
htey always run offf bcuz relly wut could tak out two BSSes with perma tanked setups? nothing
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TheMaster42
Lobster Gazelle Unicorn
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Posted - 2009.08.25 06:59:00 -
[26]
tld; SHOTO NINJAS NAD MAKE THEM PAY FOR STEELING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!@
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Vhiskey
Caldari
Imperial Forces
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Posted - 2009.08.25 07:14:00 -
[27]
Originally by: TheMaster42
ya i wnat to chim in that donig missuns wit a buddy is asurefir way to deterr ninjas
me in my ravne and buddy in another BS (i hav a lot fo buddys so they culd be in natyhing) wit our t1 mods and t1 drones, wenever we see a ninja we shoot the @#$% out of him
htey always run offf bcuz relly wut could tak out two BSSes with perma tanked setups? nothing
how old are you?
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Jim Nakamura
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Posted - 2009.08.25 07:27:00 -
[28]
If ninja salvagers really bother you, fly an overtanked BC in level 4 missions. Generally, BC = level 3 missions = crap salvage that's not wotrth causing tears over. Salvagers will be looking for BS, Marauders and command ships - BS above the other, as there's much less chance they'll be salvaging as they go.
And yes, apart from the brand new characters who are doing it for income, the emorage is half of the fun. Seeing a mission runner go into a hissy fit and blow up his own loot just to stop you getting it is awesome!
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Orion GUardian
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.08.25 09:13:00 -
[29]
You know...the aren't ninjas as they aren't stealthy or elite..l.garbage collectors
Anyway, shooting the wrecks is it for me, or warping out
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Derg Russel
Gallente
Draconic Industries
Eternus Imperium Alliance
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Posted - 2009.08.25 09:46:00 -
[30]
thx
I am Mr Russel! |
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