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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
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Posted - 2009.08.25 22:00:00 -
[1]
"Welcome aboard Ebank 1, Ray" "Thank's Ebank - what's our current destination?" "We're thinking about a nose-dive into that corn field over there. It looked safer than the volcano."
Seriously Ray, thanks for being honest, and best of luck.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.25 22:16:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Lecherito Edited by: Lecherito on 25/08/2009 21:57:20 So every time that something like this happens, meaning scandal or misfortune plagues the MD MVPs, a group of uncomfortably naive individuals arises to voice unconditional support for those affected. Our precious "MD Elite" have, effectively, stolen over a *trillion* ISK in public money. Their "might get it back, might not, mayhaps a year" attitude is akin to the bipolar mentality we saw in LRN's attention whoring, some months ago. Commendable? I think not.
How the bajeezus are those whose ISK you've unethically seized not entitled to input concerning how their capital is utilized? Do the MD elites truly have the authority, the faith, to pull this off while retaining their "good" names? If *anyone* else even *attempted* something like this, they'd be flamed out of MD indefinitely. But because of the "prestige" associated with names like Ray and Athre, people continue to give them the benefit of the doubt. How is this sound? How is that continued faith justifiable?
Ebank started off as corrupt, continued to act corruptly, and has just embarked on one of the most corrupt paths possible. When the F will MDers start standing up for themselves??
-L
I can wish Ray good luck pulling this one out while simultaneously maintaining my 0 isk investment.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.26 13:48:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Brock Nelson Just couple of questions;
1. If a business going under, the first step would be to eliminate liabilities. First thing that came to mind with wiping out the 75b owing to employee salaries. Was that option considered? I can imagine that some people would outright reject that.
2. It's known that EBank owns shares of public corporation including Flux Technologies, does EBank plan to hold onto those shares or sell them off at higher than purchase price?
3. Relating to #2, because you guys froze all accounts; customers can't retrieve their isk or earn interest. What's to stop other corporation whose shares are owned by EBank from sending dividends to EBank? I don't have any investment in EBank but if I did, my line of thought would probably be like this "If I can't get my money, why should I send these guys money?"
Good luck
You bring a great point here, Brock. Whatever their intentions might be, E-bank has effectively stolen a trillion isk, with a promise of "we'll pay it back".
I would hold you and any other companies with collateral, securities or other assets to seize 100% blameless to claim or at least freeze those assets against this default, doing no worse than a trusted third party reclaiming loan collateral on a scam or bust IPO/bond.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.26 14:48:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Ray McCormack
Originally by: Salvo Brunel You have stated that you won't be asking for repayment of the 75b paid as salary. Have any of those who received salaries offered to repay it?
Yes, some have. I refused their offer.
This is what I'm hearing, do I understand you correctly?
Ebank is in dire straits due to gross mismanagement/negligence of various ebank employees. Some of those employees would like to return salaries paid to expedite returning ebank's good standing. You're refusing to serve as the natural medium to allow this to happen?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.26 15:28:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Ray McCormack
Originally by: Dzil This is what I'm hearing, do I understand you correctly?
Correct. Go on, ask me to explain why so you can turn around and tell me how my point of view sucks donkey balls.
I'll admit, I've had time to think on this decision, and while it still has no direct impact on my finances, I think you're taking the bank in the wrong direction.
That said, I don't think your point of view sucks donkey balls. I welcome the diversity of skills, experience and ambition that come together in EVE, yours included.
Needless to say, there are many important decisions in ebank's future at this point. To better understand how those decisions were made will become a roadmap to success or failure, that either way I think MD will gain something from.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.26 15:57:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Ray McCormack
Originally by: Dzil I'll admit, I've had time to think on this decision, and while it still has no direct impact on my finances, I think you're taking the bank in the wrong direction.
Care to elaborate further on why and in which direction you would take it?
I'd give customers an option to liquidate, even if at 30, 50, 20, whatever % aligns with the present solvency of the bank. Ricdic stole some money, and members of the board of directors made some mistakes. Admitted, and time to move on.
If you liquidate those that want out, it has a lot of advantages: -They get closure, and can move on from trolling your thread -It means a smaller overall volume of isk to recover. It's easier to earn higher margins on smaller volumes of isk; one of the main reasons Hexxx was interested in shrinking the bank before he resigned.
To me the perception you're creating is attempting to force yourself to be the hero/martyr. You're here to save the day, you're going to make sure every customer gets their isk back fairly no matter what! But I think even if you pull it off, by forcing people down this path you aren't going to earn any credit for yourself or the bank you represent.
Give your customers the opportunity to find their own way out of this fiasco, if they choose. Maintain your commitment to the ones that want to stick with it.
That would be my recommendation. But as I respect it is your time that you choose to pour into this business, which is probably much different than what you originally thought you signed up for, I truly do wish you luck and success in whichever road you go.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.27 13:31:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Kalrand
Originally by: Jin Nib
Originally by: Kalrand
Whats hilarious to me is now its the three Goons that hang out in here that are about the only serious market people that haven't run off with truck loads of their investors' isk recently.
Take your time...
My investors got paid. And I even warned of Ebank. Here's where. MD didn't fund me, the goons did.
Yes Kal, but paying back corpmates or alliance mates is different from paying back investors who's only relationship with you is their trust and investment. Not paying back your alliance mates could cost you your place in a major alliance. Not paying back some guy in MD would likely be seen by your peer group as laughable.
With audits, you could prove that money was borrowed, isk was generated, and money was paid back. It proves you have the capabilities to generate isk. But it brings you no closer to being trustworthy in the eyes of the regular here.
To be fair, that may not be such a bad thing. More and more, we see the trust laid out here betrayed because there's no real repricussions for defaulting a loan. I'm beginning to feel more and more only 0.0 territory holding alliances can underwrite a loan without collateral, where a creditor can extract a real consequence should financial obligations not be met.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.27 13:55:00 -
[8]
Quote:
Assuming you have the financial means to hire a merc corp, or military force within your corp / alliance to extract said 'consequence', and yes of course lets not forget they have to be willing to go and fight to get back at the individuals who pulled a fast one on you. What about the individual investor who is not inside of a large 0.0 alliance, or doesn't go to 0.0 period, how would this benefit them at all?
If you don't have the financial means to go after your loans, you are loaning out too much money.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.27 17:20:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Varo Jan
Regardless, it would take a week for any Director with any nous whatsoever to work out that EBank was a disaster waiting to happen. So, yes, Hexxx failed miserably - as did any Director who lasted more than a week. And they ought to be held accountable - but, judging from the way this thread is going, I doubt that any will suffer the consequences.
Suffer what consequences? Did I miss where the customers of ebank have some recourse they are just avoiding leveraging out of the kindness of their hearts? I see one random alt threatening them with some "information", which due to the need to make public posts about it is likely little more than rubbish.
Did you mean their effective ability to launch their own public offerings/bonds? I'm quite sure with their hands full with ebank, you'll see none anytime soon, at least not on any character you can tie to the directors here.
Perhaps you'll hire a merc fleet to station camp their jita alts?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.27 19:29:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Dranakolys Edited by: Dranakolys on 27/08/2009 18:10:17
Originally by: Dzil
Suffer what consequences? Did I miss where the customers of ebank have some recourse they are just avoiding leveraging out of the kindness of their hearts? I see one random alt threatening them with some "information", which due to the need to make public posts about it is likely little more than rubbish.
Did you mean their effective ability to launch their own public offerings/bonds? I'm quite sure with their hands full with ebank, you'll see none anytime soon, at least not on any character you can tie to the directors here.
Perhaps you'll hire a merc fleet to station camp their jita alts?
If you thought before you posted you would have realised that he is referring to consequences as far as they exist in MD (this needs a "duh"), as limited as they are. One part would be resigning/being fired from their positions. The other is the damage to their reputation and standing, which might actually matter to some of them (haha -- assuming their hands weren't in the jar all along).
Well go ahead member of MD: fire the ebank employees. Wait, you can't: it's a private corp. Customers can whine, petition, and circle jerk outside the ebank virtual HQ if they want, but it won't change a thing. To be honest its up to Ray to decide whether any former BoD members can help him rebuild it, or detract from ebank with their history. There's also the consideration that without solid financial history, he's probably entire reliant on their word for what they currently hold in ebank funds. Firing them could encourage them to fudge those numbers.
As for damage to their reputation and standing, I don't think former ebank employees will walk away untarnished from this. Again, whatever their good intentions, at this point in time ebank has lost over a trillion isk belonging to its investors, and as was said every BoD member is in part accountable for that. But that will only come into play if they actually attempt to leverage their reputations in the future. I am somewhat surprised that we haven't seen some of the major figures from Ebank past and present come here to make a public apology for the damage this caused to ebank's customers.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
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Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
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Posted - 2009.08.27 19:30:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Xetal Maelstrom What reason does anyone have to repay their loan to a bank that kidnapped/stole everyone's money, lacks the game mechanics to do anything about a loan default, and lacks the funds to pay someone to go after someone who defaulted on a loan?
Call me a pessimist, but I just can't see a lot of people with outstanding EBANK loans lining up to pay them back... especially those loans with low/no collateral.
Those with collateral: well, there's incentive. Those with no collateral represent the majority of the problem, they didn't get paid back.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.27 21:38:00 -
[12]
Is it at all possible, that some of those 2 trillion in deposits never actually happened? That someone found a way to monkey with the SQL database, but unlike dbank it went undiscovered?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.28 19:00:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Ray McCormack Do not vilify the staffers staying on to help recuperate this drunken horse, they are acting with best intentions. You may disagree with either the methods or intentions outlined, but it does not give you the right to criticise or demean their character. These are stand up guys who are staying on in the face of all adversity, they deserve that much respect.
Some of them are responsible for the position the bank find itself in, and they're staying on because of that and accept their failings; but others are not responsible. Do not lump them all in the same boat, and remember that your attacks affect those who have no part to play in the culpability. [/quote
That's not very realistic Ray. Ebank is accountable to the damage it caused its customers. When you choose not to name specific BoD members for their role in the fault, that implies the board as a whole shares accountability for the damage, even if they specifically didn't cause it. The blame doesn't just go away.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.28 19:13:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Tesal
Originally by: Ray McCormack
Originally by: TraderAlt 3104989531
1) Are the BOD and employees account frozen as well? 2) Could you tell us how much from those accounts was withdrawn after this solution was proposed/discussed to the BOD and employees, but before it was announced publicly (in aggregate form, no one need be identified)?
1. Yes. 2. 28b if I'm not mistaken, from the accounts I know about. I authorised the withdrawals.
Am I reading this right? You let the BOD pull out their isk to an amount of 28b after you had begun discussing a freeze the bank funds. That was a terrible move, given they were taking out isk at full value while leaving customers with only a fraction of their investment. They walked off with close to 20b isk that wasn't theirs considering cash on hand at the bank. As far as I can see, that is a straight up theft from remaining depositors. This is in addition to all the fees paid out. Its over 100b paid out to EBank insiders as far as I can see. Thats real money, its close to 10% of what you need to set the bank right, and you just passed it out the door to insiders.
I have to mirror this sentiment. Yes, internal BoD members recently put that money into the accounts to attempt to balance solvency personally. However, in the net balance of things, this isn't any different from a customer depositing money in those last 2 weeks either. Nor money customers invested around the time of the first release of information when Ricdic scammed. You essentially allowed insider trading to occur. And again, without specifics to which board members were involved, the community has no choice but to hold the entire board accountable.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Halo Industries
|
Posted - 2009.08.29 15:07:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Proton Power
So your saying that the BOD is responsible for making sure that every isk gets paid that is in every account with the interest that they signed up for?
Then why is there talks of liquidating accounts for lower amounts and why is interest cut off by the BOD.
Now if your going ot cut interest off thats fine, but then people should be able to withdrawl isk.
Since you clearly haven't read the whole thread (pretty surprising given your usual passion for ebank and drama) - I'll answer your questions for 25m isk.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.08.31 16:12:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Stardust CEO
Originally by: LaVista Vista
Originally by: Dr Lebroi
It's no longer justifiable for CCP to claim that the activities of Ebank are 'in-game' therefore beyond intervention. It's clear now that their activities stretch beyond the game and into the real life arena.
I agree with this! No longer can EBANK hide ingame. It's time to take it into real-life and share a few beers with CCP at Fanfest, and laugh at how silly Ricdic was for doing RMT, which landed him a few bans.
I'm attending Fanfest for sure
On that note... someone should convince Ricdic to attend Fanfest, and have a punching booth... let people pay $5 to punch Ricdic, then use that money to buy timecards. Sell those timecards for isk and voila, money in the bank.
I'm not sure whether to laugh at the genius of the idea, or cry that we're joking about hitting people irl for their "video game crime".
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.08.31 16:37:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Master waka no really what has the board done the past 18 months to justify 75 billion in pay checks, none of them have any idea what happened the past 18 months....why did they get paid, why are they getting paid after ebank gets back on its feet?
The answer Ray probably can't give you: because ebank doesn't have them by the nuts.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
|
Posted - 2009.09.01 13:18:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Sytoru Hiroshyma
Originally by: Johnny Ringo Edited by: Johnny Ringo on 01/09/2009 11:03:02 Removing their isk before the accounts were frozen while leaving the rest of us stuck and screwed is more akin to insider trading, which in rl you can go to prison for. We trust ebank and our money's frozen, the guys that ****ed it up get to keep theirs. Sorry, but that's just wrong.
I still don't think that you have understood the order in which events happened. Let me try it another way:
1) Ray: Guys, we're pretty ****ed right about now. 2) BOD: We have 17Mil, can we help? *chucks 45B isk into the bank from personal accounts. 3) Ray: Nice thought guys but that's really just ****ing in the ocean. I'm gonna have to freeze all deposits and interest on same. I advise you to take that ISK back again since it's gonna do **** to help. 4) BOD: *yoink* 23B of 45B isk reclaimed.
As for the period of time that elapsed between stages 1 and 4 we don't know because nobody has asked. Christ, it could have been 5 minutes for all we know.
True, and that's pretty unfair. While I guess that's Ray's call, I'm disappointed nonetheless that the final withdrawls from ebank for the foreseeable future were the directors pulling some of their own funds out. It simply doesn't give me confidence that returning ebank's customer's money is the BoD's top priority.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.10 15:42:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Heroldyn
Originally by: Claire Voyant
Quote: Please don't evade the profanity filter, Zymurgist
I didn't know the profanity filter had a name.
best post in a 23-pages thread
Well I'm glad there was something here for everyone.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.14 13:35:00 -
[20]
Just curious, after making threats like this what 3rd party will you use to transfer back collateral when people repay their loans?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
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Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.14 16:22:00 -
[21]
Originally by: KaarBaak
Originally by: Dzil Just curious, after making threats like this what 3rd party will you use to transfer back collateral when people repay their loans?
Do any of them really believe they'll get any collateral back if they repay?
Freezing accounts would be cause for concern. Denying people the ability to pay off their ebank loans with ebank isk puts them in terrible trouble. But now attacking their customers/would be investors?
Time to call the next of kin. This one is DEAD.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
|
Posted - 2009.09.15 04:07:00 -
[22]
Originally by: cosmoray
Originally by: SetrakDark Edited by: SetrakDark on 15/09/2009 03:09:23 This
Originally by: isevele please someone correct me, because i pray im wrong......will someone review the financial statement and tell me if the debt has gone up another .1 trillion or no....i thought it was 1.2 trillion and now its 1.27 trillion......what the hell are you people doing?
I believe is referring to this
Pending Withdrawals226,919,577,200
which is a new addition to the sheet.
Edit: and has nothing to do with APIs.
How can they have pending withdrawals of 226B. When I look at the site, I don't see a withdrawal "button", yes I know withdrawals are suspended, I just wondered how you could even action it.
Salaries, of course.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
|
Posted - 2009.09.15 13:35:00 -
[23]
Quote: The possibility of a future bank run means that since the only reason EB is holding deposits is to try and stay open, then it might as well close now because it will close when it unfreezes deposits anyway.
This statement is interesting, and brings an opportunity to steer this 27 page thread back onto some kind of constructive turf (Hey, I like driving on and off the sidewalk).
Ray, you stated ebank will never liquidate. What are your motivations for keeping the bank open?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.17 14:41:00 -
[24]
The roof, the roof, the roof is on fire The roof, the roof, the roof is on fire We don't need no water Let the mother ****er burn.
I've had a change of heart. Since I had no capital in ebank, I now 100% approve of McCormack's actions and direction with ebank. This is the most fun MD has had since, well, the last time ebank announced a bunch of money missing. Please let me know if ebank does launch an IPO, so I can buy a share of this epic piece of history.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.17 21:59:00 -
[25]
October announcement: completion of the Ebank BOD titan fleet is complete. Bye!
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.21 12:16:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Leneerra So you will cease claiming it is in my best intrest that you do this?
Where did they claim it was in your best interest?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.23 13:57:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155
At the moment you essentially have two options.
1. Wait until the next announcement and whine about things until it comes 2. Wait until the next announcement
There are other options. I would suggest the most vindictive thing you could do would be to start your own bank, succeed where ebank failed, and ensure they are never able to regain a place in the market.
At any rate, don't ever accept the false dilemma a salesman gives you.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.25 06:14:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155
Originally by: josh parker Hello Ebank. My main has a loan through your corp. I have made the decision, although not an easy one. That i will not be paying the loan back for at least the next year, maybe even the next two. Also i must ignore any interest i would be paying you over these next two years.
Basically, the company we were working on creating, has how can i say, fallen on hard times, and basically its not in our best interest to honor any former agreements with you as our banker. I know this may be unfortunate for ebamk, however i am sorry. I will get back with you in 6-12 months, and inform you if we are able to pay back the loan interest free. Once again i am sorry, but this is the options we give you, it is in the best interest of our company as a whole. - josh
0/10. Unfortunately, you are late to the party and your joke isn't original. Maybe next time?
The x/10 dismissal meme. Way to beat unoriginality with a stale cliche :P
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.09.27 22:09:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Leneerra I am surprised by the anger that is directed at fellow accountholders that just try to get their isk back (even ebank proclaims the isk they hold hostage belongs to the account holders).
..
I understand many feel a need to pacify those people that hold your isk hostage in some vain hope to get at last something back from what you entrusted to ebank. But try to keep in mind who is actually harmimng you. .
It's similar to cutting in line. If everyone is expecting the early payout to be around 40%, and you manage to get 90% on your balance, it's only reasonable to see that everyone else is getting a little bit less then. If you're in the party of waiting the year for a 100% return, ebank has that much less capital to start with to reach that goal: again, a losing proposition for you.
Granted, I don't think you owe other ebank account holders anything: you got robbed, and you're trying to make the best of that situation. It's a moral grey area. But I see where other's are coming from.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.10.15 12:39:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Drab Cane A thought hit me after reading Hexxx's post about pricing future valuation.
Future valuation refers to the price the stock/security can be expected to be sold for when sold to other investors. That is, in the future, what will other investors think of this security?
Future likely sentiment, discounted to present value, probably puts the value of EBANK accounts closer to 5 - 10% of balance.
Even if the future value of the account is considered its current balance, discount it by the 10%/month most traders can grow their funds, and assume 16 months for EBank to open up, we're talking a value of 20% of current balance.
I did some math on this a while back. The 10%/month (interest rate), 16 months (maturity time) and 20% (estimated current value) are all variables: if you set any two you can arrive at the third.
If you go with 16 months and 10.6% interest/month, a 20% on the current balance is right on the money.
Personally however, given recent learnings about uncollateralized loans to the tune of 100s of billions (and their tendency to bring about the worst in people), I couldn't invest in this no matter what the interest rate without a tighter control of the security to include 3rd party collateralization of the loan. I realize existing ebank clients may not have that option, and are in little control to negotiate for it.
However, something ebank may want to consider in light of it's doing best for all its clients:
If instead of 10.6% interest, it could acquire that "loan" based on market supply/demand at an interest rate of 3% over 16 months, early buyout customers would get 62% of their investment back today. The catch is What security can you provide to bring the trust level back to 3%?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
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Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.10.25 23:46:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Black Dronza Hi EBank officials.
Rather than read through a 32 page post please can you give an update on the recovery plan. How is it going against forecast?
Many thanks -bd-
I mean, the title pretty much broadcasts their intended date of releasing information. I'm not sure why they didn't just set the expectation of Nov 1st, but meh.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.11.02 04:01:00 -
[32]
Ray, in the absence of an update, if you were a dead horse, what size stick would you prefer to be beaten with?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.11.02 20:15:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155
Originally by: EBANK Amarr155 On behalf of everyone at EBANK I would like to apologize for the delay in getting our next announcement out to you.
We're finalising some last minute issues that arose due to the policy changes we'll be announcing. Once they are finalised the post will be made. So expect it this weekend if not sooner. Again we apologize for the delay but it was unavoidable.
BTW, that is me for all the slower people in the room.
Par for the course to call people slow while extending your own deadlines, no?
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.11.03 00:30:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155
Originally by: Dzil
Par for the course to call people slow while extending your own deadlines, no?
I'd have to disagree with you for a couple of reasons:
1. Not my deadline. I didn't provide any input as far as a deadline is concerned, I'm too busy playing with all my new toys to care about deadlines. /sarcasm 2. Slow as in people that wouldn't make the connection not slow as it relates to speed or lack thereof....but I see what you tried to do there. 3. I'm out way more isk than most of you so please forgive me if your cries fall on deaf ears.
I've gotta get back to work making isk back that I wasn't responsible for losing so forgive the shortness of this post (as it relates to length and not attitude or tone).
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Sausage Banking
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Posted - 2009.11.06 12:57:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Rico Minali I would like all my isk, that EBank have decided to keep, to be given to charity, since, I stole most of it from passing strangers in lowsec, I think its only fair it should go to the widows and orphans of all the pilots I have killed and robbed over the past 2 years of piracy.
Rico.
By charity you mean the poorest guy in EVE, right? Cuz I think Ray's running about -1 trillion atm. That's probably rock bottom.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
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Posted - 2009.11.08 18:51:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Roguehalo I've never been any great fan of Ebank........particularly when Ricpric was running it.
However I think that Ray is probably making honest efforts to salvage as much as possible from the wreckage. Salvage operations are probably being hindered by the upcoming patch induced downturn and I suspect that when the 'announcement' does come it will only be a holding announcement since the best time to liquidate Ebank will be during the post patch boom.
tl,dr It's gonna take time....be patient
Aye, but that's just it. Those that are contemplating the "less, but immediate" cash out option would probably like to ride the tide of the patch too. Not let ebank take credit for it while making less money using its interest free loan.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
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Posted - 2009.11.10 00:10:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Leneerra Ray,
If someone was to excercize the option to use at most 30% of their listed account value to function as 20% of the collateral of a new loan (80% colateralized trough other means), and that loan is defaulted on. Then how much of their listed account value would they lose? 30% or 100%?
There's a divide by zero joke in here somewhere, I'm sure of it.
An interesting question though. Complicated by the hypothetical situation of someone trying to game the face value through intentional default.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
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Posted - 2009.11.10 15:58:00 -
[38]
Quote: If you want this to actually work you'll have to accept a pitiful interest rate: a decent 5% roi, 80% collaterized loan could fill up in minutes or hours to the public, and a 4% loan would probably fill up eventually if it was well thought-out and not too huge.
So, why not offer 3%, with the pockets to fulfill those larger loan needs?
3% monthly may be low by EVE standards, but it's still a healthy chunk of money. 36% per year just by simple interest, more if it's being compounded rather than paid off monthly.
Collateral based loans should be "pitifully low" compared to unsecured loans, especially in EVE. People put their money in a bank to be safe. If they wanted high risk, they'd independently invest, or invest in a mutual fund that claimed to be high risk.
I don't think collateralized loans are going to magically fill the debt in ebank's coffers, but it is a good sign they are attempting to return to some kind of business norm. A bank frozen and not offering any services is either making no profit at all, or making profit in very non traditional bank ways.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
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Posted - 2009.11.11 14:43:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Krathos Morpheus
Originally by: Ray McCormack
Originally by: Nano Pope overcollateralized loans
Hardly. Your ISK isn't worth what it should be, we're just allowing you to use it's actual value without liquidating or selling it.
Hardly. You are actually charging money to use what is not yours, but their own money. Anyone can get 6% interest or less with 100% collateral, but you are charging 6 to 10%, asking for the collateral "to exceed the loan amount in value" and valueing isks at 30% when it's value is 40.33% by your own words. You are overcollateralizing in every step and you are not "allowing people to use the money", you are lending them their own money.
I'll agree, that's an uncompetitive offer. On the other hand, Ray and team could probably just lock the isk down entirely bond-style and enter manufacturing/marketing endeavors instead, and make a lot more isk/month than fooling with loans. People wanted a choice, he offered it. Next time specify you want an attractive choice.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
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Posted - 2009.11.11 19:19:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Ray McCormack
Originally by: Proton Power the only thing I can come up with.
The stupid-shop phoned, they want their stupid back, it seems you took it all.
You know C&P does it enough to MD: maybe if we post a couple pages of stuff like this we can get the mods to move the thread to C&P.
Forum wars at their finest.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
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Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
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Posted - 2009.11.11 19:35:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Proton Power
... Does the interest paid out in accounts reflect actual value Ebank has ever paid/owes or does it only reflect enough to make the deficit = with your numbers.
[Microsoft Paper Clip] Are you attempting to ask whether Ray's data is enough to determine the exact amounts owed/paid to each account as interest on outstanding balances? [/Microsoft Paper Clip]
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
|
Posted - 2009.11.13 14:47:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Ray McCormack This thread is now about my manboobs and Reilly's dreams about them.
Although first instinct may be to blame Ray's manboobs for the decline of ebank, it's important to consider that these are in fact a symptom, not the cause, of the current dilemma.
Ray's manboobs are in fact a result of the over supplied pancake and waffle markets, which banks naturally consume the surplus. This, combined with the declining demand for maple syrup, has put terrible economic strain on the bank, adding a lot of non-producing assets.
I have an inside source that suggests Ricdic not only made off with hundreds of billions of isk. He also stole all the execise equipment.
Folks, I have no concrete evidence, but I sense a conspiracy brewing in MD. One which will could wreck havoc on the secondary markets, while secret backroom brokers get rich on the manipulated price of dietary supplements.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari United Kings Holdings
|
Posted - 2009.11.16 16:31:00 -
[43]
People expected an eruption of insolvency once the Ricdic scam landed. Surprisingly, while there was a wave of withdrawls much of the isk stayed put.
My takeaway is that either there's a lot of confidence remaining the bank that remains mostly silent on these forums, and/or there's a lot of isk deposited in the bank belonging to inactive players.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
|
Posted - 2009.11.16 21:10:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Dzil on 16/11/2009 21:15:34 25m to the best haiku regarding ebank's 15day late miss of their deadline to announce stuff. Contest will continue until ebank actually makes an announcement. Yes, this could take longer than the BIG titan lottery.
Edit: also, page 40 snipe.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2009.11.17 14:52:00 -
[45]
Dawn comes from the east Like yesterday, but we're one Day closer to death.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2009.11.17 20:23:00 -
[46]
Originally by: RAW23 Edited by: RAW23 on 17/11/2009 19:11:55 Edited by: RAW23 on 17/11/2009 19:11:28 Edited by: RAW23 on 17/11/2009 19:03:11 EBank was early Or I was a latecomer Isk still in wallet
Edit - Nice idea Dzil! Where did you get it? If you're interested we could team up and fund one of these a week.
Edit 2 - On topic Haiku
Late is a concept Ephemeral like bank debt Blossom falls in road
Original credit Belongs to one "DragonRiderTao": Safer than Ebank
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Waffle Investment Fund
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Posted - 2009.11.18 14:25:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Clementina Are you allowed to make more then one entry? Or is it one per customer?
Make many entries Only one can be winner Do not try too hard.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Waffle Investment Fund
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Posted - 2009.11.19 14:28:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Krathos Morpheus Please learn what a haiku is before even thinking about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku
Anything without caesura, cut or kire is not a good haiku and should not qualify for the best haiku.
Wikipedia Also contains articles on humility.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Waffle Investment Fund
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Posted - 2009.11.20 15:23:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Kalrand So any word on when the next deadline for THE BIG ANNOUNCEMENT is?
Twenty-five million Is giant prize fund, I know; But be patient, please.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
Dzil
Caldari Waffle Investment Fund
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Posted - 2009.11.23 14:45:00 -
[50]
Announcement was made Winner will be decided Sometime tomorrow.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
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Dzil
Caldari SafeHouse Investments of Tautology
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Posted - 2009.11.24 17:26:00 -
[51]
Will send prize today No API Requirement! You are all winners.
Dzil's Corp Sales - 200m |
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