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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:09:00 -
[1]
I was chillin out and buying a Nemesis and I was going to grab some CN Torpedoes for my little outing.
Not like this is news to me but it really hit home when I looked at the market and saw 3000 ISK for a CN torpedo. I mean, there is no other brand except for Dread Guristas, and those are not farmable by your standard carebear in highsec.
Why does CCP coddle Caldari so much? Will this ever change? It goes far beyond missiles.
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Ivana Twinkle
Amarr Polytechnique Gallenteenne
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:12:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa I was chillin out and buying a Nemesis and I was going to grab some CN Torpedoes for my little outing.
Not like this is news to me but it really hit home when I looked at the market and saw 3000 ISK for a CN torpedo. I mean, there is no other brand except for Dread Guristas, and those are not farmable by your standard carebear in highsec.
Why does CCP coddle Caldari so much? Will this ever change? It goes far beyond missiles.
Because of all the Tears about caldari being nerfed? :P
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Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente Eleutherian Guard
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:17:00 -
[3]
Hmm CN Torpedoes are thus an excellent way to cash in loyalty points... ---
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Meiyang Lee
Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:26:00 -
[4]
to put it simple, there's lots of demand, because lots of people use their shield-tanking missile ships to mission. CN missiles are great, CN shield mods are the best available short of deadspace/officer mods, hence there's a big pricetag. Add that a lot of CN missionrunners probably use their LP to get Navy Ravens to sell on, and you end up with demand far outstripping supply, resulting in rather high prices.
Also in PvP faction ammo is the defacto standard, because the T2 stuff has to many drawbacks. This increases demand even further, CN missiles are the only ones available, simple end result.
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Lindsay Logan
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:36:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Meiyang Lee to put it simple, there's lots of demand, because lots of people use their shield-tanking missile ships to mission.
Yeah, its absolutly horrible!
Due to the mission runners that are actually willing to pay lots of isk, the prices are at an all time high!
100 Mill for a CN BCU? lol wut? 400 Mill for a CN Invul? lol wut? Outrageous prices for a CN Raven? lol wut? Stuidly high prices for CN ammo? lol wut?
And it sonoly about a half a year ago the CN BCU as 64 Mill, and CN Raven was 370 Mill. I can outright forge tto use CN Invuls on my PVP fits, unlike armor tankers that can easily uyse the cheap AN EANM.
Mission runners are runing the prices since they got nothing better to do then fly expencive pinatas. I lothe them and their price increasing effect! And it mkaes me wish teh armor tankers was the best mission ships so I cpuld get cheap stuff.
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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:38:00 -
[6]
Well the thing is, there's Caldari Navy Antimatter and Fed Navy Antimatter.
But there's ONLY Caldari Navy missiles. No other brand. That makes it a virtual monopoly.
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Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:41:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Well the thing is, there's Caldari Navy Antimatter and Fed Navy Antimatter.
But there's ONLY Caldari Navy missiles. No other brand. That makes it a virtual monopoly.
Khanid Navy should get Torps while Caldari should get Cruise. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Originally by: CCP Fallout :facepalm:
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Markesian
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:49:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Markesian on 02/10/2009 08:55:36 Back in the day Minmatar LP stores used to have Explosive variants - republic fleet bane torps, republic fleet devastator cruise aso. They got the boot for some reason, I'm not too clear on why.
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ArmyOfMe
Black Nova Corp IT Alliance
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Posted - 2009.10.02 09:28:00 -
[9]
seriously, you must really have started to run out of things to whine about when u make threads like this.
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Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2009.10.02 09:41:00 -
[10]
Cool story, Siigari
Originally by: CCP Whisper So you're going to have to do some actual thinking with regards to hull components and their capabilities instead of copying some cookie-cutter setup. Cry some more.
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Kaikka Alenia
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.10.02 09:50:00 -
[11]
caldari are the most popular race, demand is thus higher, if supply does not match you can do the math... and then complain about it ------ love lost is better than love never lived |
Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2009.10.02 10:51:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa I looked at the market and saw 3000 ISK for a CN torpedo
That's funny, I see them at prices as low as 2400 ISK a piece, and the volume per day is pretty pathetic even in Jita, the belly of the universe... so 2800 would be a more decent estimate. 5500 LP + 5.5 mil ISK + 5000 T1 torps -> 5000 CN torps 1 CN torp (2800 ISK) = 1.1 LP + T1 torp cost (300 ISK) + 1100 ISK 2800 ISK - 1400 ISK = 1.1 LP
1 LP = (aprox) 1272 ISK Not a very good LP exchange rate, if you ask me. Especially considering the pretty low volumes involved (on average, you barely more 1 mil LP's worth of torps if you include all damage types, in Jita, which is VERY low).
So, no, caldari navy LP are NOT worth so much more than other. They're actually worth pretty much the LEAST of ALL possible empires, with Amarr/Minmatar LP shops offering some items bordering on 4000 ISK per LP at current market prices.
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Info about our corp | Beginer's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper |
Roemy Schneider
Vanishing Point.
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Posted - 2009.10.02 10:53:00 -
[13]
my SoE lolly store just atarted giggling - putting the gist back into logistics |
Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2009.10.02 11:15:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Akita T on 02/10/2009 11:19:32
Originally by: Lindsay Logan Due to the mission runners that are actually willing to pay lots of isk, the prices are at an all time high! [...]100 Mill for a CN BCU? lol wut? Outrageous prices for a CN Raven? lol wut?[...] And it sonoly about a half a year ago the CN BCU as 64 Mill, and CN Raven was 370 Mill. I can outright forge tto use CN Invuls on my PVP fits, unlike armor tankers that can easily uyse the cheap AN EANM.
/facepalm...
Prices are actually at an all-time high because CCP banned 6k++ RMT-related ISK farmer accounts three months ago, and a big chunk of them were mission-runners themselves. The LACK of (desperate) mission-runners creates this increase in price, NOT the abundance of them. Countless farmer accounts trying to unload massive amounts of LPs constantly in huge chunks, that's what made LP value become next to negligible.
A CN BCU costs 45k LP, 18 mil ISK and roughly 33.5 mil worth of tags in the "single unit" choice, or 135k LP, 54 mil ISK and roughly 100 mil worth of tags, plus various other items in 5-run BPC form. Even at a very MODEST 1000 ISK per LP, the "single unit" version comes up at 96 mil, the 5-run version somewhere around 60+ mil ISK. The problem with the BPC version is that it's not available in "combat corp" LP-stores, and earning LP for the corps that offer it can be nasty, so the baseline is still the "single-unit" version.
Considering a CNR (or RNI if you prefer the proper name) cost either 500k LP, 200 mil ISK plus materials for a Raven, or 600k LP and a Raven plus a negligible-cost chip, at 1000 ISK per LP, that's 775-675 mil ISK for one. It's only if you value your LP as low as roughly 500 ISK per LP or thereabouts that a CNR can get sold at such incredibly low prices.
Now, as to the "cheap AN EANM"... well, guess what ? The "singleton" offer from combat-oriented LP shops is 9k LP, 3.6 mil ISK and some tags worth around 12.5 mil ISK. Even if you value your LPs at a damn high 4000 ISK per LP, and that would still only cost 52 mil ISK a piece. If you go with the 1000 ISK/LP we used a lot above, that's barely 25 mil per AN-EANM. OF COURSE IT'S DIRT CHEAP ! CCP made it that way.
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Info about our corp | Beginer's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper |
Steve Celeste
Caldari Overdogs
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Posted - 2009.10.02 11:29:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Akita T Now, as to the "cheap AN EANM"... well, guess what ? The "singleton" offer from combat-oriented LP shops is 9k LP, 3.6 mil ISK and some tags worth around 12.5 mil ISK.
Look at the price of tags again Akita, they kinda asploded in value....
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De Guantanamo
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Posted - 2009.10.02 13:36:00 -
[16]
oh look a Siigari thread
fake edit: reported for spam
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Trebor DeCaldar
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2009.10.02 14:18:00 -
[17]
Supply and Demand... did High Schools stop requiring basic economics courses?!?!?
Wait a minute... Siigari, queen of the GTC, and lulz over priced fit kill mails, is complaining about ammo being over priced without actually doing the math.
Originally by: Hoo Is Siigari lost a ship...
In other news, water is wet, fire is hot, and bacon is delicious
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bruce liang
Caldari Dragon Warrior.
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Posted - 2009.10.02 14:29:00 -
[18]
because many ppl use raven finish mission,so the demand of torpedo is mucher than other ammo
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Warrio
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.10.02 14:42:00 -
[19]
Originally by: ArmyOfMe seriously, you must really have started to run out of things to whine about when u make threads like this.
I hate the op for making me agree with this statement. - |
soldieroffortune 258
Gallente Trinity Council
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:02:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Well the thing is, there's Caldari Navy Antimatter and Fed Navy Antimatter.
But there's ONLY Caldari Navy missiles. No other brand. That makes it a virtual monopoly.
Yeah well there's only Gal Navy and Amarr Navy Armor Hardeners and Armor Reps, IIRC, none for Republic Fleet and Caldari Navy.
Makes sense to me, Gallente really dont use missiles, as for Caldari it's their primary weapon system. . . . . . Please re-size your signature to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000 bytes.Applebabe
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Jhagiti Tyran
Mortis Angelus BricK sQuAD.
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:09:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Well the thing is, there's Caldari Navy Antimatter and Fed Navy Antimatter.
But there's ONLY Caldari Navy missiles. No other brand. That makes it a virtual monopoly.
I agree its terrible I want to be able to buy Gallante Navy multifrequancy M and Amarr Navy EMP M the monopoly is totally game breaking.
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Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:13:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Jhagiti Tyran
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Well the thing is, there's Caldari Navy Antimatter and Fed Navy Antimatter.
But there's ONLY Caldari Navy missiles. No other brand. That makes it a virtual monopoly.
I agree its terrible I want to be able to buy Gallante Navy multifrequancy M and Amarr Navy EMP M the monopoly is totally game breaking.
Considering Khanid are pretty much solely focused on using close range missiles, they should get their own Torps/Rockets/HAMs from LP stores. Also they desperately need more combat agents that aren't clumped in one of two lowsec systems _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Originally by: CCP Fallout :facepalm:
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Tippia
Raddick Explorations Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:19:00 -
[23]
Because people are using the LP stuff are ready to pay a lot in order to earn more LP, and since the LP they earn are worth so much, they can use the money they earn to pay a higher price for LP stuff. It's a vicious cycle.
There's also the question of branding — everyone has heard about CN stuff, and buy it in droves, even when they could by completely equivalent stuff for a much lower cost. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki |
Lindsay Logan
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:38:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 02/10/2009 11:19:32
Originally by: Lindsay Logan Due to the mission runners that are actually willing to pay lots of isk, the prices are at an all time high! [...]100 Mill for a CN BCU? lol wut? Outrageous prices for a CN Raven? lol wut?[...] And it sonoly about a half a year ago the CN BCU as 64 Mill, and CN Raven was 370 Mill. I can outright forge tto use CN Invuls on my PVP fits, unlike armor tankers that can easily uyse the cheap AN EANM.
/facepalm...
Prices are actually at an all-time high because CCP banned 6k++ RMT-related ISK farmer accounts three months ago, and a big chunk of them were mission-runners themselves. The LACK of (desperate) mission-runners creates this increase in price, NOT the abundance of them. Countless farmer accounts trying to unload massive amounts of LPs constantly in huge chunks, that's what made LP value become next to negligible.
A CN BCU costs 45k LP, 18 mil ISK and roughly 33.5 mil worth of tags in the "single unit" choice, or 135k LP, 54 mil ISK and roughly 100 mil worth of tags, plus various other items in 5-run BPC form. Even at a very MODEST 1000 ISK per LP, the "single unit" version comes up at 96 mil, the 5-run version somewhere around 60+ mil ISK. The problem with the BPC version is that it's not available in "combat corp" LP-stores, and earning LP for the corps that offer it can be nasty, so the baseline is still the "single-unit" version.
Considering a CNR (or RNI if you prefer the proper name) cost either 500k LP, 200 mil ISK plus materials for a Raven, or 600k LP and a Raven plus a negligible-cost chip, at 1000 ISK per LP, that's 775-675 mil ISK for one. It's only if you value your LP as low as roughly 500 ISK per LP or thereabouts that a CNR can get sold at such incredibly low prices.
Now, as to the "cheap AN EANM"... well, guess what ? The "singleton" offer from combat-oriented LP shops is 9k LP, 3.6 mil ISK and some tags worth around 12.5 mil ISK. Even if you value your LPs at a damn high 4000 ISK per LP, and that would still only cost 52 mil ISK a piece. If you go with the 1000 ISK/LP we used a lot above, that's barely 25 mil per AN-EANM. OF COURSE IT'S DIRT CHEAP ! CCP made it that way.
But if you look at market trends, it had started to go up even before CCP banned the accounts. More players, more demand, more prices, and carebears are despite everything rich.
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baltec1
Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:41:00 -
[25]
Mission Monkies are the reason.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:08:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Lindsay Logan But if you look at market trends, it had started to go up even before CCP banned the accounts.
False.
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Info about our corp | Beginer's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper |
wickedpheonix
Caldari Guy Fawkes Trust Fund 31ST Reliables Division
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:40:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa I looked at the market and saw 3000 ISK for a CN torpedo
That's funny, I see them at prices as low as 2400 ISK a piece, and the volume per day is pretty pathetic even in Jita, the belly of the universe... so 2800 would be a more decent estimate. 5500 LP + 5.5 mil ISK + 5000 T1 torps -> 5000 CN torps 1 CN torp (2800 ISK) = 1.1 LP + T1 torp cost (300 ISK) + 1100 ISK 2800 ISK - 1400 ISK = 1.1 LP
1 LP = (aprox) 1272 ISK Not a very good LP exchange rate, if you ask me. Especially considering the pretty low volumes involved (on average, you barely more 1 mil LP's worth of torps if you include all damage types, in Jita, which is VERY low).
So, no, caldari navy LP are NOT worth so much more than other. They're actually worth pretty much the LEAST of ALL possible empires, with Amarr/Minmatar LP shops offering some items bordering on 4000 ISK per LP at current market prices.
To hell with Jita - you're going to find the real prices for faction ammo in systems like mission hubs. It doesn't make sense for a mission runner to go several jumps to Jita and back just to pick up faction ammo that he'll run through in a few days of dedicated missioning. What he does is just buy in the mission hub where the prices will be inflated but he will earn more money since he doesn't waste time flying to market hubs and spends that time missioning instead.
A quick check shows anywhere from 3,000 to 4,500 per missile, although turnover is somewhat low (since it only really makes sense to use faction ammo in a Marauder and most people don't use those).
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MatrixSkye Mk2
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:43:00 -
[28]
Edited by: MatrixSkye Mk2 on 02/10/2009 16:43:21
Caldari are actually good for something you say? This is unacceptable and must be dealt with immediately!
CCP, NERF CALDARI PLOX!!!
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Jarna
Amarr Eternal Frontier
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:44:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Blane Xero Edited by: Blane Xero on 02/10/2009 09:15:50
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Well the thing is, there's Caldari Navy Antimatter and Fed Navy Antimatter.
But there's ONLY Caldari Navy missiles. No other brand. That makes it a virtual monopoly.
Khanid Navy should get Torps while Caldari should get Cruise. Also give the Khanid navy some god-damn highsec level four agents.
Heh, the Amarr Navy is in the same boat. No hisec L4 agents that aren't negative Quality. As far as Agents that are 80% or higher on Combat missions. ------------------------------
EVE players are just as immature as WoW players. |
Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:50:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Jarna
Originally by: Blane Xero Edited by: Blane Xero on 02/10/2009 09:15:50
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Well the thing is, there's Caldari Navy Antimatter and Fed Navy Antimatter.
But there's ONLY Caldari Navy missiles. No other brand. That makes it a virtual monopoly.
Khanid Navy should get Torps while Caldari should get Cruise. Also give the Khanid navy some god-damn highsec level four agents.
Heh, the Amarr Navy is in the same boat. No hisec L4 agents that aren't negative Quality. As far as Agents that are 80% or higher on Combat missions.
Ministry of Internal Order FTW. But yeah, there really needs to be more disparity between lowsec agents, I.e 10 agents spread out through various systems (Not all clumped into one damn Hub) and a couple of highsec agents _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Originally by: CCP Fallout :facepalm:
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