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Beani Kliadi
Caldari Off-Axis Response
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Posted - 2009.10.11 11:49:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Beani Kliadi on 11/10/2009 11:50:47 Hello
Im looking at creating a research and invention alt to make blueprints to manufacture with.
Im wondering if anyone can tell me the quickest way to get standings with datacore agents and how long it would take.
Also im unsure which skills are appropriate for each type of invention, can someone point me at a chart or spreadsheet that lists the skills and datacore for each item. Aim to make 8 alts for this purpose, so wanna be able to cover a large amount of items and still have enough datacores to do all the invention.
Thanks, Beani Kliadi
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Arous Drephius
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Posted - 2009.10.11 13:38:00 -
[2]
Datacores you get from agents are not free.
If you don't plan on selling the cores then you may as well buy them on the market.
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Cersei
4S Corporation Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2009.10.11 13:46:00 -
[3]
ccc
datacores you get from agents aren't free the isks you spend buying datacores are free
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Beani Kliadi
Caldari Off-Axis Response
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Posted - 2009.10.11 14:20:00 -
[4]
that makes no sense, i think
datacores from agents cost more than datacores off the market?
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Liua Ae
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.10.11 17:50:00 -
[5]
Datacores are "free".
You do research at the agent and every day it gives you X amount of research points, at I believe 50 points you can buy 1 datacore from the agent for 50 points So it only costs time, not isk :)
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Breaker77
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.10.11 18:18:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Liua Ae Datacores are "free".
You do research at the agent and every day it gives you X amount of research points, at I believe 50 points you can buy 1 datacore from the agent for 50 points So it only costs time, not isk :)
Yes because the time spent getting high standings to use the agents, train the skills, and the cost of the skillbooks is completely worthless.
I, and many others, prefer to put a value on my time. However if you live in your mothers basement, then you might not value your time.
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Horchan
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.10.11 18:20:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Liua Ae Datacores are "free".
You do research at the agent and every day it gives you X amount of research points, at I believe 50 points you can buy 1 datacore from the agent for 50 points So it only costs time, not isk :)
Except those same exact datacores could be sold on the market for isk. Thus, they have value, and that value must be accounted for in your profit calculations for when you're using those datacores for invention.
Why use the datacores to help you invent something that overall will get you less isk than if you had just sold the datacores on the market? ---
DesuSigs |
Arous Drephius
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Posted - 2009.10.11 22:05:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Beani Kliadi that makes no sense, i think
datacores from agents cost more than datacores off the market?
No, they're both worth exactly the same.
If you only want the datacores from your agent to use in invention, save yourself the standing grind and just buy them.
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Don Pellegrino
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Posted - 2009.10.11 23:49:00 -
[9]
I just want to rephrase what has been said because it is probably very confusing for those that are trying to understand all the stuff posted above.
Those datacores you receive for nothing have a value, so if you use them instead of selling them, you don't get the isk they're worth. Basically, it's exactly like if you paid for them. Your time has a value and so does the stuff you own and build.
To summarize: Owning stuff but not having its market value in your wallet IS THE SAME AS selling stuff (not owning it) and having the isk in your wallet.
Here's another example that makes me smile everytime: I know a guy that mined to get the minerals he needed to build stuff. The problem was that he could get a lot of isk running L4 missions. In fact, he could have got MORE minerals by running missions and buying the minerals with the money he got by running missions. That means that he lost money by mining!
SO, do what gets you the most isk/hour and then buy what you need.
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Don Pellegrino
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Posted - 2009.10.11 23:59:00 -
[10]
Considering your actual questions:
Do your research and calculate everything. Calculate how much it costs to build the item and calculate the average cost to get a successful invention. Datacores are a nice secondary money input but you will never get enough datacores to be able to sustain 8 alts! We're talking about well over 100 datacores needed everyday, here. Also, getting exactly the kind of datacores you need is far from easy.
Do your research and search for calculators or spreadsheets or create your own. Once you found what item gets you the most isk/24 hours (and has a high enough volume sold everyday in your region), look ingame at the skills needed to invent that item and do it.
Once again: Don't forget to calculate the average invention cost, because if you dont, you will lose money over selling the datacores and building something else (just like my mining example in the post above).
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2009.10.12 02:29:00 -
[11]
Beani, there's a Research Agent Guide on the wiki, which will help you pick some corps/agents to work for.
There is advice on grinding standings with Duvolle and Core Complexion over on EVEbott, which you might be able to adapt to your needs with other factions. [Aussie players: join channel ANZAC] |
Gunnanmon
Gallente Imperial Syndicate Forces The Laughing Men
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Posted - 2009.10.13 14:55:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Beani Kliadi Im wondering if anyone can tell me the quickest way to get standings with datacore agents and how long it would take.
Use an alt to do missions for a good agent, until the rnd alt can get the missions, then use the 1st alt to actually do the missions.
Time? Hmm, depends how hardcore you are at missions. Signature locked for discussing moderation. Navigator
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Kalrand
Charles Ponzi School of Business GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.10.13 15:03:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Kalrand on 13/10/2009 15:03:21 it might be worth mentioning that the skill overlap on a datacore alt, and a invention alt are pretty high.
If one was to say, do missions to raise the funds for the skillbooks needed for invention, and was smart enough to grind standing along the way, a datacore income stream is a nice side benefit for an invention/manufacturing alt.
Smart planning gives you more isk. But the datacores aren't free. Think of them as a secondary income stream.
edit: clarity
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Yarinor
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Posted - 2009.10.13 15:05:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Horchan Except those same exact datacores could be sold on the market for isk. Thus, they have value,...
Just because something has a value doesn't mean you don't get it for free!
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Latitia Velora
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Posted - 2009.10.13 17:35:00 -
[15]
Datacores are a bit special in the "free" catagory.
After the standings grind, skill book purchase, and skill training, it takes hardly any effort to gather them. They are a lot more "free" than the minerals you mine yourself to build.
However, as many people mentioned, they have an isk value once you have them. Using them for invention does not make the invention cheaper, as you could have sold the datacores.
"I have an alt with several RnD agents, which nets me about 100M / month in free isk." This is somewhat correct.
"I make 20M profit per HAC I invented, as I got the datacores for free". This is very wrong.
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Ukucia
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2009.10.13 17:38:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Yarinor
Originally by: Horchan Except those same exact datacores could be sold on the market for isk. Thus, they have value,...
Just because something has a value doesn't mean you don't get it for free!
You're looking at it backwards. Your considering obtaining the item. We're talking about consuming the item.
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2009.10.14 08:26:00 -
[17]
Arous Drephius is apparently on a quest for stupidity.
Once you cover skill book cost then data cores are free.
Being free doesnt mean they have no value(this was probably Arous Drephius's point.)
Wherever you went - Here you are.
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SuperUglyChick
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Posted - 2009.10.14 19:52:00 -
[18]
Grinding the standing for an alt to get lvl4 research agents is not really worth it. It takes forever and brings in very little isk, unless you value your time at 0isk/hour or are going to be running missions anyway.
Copy alt is pretty easy, not as quick as before, but about 10 days(?). Science V, Lab op V, Advanced lab op IV, Scientific Networking I, Cybernetics I, and add in whatever learning skills make it faster through EVEmon. Sounds right.
Why would you make 8 alts if you don't really know what you are doing? So much effort involved, even doing the easiest of tasks. You will click so much you fingers and mouse will break. Start training to play left handed, invention/manufacturing is abysmal clickfest of death.
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Haram Haram
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Posted - 2009.10.23 12:35:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Breaker77
Originally by: Liua Ae Datacores are "free".
You do research at the agent and every day it gives you X amount of research points, at I believe 50 points you can buy 1 datacore from the agent for 50 points So it only costs time, not isk :)
Yes because the time spent getting high standings to use the agents, train the skills, and the cost of the skillbooks is completely worthless.
I, and many others, prefer to put a value on my time. However if you live in your mothers basement, then you might not value your time.
Time to leave the basement Breaker: a skilled toon is worth isk.
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Tanja Cyprus
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Posted - 2009.10.23 13:43:00 -
[20]
Lol the guy asks questions about how to get datacores and people start bombarding him with they are not free comments ....
Of course (once the grinding etc is done) they are "free", you need do nothing to get them. But they are just like "free" isk being paid to you on a regular basis, you wouldn't throw that into a production without expecting to get it back now would you?
As for quickest way to get standing ... grind missions fast + do every 16th mission near where said company has a storyline agent?
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BurnHard
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Posted - 2009.10.23 13:58:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Breaker77 Yes because the time spent getting high standings to use the agents, train the skills, and the cost of the skillbooks is completely worthless.
I, and many others, prefer to put a value on my time. However if you live in your mothers basement, then you might not value your time.
Doh? The time you spend grinding standings up through agents to get the research agents you want is paid in ISK, Loyalty Points, Loot and Salvage. I've been doing it for two weeks and I've made 500m from previous (level 4's because I want high ranking, high quality research agents).
At the end of it, you've got one or more agents giving you free data cores. Where's the fail?
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