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Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.07 00:52:00 -
[1]
Can we please have them do SOMETHING?
Any skills that only give access to some modules or production should also affect those modules in some way.
Example: Jury rigging - 2% reduction in all Rig drawbacks per level. X ship construction - 5% less repair fee for that type of ship Anchoring - 5% less anchor time for EVERYTHING that can be anchored
... for example.
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Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.07 01:01:00 -
[2]
... sounds like a feature request but this is "get ideas" before submitting a feature request. . |
Itala D'Uhmri
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Posted - 2009.11.07 02:12:00 -
[3]
No.
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Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.07 03:57:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Itala D'Uhmri No.
No is not an idea . |
Forranz
The R.I.T.U.A.L Corp Twilight Federation
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Posted - 2009.11.07 06:17:00 -
[5]
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Yarinor
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Posted - 2009.11.07 07:09:00 -
[6]
Quote: Jury rigging - 2% reduction in all Rig drawbacks per level.
No, just yet another skill that everyone will need to have, we have enough of those already.
Quote: X ship construction - 5% less repair fee for that type of ship
This will just increase the current problem we have with Production Efficiency where you more or less need the skill at V to make any profit at all, remember, you aren't improving stuff, you're making it less bad, and there's a limit to how much less you can make it.
Quote: Anchoring - 5% less anchor time for EVERYTHING that can be anchored
This one I really can't see any problem with tho.
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Viggen
Caldari The Lunatic Asylum Notorious Organization of Brothers
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Posted - 2009.11.07 13:42:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Ravenal Can we please have them do SOMETHING?
DED Connections and Hypernet Science. Please CCP, release them to us, or scrap them and take them off the character sheets. Please dont leave unobtainable skills on our skill sheets any longer.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2009.11.08 11:00:00 -
[8]
God these forums....so much negativity, so little reason.
Originally by: Yarinor
Quote: Jury rigging - 2% reduction in all Rig drawbacks per level.
No, just yet another skill that everyone will need to have, we have enough of those already.
Umm, everyone already needs to have Jury 3 to fit non-gridrigs and Jury 4 for T2 grid/electronics rigs. And it's not like everyone *has* to train it to 5 for that extra 2%, as nearly no-one trains skills like armor rigging to 5 either, and the latter gets a fricken 10% drawback reduction /level from that skill.
How many rigging skills do you have trained to 4 or 5, btw?
In short, your objection here is completely and utterly invalid.
Quote:
Quote: X ship construction - 5% less repair fee for that type of ship
This will just increase the current problem we have with Production Efficiency where you more or less need the skill at V to make any profit at all, remember, you aren't improving stuff, you're making it less bad, and there's a limit to how much less you can make it.
That "problem" has nothing to do with the skill. It's merely a consequence of the high level of competition, due to how crowded Eve is these days. Also how simplistic and static manufacturing is ofc.
More importantly, wtf are you on about? Wth does repair costs have to do with production?
Quote:
Quote: Anchoring - 5% less anchor time for EVERYTHING that can be anchored
This one I really can't see any problem with tho.
Would be welcome indeed. |
Jagga Spikes
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2009.11.08 11:56:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Qui Shon ...
Quote:
Quote: X ship construction - 5% less repair fee for that type of ship
This will just increase the current problem we have with Production Efficiency where you more or less need the skill at V to make any profit at all, remember, you aren't improving stuff, you're making it less bad, and there's a limit to how much less you can make it.
That "problem" has nothing to do with the skill. It's merely a consequence of the high level of competition, due to how crowded Eve is these days. Also how simplistic and static manufacturing is ofc.
More importantly, wtf are you on about? Wth does repair costs have to do with production? ...
once you have to repair ship with 1% hull remaining, just about everything :)
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2009.11.08 12:17:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Qui Shon on 08/11/2009 12:18:16
Originally by: Jagga Spikes
Originally by: Qui Shon Wth does repair costs have to do with production? ...
once you have to repair ship with 1% hull remaining, just about everything :)
Mind connecting the dots there?
The dots being manufacturing and repair costs, if I really have to repeat that once more.
Off topic, I've repped countless ships hulls by now, 9/10 times with rem hull reps. Using station services for that.... why would you? If there's hostiles outside, don't undock in that ship?
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2009.11.08 16:10:00 -
[11]
You need Jury Riggivng V to manufacture T3 sub-systems. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.11.09 03:23:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Forranz
that is not an idea!!!
also no.
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RavenPaine
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Posted - 2009.11.09 08:19:00 -
[13]
Agreed . Ship construction should affect ship materials or something similar .Even production time would be nice.
Racial encryption skill , would be nice of it had a defined benefit ( I think it has an undefined benefit)
And Sovereignty......is it even required for Sovereignty
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RedClaws
Amarr Dragon's Rage Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2009.11.09 11:36:00 -
[14]
I'd suggest Survey to also give bonusses to codebreakers, analysers and salvagers ... Stupid survey lvl 5 :(
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Malakari
Amarr Veritas Aequitas Force
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Posted - 2009.11.09 14:07:00 -
[15]
I do wish they'd do something at least besides just allowing skills to be used. Maybe speeding up training for the specific skills they affect or something idk.
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Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.13 19:40:00 -
[16]
This is a "throw around some ideas for skills that don't do anything but grant access/be prereqs" ... those kinda skills are terribly annoying and seem like a waste to have made it through game design even...
Anchoring is getting good reviews.
Construction skills are getting mixed reviews ... an idea there might be to be yet another level of production efficiency, but only for t2+ stuff. Most T2 items don't benefit from extra production efficiency UNLESS they are invention items. So allowing the construction skills to apply to t2 only shortens the gap between t2 invention costs (at the expense of added training time) and t2 bpo producion costs... (speaking as an owner of some t2 bpos so not biased in that aspect)
... if you are gonna say "no" please add why and/or provide an alternative. . |
Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.13 21:20:00 -
[17]
Originally by: RedClaws I'd suggest Survey to also give bonusses to codebreakers, analysers and salvagers ... Stupid survey lvl 5 :(
yeah, should be a basic skill for those professions... similar as spaceship command is the basis of all ship skills. . |
Neliel Soifon
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Posted - 2009.11.14 17:32:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Neliel Soifon on 14/11/2009 17:33:24
Originally by: Yarinor
Quote: Jury rigging - 2% reduction in all Rig drawbacks per level.
No, just yet another skill that everyone will need to have, we have enough of those already
LOL, most stupid answer ever
edit: about those ideas, i like them, btw.
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Neliel Tu
CKSSA Industries Inc.
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Posted - 2009.11.16 04:02:00 -
[19]
My main has Jury Rigging trained to 4, it lets him use large T2 CCC rigs. So it clearly does something, just not in the manner you're bawling about.
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RaTTuS
BIG Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2009.11.16 08:30:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Sturmwolke You need Jury Riggivng V to manufacture T3 sub-systems.
^ this -- 3 Titans Lottery EB | Capital |
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Zaknussem
Intrum Industria
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Posted - 2009.11.16 11:43:00 -
[21]
Another skill that fits right into this topic is the Survey skill, as the upcoming skill req changes in Dominion will make training Survey past III an utter joke.
Yes, the skill grants a "x% per level" bonus, but can anyone really say that they notice that bonus? With Survey becoming next to useless, a change is needed to make it worthwhile to train for other purposes than skill requirements.
At least they made Jury Rigging V be of some use.
Which reminds me, does Industrial Construction past III do anything? I can't see that it does. |
Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.17 04:08:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Neliel Tu My main has Jury Rigging trained to 4, it lets him use large T2 CCC rigs. So it clearly does something, just not in the manner you're bawling about.
yes yes, and lvl5 allows you to manufacture t3 stuff ... but the only thing it does is ALLOW you to do stuff.
All well and good but it should actually DO something more than ALLOW. . |
Khadrea Shakor
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.11.19 08:51:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Ravenal All well and good but it should actually DO something more than ALLOW.
Why, exactly? It only seems logical. You must first master the multiplication table before even thinking about stuff like integrals, for example.
It's not broken. Don't try to fix it.
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Moon Dogg
Gallente The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2009.11.19 21:10:00 -
[24]
Why do you feel that these skills SHOULD do something?
There is nothing wrong with a skill that unlocks an ability or item. Jury Rigging, to me, seems to be perfectly fine the way it is. Anchoring I could definitely see a reason for changing to affect times to anchor - especially since towers are know quite common, and with Dominion will be less integral to the space-holding experience.
*********************************** "Burn the land, boil the sea, you can't take the sky from me..." |
Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.20 02:37:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Khadrea Shakor
You must first master the multiplication table before even thinking about stuff like integrals, for example.
bad example... by being better at the multiplication table you become not only able to learn more math but also do it better. You are talking to someone who has taught elementary school math here...
Every time you learn something new it enables you to understand more stuff... it also brings a deeper understanding to what you already can do. Again... speaking to a professional in this stuff. . |
Khadrea Shakor
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.11.20 06:15:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Ravenal bad example... by being better at the multiplication table you become not only able to learn more math but also do it better. You are talking to someone who has taught elementary school math here...
Every time you learn something new it enables you to understand more stuff... it also brings a deeper understanding to what you already can do. Again... speaking to a professional in this stuff.
Thank you for emphasizing your level of professionalism and insight, but I still consider these skills to be cornerstones. My example may be "bad". Let me try again:
You must first learn to walk in order to start running?
Eagerly awaiting your revelation of being a gym master ;)
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Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.20 18:43:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Khadrea Shakor Thank you for emphasizing your level of professionalism and insight, but I still consider these skills to be cornerstones. My example may be "bad". Let me try again:
You must first learn to walk in order to start running?
Eagerly awaiting your revelation of being a gym master ;)
Kinda funny actually... my high school major (16 - 20 years old) was sports :D
yes, and you would agree that being able to run makes you a better walker (added balance, strength and coordination)
So, your take on this is that the "walking" skill is simply a prerequisite skill that you need at level x to be able to train "running"?
Walking in itself doesn't do anything else ... ? Seriously? . |
Khadrea Shakor
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.11.20 22:54:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Ravenal
Kinda funny actually... my high school major (16 - 20 years old) was sports (which gives me a certificate to do gym with kids) :D
What are the odds of that...
Originally by: Ravenal
yes, and you would agree that being able to run makes you a better walker (added balance, strength and coordination)
No, I would not necessarily agree that being able to run makes one a better walker. You forgot to mention stamina, but the added balance and coordination is questionable due to different mechanics that apply for running (both feet off the ground at the same time, different weight shifting, shock absorption, inner ear stress cycles/eye movement compensation, hand coordination, etc.).
Originally by: Ravenal
So, your take on this is that the "walking" skill is simply a prerequisite skill that you need at level x to be able to train "running"?
In a way, yes. One cannot start running unless learned to walk. In other words - it's a prerequisite. Can't really put a finger on a proper 'level' of it though
Originally by: Ravenal
Walking in itself doesn't do anything else ... ? Seriously?
Of course it does! 1) Gets you from A to B, and 2) allows you to advance to running
You do realise we got slightly off topic, right?
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Ravenal
The Fated E.Y
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Posted - 2009.11.21 01:18:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Khadrea Shakor
No, I would not necessarily agree that being able to run makes one a better walker. You forgot to mention stamina, but the added balance and coordination is questionable due to different mechanics that apply for running (both feet off the ground at the same time, different weight shifting, shock absorption, inner ear stress cycles/eye movement compensation, hand coordination, etc.).
... not a definitive list, but all of those attributes make for more productive walking.
Originally by: Khadrea Shakor
Of course it does! 1) Gets you from A to B, and 2) allows you to advance to running
You do realise we got slightly off topic, right?
Actually we are not, the topic is that there are skills that just give you access to stuff without doing anything by themselves. You've just provided two examples (multiplication table and walking) as examples of skills that are prereqs AND do something by themselves. . |
Khadrea Shakor
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.11.21 09:44:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Ravenal
Actually we are not, the topic is that there are skills that just give you access to stuff without doing anything by themselves. You've just provided two examples (multiplication table and walking) as examples of skills that are prereqs AND do something by themselves.
I think at this point we can agree to disagree. Agree?
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