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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
White Aero
Arcana Imperii Ltd. Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:13:00 -
[1591]
Originally by: Kraken Kill CURRENTLY on SISI Motherships STILL retain the HP BUFF and INCREASE JUMP RANGE. They Currenly have the OLD STYLE Bonuses (vat bay, triage, gang mods, remote rep bonus hel).
When you say you wont be doing ANY changes to motherships do you mean you wont be changing the bonuses but the Ships will still retain the Jump range and HP buff?
Please Confirm this? Please Clarify the poorly presented info in the blog.
ANSWER!!
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Li Na
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:17:00 -
[1592]
Holy crap CCP youv done something cool
on SISI right now for my nyx I can use 20 fighters but only launch 15 FBs due to BW restriction also according to ship details I no longer recieve my 5% bonus per lvl to bombers just fighters. CCP if this is true you might be on your way to redeeming yourself
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McFly
C0LDFIRE
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:19:00 -
[1593]
Wow CCP, you guys really fixed moms... I understand you want to rework them, and have run out of time. Okay got it. But reverting to no change at all while continuing with the other dominion changes you have just made motherships unusable. Titan changes specifically will for sure keep mothership's logged off and hugging poses. The threat of Titan hotdropping and instapopping a mothership is too much risk for these ships and their pilots to be used.
Please move forward with at least the HP Buff at a minimum, otherwise you'll be condemning these ships to remain logged off until whatever changes are eventually implemented. On another note, when should we expect to hear or begin our input on the Dominion Motherships v3.0?
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Tarron Sarek
Gallente Biotronics Inc. Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:21:00 -
[1594]
Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 21/11/2009 02:23:24
Originally by: CCP Hammer Hi, everyone
We have been carefully watching this thread and I want to set the record straight on a few misconceptions.
(..)
The other misconception I want to address is about our public test server. (..)
Thanks for your reply Hammer.
It's good to see some explanation, even though it's not in-depth, but it gives us an idea of what your thoughts and motivations have been.
I'd like to comment again on both the mothership (non-)change and Sisi.
While I do understand your reasons for not changing the motherships until a future patch, I think it's a bit of a harsh decision. This is due to two reasons:
- Titans do get changed. The new doomsday weapon threatens motherships, and the hp boost is what motherships would need to counter that threat.
- You already told players in a devblog how motherships were supposed to get changed.
Point 2 is also something I'd like to point out with regard to Sisi. Of course no change on Sisi is final or can be relied upon. It's the Test-server for a reason and any changes there might just be a crazy idea some dev wants to evaluate with player-feedback (although you got to admit it usually is kind of the final step for design and test iteration..).
But what about devblogs? If you publish a devblog and say "this is what we're going to do", isn't that much more than some test-runs on Sisi? I'm not 100% sure, but have arenas and storefronts ever been points in a devblog which covered changes of a comming patch?
This is what bothers me a bit. You announced changes to motherships, well actually one could say you promised them, as mothership pilots were longing for a boost or change that made their ships more useful or important, and now you're about to leave them out in the rain.
I suggested earlier to give them at least half the planned hp boost, since I believe that a hp boost is what motherships need and should be receiving anyway, sooner or later. Those are supercapitals after all. And half of it to make sure it's not too much. If you previously considered the planned changes to be ok, half of one aspect of the change, basically a passive and defensive change, shouldn't be game-breaking. Even 1/3 would be something. Please also note that I don't own a mothership. It's not my personal agenda. I just think you owe them.
Of course it would only be a transitional solution and as such questionable. It might even worry mothership pilots, as they might fear you could forget about them and not follow up on that temporary change. But that's something which can be easily avoided by simply not forgetting and keeping up the communication
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Balance is power, guard hide it well
"Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam" |
ace togge
Destructive Influence IT Alliance
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:22:00 -
[1595]
Soon we will see the Starwars Galaxies effect :)
Seriously.
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Kuar Z'thain
Fraser's Finest
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:27:00 -
[1596]
Quote: Deleting posts is non-constructive
Disagreement is constructive
You can have a discussion or you can have censorship, they are mutually exclusive.
Posting this again. They must have a delete script or something. Free Abathur |
Misaki Yuuko
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:30:00 -
[1597]
Edited by: Misaki Yuuko on 21/11/2009 02:30:45 Hey hey, this explains a lot:
http://ccp.vo.llnwd.net/o2/features/revelations2/vid-ivar.swf
Goddamnit, oh the irony.
(IBF Ban/Delete/Whatever).
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Lira Reib
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:35:00 -
[1598]
Originally by: CCP Hammer First, IĘd like to say that a single developer cannot come in and unilaterally change everything with no oversight. People are spewing a lot of hate at CCP Nozh but instead itĘs a case of shooting the messenger. He is just doing his job trying to improve the game and explain the reasoning for why changes were made. We work as a team and agree on the direction things are taking. We want the game to be balanced and fun for everyone to play. We also think about the future of the game and how it will be in years to come after our changes weighing the medium- and long-term repercussions.
I'm down with not vilifying nozh, but the fact is the words "target painters" are in a dev blog about capitals. Somebody needs to be vilified, and if it's the entire capital team I'm pretty sure we can adapt.
Quote: We werenĘt entirely happy with the direction and balancing of MOMs before development of Dominion began. Even during the SISI tests they still werenĘt falling into place for us. They were potentially too powerful and that would have resulted in a small minority having a lot of fun at the cost of thousands who would be instapopped in 0.0. So we tried to tune them again to a point we felt was balanced, but then the role of the ships wasnĘt clear once we started to lower the damage. Instead, they started to blur with dreads and carriers.
Whatever the vision for motherships is, I'd just like to recommend that you add "Making the customers happy" to it. The direction things are going right now is short on that. You can apply this to capitals too; phoenix and nag do NOT need a nerf at this point in time.
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Li Na
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:39:00 -
[1599]
Hey if these changes you have implemented on the MSs stays you have won me back from all my hate now just bring the Titans back to where they were put the Nag back the way it was and give us our improved AFs
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Dream Raven
Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:41:00 -
[1600]
Originally by: Misaki Yuuko Edited by: Misaki Yuuko on 21/11/2009 02:30:45 Hey hey, this explains a lot:
http://ccp.vo.llnwd.net/o2/features/revelations2/vid-ivar.swf
Goddamnit, oh the irony.
(IBF Ban/Delete/Whatever).
He doesn't look like a capital pilot at all. No neckbeard or anything.
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Kruzenshtern
Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:42:00 -
[1601]
Originally by: CCP Hammer People are spewing a lot of hate at CCP Nozh but instead itĘs a case of shooting the messenger.
We would appreciate if you choose a better messenger, so he wouldn't have to get shot at. Better as in:
- actually answering the relevant questions, instead of going out and about the issue. No is a good answer sometimes, but spending multiple dozens of lines on various capital redesign issues and exactly zero on MS/SC in the thread burning with MS/SC questions is not a good move - having an actual idea about how game mechanic works (painters vs dreads, etc), OR patiently and explicitly explaining to us why our knowledge is useless. Yes we can theorize that perhaps the mighty devs can suddenly make painters work on sieged dreads. Then tell us so, and be done with it. Otherwise you are putting fires out with gasoline, and making your messenger look stupid in the process.
TL;DR version: if you want to explain - EXPLAIN. Ditch those slimy PR methods.
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Tarron Sarek
Gallente Biotronics Inc. Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:43:00 -
[1602]
Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 21/11/2009 02:43:59
Originally by: Li Na Why not instead of a damage bonus for the titans DD per level make it a time reduction for refire rate or activation time. Make them train for the extra refire rate speed its not like it needs more damage.
This is an interesting idea and would probably make doomsday weapons easier to balance. However it would decrease the incentive to train the skill up to maximum. So it's not a perfect concept.
Imho I've been throwing ideas around in my head of 2 DDs being required to kill a capital ship. A single DD would/should then only severely damage it. - It would encourage timing and co-ordination of titans. Requiring more than simply pressing a button is always a good thing. - It would also discourage and to a certain degree prevent solo-DD-drive-bys. - It would allow titan capital turrets to be boosted as previously planned.
The first two points would be an issue if titans were rare. Since there are so many ingame, it certainly isn't an issue. However it's hard to achieve since capital effective hp differ so heavily.
___________________________________
Balance is power, guard hide it well
"Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam" |
Promethian child
Amarr 0utbreak
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:43:00 -
[1603]
Subscription successfully cancelled
Thats what you get for deleting posts.
I will not play a game run by a bunch of stasi bastards nvm paying for it.
The deletion of constructive posts only shows to me that you do not give a rats arse about your most loyal fanbase The only thing that counts for you is getting in subs and to that end you have stooped to the level any growing corp goes employing ******s that spin a nice tale but have no idea about the product they are selling.
Have fun doing SWG all over again.
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Tarron Sarek
Gallente Biotronics Inc. Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:50:00 -
[1604]
Originally by: Promethian child I will not play a game run by a bunch of stasi bastards nvm paying for it.
I would delete your post simply because of that.
I'm perfectly fine with forum mods doing their job btw. Some of the crap which gets posted here isn't worth the hard-drive space it occupies. If you feel masochistic enough and want to read it all up, go to EVE-Search.
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Balance is power, guard hide it well
"Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam" |
Li Na
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:51:00 -
[1605]
Ok maybe they are not 100% fixed in SISI FBs do 0 damage to just about everything
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Cha chingk
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:51:00 -
[1606]
Will let subscription expire, which will be after Dominion. Good luck getting me to change my mind. (Used to love EVE, the changes and CCCP customer service skills burns my stomach.)
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Vadinho
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:51:00 -
[1607]
Originally by: Tarron Sarek I would delete your post simply because of that.
why does he give a **** he canceled his account
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Kynah
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Posted - 2009.11.21 02:57:00 -
[1608]
Reading all these posts, makes me wonder one little thing. How can a company survive when it goes out its way to alientate its customner base?
How can you allow system development to so substantially go off the rails as to have to admit failure and start again? Who is going to be held accopuntable for these horrendous misjudgments and pay the price?
It is now obvious why CCP's homeland got into so much difficulty; arrogance mixed with incompetence and ignorance will only sustain you for so long.
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Nimrias
Gallente Atropos Asylum
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:01:00 -
[1609]
Edited by: Nimrias on 21/11/2009 03:05:42 I hate poasting, and I'm trying to be constructive here, but you just don't get it CCP. This isn't going to be a long, crazy rant.
Where did this all go wrong? 1. Changing MOMs on Sisi that had been tested and tested and tested without so much as a "hey, we're trying something new with MOMs" post. A player noticed and posted first. Shameful!
2. Once said thread got fully underway, Nozh popped in for a "yeah, we changed 'em all right" post. No explanation, just "yep, they've changed". CCP Hammerhead says that they weren't happy with the direction the MOM changes were going. Well, that was news to all those fools that logged into Sisi to help test the MOM -> SC changes.
3. Later, Nozh comes back into said thread with "tested changes are gone, nutty thrown-in-at-the-last-minute changes are gone, but HEY, YOU CAN DOCK MOMS AND THEY COST LESS TO BUILD NOW! (SURPRISE!)".
Hmmm...Where did it go wrong? I think a "Hey guys, thanks for all the months of testing, but we just aren't happy with where we're heading" post, which hopefully contained "since we're unhappy, we're going in some new directions on Sisi, but don't freak, these aren't getting tossed into Dominion at the last moment" would have greatly eased tensions.
Please! Learn from this CCP! Learn! I'm tired of all the damn posting required to get your attention about silly things that should have been addressed right the first time, not after hundreds and hundreds of forum posts.
-Nim
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Sajeera
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:01:00 -
[1610]
Edited by: Sajeera on 21/11/2009 03:01:58 Edited by: Sajeera on 21/11/2009 03:01:46
Originally by: Tarron Sarek
Originally by: Promethian child I will not play a game run by a bunch of stasi bastards nvm paying for it.
I would delete your post simply because of that.
I'm perfectly fine with forum mods doing their job btw. Some of the crap which gets posted here isn't worth the hard-drive space it occupies. If you feel masochistic enough and want to read it all up, go to EVE-Search.
Actually you cant read it on eve-search too. For some reason today eve-search started to make its updates with around 30-40 mins delay aswell as failing to retrieve many of the posts. Either CCP blocked or delayed the updates which eve-search makes, or they just made Chribba "an offer he cant refuse".
And yes i posted this before and it got deleted.
[1438]
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Innominate
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:08:00 -
[1611]
Originally by: Kynah
How can you allow system development to so substantially go off the rails as to have to admit failure and start again? Who is going to be held accopuntable for these horrendous misjudgments and pay the price?
If CCP would admit failure and start over on dominion, they'd be a lot better off. Most of the problems stem from throwing out many of the original ideas behind dominion without compensating for it. All of the titan, mothership, capital, sov, 0.0 economic changes are intertwined. As they've abandoned bits and pieces of each, there has been no modification to other changes that rely on them.
Leaving motherships the way they are makes the modified titans ridiculous and motherships worthless. Leaving titans the way they are now retains the AOE doomsday which is both the bane of all subcap pilots, and are likely made worse when sov fights are moved onto gates.
Dominion is not a few independent changes, it is an interconnected, interdependent web. Each bit directly affects the others. Each one they've thrown out has created numerous other issues that have been ignored.
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Li Na
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:15:00 -
[1612]
For those of you who have not been paying attention they have just released a new patch for SISI with completly new MS changes perhapes you should check them out before continuing the rants.
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Promethian child
Amarr 0utbreak
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:18:00 -
[1613]
Originally by: Li Na For those of you who have not been paying attention they have just released a new patch for SISI with completly new MS changes perhapes you should check them out before continuing the rants.
Wut ? for once CCP took notice of a 48 page + deleted posts threadnought
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Condecinte
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:19:00 -
[1614]
I'd like to say hi to everybody cancelling their accounts. Don't let the door hit you on the way out and you be sure to have a good time playing WOW.
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White Aero
Arcana Imperii Ltd. Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:25:00 -
[1615]
Originally by: White Aero
Originally by: Kraken Kill CURRENTLY on SISI Motherships STILL retain the HP BUFF and INCREASE JUMP RANGE. They Currenly have the OLD STYLE Bonuses (vat bay, triage, gang mods, remote rep bonus hel).
When you say you wont be doing ANY changes to motherships do you mean you wont be changing the bonuses but the Ships will still retain the Jump range and HP buff?
Please Confirm this? Please Clarify the poorly presented info in the blog.
ANSWER!!
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Kraken Kill
Arcana Imperii Ltd. Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:25:00 -
[1616]
Ok checked out the changes on Sisi- From what ive heard the fighter bombers still need target painting to do damage. The Phoenix still sufferes massively with the explo radius of cruise and torps requiring target painting.......... The nag is still nerfed to the stoneage. The titan is still ineffective other than to jump bridge. |
Tommy Blue
Arcana Imperii Ltd. Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:30:00 -
[1617]
CCP, I'm disappointed that you deleted my post (and those of many many many many others). I would like you to put my post back (and everyone else's) because we are just stating the facts. If you cant handle the truth than you dont deserve to work in the MMO industry.
Anyways, do what Kraken said earlier which I had in my original post.
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Vadinho
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:33:00 -
[1618]
Edited by: Vadinho on 21/11/2009 03:34:08
Originally by: Kraken Kill Ok checked out the changes on Sisi- From what ive heard the fighter bombers still need target painting to do damage. The Phoenix still sufferes massively with the explo radius of cruise and torps requiring target painting.......... The nag is still nerfed to the stoneage. The titan is still ineffective other than to jump bridge.
baby steps, kraken, if theyre willing to hear us out on this maybe theyll come to their senses and give the citadel missiles not-awful blast radii and hand back the naglfar's not-awful bonuses
edit: re-linking kraken kill's post from earlier so you can print it out and use a magnet to affix it to the dev team's whiteboard hth =D
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KeratinBoy
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:39:00 -
[1619]
Originally by: Li Na For those of you who have not been paying attention they have just released a new patch for SISI with completly new MS changes perhapes you should check them out before continuing the rants.
You mean they changed stuff without mentioning it in this here thread devoted to that exact stuff? Well, I am surprised.
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Sajeera
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Posted - 2009.11.21 03:40:00 -
[1620]
Originally by: Kraken Kill Ok checked out the changes on Sisi- From what ive heard the fighter bombers still need target painting to do damage. The Phoenix still sufferes massively with the explo radius of cruise and torps requiring target painting.......... The nag is still nerfed to the stoneage. The titan is still ineffective other than to jump bridge.
There will be no fighter bombers dude. They said they are reverting all the changes, at the moment motherships on SiSi are the same from TQ just with buffed HPs and jump range.
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