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Lucia Denniard
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
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Posted - 2012.06.20 22:53:00 -
[1] - Quote
Confederation of xXPIZZAXx recently joined Faction Warfare. Initially, we believed that recent changes had made for a better PVP experience, but we quickly encountered problems.
#1 - The ease of running both defensive and offensive plexes solo, using low sp afterburner frigates makes flipping and defending systems impractical for larger, PVP oriented gangs. Forming a fleet to run individual plexes is pointless; fights are not forced.
#2 - Defensive plexing is risk free and needs no real investment. A t1 frigate alt can defensive plex with impunity, faces no immediate threat, and ship losses are trivial. This only serves to stymie the rate at which systems come under threat, and fighting for these systems.
#3 - Plex behaviour is unpredictable. Plexes spawn and de-spawn in an inconsistent fashion, can fail to award lp, and can stack to huge numbers in specific systems.
#4 - Acceleration gates favour GÇÿcampingGÇÖ behaviours and limit the viability of long range fleets.
#5 - Reward tier disparity. A Slicer at tier 1 costs 40kLP, 2.5kLP at tier 5, and pilots gain LP at a 20% increased rate at tier 5. Pilots may simply play both sides of the war, using alts, for personal profit; faction loyalty isnGÇÖt incentivised. This further serves to stagnate the progress of system conquest.
#6 - Reward disparity. The Amarr LP store itself contains fewer high demand ships and modules than the Minmatar LP store. This is a minor issue, and mostly the fault of the larger EVE sandbox. But is an issue nonetheless.
As a female small gang PVPer, I feel that faction warfare has too much emphasis on alts, incentivising low risk play with LP, and fails to offer enough opportunities for fleet combat. Ultimately, Faction Warfare is still focused on a PVE metagame.
Any constructive comments regarding these issues would be appreciated. |
Wirty Dhore
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
5
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Posted - 2012.06.20 22:55:00 -
[2] - Quote
As a female small gang PVPer I support this as well. |
zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
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Posted - 2012.06.20 22:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
As a female small gang PVPer I agree on all points. |
Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
310
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
Fweddit > PIZZA, tbh. Maybe you guys should just go back to farming nullbears. Sa souvraya niende misain ye. |
Aldrith Shutaq
Knighthood of the Merciful Crown Aegis Militia
38
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Posted - 2012.06.20 23:09:00 -
[5] - Quote
See here: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=121960 |
Garrus Calby
Broski East
0
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Posted - 2012.06.20 23:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
As a bona fide space liberal I feel that the misogynistic and tyrannic system known as faction warfare is keeping strong independent womyn down and only aiding the ultra masculine minmatar and leaving the sleek feministic amarr in the space dirt. And as a minmatar pilot I apologize on behave of my race's faction warfare militia for these crimes against female small gang PVPers and equality as a whole. |
420rainbowdash1488xxx
xXx-PoNyViLLE-xXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:16:00 -
[7] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:Fweddit > PIZZA, tbh. Maybe you guys should just go back to farming nullbears.
if faction warfare really is just a ratting contest, then we have no interest in continuing with it. in nullsec there are incentives to fight, and ways to punish people for not fighting your gangs. i don't want to bully my members to go out ratting solo for monopoly money that might be worth something one day, in the vain hope that maybe we can rat more than our enemies and their alts, so that maybe they will fight us over an ihub. **** that. |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
Lucia Denniard wrote:#4 - Acceleration gates favour GÇÿcampingGÇÖ behaviours and limit the viability of long range fleets.
Actually, IMO plexes favour long range nano fleets over short range. Why? because warping is not allowed within complexes nor outside on the acceleration gate!
Consider the following scenarios:
a) You are in the plex first: You set up at range, you pummel the opposition as it comes in. If you can maintain your range, the enemy can't even get a warpin on you.
b) You are not in the plex first, however the enemy fleet is. If you have a fleet and not just a few guys, there's a decent chance you can get in, only lose a few on the warpin and get your range advantage.
c) The acceleration gate itself is a fantastic place to place a ranged fleet, same reasons as a). |
Della Monk
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
37
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Posted - 2012.06.20 23:27:00 -
[9] - Quote
chatgris wrote:Lucia Denniard wrote:#4 - Acceleration gates favour GÇÿcampingGÇÖ behaviours and limit the viability of long range fleets.
Actually, IMO plexes favour long range nano fleets over short range. Why? because warping is not allowed within complexes nor outside on the acceleration gate! Consider the following scenarios: a) You are in the plex first: You set up at range, you pummel the opposition as it comes in. If you can maintain your range, the enemy can't even get a warpin on you. b) You are not in the plex first, however the enemy fleet is. If you have a fleet and not just a few guys, there's a decent chance you can get in, only lose a few on the warpin and get your range advantage. c) The acceleration gate itself is a fantastic place to place a ranged fleet, same reasons as a).
If sitting at range in a sniper fit waiting for prey to land at your optimal isn't camping I don't know what is |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:29:00 -
[10] - Quote
Della Monk wrote:chatgris wrote:Lucia Denniard wrote:#4 - Acceleration gates favour GÇÿcampingGÇÖ behaviours and limit the viability of long range fleets.
Actually, IMO plexes favour long range nano fleets over short range. Why? because warping is not allowed within complexes nor outside on the acceleration gate! Consider the following scenarios: a) You are in the plex first: You set up at range, you pummel the opposition as it comes in. If you can maintain your range, the enemy can't even get a warpin on you. b) You are not in the plex first, however the enemy fleet is. If you have a fleet and not just a few guys, there's a decent chance you can get in, only lose a few on the warpin and get your range advantage. c) The acceleration gate itself is a fantastic place to place a ranged fleet, same reasons as a). If sitting at range in a sniper fit waiting for prey to land at your optimal isn't camping I don't know what is
I bolded the relevant part I was referring to the viability of long range fleets: Camping happens everywhere in eve: gates, stations and plexes and isn't an issue I address in this post. |
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White Tree
Large Hybrid Turret V
844
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:33:00 -
[11] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:Fweddit > PIZZA, tbh. Maybe you guys should just go back to farming nullbears. Hey, yo, shut up. Former member of CSM6, Champion of the Gallente Master Race. |
Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
310
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:40:00 -
[12] - Quote
White Tree wrote:Vordak Kallager wrote:Fweddit > PIZZA, tbh. Maybe you guys should just go back to farming nullbears. Hey, yo, shut up.
Lol. I have not been impressed with PIZZA's performance in the Min/Amarr warzone, from a purely PvP stand point. vOv Sa souvraya niende misain ye. |
zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:41:00 -
[13] - Quote
chatgris wrote:Lucia Denniard wrote:#4 - Acceleration gates favour GÇÿcampingGÇÖ behaviours and limit the viability of long range fleets.
Actually, IMO plexes favour long range nano fleets over short range. Why? because warping is not allowed within complexes nor outside on the acceleration gate! Consider the following scenarios: a) You are in the plex first: You set up at range, you pummel the opposition as it comes in. If you can maintain your range, the enemy can't even get a warpin on you. b) You are not in the plex first, however the enemy fleet is. If you have a fleet and not just a few guys, there's a decent chance you can get in, only lose a few on the warpin and get your range advantage. c) The acceleration gate itself is a fantastic place to place a ranged fleet, same reasons as a). I actually agree with you, and in practice, we were able to get our fleet burned out to range while taking minimal losses, but soon after the first SFI died to our caracal fleet, they simply buggered off. Whatever was left behind to tackle was eaten up shortly after.
We held field, and if they tried to warp back in with that same gang, they would be further disadvantaged, a strong disincentive to even try to fight the long range fleet once it is in the site. But what did that mean? We got to sit on a PVE site for 37mins to take our 0.7% of one of the 70 systems in the amarr-minmatar FW zone, and we wouldn't even be given a proper brawl over it because who in their right mind would warp to the optimals of our ships? |
zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:White Tree wrote:Vordak Kallager wrote:Fweddit > PIZZA, tbh. Maybe you guys should just go back to farming nullbears. Hey, yo, shut up. Lol. I have not been impressed with PIZZA's performance in the Min/Amarr warzone, from a purely PvP stand point. vOv citation needed |
420rainbowdash1488xxx
xXx-PoNyViLLE-xXx
3
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:43:00 -
[15] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:White Tree wrote:Vordak Kallager wrote:Fweddit > PIZZA, tbh. Maybe you guys should just go back to farming nullbears. Hey, yo, shut up. Lol. I have not been impressed with PIZZA's performance in the Min/Amarr warzone, from a purely PvP stand point. vOv
well we can make minmatar militia avoid fighting us pretty easily, whatever that accomplishes. |
Lucia Denniard
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
6
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 23:58:00 -
[16] - Quote
Well, here are my thoughts for the evening, what if Faction Warfare worked like Incursions, and you earned LP into a pool which paid out when the system flipped? That'd encourage actually taking systems and offensively plexing in systems you intend to take.
My other thought is that complexes should be done in groups, so you could either crank up the rat difficulty, or just hold people there until the rats have died. Scram/web rats would work pretty well, holding down players for extended periods, leaving them open to possible PVP situations.
Any and all crazy ideas are appreciated. |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:02:00 -
[17] - Quote
Lucia Denniard wrote:My other thought is that complexes should be done in groups, so you could either crank up the rat difficulty, or just hold people there until the rats have died. Scram/web rats would work pretty well, holding down players for extended periods, leaving them open to possible PVP situations.
This I strongly oppose: Factional warfare is differentiated from null in that dispersed solo work is more valuable than big fleet fights in determining who wins. If you want fleet warfare, null is the place for it. FW actually provides incentives to disperse and run small gangs/solo rather than who can form the biggest blob and win. |
Mai Amarr Waifu
Viziam Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:09:00 -
[18] - Quote
chatgris wrote:Lucia Denniard wrote:My other thought is that complexes should be done in groups, so you could either crank up the rat difficulty, or just hold people there until the rats have died. Scram/web rats would work pretty well, holding down players for extended periods, leaving them open to possible PVP situations. This I strongly oppose: Factional warfare is differentiated from null in that dispersed solo work is more valuable than big fleet fights in determining who wins. If you want fleet warfare, null is the place for it. FW actually provides incentives to disperse and run small gangs/solo rather than who can form the biggest blob and win.
For groups that size in the 3000+ member range each side should be able to field 50 guys, surely?
The fact is, there's no reason to fight, since it's entirely based on the simple meta game of getting the most alts into running sites as you can at the same time in t1 junk frigates to farm LP on whatever side has the best LP store.
Pretty much everyone knows this in faction war, and the only people who seem to have a problem with a change in the system is those who stand to lose from not being able to exploit the ****** game mechanics where ccp puts AFK-pseudo pve in front of PVP, when the whole point of FW is supposed to be PVP.
Or are you the kind of person who thinks meaningless '1v1's with 2 boosting alts and a cloaked falcon is the pinnacle of lowsec pvp? |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:26:00 -
[19] - Quote
Mai Amarr Waifu wrote: For groups that size in the 3000+ member range each side should be able to field 50 guys, surely?
50 guys is still a blob IMO. I far prefer the 2-5 man gangs myself. Which have a purpose in fw. I DO NOT WANT to be stuck in a fleet to play my game: That's why I do not and never intend to live in nullsec.
Mai Amarr Waifu wrote: The fact is, there's no reason to fight, since it's entirely based on the simple meta game of getting the most alts into running sites as you can at the same time in t1 junk frigates to farm LP on whatever side has the best LP store.
Which is a far preferable situation than one where I am forced to sit in a fleet all day to play the game.
Mai Amarr Waifu wrote: Pretty much everyone knows this in faction war, and the only people who seem to have a problem with a change in the system is those who stand to lose from not being able to exploit the ****** game mechanics where ccp puts AFK-pseudo pve in front of PVP, when the whole point of FW is supposed to be PVP.
A change in the system is great: killing all rats for example is an almost universally proposed solution to slow down the afk frigate farmers. A change in the system that turns this into blob warfare is not. Right now people already blob to avoid risk: At least the mechanics of the game (how plex LP is split up among those on the button, LP split on kills and occupancy) provide some incentive to move away from the natural "safety in numbers" that eve tends to move towards.
If you want a system that is geared towards fleet pvp, then my gosh there is a LOT of eve waiting for you. Go enjoy it, don't try to make everything in eve need a 20, 30, 50 man blob.
Mai Amarr Waifu wrote: Or are you the kind of person who thinks meaningless '1v1's with 2 boosting alts and a cloaked falcon is the pinnacle of lowsec pvp?
I have one boosting alt, and I don't bother to drag it around with me when I'm roaming solo. I do bring it for fleets. I do sometimes bring it out when I find myself significantly outnumbered. Please, find the last kill of mine which is just me and a falcon. You'll be looking a long long ways back.
And if you want to start epeening about killboards and solo-ing and lowsec do please post with your main. It sounds like you're a nullbear to me, afraid to roam without your fleet and logis trailing along. |
Duke Dantez
T.R.I.A.D Defiant Legacy
16
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:35:00 -
[20] - Quote
Lucia Denniard wrote:Well, here are my thoughts for the evening, what if Faction Warfare worked like Incursions, and you earned LP into a pool which paid out when the system flipped? That'd encourage actually taking systems and offensively plexing in systems you intend to take.
My other thought is that complexes should be done in groups, so you could either crank up the rat difficulty, or just hold people there until the rats have died. Scram/web rats would work pretty well, holding down players for extended periods, leaving them open to possible PVP situations.
Any and all crazy ideas are appreciated. Absolutely horrible idea!!
Isk hungry carebears will always figure out a way to out-wit the NPCs. Making the rats harder to kill and with more Ewar will only decrease the amount of small scale pvp and especially a lot of the 1v1s that happen in and around plexes. And you wont get rid of the smart carebear who figured out the trick to minimize effort whilst alone in a plex.
Go to high sec if you want incursions. the whole point of the plex is to generate pvp first and a stepping stone to flipping a system second. |
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zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:38:00 -
[21] - Quote
chatgris wrote: This I strongly oppose: Factional warfare is differentiated from null in that dispersed solo work is more valuable than big fleet fights in determining who wins. If you want fleet warfare, null is the place for it. FW actually provides incentives to disperse and run small gangs/solo rather than who can form the biggest blob and win.
I bolded part of your post because it is incredibly aloof to suggest some incredibly skilled soloers are the driving force behind the 'winning' side in faction warfare. The 12 :shobon: newbies from fweddit banding together on a site is doing the same to system control as the elite sfi soloer with 3 flavors of links in one system, who are all doing the same thing as an afterburning frigate idly orbiting a site.
If the objective is "to win faction warfare," ie: take the enemy systems, the most efficient way is to run as many sites with individual alts as possible. If an enemy actually comes around to contest you, the best course of action is simply to move to another site, as they are readily abundant (plus if the guys who chased you off actually wanted to take the site, they need to leave someone behind to sit on their hands for the base time + however long you were there, providing you enough time to do another site before worrying about them again).
The issue becomes one of conflicting goals: -to take systems and reap massive amounts of spacegold off sites by avoiding fights whenever possible -to find something to shoot, which is generally hindered by the fact that you need to idle on each site (or ignore the anoms completely and let your faction "lose")
the mechanics of FW are wholly circumstantial to any actual pvp content generated and will only happen because both sides got bored of taking systems--not actually taking systems |
Mai Amarr Waifu
Viziam Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:39:00 -
[22] - Quote
Duke Dantez wrote:Lucia Denniard wrote:Well, here are my thoughts for the evening, what if Faction Warfare worked like Incursions, and you earned LP into a pool which paid out when the system flipped? That'd encourage actually taking systems and offensively plexing in systems you intend to take.
My other thought is that complexes should be done in groups, so you could either crank up the rat difficulty, or just hold people there until the rats have died. Scram/web rats would work pretty well, holding down players for extended periods, leaving them open to possible PVP situations.
Any and all crazy ideas are appreciated. Absolutely horrible idea!! Isk hungry carebears will always figure out a way to out-wit the NPCs. Making the rats harder to kill and with more Ewar will only decrease the amount of small scale pvp and especially a lot of the 1v1s that happen in and around plexes. And you wont get rid of the smart carebear who figured out the trick to minimize effort whilst alone in a plex. Go to high sec if you want incursions. the whole point of the plex is to generate pvp first and a stepping stone to flipping a system second.
The current meta doesn't generate fights in any shape or form.
It generates LP farmers who will always tend tward the side with the easier ability to solo farm for lp which is completely clear in minmatars case. You either need an army of alts or a fleet of 2 people in each system with no real way to flip a specific system because of the randomness involved with sites spawning. |
zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:43:00 -
[23] - Quote
Duke Dantez wrote:Lucia Denniard wrote:Well, here are my thoughts for the evening, what if Faction Warfare worked like Incursions, and you earned LP into a pool which paid out when the system flipped? That'd encourage actually taking systems and offensively plexing in systems you intend to take.
My other thought is that complexes should be done in groups, so you could either crank up the rat difficulty, or just hold people there until the rats have died. Scram/web rats would work pretty well, holding down players for extended periods, leaving them open to possible PVP situations.
Any and all crazy ideas are appreciated. Absolutely horrible idea!! Isk hungry carebears will always figure out a way to out-wit the NPCs. Making the rats harder to kill and with more Ewar will only decrease the amount of small scale pvp and especially a lot of the 1v1s that happen in and around plexes. And you wont get rid of the smart carebear who figured out the trick to minimize effort whilst alone in a plex. Go to high sec if you want incursions. the whole point of the plex is to generate pvp first and a stepping stone to flipping a system second. I could probably get more fights sitting at belt 1 at 0 in any of these systems. |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:43:00 -
[24] - Quote
zero9300 wrote:chatgris wrote: This I strongly oppose: Factional warfare is differentiated from null in that dispersed solo work is more valuable than big fleet fights in determining who wins. If you want fleet warfare, null is the place for it. FW actually provides incentives to disperse and run small gangs/solo rather than who can form the biggest blob and win.
I bolded part of your post because it is incredibly aloof to suggest some incredibly skilled soloers are the driving force behind the 'winning' side in faction warfare. The 12 :shobon: newbies from fweddit banding together on a site is doing the same to system control as the elite sfi soloer with 3 flavors of links in one system, who are all doing the same thing as an afterburning frigate idly orbiting a site.
I am not trying to suggest that at all. I agree that the current mechanics are best won by pve alts. I am merely disagreeing with the notion that the solution is to make taking complexes require *fleets*.
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Mai Amarr Waifu
Viziam Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:46:00 -
[25] - Quote
chatgris wrote:zero9300 wrote:chatgris wrote: This I strongly oppose: Factional warfare is differentiated from null in that dispersed solo work is more valuable than big fleet fights in determining who wins. If you want fleet warfare, null is the place for it. FW actually provides incentives to disperse and run small gangs/solo rather than who can form the biggest blob and win.
I bolded part of your post because it is incredibly aloof to suggest some incredibly skilled soloers are the driving force behind the 'winning' side in faction warfare. The 12 :shobon: newbies from fweddit banding together on a site is doing the same to system control as the elite sfi soloer with 3 flavors of links in one system, who are all doing the same thing as an afterburning frigate idly orbiting a site. I am not trying to suggest that at all. I agree that the current mechanics are best won by pve alts. I am merely disagreeing with the notion that the solution is to make taking complexes require *fleets*.
How about some form of a ticket system like in the Battlefield series, that capped at 5~ people, which depending on site/ship size you got a faster amount of tickets per second on the point?
With the addition of webbing/target painting rats I think that would make sites much more friendly to 'small gang pvp' considering 5 is a small gang in mostly everyones eyes. |
zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:47:00 -
[26] - Quote
chatgris wrote:zero9300 wrote:chatgris wrote: This I strongly oppose: Factional warfare is differentiated from null in that dispersed solo work is more valuable than big fleet fights in determining who wins. If you want fleet warfare, null is the place for it. FW actually provides incentives to disperse and run small gangs/solo rather than who can form the biggest blob and win.
I bolded part of your post because it is incredibly aloof to suggest some incredibly skilled soloers are the driving force behind the 'winning' side in faction warfare. The 12 :shobon: newbies from fweddit banding together on a site is doing the same to system control as the elite sfi soloer with 3 flavors of links in one system, who are all doing the same thing as an afterburning frigate idly orbiting a site. I am not trying to suggest that at all. I agree that the current mechanics are best won by pve alts. I am merely disagreeing with the notion that the solution is to make taking complexes require *fleets*. A solution is to make taking complexes require *combat ships* not fleets
In fact, if an individual pilot were able to do more damage to system control in a reasonable amount of time then he can now, he would likely see more fights if individual sites were more meaningful. |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:50:00 -
[27] - Quote
zero9300 wrote:A solution is to make taking complexes require *combat ships* not fleets
And that is a goal I agree with - for example, require all rats to be killed. There were also ideas thrown around to have the timer count down to begin state automatically, so if you chase a farmer away, at least they can't just instantly resume later and you don't have to sit there.
zero9300 wrote: In fact, if an individual pilot were able to do more damage to system control in a reasonable amount of time then he can now, he would likely see more fights if individual sites were more meaningful.
This used to be the case, but CCP wisely increased the time it takes to flip a system. Much shorter than it is now, and you worry about going to sleep and then waking up unable to redock in your station with all your assets. |
zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 00:57:00 -
[28] - Quote
The problem is that the mechanics of FW themselves don't motivate a fight.
Consider the following, chatgris: Anyone who has decided to fight you in a plex did it because they wanted a fight (or a killmail, we will consider these equivalent). They did not fight you for the plex money, they would be better off moving to another plex. They did not fight you for the system control, you will log off in an hour or two having done little to the actual contest meter. They did not fight you to have their faction "win"
They might as well have been on any celestial in system to fight you, though FW conveniently factored out the hassle of GCC, that is pretty much it. |
zero9300
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 01:34:00 -
[29] - Quote
chatgris wrote:zero9300 wrote:A solution is to make taking complexes require *combat ships* not fleets
And that is a goal I agree with - for example, require all rats to be killed. There were also ideas thrown around to have the timer count down to begin state automatically, so if you chase a farmer away, at least they can't just instantly resume later and you don't have to sit there. zero9300 wrote: In fact, if an individual pilot were able to do more damage to system control in a reasonable amount of time then he can now, he would likely see more fights if individual sites were more meaningful.
This used to be the case, but CCP wisely increased the time it takes to flip a system. Much shorter than it is now, and you worry about going to sleep and then waking up unable to redock in your station with all your assets. A system can be tuned to still be a lengthier switch, but require less monotony than entering plexes all day while combating the idle farming.
I can't quite remember the numbers for each site, but say you are doing outposts in a single system where each took one percent every 15 minutes. If they spawned back to back (which they don't, this is just for illustrative purposes) and you did each one, it would take 25 manhours to flip the system. Doing those hours in parallel is only possible by the number of sites. Given the reality of how sites spawn, "focusing" a system is wholly impossible. The control of systems is a general systemic approach, as a whole group of systems must be run as nebulously as their sites are willing to spawn.
A precursor suggestion would be to have static sites which would have npcs spawns (which need to be killed) much like the current system, once taken, it would begin to shift the contest bar towards one side, slowly, leading to an ihub vulnerability. An occupation force of npcs will sit there. If a system is left alone while being contesting, then it shouldn't require an absurd amount of activity (25manhours) to flip. Smaller numbered fleets could still dance around larger ones by doing more sites in parallel and move faster from system to system, but the efforts of large fleets can be appreciable, as being unengaged still shifts contension meaningfully.
Defining a set of mechanics that don't marginalize anyone (fleet-goers, gangbuddies, or soloers alike) while promoting fun (the fights I hope everyone joined FW for) will take time and discussion, but step 1 is admitting that the current set is garbage for setting up timely engagements. |
Rengerel
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 03:31:00 -
[30] - Quote
I'm relatively new to FW, and unlike most that jumped into minmatar to speedtank offensive plexes, i've been soloing defensive ones to get a feel for the whole process. Watching militia chat, it seems there are certain bottlenecks where fleets will form to bash at gate camps. Most of the time it seems to be small groups or soloers running missions or looking for small scale pvp. Besides those people that want to get the most from their LP, there doesn't seem to be much concern when a system is reaching 80%+ contested, as it still won't make people go defensive plexing. I guess because it does take so long even for that final bit to flip, they figure someone will go and save it eventually.
My suggestion would be to have the rate of change increase as you get toward each end. If < 30% or > 70% instead of 0.9% for a major, you get 5%. That might lead more people into the system to either try and make it stable, or to fight to flip it. More people = more chance of a fight. The way it is now, no one wants to defensive plex because all you get is corp standing, while offensive plexing gives you the LP. If you could make a real difference defensive plexing though, I think more people would do it.
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