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Kzintee
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.02.16 02:39:00 -
[1]
For all of you lvl5 runners, can anyone suggest a turret ship to use?
The requirements can vary depending on how universal I want to try to get. Drone/Sansha missions I already do in Nightmare, so there's no problem. Gallente missions I already can do in 700DPS Tengu. What I am looking for is a setup for Matar/Angel missions and possibly Gallente.
So what are my problems? 1. Range. Matars/Angels like to fight up close BUT the BSes are split up about 50/50 between close range (sub-10k) and long range (30-40km). Cruisers are not a problem with their 20km orbit. Adding Gallente missions into the mix makes situation worse since they like to orbit at 50km. 2. DPS at that range. You may get lucky and get all close range boats, you may get unlucky and get Fate of angels where every fricken spawn in sitting at 35km. 3. Missile batteries are quite often positioned way the hell out there at 60-100km and do provide a very sizable portion of the mission damage profile (quite often the WRONG damage you normally don't have to account for) 4. Needs to fit respectable buffer tank (100k EHP at least) 5. I have a logistics alt that's currently training for missile boat. 6. One-off problem missions like Convoy Attack with mission objectives in 70km orbit (and 300k EHP).
The best scenario I've found so far is a Machariel with 4 gyros and 3 TEs. It can fit a decent 120k EHP against angels/matar with 62km falloff. Turret DPS is 900-950 which means close range I'll be dealing most of it and 36km NPCs will get about half which is worse than the HML Tengu I fly right now.
So is there hope for this? Do I just suck it up and fly a Tengu I have or finish training for torps and go with Rattlesnake which doesn't impress me much with a hard limit at around 66k beyond which you are stuck doing 300DPS with sentries.
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syphurous
Gallente Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2010.02.16 02:56:00 -
[2]
Sentry Ishtar. Most people will read this thinking it's part of my post, when its actually my sig :P
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Kzintee
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.02.16 02:59:00 -
[3]
Originally by: syphurous Sentry Ishtar.
Even a plain Maelstrom will beat it for running lvl5s, but thank you for the suggestion.
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RavenPaine
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Posted - 2010.02.16 06:12:00 -
[4]
Im a missile ***** ...so this is just a thought , not really from experience. Have you thought af a MWD Nightmare ? The crystals change out super fast , and it has a drone bay . DPS is up there .. over 1200 I think .
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Loco Eve
Critical Density Tread Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.16 06:22:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Loco Eve on 16/02/2010 06:23:12 Am I missing something here? OP didn't say they are using logistics. Otherwise, how to deal wtih neut towers?
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Kzintee
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.02.16 15:35:00 -
[6]
Originally by: RavenPaine Im a missile ***** ...so this is just a thought , not really from experience. Have you thought af a MWD Nightmare ? The crystals change out super fast , and it has a drone bay . DPS is up there .. over 1200 I think .
Being EM resistance is 75% and thermal is 65% on angel rats...and quite a few missions still have gates it may not work out as well. I need to do the calculations though, it MAY be better than others simply due to overall dps.
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Kzintee
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.02.16 16:59:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Loco Eve Edited by: Loco Eve on 16/02/2010 06:26:01 Minivarg?
What is that exactly? If it's Vargur, then I'm afraid it suffers from falloff problems even more than Machariel.
Although...3TE Mach does have a 93km falloff with Barrage. I suppose that would work fine for those targets that are far out (I'd deal probably 80% of potential DPS at targets in 35km orbit).
Torpedoes sound better and better...
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Kzintee
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.02.18 00:46:00 -
[8]
After doing some extensive EFT warrioring and spreadsheet calculations...
I've compared Machariel, NM, Tengu, Vargur, Maelstrom. The ships were setup for DPS and buffer (which means shield rigs, lows with DPS/TEs) the verdict I've reached for myself is this: Against angels/matar nothing really beats Machariel.
NM is horribly hindered by the high EM/T resists, so much that it's effective DPS is less than 1/3 of raw. NM never manages to do more DPS than Mach at any ranges (I only used 3 crystals but the trend is clear)
Mach comes in at about 50% DPS resisted. Around 36km Barrage overtakes EMP charge in DPS.
Mael does not come close to being an effective contender (if only in price) with having 2/3s the DPS and 2/3 falloff of Mach.
Vargur is close in terms of closerange DPS (using faction ammo), but has less falloff but also less buffer.
Tengu is an interesting case. Given the kinetic bonus and Angel resists it makes no difference whether you shoot kin or expl missiles, the DPS is effectively the same.
Tengu overtakes Mach shooting EMP at 52km and shooting Barrage at 68km.
Mach vs Tengu against Gallente NPCs: Mach is better shooting t1 ammo than Tengu shooting t2 out to 40km. Switching to Barrage would extend that range given that Gallente have 3 orbit ranges: sub-10k, 32k and 51k.
The calculations were done using my skills (which are lvl spec lvl4, support at lvl5 for all but falloff which is at 4) and 5% damage implants (one for missiles, one for ACs) so the data may vary about 5% in favor of Tengu since my missile skills are a tad worse there. Now, letting Machariel shoot faction ammo will probably cost double of Tengu shooting t2 missiles (7 guns, 2x RoF) but also increases DPS about 15% to over 1k.
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