EVE Search - RR NUETRALS (TACTICS) R-V-B

All Channels

Warfare & Tactics

RR NUETRALS (TACTICS) R-V-B

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Orion Shadowmaker Amarr Blue Republic	Posted - 2010.03.05 20:14:00 - [1] Hey Guys, Another great week in RVB with over 36 Fleet engagements, a *beautiful* 100+ BS fight, and 1200+ kills posted. But recently we have a few War decers who have really honed in on the remote repping cheat utilized by Nuetrals alts in conjuction with their fleets. We have used quite a few tactics to offset this tremendous bulit in eve cheat, but as you guys know the remote reppers all from different corps can get there RR from range and then just dock to get away. All the while allowing fleets that have no chance against us in normal fight situations to get easy kills and then dock up or jump gates themselves. I would like some ideas on this type scenario. the cool thing about RVB is we can experiment a bit, as the fights are so frequent it allows for some creativity. But I really want some sound tactics that have been used to great effect to counter this cheesey (non tactical) eve component. Thanks ahead of time, GO BLUES Orion Shadowmaker Go Blues!
Beltantis Torrence Groovy Guns	Posted - 2010.03.05 20:42:00 - [2] Move into low sec and stage out of a POS + Station. Then feel free to ignore neut alts and war dec'ers since you can just **** them on a gate or avoid them entirely.
Orion Shadowmaker Amarr Blue Republic	Posted - 2010.03.05 21:12:00 - [3] Well im currently apart of one of the fastest moving corps in all of the EVE universe in *terms of kills* so I dont want to go down in the quantity or quality of the fights. Would prefer some sound tactics that can work or have worked agaisnt this ingame cheat mechanic. Thanks Orion Shadowmaker Go Blues!
Amarr Supremacist	Posted - 2010.03.05 21:25:00 - [4] ... Are you serious? Holy crap... Your posting was bad before but now it's just laughably bad. - Intigo
Viibl Triibl	Posted - 2010.03.05 21:38:00 - [5] So anyway, what are the preferred methods - if any - to mitigate neutral RR in high sec? Just more DPS? ECM or nootz on the reppers? Magic?
Marko Riva Adamant Inc.	Posted - 2010.03.05 21:49:00 - [6] BS fleet fights? ----------- I think, therefore I'm single. Want to learn combat/PVP? Alliance creation service
Orion Shadowmaker Amarr Blue Republic	Posted - 2010.03.05 22:02:00 - [7] The only troll I seem to see anymore is Amar Sumpremecist -- Anyway this is BS size fight sometimes they have as many as 8-9 Battleships. They use gates and Stations along with Nuetral repping from a multitude of different nuetral corps. Surely someone has real tactics for this scenario, instead of stupid comments like Amar just made. Orion Shadowmaker Go Blues!
MaraLoca	Posted - 2010.03.05 22:39:00 - [8] If they are not in NPC corps wardec them.
modnar teihs	Posted - 2010.03.05 23:08:00 - [9] What baltantis said, make it worth something other than spending isk to learn / gorg yourself on pvp. Go play MW2 or something.
Samuel Crowe	Posted - 2010.03.05 23:18:00 - [10] Neutral RR'ing in Hi-sec is currently the lamest thing ingame right now especially since they can dock straight away. There's not a great deal you can do about it really.
Orion Shadowmaker Amarr Blue Republic	Posted - 2010.03.05 23:39:00 - [11] Appreciate all the ideas, that are really trying to tackle this issue. The problem with War decs is we are activly at war with at least 3-4 corps each side, sometimes different coporations, at least until time allows us to line them up. So no room really to war dec one corp just because they are using an alt from that corporation to do it. They also use NPC corps as well. So war decing is not a good option here unfortunatly. We are using some tactics to break it up occasionally, just hoped we could get some fresh ideas on this stupid in game cheat. I cant share what are doing now of course as it will immediatly impact our scenario. Again, its just part of fighting in high sec, but I would like to find away to make the cheat harder to utilize. Thanks Orion Shadowmaker Go Blues!
Cartheron Crust Krazny Oktyabr Revolyutsiya	Posted - 2010.03.05 23:40:00 - [12] You can see exactly what races ships they are repping with. So fit ECM ships to specifically counter them.
JeChecke	Posted - 2010.03.05 23:48:00 - [13] Only problem is you can't attack them...
Orion Shadowmaker Amarr Blue Republic	Posted - 2010.03.05 23:48:00 - [14] The ECM helps a ton! -- But the freaking station camping mechanic comes into play for your target -- Its really a shame Eve developers allow this shady untactical bullsheet. And before the smartaaas's come out RVB has always allowed ECM modules on war targets and on Purple Ops. so there Thanks Orion Shadowmaker Go Blues!
Dark Proteus	Posted - 2010.03.05 23:49:00 - [15] I don't see a magic bullet to counter this tactic. But things to try, although I imagine these have already occurred to you. 1. Energy Neutralizing the logistic ship is a valid tactic. Cap is life for the logistic. 2. Jam the logistic ship. If they can't target they can't repair. Most logistic wings count on each other for ancillary support when aggression is thrown at them. It is rare to see fully configured logistic wing setup that can handle 1-2 jamming ships along with 1-2 heavy neutralizing ships. I don't recommend jamming and neuting the same ship as that only takes out one ship. I would jam one ship while neuting another, along with enough DPS to break their internal tank, and you break the link in two places. 3. Build and assign a wing of your fleet to handle just the logistic ships. RR fleets tend to get a bit anxious if a whole section of the enemy fleet peels off to address just them. You will need to train these pilots in how to jam, neutralize and deal DPS in concert with each other or your just wasting valuable fleet assets. Bottom line is your fleet has to be configured and sized to handle the additional drain on resources the RR will put on you. From my perspective the enemy dictates the rules of engagement. If he brings a knife I bring a bigger one. If he brings a gun I bring a better one. If you can't increase your ranks to deal with the RR, or develop and practice a solid strategy that counter these RR tactics then you have to adapt and fight fire with fire. But that is a personal choice every commander has to make for himself. Personally I don't enjoy fighting on terms that I find contrary to my personal honor. But I enjoy losing even less. I doubt most of this helps you, or tells you anything you do not already know, but you have a real challenge on your hands. Good luck!
Artemis Rose Sileo In Pacis THE SPACE P0LICE	Posted - 2010.03.06 00:12:00 - [16] ECM. Oh wait, you banned that "in-game cheat" from your fleets . Insta undocks, and only engage your WTs away from stations + gates. Is it really that hard? *** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats
Cartheron Crust Krazny Oktyabr Revolyutsiya	Posted - 2010.03.06 00:27:00 - [17] Originally by: Artemis Rose ECM. Oh wait, you banned that "in-game cheat" from your fleets . Insta undocks, and only engage your WTs away from stations + gates. Is it really that hard? ECM has always been allowed and encouraged against 3rd party wardecs in RvB.
Orion Shadowmaker Amarr Blue Republic	Posted - 2010.03.06 01:49:00 - [18] Nice -- Dark Proteus, we have done of few of these but I printed your response - I believe we missed a step and you just covered it!! -- very nice breakdown there. I appreciate all the help on this post -- Thanks Orion Shadowmaker Go Blues!
Slade Hoo Amarr Corpse Collection Point	Posted - 2010.03.06 04:42:00 - [19] Edited by: Slade Hoo on 06/03/2010 04:43:02 I pray for the introduction of warp disruptors making docking attempts impossible. This was stated by CCP in the CSM minutes from the iceland meeting. Remote repping **** docking instantly because they have no aggression timer is dumb. P.S.: go on RvB :-) I'd really like to join your fight..but am busy in lowsec and can't enter highsec right now ------ Make Lowsec useful! Vote in the CSM-Forum!
altyaltyaltyalt	Posted - 2010.03.06 05:42:00 - [20] Theres a few ways to deal with this... Plow through them anyway - Plan on bringing 2x 1100 dps BS to nullify 4x reps, this is not a very efficient use of manpower. Damps - logi alts like to warp in at the rear of station, a couple range damps usually takes them out of the fight real quick, and will force them to dock and give you an opportunity to pop something. If you can't pop a repper on undock, your only chance is ecm. ECM - most station camping guardians/oneiroses fit 2-3 ECCM, but a few blackbirds w/racials can still get jams in. best practice is to combine this with neuts, once capped out they cant turn eccm back on & they can be jammed easily.
Lukka	Posted - 2010.03.06 06:08:00 - [21] Originally by: Orion Shadowmaker Hey Guys, Another great week in RVB with over 36 Fleet engagements, a *beautiful* 100+ BS fight, and 1200+ kills posted. But recently we have a few War decers who have really honed in on the remote repping cheat utilized by Nuetrals alts in conjuction with their fleets. We have used quite a few tactics to offset this tremendous bulit in eve cheat, but as you guys know the remote reppers all from different corps can get there RR from range and then just dock to get away. All the while allowing fleets that have no chance against us in normal fight situations to get easy kills and then dock up or jump gates themselves. I would like some ideas on this type scenario. the cool thing about RVB is we can experiment a bit, as the fights are so frequent it allows for some creativity. But I really want some sound tactics that have been used to great effect to counter this cheesey (non tactical) eve component. Thanks ahead of time, GO BLUES Orion Shadowmaker LOL.. I made a post in your last 'recruiting' thread on 'how to deal' with this. Hisec wars aren't 0.0--brute force won't win a fight, unless ensuring a fight doesn't happen is inclusive in your definition of victory. Everything you wrote in this post--and I mean EVERYTHING--is a long winded version of: Orion Shadowmaker > I just don't get it. Sorry bud, no one can help you with that. No one can make you see what you don't want to see. Thanks for the laugh, /lukka
Doccia Ellicis Caldari Red Federation	Posted - 2010.03.06 07:43:00 - [22] First, I would like to point out that neutral RR aren't "cheating". Second, Dark Proteus has pretty much covered everything. However, here's something that I haven't seen anyone mention: - Bring the Logistics ships closer to the field of battle: If the Logistics Ship is station hugging, make it dock. This way, the only way to re-enter the battle is from the station undock, where you can easily apply DPS to force it to dock again. This is also where Sensor Damps are useful. If you can get two bonused damps on the Logistics ship, its effective range will be limited to <25km. Thus bringing it within range of your DPS ships.
Fearless M0F0 Blue Republic	Posted - 2010.03.06 07:52:00 - [23] So it seems they are throwing all the lame empire station camping tricks at us. We have seen their neutral guardians switch corps so we have to set individual standing to catch them in local. Yesterday they threw a new twist: a neutral command ship giving them fleet bonuses. If that is not an exploit we should start doing it Kudos to them for bringing the challenge... as for the guardians, i predict we will be salvaging some of them wrecks this weekend EVE II "Dominion" - The Return of teh LAG
Dark Proteus	Posted - 2010.03.06 09:16:00 - [24] I concur with Doccia's tactic of bringing the logistics closer to the battle. Logistic ships are built for conducting operations at range. Forcing a logi pilot to undock at zero to the enemy fleet is an opportunity for the FC to take advantage of. If we are discussing true logistic ships they are at the core just a cruiser so heavy DPS can nearly alpha them into dust. To be certain though. Get a fleet of 5-7 fully qaulified level 5, elite core skilled logistic pilots with several dozen wars under their belt and they will know the counter the undocking weakness. But it is one more of the very few situations in which a logistic ship is vulnerable. Knowing your enemy here is critical, although difficult given the very nature of the neutral remote repper. The FC facing the neutral RR needs to enforce discipline on his fleet members in regards to returning aggression to the neutral remote logistics. I have seen fleets get decimated by not managing aggro appropriately by carelessly allowing unfocused aggression to be applied to the neutral RR fleet and within seconds an extra 25-35 hostile Tech2 drones emerge from the neutral fleet and go about their merry business of stripping enemy drones out of space before converging on the main task force burning them into glass beads. Orion, keep this thought in mind. There are entire fleets of neutral logistics pilots that do this work for a living in EVE. Its what they do. They enjoy the concept of war from the bridge of a logistic ship just as much as you enjoy the war from the bridge of your battleship. They drill their fleet members as often as you hold combat ops. But remember, a professional neutral logistic pilot has be very quick to watch who and what is aggressing them. They are rarely just the everyday pilot who listens for primary and presses F1-F8. They typicaly have a firm grasp of the game mechanics. They will have the upper hand on you at almost every turn. They usually arrive after the battle starts so they have solid intel on your fleets capabilities. They also know exaclty where the battle is occuring in relation to the station or gate so they get the advantage of pinpointing their landing spot around the fleet so they have a key advantage of position. They may even hold a portion of their own fleet in reserve just in case you have a trap for them. There are weaknesses in the tactic. But you have to be quick to spot them and have the foresight to have a game plan setup and ready to roll. Honestly sometimes the best way to counter a tactic is to try out the life of that pilot for a few days. Crawl into a logistic ship and setup a few skirmishes with your fellow corpmates. You will quickly face his fears, his challenges and from those experiences you will begin to develop the tactics required to defeat him. One tactic I have seen help force a logistic fleet to make some hard decisions is when a few pilots drop several wings of Sentry 2 drones outside the range of the logistic fleets own drone cap range. Once heavy DPS starts hitting the primary logistic target the fellow logi pilots need to either put a few of the reps on their teammate or allow him to dock or warp away. Either way the chain starts to weaken. This tactic loses strength if the numbers in the logi fleet are significant enough the fleet has extra RR to spare. The neutral RR counter to this tactic is the logistic commander will call for reinforcements to warp in from the appropriate direction to put his own set of neutral RR behind his main logi force by 50-60 KM thereby giving his front line pilots a huge advantage as they are now being repped by this secondary force that is nearly 110-130 KM from the main battle line. I have seen this tactic go three deep with the final reinforcements literally 150-160 KM away from battle yet still providing their logi benefits all the way up to the front line. Hope this helps you in some way.
Calistai Huranu Gaping Axe Wound Promotions	Posted - 2010.03.06 09:24:00 - [25] With the number's in RvB, the lowsec solution is really the way forwards tbh, personally i'd reccomend Khanid lowsec, maybe staging corps out of nandeza and Goudiyah or Irmalin, nice grouping of system's just perfect for you guys to enjoy. As to staying in highsec and nuet RR, you just need MOAR ALPHA.
The AEther Caldari Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2010.03.06 10:32:00 - [26] Originally by: Doccia Ellicis If the Logistics Ship is station hugging, make it dock. This way, the only way to re-enter the battle is from the station undock, where you can easily apply DPS to force it to dock again. This is also where Sensor Damps are useful. If you can get two bonused damps on the Logistics ship, its effective range will be limited to <25km. Thus bringing it within range of your DPS ships. To add to this, if you can force them to fight on the Duvolle station in Alentene system that's a kick-out station so an undocking logi ship won't be able to just wait out session change, throw some reps, and immediately dock back up again. If there are quick tacklers capable of scrambling and webifying it into oblivion you can take it down once it undocks for round 2 still and is still flagged for repping WT. If they are unaware of this station being a kick-out one, you may get a few of them aggressed, docking, then kill them if they try to reenter the fight. There was talk about this months ago that if Blue based out of this station there would be much less station humping going on. Agony Unleashed - no blues 0.0 pvp, pvp classes
Tu Ko	Posted - 2010.03.06 10:43:00 - [27] Please excuse my ignorance, but I thought RvB had adopted sepcific rules of engagement to create a completely t1 fighting enviroment for High Sec. Wouldn't you all just agree to toss out people that engage in behavior counter productive to your theme? I mean unless you are saying that the RR are true neutrals that are engaging the in the fight without consent to do so?
Lallaallaa	Posted - 2010.03.06 11:02:00 - [28] Wow... So much stupidity. It's hard to handle.
Hiroshima Jita	Posted - 2010.03.06 11:49:00 - [29] If you have 5 guys, and you are fighting 5 people with 5 neutral remote reppers you are really fighting 10 guys outnumbered 2 to 1. To win bring 10 guys with as much dps as they can. If a nuetral with RR gets an aggro timer neut it or jamn it and keep your dps on things that are aggressed. Or bring your own RR. Or fight in locations witout gates or stations, like in the middle of the enemy's mission. Alternatively you could move your operation to lowsec like the other guy said. The lowsec equivalent of nuetral RR is when people undock capitals on you. People don't do that in 0.0 because caps that do that there tend to instapop. Instead 0.0 plays host to the uberblob and more experienced pvpers then most empire wardec guys want to deal with.
Arec Bardwin	Posted - 2010.03.06 13:04:00 - [30] Have an arty sniper wing ready to warp in at range and alpha one or two, warp out and repeat.

Pages: [1] 2 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.