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Xilian Yula
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Posted - 2010.03.09 20:48:00 -
[1]
Hello,
It surprises me if this hasn't been asked already but I really couldn't find relevant information which didn't seem to be outdated. My question is, I bought some original blueprints worth quite a bit, with the intention of researching it and then selling the copies. However, I don't know how much I should research it. My biggest concern is PE. As I see it right now, there is extremely little difference from a 10ME and a 100ME, but I don't know the differences on PE?
What would you say is standard blueprint requirement ME & PE wise (non-capital), for it to be used in production without wasting too much time on research?
Thanks!
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Special Projects Executive The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.03.09 20:51:00 -
[2]
It depends entirely on the blueprint and how much time you want to save during production.
I usually use the BPO Calc website to help me determine what levels I want to research.
(Don't have the link here at work - just do a google search for it.) --Vel
Forum Mom: Spanking the snot out of little brats. |
Mingus Sin
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Posted - 2010.03.09 22:04:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Mingus Sin on 09/03/2010 22:05:13 Edited by: Mingus Sin on 09/03/2010 22:04:52 Check HERE for some good information on ME research.
He gives some good examples using a frigate and shows what you actually save at different levels. The problem is, people are stupid and will spend millions more on a ME50 BPC instead of an ME30 BPC because they just dont understand how ME works and how little going from ME30 to ME50 actually saves.
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Estel Arador
Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services
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Posted - 2010.03.10 12:26:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Xilian Yula What would you say is standard blueprint requirement ME & PE wise (non-capital), for it to be used in production without wasting too much time on research?
ME 9 / PE 9, that reduces waste from 10% to 1%, which in my opinion is acceptable for production. Increase it to 18 if you must (double the research time 0.5% extra waste reduction). Anything more is useless.
Free jumpclone service|924 stations - Truly Universal |
Mona X
Caldari C0VEN
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Posted - 2010.03.10 13:43:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Xilian Yula
What would you say is standard blueprint requirement ME & PE wise (non-capital), for it to be used in production without wasting too much time on research?
10. But you are not researching them for building but selling, so "standard blueprint requirement" don't apply. More is better.
Originally by: Xilian Yula
My question is, I bought some original blueprints worth quite a bit, with the intention of researching it and then selling the copies. However, I don't know how much I should research it.
Check your local contracts for same BPC, check their ME/PE levels and research yours at least 5 more.
Originally by: Xilian Yula
My biggest concern is PE. As I see it right now, there is extremely little difference from a 10ME and a 100ME, but I don't know the differences on PE?
Doesn't matter. If your competitors wlll have PE at higher level (with same ME) they will have better chance of selling their prints for higher price.
Originally by: Estel Arador Anything more is useless.
Anything more is selling point.
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Estel Arador
Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services
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Posted - 2010.03.10 14:25:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Mona X
Originally by: Estel Arador Anything more is useless.
Anything more is selling point.
Your right of course. For some reason I thought the OP was talking about production; I somehow missed the part about selling copies. For selling BPOs/BPCs: higher is better. People will pay a premium for insane (and useless) ME levels.
Free jumpclone service|924 stations - Truly Universal |
Xilian Yula
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Posted - 2010.03.10 17:23:00 -
[7]
Thank you all for the feedback.
I see that there is a certain ignorance among buyers, but who are they to blame. I think I'll research them to an appropriate practical level and sell them cheaper than current BPC's on the market.
There are a few BPO I own which I think I'm gonna produce myself, I'd like to know what I should research them to. The ME I'm fairly known with, but I'd still like more information regarding PE.
What is the time difference percent-wise from say PE 5 vs. PE 25?
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Jovialmadness
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Posted - 2010.03.10 18:30:00 -
[8]
Some of the guys have really already answered that. Me/pe both 9 gets you solid. Anything beyond that begins to set your blueprint above others for bpc sales and manufacture costs. |
Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2010.03.11 00:29:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Xilian Yula What is the time difference percent-wise from say PE 5 vs. PE 25?
According to the Blueprint Researching Guide, the formula for production time is:
Production Time = Base time + (Base Waste)/(1 + PL)
Base Waste is 20% of Base Time.
Let me do some of the calculation in public so I can be publicly ridiculed when I get it wrong ...
At PE 5, the time wastage is 1/5 * 1/6 = 1/30 (expressed as a proportion of the base production time), while at PE 25 the time wastage is 1/5 * 1/26 = 1/130.
As a hypothetical example, assume you had a blueprint for an item which takes a day (1440 minutes) of "Base time". The PE0 waste time would be 4.8 hours (4h 48m) the PE5 waste time would be 48 minutes, while the PE25 waste time would be 11 minutes - by spending the extra time to research to PE25 you'll have shaved 23 minutes off the time to produce that item (leaving production time at 1d 0h 23m).
Extra PE research obviously has some value, but a sensible person wouldn't pay more for a BPC with extra ME/PE than they'd save over the entire production run. Thus a sensible person would look at PE5 versus PE25, multiply the cost to hire (or fuel) a manufacturing slot for 23 minutes by the number of products they'll produce from that BPC, arrive at a value X, and be willing to pay something less than X for a PE25 BPC over a PE5 BPC.
To pull up a more realistic example, consider that the build time of a Fenrir is: 2w0d19h @ PE0, 1w6d8h @ PE1, 1w5d20h @ PE2, 1w5d10h @ PE4, 1w5d8h @ PE5 (according to the BPO Calc service). Researching from PE4 to PE5 will save two hours on production time, on a product that takes 12 days to produce.
At some point, you'll make more profit per unit time (because time is the ultimate critical resource) by buying two BPCs and running two production lines in parallel.
From the point of view of someone researching BPOs in order to sell BPCs, none of this matters. The world contains many people who can't or won't do the basic maths. Some of them will use other justification for paying a much higher price for the BPC, such as "time to market" (because getting a freighter off the production line half an hour earlier will magically justify paying 1M ISK more for the BPC).
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