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Haniblecter Teg
F.R.E.E. Explorer The Initiative.
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Posted - 2010.10.09 19:01:00 -
[121]
Yea...lets remove local...so you have to scan dozens of systems to find someone who can avoid you even easier by pressing a button once every few seconds.
I swear, some of these pilots just dont know what's best for them. ----------------- Friends Forever |
Vlepo
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Posted - 2010.10.09 21:35:00 -
[122]
Enough with this nonsence. You want to make money RISK-FREE ????? STEP RIGHT THIS WAY----->PLEXXXXX
Buy your iskies and be happy chaps about it.
Ratting in Carriers, ratting in Super-Carriers what comes next ???
YOUR GREED IS THE SOURCE OF YOUR PLIGHT REPENT!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ps. You can always became high-sec traders.....
Ps2. Aligning WILL NOT HELP (buBBles) |
Khalessa
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Posted - 2010.10.09 22:09:00 -
[123]
Edited by: Khalessa on 09/10/2010 22:10:11 I know! Lets not remove local and make cloakers not show up in local
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Abduakla
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Posted - 2010.10.10 05:24:00 -
[124]
Originally by: MWDrive
Originally by: Khanoonian Singh Are you really that afraid of an afk cloaker? You have no home defense or operations security set up?
Here is a fix- remove local, then you won't have to see the scary AFK cloaker.
Having local or removing it is another topic. Problem here is mechanics which allows you to be invulnerable 23/7 in hostile space. I don't mind AFK cloakers, just go rat in system next door, but that doesn't mean mechanics isn't broken.
The current mechanic is so broken that the leaders of Providence have all agreed in their defensive pact to NOT do this **** to each other.
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Ione Hunt
Storm Solutions
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Posted - 2010.10.10 06:28:00 -
[125]
You're already penalized enough for fitting a cloak. You can't get good damage or a great tank by fitting a covops cloak. Drop 1 high-slot or med-slot on your ratting ships to counter typical cloaking ships and you shouldn't have to act like a scared rabbit. _______________
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Min Mae
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Posted - 2010.10.10 07:06:00 -
[126]
The only thing I would change about Cloaking Devices is either making your ship harder to fit by using a percentage of powergrid and cpu rather than a fixed amount and/or lower the performance of the ship in more ways than just targeting lock time. Make the capacitor recharge slower, make the ship slower when uncloaked, increase the signature due to the wild physics involved in making a ship disappear.
You could also allow cloaked ships to be scanable down to the grid they are on, and someone just has to canvas the entire grid to find you. Maybe give subtle visual clues to the location like a shimmering similar to a cloaked bird of prey.
Make a cloak FUN instead of totally invulnerable. That is all.
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Min Mae
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Posted - 2010.10.10 07:09:00 -
[127]
Maybe a special pos modual that emits special hyperspace waves allowing combat probes to catch signals from a cloaked ship. Scan down to the grid, invite 1000 friends to comb the desert...
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Min Mae
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Posted - 2010.10.10 07:15:00 -
[128]
Have a modual fitted to a ship that increases the range at which your ship needs to be to decloak a cloaked ship. Make it eat large amounts of cap requiring logistics or lots of RR energy transfer to keep it going.
A pos modual that decloaks ships within an additional 20km of the pos shields.
All these ideas bring more skill into the game, while still allowing people to cloak with impunity.
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Min Mae
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Posted - 2010.10.10 07:19:00 -
[129]
ps... I also agree with getting rid of local in 0.0... Intel chans should replace that info...
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Vjorn Angannon
Fleet Escort Services
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Posted - 2010.10.10 07:36:00 -
[130]
Sorry, I didn't bother to read the whole thread, but I have a question:
What is the difference between my cloaked cheetah, afk 23/7, and my uncloaked cheetah with dual eccm, burning from an unaligned safe to an unaligned point, afk 23/7?
Next are we gonna ask to nerf eccm???
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Gibbo3771
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Posted - 2010.10.10 14:22:00 -
[131]
The solar panels on my loki soak up enough energy to Perma run my cloak. Just knocked a huge hole in your logic.
Now go away
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Feikno
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Posted - 2010.10.10 22:34:00 -
[132]
Just my two cents, but I think it's silly that there really is no 'true' form of covert ops, and espionage. Local Chat seems a little to easy to notice how many people are in a system or are unfamiliar in said system.
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xavier69
Gallente Stark Enterprises LLC
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Posted - 2010.10.11 00:19:00 -
[133]
MAKE CLOAKERS NOT VISIBLE IN LOCAL
PROBLEM FUKING SOLVED
REALLY TIRED OF HEARING THE SAME Whining for 4 years about cloaks
XOXOXOXO |
Eagle Tarquinas
Gallente Reliables Inc Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2010.10.11 07:09:00 -
[134]
Originally by: Vjorn Angannon Sorry, I didn't bother to read the whole thread, but I have a question:
What is the difference between my cloaked cheetah, afk 23/7, and my uncloaked cheetah with dual eccm, burning from an unaligned safe to an unaligned point, afk 23/7?
Next are we gonna ask to nerf eccm???
Knowing its a cheetah and thus going "oh who gives a ****" as opposed to thinking "hmmm.... cloaky in system.... is it a recon? covops? full fledged battleship? battlecruiser? or just a noob ship witha co-processor on it."
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Brian Ballsack
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Posted - 2010.10.11 11:30:00 -
[135]
AFK cloakers are harmless.
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Alberta
Gallente Wayne Solutions Amalgamated
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Posted - 2010.10.11 13:49:00 -
[136]
I'm generally against the idea of requiring fuel to use a cloak or heavily nerfing the ability of ships designed for covert use to remain undetected for relatively long periods of time. That said I don't really see a problem with reducing the ability of non-covert ships to remain cloaked for long periods, or having some limit / logistical requirements for covert ships. I can just about see a workable compromise solution by combining heat mechanics with a special bay (not fuel but waste matter) on covert ship classes. It would go something like this:
First we'll start off with the mandatory tenuous rp technical explanation. (Not sure if this in with existing material or not and it's certainly not meant to be completely free of physics holes). Cloaks work by controlling the radiative emissions of a ship. This is not an energy neutral process, requiring the retention of more energy than that emitted. This results in the gradual build up of 'heat'. Covert ship classes get around this by having their designs based around a massively complicated bit of kit known as an Energy-matter converter mk2 (apparently the mk1 was a disaster resulting in the instantaneous destruction of the prototype ship when it produced almost 300 million times more mass than was predicted). This uses the excess heat to produce waste matter that is stored in a specially constructed matter production and containment chamber that can only be safely accessed using the fitting services of a station/POS/carrier. Allowing them to make extended use of any cloaking device fitted to the ship.
Now we've got the dodgy tech explanations out of the way, here's the mechanics. Active cloaks build up heat at a rate that is likely to start causing damage after a couple of minutes. In a covert ship, this heat will be converted to matter and stored in the waste matter bay, assuming that there is space. Covert ships should have space for maybe 24-48hrs of cloak operation. The waste matter bay requires the use of fitting services to be emptied.
The fallout You can still use a cloak on any ship, don't need to buy, mine or remember to bring fuel. If you're in a covert ship and your waste matter bay is full you should still be able use you cloak enough for travel purposes to go and get it emptied in relative safety unless you've let it burn out.
Non-covert ships can't afk cloak. You should be able to manage a pee break without your cloak taking heat damage, and with some safespot warping and nanite paste usage you might be able to wait out some hostiles long enough to either get some help, or until they get bored waiting if you're not a particularly tasty target. If you're trying to rat covertly in hostile territory though, you're probably going to need to bring a (shock horror) covert ship.
Covert ships can still akf cloak, but do have to leave hostile systems occasionally. Most covert players probably aren't going to be particularly inconvenienced by the logistics requirements unless they're engaged in 23/7 *******ging (adding some minor logistical requirements to doing this deep in hostile territory is no bad thing imo).
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Bernard Schuyler
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Posted - 2010.10.11 15:36:00 -
[137]
Originally by: Alberta I'm generally against the idea of requiring fuel to use a cloak or heavily nerfing the ability of ships designed for covert use to remain undetected for relatively long periods of time. That said I don't really see a problem with reducing the ability of non-covert ships to remain cloaked for long periods, or having some limit / logistical requirements for covert ships. I can just about see a workable compromise solution by combining heat mechanics with a special bay (not fuel but waste matter) on covert ship classes. It would go something like this:
First we'll start off with the mandatory tenuous rp technical explanation. (Not sure if this in with existing material or not and it's certainly not meant to be completely free of physics holes). Cloaks work by controlling the radiative emissions of a ship. This is not an energy neutral process, requiring the retention of more energy than that emitted. This results in the gradual build up of 'heat'. Covert ship classes get around this by having their designs based around a massively complicated bit of kit known as an Energy-matter converter mk2 (apparently the mk1 was a disaster resulting in the instantaneous destruction of the prototype ship when it produced almost 300 million times more mass than was predicted). This uses the excess heat to produce waste matter that is stored in a specially constructed matter production and containment chamber that can only be safely accessed using the fitting services of a station/POS/carrier. Allowing them to make extended use of any cloaking device fitted to the ship.
Now we've got the dodgy tech explanations out of the way, here's the mechanics. Active cloaks build up heat at a rate that is likely to start causing damage after a couple of minutes. In a covert ship, this heat will be converted to matter and stored in the waste matter bay, assuming that there is space. Covert ships should have space for maybe 24-48hrs of cloak operation. The waste matter bay requires the use of fitting services to be emptied.
The fallout You can still use a cloak on any ship, don't need to buy, mine or remember to bring fuel. If you're in a covert ship and your waste matter bay is full you should still be able use you cloak enough for travel purposes to go and get it emptied in relative safety unless you've let it burn out.
Non-covert ships can't afk cloak. You should be able to manage a pee break without your cloak taking heat damage, and with some safespot warping and nanite paste usage you might be able to wait out some hostiles long enough to either get some help, or until they get bored waiting if you're not a particularly tasty target. If you're trying to rat covertly in hostile territory though, you're probably going to need to bring a (shock horror) covert ship.
Covert ships can still akf cloak, but do have to leave hostile systems occasionally. Most covert players probably aren't going to be particularly inconvenienced by the logistics requirements unless they're engaged in 23/7 *******ging (adding some minor logistical requirements to doing this deep in hostile territory is no bad thing imo).
How many convoluted suggestions do we need to have before people just realize that what they really want has ZERO to do with cloaks and they just want AFK nerfed.
Idle for more than X minutes, auto-logoff. Problem solved.
If you can't abide that because you want to be AFK for other purposes, then too bad, live with the cloaks.
Because AFK-at-a-safe-unprobable-ships will STILL be there and you'll STILL be crying.
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Poastingalt
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Posted - 2010.10.11 18:42:00 -
[138]
Originally by: AFK Cloaker
I love this guy.
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Andrea Griffin
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Posted - 2010.10.11 18:50:00 -
[139]
Originally by: Bernard Schuyler Idle for more than X minutes, auto-logoff. Problem solved.
When I am sitting cloaked outside of someone's POS for an hour and watching their comings and goings, I would not want to magically be whisked away because the game thought I was not playing.
And yes, I will sit at a tower for an hour or two, just watching. Good things come to those who wait.
The real solution to AFK cloaking: Move back to high sec. Leave the rest of the game for the people who can deal with it. Fix Rockets in '08 '09 2010 2011 2012?! |
Bernard Schuyler
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Posted - 2010.10.11 18:55:00 -
[140]
Originally by: Andrea Griffin
Originally by: Bernard Schuyler Idle for more than X minutes, auto-logoff. Problem solved.
When I am sitting cloaked outside of someone's POS for an hour and watching their comings and goings, I would not want to magically be whisked away because the game thought I was not playing.
And yes, I will sit at a tower for an hour or two, just watching. Good things come to those who wait.
The real solution to AFK cloaking: Move back to high sec. Leave the rest of the game for the people who can deal with it.
Agreed. And that's why people should just deal with AFK cloakers. They are doing nothing that thousands of other people are doing in the game. Sitting idle. Not attacking anyone. :-p
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Guillame Herschel
Gallente NME1
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Posted - 2010.10.11 19:36:00 -
[141]
Originally by: BC Tank Fuel for using a cloak on your ship does this hide my afk cloaker whine sufficiently?
No.
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Djerin
Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2010.10.11 20:00:00 -
[142]
Originally by: BC Tank The reason for the post as some of u might have guessed is, having a hostile in your null security system or systems AFK'ing 24 hours aday cloaked for many weeks on end.
Simple solution: just move to the system next doors and do your carebearing there. Carebear solution: cry about it on forums. Funny solution: fake isk-whoring and try to kill the cloaker when he thinks he can tackle you for his friends.
The only thing an afk cloaker achieves is that afk miners/ratters can't do their usual business in his presence. I have absolutely no problem with that. Actually I endorse it. ---- Sarmaul's crosstrainorgtfo |
Zyress
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Posted - 2010.10.11 20:21:00 -
[143]
Ya know, when I'm afk for long enough my client logs out automagically, how are these afk cloakers staying online and inactive?
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Allestin Villimar
Zebra Corp
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Posted - 2010.10.11 22:07:00 -
[144]
I can afk for hours on end and it doesn't log me out. Not sure what the difference would be. ...in bed. |
Grimpak
Gallente The Whitehound Corporation The Chamber of Commerce
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Posted - 2010.10.11 23:04:00 -
[145]
AFK cloakers are harmless.
it's the ones that are not AFK that you must be careful of.
...and which ones are? well, that's your job to find out. ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Melodee619
The Scope
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Posted - 2010.10.12 02:38:00 -
[146]
you lads still fighting over this, its been months. Simple fact is, if you ratters are too scared to leave POS when a solo "afk'er" shows up.... you really shouldn't be in 0.0 in first place :).
One Recon/force or a solo SB, cant do **** to you so who ares if he is gathering info on movements, one way or other a Cyno is gonna show up if that is what he's there for,there isnt a damn thing you can do to stop it. If he's just there to **** you off, then get over it or bait him....I know I got baited once when 2 "hulks" mistakenly talked in local about the belt they were in was spawning TS haulers....
It cost me a Hound cos I got stupid. Try flying a cov ops before demanding nerfs, an you will find they are anything but the invincibility machines you seem to think they are :)
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Milan Nantucket
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Posted - 2010.10.12 02:41:00 -
[147]
The fix is easy.. find a different system to macro err... I mean rat in.
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VC General
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Posted - 2010.10.12 09:33:00 -
[148]
Originally by: Gibbo3771 The solar panels on my loki soak up enough energy to Perma run my cloak. Just knocked a huge hole in your logic.
Now go away
How does it do that when the sunlight just passes through or bounces off?
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