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Elldranga
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Posted - 2010.05.28 23:58:00 -
[1]
Well... my major mission site has multiple l4 agents, all with a decent quality.... and just far enough from low sec that there aren't many low sec assignments, even post patch.
The number of people in system as I write this is 86. Pre-patch, it would generally hang in the 20's at this time of day.
Those of us running missions in the system anticipate rapid increases from this... that 86 will shortly represent a "low" average and that we'll see continued migrations into this system till it's a multi-hundred average like so many other hubs.
I for one, would like to congratulate CCP on MISSION ACCOMPLISHED! as regards lowering the load an mission hubs. Currently the load is 4x what it was, and it'll likely go much much higher.
Real good thinking guys! Way to move people FURTHER away from low-sec. I know it's your game and all... and that you guys probably put a lot of effort into thinking of some things, but this one, you kinda missed a few crucial elements.
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Serkaan
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Posted - 2010.05.29 00:39:00 -
[2]
waaah waah waah. grow up.
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Party Scout
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Posted - 2010.05.29 00:45:00 -
[3]
OP is right, mission runners will gravitate more towards deeper high sec now.
There is a big difference between making low-sec more attractive, and forcing people to low-sec. One works, the other does not and aggravates people. Guess which one CCP chose...
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Elldranga
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Posted - 2010.05.29 00:52:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Serkaan waaah waah waah. grow up.
Yet another epic fail!
I'm not crying... I don't have to move or change anything. Reading comprehension for the win!
I'm mocking CCP for implementing a change which is accomplishing the exact opposite of their stated intent.
Now of course I'm mocking you for failing to comprend the obvious.
No worries it's all good. I'm equal opportunity.
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Princess Oriana
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Posted - 2010.05.29 00:53:00 -
[5]
I am coming to a mission hub near you! forced by the misguided nerf of ccp
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suckitdonks
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Posted - 2010.05.29 03:29:00 -
[6]
I for one thank all of you for moving so that i dont have to see all of you on my screen LOL..
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Lanais Suleia
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Posted - 2010.05.29 05:34:00 -
[7]
The word "epic" has lost all meaning... |
Cotilla
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Posted - 2010.05.29 07:45:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Lanais Suleia The word "epic" has lost all meaning...
Yep. That's epic true.
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Wet Ferret
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Posted - 2010.05.29 08:08:00 -
[9]
I epic this thread.
But for the record, I only changed my sig because I was annoying myself with the last one.
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RootEmerger
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Posted - 2010.05.29 08:16:00 -
[10]
Having an hundred peoples in local is a thing. having an hundred peoples in local that spawn twenty to fifty npc each plus roids plus structures etc. is entirely another thing... With this patch you get lots of missioners in system to request missions, but the mission - and the npc spawn - is done elsewere, in a less congested system. I dont see any fail.
----------------------------------------------
If this were played upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction. |
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Jamie Banks
Gallente Wasted and Still Mining
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Posted - 2010.05.29 08:40:00 -
[11]
Originally by: RootEmerger Having an hundred peoples in local is a thing. having an hundred peoples in local that spawn twenty to fifty npc each plus roids plus structures etc. is entirely another thing... With this patch you get lots of missioners in system to request missions, but the mission - and the npc spawn - is done elsewere, in a less congested system. I dont see any fail.
Lack of Punctuation and Grammer, Epic Fail Logical thinking in a forum thread?!?! Epic
_____________________________
EVE - Everyone vs. Everyone Join in-game Channel 'Aussies'
Check my Bio in-game for good deals on Invention Packs |
Jamie Banks
Gallente Wasted and Still Mining
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Posted - 2010.05.29 08:51:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Jamie Banks on 29/05/2010 08:52:42 If anyone has been around for more than a few years in the EvE world, they will realise this Patch is not a nerf but a standardisation, Level 4's have been extremely overpowered in regards to their risk vs. reward for a long time now. Likewise the Lvl5's in highsec, should never have happended. They were intentionally only meant to be a feature of low-sec not high-sec.
It's just the fact the you youngins are so used to CCP hand-feeding you ISK that when your weened off easy-mode, you can't handle it. Seriously grow a pair. If you make less isk/hr, everyone else doing the same mind numbing lvl4's are gonna take a hit and more than likely prices of things will drop, aka deflation, or you change career and do something more profitable.
/me Leans back in his rocking chair
Back in the old days, we had to mine for a month just to build a cruiser, we couldn't even afford ammo we had to bump the NPC's to death and use drones, if you were lucky enough to afford them! _____________________________
EVE - Everyone vs. Everyone Join in-game Channel 'Aussies'
Check my Bio in-game for good deals on Invention Packs |
nafiy gnaw
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Posted - 2010.05.29 09:53:00 -
[13]
Dodixie, here I come!
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Xiu Wenyin
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Posted - 2010.05.29 09:57:00 -
[14]
This is great news actually. Now I don't have to put any effort at all in probing out mission runners. Like shooting a blunderbuss in a bucket of sardines.
The downside is that, coupled with the changes in NPC loot, salvage materials will become worthless.
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Elldranga
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Posted - 2010.05.31 01:04:00 -
[15]
Yep... numbers in local still moving to new records.
For those of you who don't understand the fail by CCP,
They stated that the purpose of this patch was to reduce lag by removing load from systems.
While I'm sure to some extent that has worked in some ways, it has had an opposite effect. There were quite a few more possible mission hubs. The fact that many of those hubs now send missioners to low-sec reliably, means that it's no longer a viable mission hub, so many people are clustering towards the good hubs that don't send you to low sec but still have several high quality l4 agents.
The attempt to reduce load, has actually increased it, since the same number of people are beginning to use a smaller number of systems.
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Pyro Ninja
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Posted - 2010.05.31 01:54:00 -
[16]
I can understand your point Elldranga. CCP is trying to balance the missions as they were being over farmed for very little risk turning it into more of a WoW affaire. There's suppose to be an element of risk to get a better reward.
Most of the people that have the issue are solo mission runners. Working as a team in low sec is rewarding and if you can pop a couple rats and take their loot the better income you will get.
But yes all the high sec hubs will be overwhelmed soon but the miners and producers will be happy as there will be more isk flow.
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Ydra Ko'Zyn
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Posted - 2010.05.31 02:17:00 -
[17]
I think the only fail with this feature is the fact that CCP applied the same rules to low-sec.
You're never going to see 20+ people in a low sec system doing missions so it makes little sense to apply the same rules. This is a major nerf to low sec mission runners.
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Ildryn
The Inf1dels En Garde
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Posted - 2010.05.31 02:18:00 -
[18]
Everything is working as intended. The system load of multiple players is not as bad as level 4 crap floating around and all the wrecks that didn't get looted. So everyone close yourselves in your little "safe" hub. I'm staying in 0.0 where the good money is.
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Goose99
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Posted - 2010.05.31 02:59:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Ildryn Everything is working as intended. The system load of multiple players is not as bad as level 4 crap floating around and all the wrecks that didn't get looted. So everyone close yourselves in your little "safe" hub. I'm staying in 0.0 where the good money is.
Oh please! Every carebear and their mother want to get into sov null. In some of the backwater systems, you don't see non-blues for weeks on end. You're more likely to get suicide ganked in a highsec hub than get killed there. The problem is those corps don't accept anyone with sp below 50 mil. Yeah, big bohoo...
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Ocih
Amarr The Program Vanguard.
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Posted - 2010.05.31 04:15:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Goose99
Originally by: Ildryn Everything is working as intended. The system load of multiple players is not as bad as level 4 crap floating around and all the wrecks that didn't get looted. So everyone close yourselves in your little "safe" hub. I'm staying in 0.0 where the good money is.
Oh please! Every carebear and their mother want to get into sov null. In some of the backwater systems, you don't see non-blues for weeks on end. You're more likely to get suicide ganked in a highsec hub than get killed there. The problem is those corps don't accept anyone with sp below 50 mil. Yeah, big bohoo...
This.
Without full API, your mother maiden name, a DNA sample, fingers of your first born you dont get in to Sov alliances because meta monkeys are encouraged in EvE and spies are a real threat. |
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Liang Nuren
Parsec Flux
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Posted - 2010.05.31 04:18:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Party Scout There is a big difference between making low-sec more attractive, and forcing people to low-sec. One works, the other does not and aggravates people. Guess which one CCP chose...
See, the thing about it is that I think "forcing" people to low sec was an unintended consequence. I don't think we'd see quite so many low sec mission runners *****ing if it wasn't the case.
At any rate, I suspect we'll see this reversed.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire |
Ildryn
The Inf1dels En Garde
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Posted - 2010.05.31 04:35:00 -
[22]
Full api and Proof of who you may be conspiring with stops alot of problem before they happen.
If you don't want to make money stay in high sec and maybe get ganked.
Not my fault you choose that route.
I guess telling this to a couple people who use alts to hide their identity is redundant.
I don't care how much money you have. But seeing where you get your money from and asking the why and who keeps me and my corp/alliance from getting nailed to a wall for fun.
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Misanthra
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Posted - 2010.05.31 08:21:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Misanthra on 31/05/2010 08:22:10 sure this is the patches fault op? It is summertime now, and all the US kiddies are either released from school or soon will be. US holiday as well and I think a bank holiday for the UK peeps.
Or it could just be mission hubs have high quality level 4's. Loot got nerfed....gonna run missions may as well go for max lp.
Also unlike in null sec....local really don't mean much unless you in an empire war dec. YOu get your own private space for missions, 50 or 100 people...no worries, just run the mission and move on. Ran in mostu with 150 local no issues lots of times. No mission busters, just thieves. And well even the thieves worked for me lol (cheap buy order pricing for the indy's rig business at the time and lots of those orders filled by my ninjya's, called it cheap labor as they "got me" while off to run another lv 4)
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Nareg Maxence
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.05.31 10:42:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Nareg Maxence on 31/05/2010 10:42:34
Originally by: Ocih
Originally by: Goose99
Originally by: Ildryn Everything is working as intended. The system load of multiple players is not as bad as level 4 crap floating around and all the wrecks that didn't get looted. So everyone close yourselves in your little "safe" hub. I'm staying in 0.0 where the good money is.
Oh please! Every carebear and their mother want to get into sov null. In some of the backwater systems, you don't see non-blues for weeks on end. You're more likely to get suicide ganked in a highsec hub than get killed there. The problem is those corps don't accept anyone with sp below 50 mil. Yeah, big bohoo...
This.
Without full API, your mother maiden name, a DNA sample, fingers of your first born you dont get in to Sov alliances because meta monkeys are encouraged in EvE and spies are a real threat.
This is just not true. There are plenty of renteralliances out there. All you need is a decent size corp of carebears and you can get a good deal.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2010.05.31 10:52:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 31/05/2010 10:53:11
Quote:
They stated that the purpose of this patch was to reduce lag by removing load from systems.
False. The purpose of this change was to reduce THEIR server CPU load, not to please you.
For CCP it means re-balancing an half empty server with a bursting full one and also rebalancing those 3 mega-congested systems with 400 players each into 30 systems with 40 players each. It's still 1200 players, just spread equally and thus using their hardware in a more homogeneous amount. Furthermore CCP don't need to reduce how many *turn* missions in any hub, they reduced how many *do* the missions in those systems, which is the activity that uses server CPU.
Therefore CCP's objective is making many "smaller isles" with an hub at the center (how many in local does not matter *them* as it's only your client that eventually lags) and a spread cloud of nearby systems to send people to execute the missions. - Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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Elldranga
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Posted - 2010.05.31 21:59:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Elldranga on 31/05/2010 22:05:10 Edited by: Elldranga on 31/05/2010 22:01:55
Originally by: Goose99
Originally by: Ildryn Everything is working as intended. The system load of multiple players is not as bad as level 4 crap floating around and all the wrecks that didn't get looted. So everyone close yourselves in your little "safe" hub. I'm staying in 0.0 where the good money is.
Oh please! Every carebear and their mother want to get into sov null. In some of the backwater systems, you don't see non-blues for weeks on end. You're more likely to get suicide ganked in a highsec hub than get killed there. The problem is those corps don't accept anyone with sp below 50 mil. Yeah, big bohoo...
Ummm... not so much. Some of us play a bit more than you do apparently. The mission alt is for the times when I'm not on the low sec alt, or the major sov holding alliance member. (let alone any of the traders/miners/manufacturers)
They all do different things. Sometimes I'm in the mood for one... sometimes I'm in the mood for another.
Being able to do what actually seems fun at the moment is a part of who's going to stay in eve for the long term, vs who isn't.
Also, the thing you've forgotten with your post, is that when you put MORE missioners into LESS space, you increase the density of those wrecks and crap in the surrounding systems... Sure... you're right, the crap may cause more lag than the people... but the amounts of crap goes up at the same time as the amounts of people... More people, more crap, confined in less space... yes, it does noticeably increase lag. I can already see a visible difference in the time it takes to load system, and the space that was previously fine, now begins to have the old "stuttering" thing going on. It started once the average population in the hub had crossed into 3 figures, (it's above that now ofc)
Lag has significantly increased in that hub at least. It doesn't make me feel better to know that it has decreased in all the systems that nobody is using.
Edit for Verah...
You've posted that it was false that CCP claimed that part of the goal here was to reduce lag and that it was soley to reduce their CPU load. Actually, if you take the time to go read the notes, CCP specifically states that this was partially to aid the lag problem. You might go read the notes before posting next time. I'm not saying your wrong about the CPU load... I'm saying your wrong in stating that it's false that CCP didn't say it was also to deal with the lag monster.
Edit for Misanthra...
No I'm not 100% sure it's the patches fault... however I can say it definitely began immediately following the patch. I can also say that not all schools let everybody out the very next day following the patch. I can also say that the increase in average numbers in system is not reflected by a proportional increase in total players logged in. Thus... the likely culprit is the patch, not schools letting out.
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Ranka Mei
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.05.31 22:07:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Party Scout OP is right, mission runners will gravitate more towards deeper high sec now.
There is a big difference between making low-sec more attractive, and forcing people to low-sec. One works, the other does not and aggravates people. Guess which one CCP chose...
^^ This. OP is right. --
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2010.05.31 22:40:00 -
[28]
Quote:
CCP specifically states that this was partially to aid the lag problem. You might go read the notes before posting next time. I'm not saying your wrong about the CPU load... I'm saying your wrong in stating that it's false that CCP didn't say it was also to deal with the lag monster
They reduce THEIR server lag by 80% while you'll see maybe 20% and will actually be more lagged when you go to turn in the mission in the "refuge" mission hub that now got many more players.
- Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.05.31 22:47:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Pyro Ninja I can understand your point Elldranga. CCP is trying to balance the missions as they were being over farmed for very little risk turning it into more of a WoW affaire. There's suppose to be an element of risk to get a better reward.
Most of the people that have the issue are solo mission runners. Working as a team in low sec is rewarding and if you can pop a couple rats and take their loot the better income you will get.
But yes all the high sec hubs will be overwhelmed soon but the miners and producers will be happy as there will be more isk flow.
And how this specific change has modified that? The OP is about the change on where you are sent, not about the loot.
Sorry, but going in group in low sec to do a mission that you can do alone elsewhere is simply stupid. You get less isk, with more risk and more aggravation as you need to gather your friends first and then do the mission.
I still fail to see why someone will risk a PvE ship in low sec.
More risk, lower payout and the same quantity of fun.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.05.31 22:59:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 31/05/2010 10:53:11
Quote:
They stated that the purpose of this patch was to reduce lag by removing load from systems.
False. The purpose of this change was to reduce THEIR server CPU load, not to please you.
For CCP it means re-balancing an half empty server with a bursting full one and also rebalancing those 3 mega-congested systems with 400 players each into 30 systems with 40 players each. It's still 1200 players, just spread equally and thus using their hardware in a more homogeneous amount. Furthermore CCP don't need to reduce how many *turn* missions in any hub, they reduced how many *do* the missions in those systems, which is the activity that uses server CPU.
Therefore CCP's objective is making many "smaller isles" with an hub at the center (how many in local does not matter *them* as it's only your client that eventually lags) and a spread cloud of nearby systems to send people to execute the missions.
And you think that adding something like 5.000 jumps every 30 minutes has no consequences?
That having 40 missions in 30 system is so much better than having 1 reinforced system and 29 systems than can share a few processors between all of them?
To me it seem that CCP in the exchange has got more systems with medium load instead of very few with high load and and a lot with low load plus an increase in jumps done and in abandoned stuff in the mission locations.
If you add to the calculation the people that have moved to the system that were already overburdened the risk is to get 30 systems with 100 players in them instead of 3 with 400 and 180 with 10 players.
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