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Durin Sarga
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Posted - 2010.06.17 17:34:00 -
[1]
So with the advent of Planetary Interaction the catch phrase was:
'What will you do when all these planets are yours?'
At which point I said 'cool' or 'sweet'. Then my second thought hit. This is oddly inconsistent.
Mining asteroids is a competitive market and CCP has given plenty of opportunities for enterprising individuals to make ISK, even while staying in 'carebear' space. You do some scanning, find a grav site, find an unoccupied WH grav site, etc. Or you just mine the Veldspar (Cause you know you like it). Hell, it's even required for some Agent missions.
However moon mining has very little competition along these same lines. Null-sec and Low-sec moons of value are already occupied or guarded tighter than Fort Knox. Abundance doesn't work, even though it still displays in the scan. On top of this, there is no 'carebear' space equivalent.
Then comes PI where abundance/concentration does work. You scan and find the best spot for the specific resource you want and, based on your setup, can extract quite a bit. There is no barrier to entry other than skill training and a little ISK. There is a 'carebear' space equivalent. Even though the extracting sucks, it's still something for those who want to know what it's all about.
So I'm a little confused here. Is 'all' of this stuff really ours? If so, why not let us mine moons in hi-sec or W-space? If not, then why are the four Empires not giving us access to all the hi-sec planets?
This is not a whine thread or 'fix it' thread. I was just wondering if anyone else had the same/similar thoughts when they heard the tagline for the Tyrannis expansion.
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LHA Tarawa
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Posted - 2010.06.17 18:02:00 -
[2]
Planitary intereaction is a first step for connecting Dust514 to Eve.
They are making a first person shooter that will take place on the planets. We'll hire the players of DUST514 to go blow up the extractors of that other guy on my planet so that I can get better use of the key resource that his extractors are sucking up.
No moon mining high sec because they want to encourage people to go to low sec and have 500 v. 500 cap fights to control the few moons that produce the most rare (and therefore most valuable) bits of moon goo.
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Durin Sarga
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Posted - 2010.06.17 18:28:00 -
[3]
Right.
So if we're encouraging MORE fighting. Then wouldn't it make sense to have PI be only low/null sec too?
That way we have fighting in space along with fighting on the ground. Someone cyno's a capital in and hot drops 50 DUST514 players onto the surface. Capitals then duke it out with space forces while battle rages down on planet surface. If unsuccessful on the ground, the capital retracts it's troops and leaves. If unsuccessful in the air, then DUST players 'surrender'?
If we're wanting players to stay in hi-sec to help with DUST then why limit the moons to just low/null?
Asteroids: Anywhere, Anyone, Abundance works Planets: Anywhere, Anyone, Abundance works Moons: Low (<= 0.3)/Null Only, Anyone, Abundance doesn't work
Hmm....one of these things just doesn't belong here
Plus, if we are encouraging more combat, we need more gear, more gear = higher demand for T2 = more moon goo needed.
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Seminole Sun
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Posted - 2010.06.17 19:48:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Durin Sarga Right.
So if we're encouraging MORE fighting. Then wouldn't it make sense to have PI be only low/null sec too?
That way we have fighting in space along with fighting on the ground. Someone cyno's a capital in and hot drops 50 DUST514 players onto the surface. Capitals then duke it out with space forces while battle rages down on planet surface. If unsuccessful on the ground, the capital retracts it's troops and leaves. If unsuccessful in the air, then DUST players 'surrender'?
If we're wanting players to stay in hi-sec to help with DUST then why limit the moons to just low/null?
Asteroids: Anywhere, Anyone, Abundance works Planets: Anywhere, Anyone, Abundance works Moons: Low (<= 0.3)/Null Only, Anyone, Abundance doesn't work
Hmm....one of these things just doesn't belong here
Plus, if we are encouraging more combat, we need more gear, more gear = higher demand for T2 = more moon goo needed.
I think the biggest argument for POS's was that it's very difficult to take down a high-sec POS (requires war-dec and a concerted effort) whereas low-sec (for example) can get harassed constantly until someone misses the defense window and it goes poof.
I don't quite understand the argument for WH's not having moon-goo (other than the system was largely in balance before and would have been thrown wacky by the addition.
I would have preferred a way to allow high-sec POS's but encourage friction (like, a constant war-dec affect for everyone in system who owns a POS).
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Vasundhara
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Posted - 2010.06.17 20:09:00 -
[5]
It's a catch-phrase it doesn't need to be consistent, just sound good.
They want PI to be acessible to a wide range of people so they have a high level of interaction between EvE and Dust as soon as it comes out. I wouldn't try applying any other kind of reasoning to it than that, it's a means to an end to encourage the EvE players to care about and interact with the Dust players. Any major competition within EvE for planets would be a distraction. We will ultimately be forced to depend upon the Dust players for the security of our planetary facilities.
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LHA Tarawa
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Posted - 2010.06.17 23:01:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Durin Sarga
So if we're encouraging MORE fighting. Then wouldn't it make sense to have PI be only low/null sec too?
Unless they intend to give new DUST players a place they can pve (attack EVE player's facilities) without pvp (Being shot by other DUST players.
Or something like that.
There has to be a reason they added it to high sec (even if the production amounts SUCK compared to low sec or 0.0).
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LHA Tarawa
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Posted - 2010.06.17 23:08:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Seminole Sun I think the biggest argument for POS's was that it's very difficult to take down a high-sec POS (requires war-dec and a concerted effort) whereas low-sec (for example) can get harassed constantly until someone misses the defense window and it goes poof.
Misses a defensive window? Not sure what that means.
We show up with a bunch of ships and incapacitate the warp disrupt, stasis and guns. We then pound the station down to 25% shield where it goes into reinforced mode. The POS then tells us exactly what time it comes out of reinforced mode.
They rep the guns and such.
We show up with a bunch of ships, again incap the guns and finish pounding the shield into oblivion. We then unanchor and steal all the other structures.
They can't restront the tower until they've repaired the shields back above 50%. They aren't going to do that if we have enough ships there to kill the logis or carriers that show up to do the repairs.
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Durin Sarga
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Posted - 2010.06.17 23:08:00 -
[8]
Quote: There has to be a reason they added it to high sec
Oh, I know. More lag in Jita
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LHA Tarawa
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Posted - 2010.06.17 23:14:00 -
[9]
Why no moon mining in 0.0?
They want the mega alliances to fight over soverigenty of 0.0 to control the few valuable moons.
Concerned about PI in high sec? Remember, it produces, what? 1/5 to 1/10 what can be built in 0.0?
As for adding lag to Jita, planets in the trade hub systems can't be interacted with.
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Olleybear
I R' Carebear
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Posted - 2010.06.18 00:05:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Durin Sarga
...'What will you do when all these planets are yours?'...
...why not let us mine moons in hi-sec or W-space?
...If we're wanting players to stay in hi-sec to help with DUST then why limit the moons to just low/null?...
The catch phrase is simply a marketing term to drum up excitement. Nothing more.
Moon minig in low/0.0 and not WH space. We can only guess why. My Guess: Back when WH came, POS were still used to claim Sov. in 0.0. Sov. allowed stations. The amount of POS required for Sov. and keep those comfy stations, plus thus the cost of POS fuel, was immense. The alliances needed ISK. Makes sense to not introduce more supply Via WH if you dont want that system collapsing.
CCP wants as many people out of high-sec as possible. They put the better planets in Low/WH/0.0 space. PI in hi-sec is just a taste so people can figure it out when they are new. CCP is trying to encourage people to get out of hi-sec, not keep them there 'to help with Dust'.
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Enthral
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Posted - 2010.06.18 01:51:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Enthral on 18/06/2010 01:52:42 Edited by: Enthral on 18/06/2010 01:51:14 CCP gave us access to PI in high-sec because if they didn't, the carebear whines about how the big alliances get everything and high-sec gets ignored would be louder than an environmentalist screaming at BP about the Gulf oil spill.
Why we don't have access to moons in high-sec is most likely a legacy issue, and they would rather not hear the tears of the alliances how everything is being taken away from 0.0 so they won't have any carebears in 0.0 space to shoot at. I could hear the screams of "Hello Kitty Online" already. Why stir up that hornets nest? (Though it WOULD be nice if they would fix the damn moons already, so we CAN mine the low-end crud in high-sec at appropriate levels for the exceptionally low risk. In fact, it would actually spawn a bunch of high-sec wars, as people try to get the best of the crummy moons. But that is another story.)
As far as CCP wanting to get people out of high-sec, into low-sec, into 0.0, are anything else: I seriously doubt CCP cares the slightest bit where we prefer to play, so long as we're having fun and our credit cards keep charging.
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Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
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Posted - 2010.06.18 11:34:00 -
[12]
When DUST514 comes will hordes of console payers blow every PI setup into bits and pieces, and regardless of anyone hiring them or not. If DUST514 lets players destroy stuff then they will do it just for fun. At that point will many players give up their current PI setups and the prices for all the PI materials will go up.
The reason why some high-sec planets are not accessible is simply because of the amounts of regular players in those system (Jita, Dodixie, etc.), and CCP does not want to have more in there than there already are. --
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Takashi Halamoto
No Limit Productions Looney Toons.
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Posted - 2010.06.18 16:27:00 -
[13]
i would hope that console players will only be able to blow up at whim npc on npc corp action across FW lines, ie Ishukone hitting Roden Shipyards pc networks,
as they stated to do hits on other alliances ships would bring dust marines to planets and launch them down to attack the enemy so i doubt its going to be all pi networks go boom due to console whim Me? im just sitting here,
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