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AtheistOfFail
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Posted - 2010.07.05 15:12:00 -
[1]
Edited by: AtheistOfFail on 05/07/2010 15:13:20 Edited by: AtheistOfFail on 05/07/2010 15:12:50 So you finally got that EvE subscription you wanted and you did all the tutorial missions? And you finally joined a corporation that's active in PvP but you have no idea what to do? Welcome to the beginner's guide to being useful in PvP. Although most new players consider their place in the battlefield to be unneeded and don't think they can help in any way, most of them are wrong. Any player can assist his or her corporation in PvP operations regardless of time ingame, amount of skillpoints or even what class of ship they fly.
This guide is designed to let new players get their feet wet into the art of PvP and allow some of them to continue to other combat activities.
Basic Vocabulary DPS - Damage per second (How much damage a ship can dish out every second) FC - Fleet Commander (the boss, he tells you what to shoot, assist or even when to run) PvP - Player versus Player (attacking other player's ship with the intent to destroy it) Tank - using a set of modules to limit damage to your ship. Scrambler - these short range modules don't allow your enemies to enter warp and disable MWDs. Disruptor - these long range modules don't allow your enemies to enter warp. MWD - Microwarp drive (this module allows your ship to reach speeds up to 500% of the current as long as it is not scrambled by an enemy ship). Pod - Your capsule (rather fragile so don't get caught in a fight in one.
Now, to start off, you will have to deal with a few basic facts of PvP life. 1) You will die (just a matter of when) <- this one's usually number 1 for a few reasons.
- Your ships will often die in a PvP encounter which is why most people recommend YOU SHOULD NOT FLY WHAT YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO REPLACE. Please read the previous line over and over until you understand why.
You should always keep an up-to-date pod (part of the training tutorials) in order to make sure you don't lose skill points in case you suffer a set-back.
2) A fleet is only as strong as it's weakest link (so keep a level head and follow your fleet commander).
- Sometimes the orders they yell out make no sense but they tend to turn out to be the right ones for a victory. This is what differentiates a good fleet commander from a great fleet commander.
3) Get your pod out a fight after your ship is gone. It's not a good idea to stick around even if you think your side is winning.
Now PvP relies on a different type of ships but they are often coupled into 3 categories (DPS <- Also known as damage per second, Tank, and support). Note most ships are a mix of all 3 but excel in one particular part.
-=DPS=-
The big leagues, these ships can pound others into oblivion with extremely high damage and quick firing speed. Most ships do pack some DPS but some are specially fitted to maximize damage on the enemy. (usually cruisers and bigger)
-=Tank=-
These ships are usually used as bait to get people to attack them for your fleet to come in. Although these ships do have some firepower, most of their capabilities come from massive tanks that allow them to withstand increasing amount of damage. (usually battlecruisers and bigger).
I know what you're thinking so far. "But AoF, i only have this little frigate to use otherwise i would break rule number 1". This is true, most new players can only afford to use frigates and would be too broke to replace even 2 cruisers. This is where support roles come in.
-=Support=-
These ships assist others in doing damage by either helping them outlive the damage, keeping the enemies there while damage is being dealt and even limiting the enemies' ability to return fire. These ships are usually the first ones to be targetted but there would be very little PvP without them. Some ships do combine Tank and DPS with support roles but some are dedicated to support roles. Since you are probably going to spend some of your first PvP experience on this, you
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AtheistOfFail
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Posted - 2010.07.05 15:20:00 -
[2]
should familiarize yourself with your race's frigates and continue reading this guide.
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AtheistOfFail
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Posted - 2010.07.05 15:53:00 -
[3]
The Gallente
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Joe Starbreaker
M. Corp
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Posted - 2010.07.05 17:35:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Joe Starbreaker on 05/07/2010 17:36:16 Nice guide. It reminds me a lot of one I wrote a while back, which never got much attention. Only thing I would dispute is your division of PVP fights into DPS, Tank, and Support. That seems like it's taken directly from World of Warcraft or something. In EVE, you can't control who your enemy attacks, so there's really no "Tank" role.
A better classification of PVP roles might be: Bait Tackle E-War Logistics RR (remote rep, short range) BS Fleet (long range) BS
... Join M. Corp, see the Galaxy |
Abbot Laarkin
Order Of Mystical Mountain Monks
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Posted - 2010.07.05 17:39:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Joe Starbreaker.
A better classification of PVP roles might be: Bait Tackle E-War Logistics RR (remote rep, short range) BS Fleet (long range) BS
Why does everyone forget the scouts?
I mean, without us you just fly in circles wondering where the hell everyone went ----
Originally by: Sir Carnage
Originally by: Marko Riva Why does that read like they're all 12 and have an IQ of 37?
I was under the impression they were 37 and had an IQ of 12
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AtheistOfFail
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Posted - 2010.07.05 17:45:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Joe Starbreaker Edited by: Joe Starbreaker on 05/07/2010 17:36:16 Nice guide. It reminds me a lot of one I wrote a while back, which never got much attention. Only thing I would dispute is your division of PVP fights into DPS, Tank, and Support. That seems like it's taken directly from World of Warcraft or something. In EVE, you can't control who your enemy attacks, so there's really no "Tank" role.
A better classification of PVP roles might be: Bait Tackle E-War Logistics RR (remote rep, short range) BS Fleet (long range) BS
Yea, i just made it simpler. Bunched E-War, logi, and tackle into support. Bait into tank and the battleships into DPS. This is designed to a new player guide, not a seasoned player one. I did mention some ships take on dual role so it's not really fair to bunch them all together or separate them.
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Baka Lakadaka
Gallente Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
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Posted - 2010.07.06 02:07:00 -
[7]
Orbiting at 1 or 2km is a bad idea until you establish that there are no smart bombs.
Non-faction smart bombs have a range of about 6km. Scramblers have a range of 7.5km. There's a hint there about what range you should orbit until you establish that smart bombs are not in the equation. ______________________ Agony Unleashed Home of the PvP University |
Beki 250
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Posted - 2010.07.06 11:27:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Beki 250 on 06/07/2010 11:29:46 A couple of thoughts.
I'm really happy to see this article. There may be some semantics issues, but you've made your points very nicely. I'm not an experienced PvPer, but I've done a few roams, and your description of the roles and responsibilities is very good.
One thing I'd like to see is a little more respect for the T1 frigates that make the effort to get involved. One corporation I was with had very little to no respect for the T1s. They wanted everything to be either a T2 ship, or a battle ship. As you said, most people who are new to the game and take the PvP route can't afford those types of ships, but they can still contribute while they build up ISK and SPs.
I'm curious about the 1-2 km orbit range, though. I had to build a short range frigate today for a mission. I picked an Atron. With the AB on I wasn't able to orbit any closer than 4500 meters. The character only had Spaceship Command III and Evasive Maneuvering III and no Inertia Stabilizer or Nanofiber Internals. Is a 1-2 km orbit possible for an Atron? If so, which skill(s) or module(s) make the most difference?
Edit:
I almost forgot. When I cut the afterburners in order to get in closer, I was no longer able to hit the target (Arbitrator). I was using two Neutron Blasters (The expensive ones.) ?? What can I do to reduce the effects of transverse velocity? |
Ulmagod
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Posted - 2010.07.06 13:54:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Beki 250 When I cut the afterburners in order to get in closer, I was no longer able to hit the target (Arbitrator). I was using two Neutron Blasters (The expensive ones.) ?? What can I do to reduce the effects of transverse velocity?
Be aware that the Arbitrator has bonus' for Tracking Disruptors and many will fit two of them in PvP. Cutting the afterburners - I assume you mean switching them off, should have improved your tracking, if it got worse that was a coincidence that you have misread, was the target engaging more than one of you? Possibly he switched to you as you slowed and got closer.
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AtheistOfFail
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Posted - 2010.07.06 14:06:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Beki 250 Edited by: Beki 250 on 06/07/2010 11:29:46 A couple of thoughts.
I'm really happy to see this article. There may be some semantics issues, but you've made your points very nicely. I'm not an experienced PvPer, but I've done a few roams, and your description of the roles and responsibilities is very good.
One thing I'd like to see is a little more respect for the T1 frigates that make the effort to get involved. One corporation I was with had very little to no respect for the T1s. They wanted everything to be either a T2 ship, or a battle ship. As you said, most people who are new to the game and take the PvP route can't afford those types of ships, but they can still contribute while they build up ISK and SPs.
I'm curious about the 1-2 km orbit range, though. I had to build a short range frigate today for a mission. I picked an Atron. With the AB on I wasn't able to orbit any closer than 4500 meters. The character only had Spaceship Command III and Evasive Maneuvering III and no Inertia Stabilizer or Nanofiber Internals. Is a 1-2 km orbit possible for an Atron? If so, which skill(s) or module(s) make the most difference?
Edit:
I almost forgot. When I cut the afterburners in order to get in closer, I was no longer able to hit the target (Arbitrator). I was using two Neutron Blasters (The expensive ones.) ?? What can I do to reduce the effects of transverse velocity?
The power of t1 frigates is not to be questioned, i would link a t3 kill with only frigates but i think the rules don't allow it.
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Mannheim Wolf
Caldari Team KickAss
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Posted - 2010.07.06 15:44:00 -
[11]
Just a note: Exequror is the gallente T1 logistics cruiser :D --- Always outnumbered. Most likely outgunned. Never outsmarted.
~Wolf |
Beki 250
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Posted - 2010.07.07 01:40:00 -
[12]
Looks like I left half the explanation out again. Sorry. I was running a mission (can't remember the name) and the Arbitrator was the last enemy ship left. The rest of them were actually pretty easy.
I didn't think about it at the time, but it seems that I read that the tighter the orbit gets the more transverse velocity YOU have, too. I could see overcoming that with skills or modules that give you better tracking speed. I think I should have actually expected to reach an orbit size where I couldn't hit
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Bronya Boga
Skyforger Tactical Narcotics Team
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Posted - 2010.07.07 04:07:00 -
[13]
Originally by: AtheistOfFail Edited by: AtheistOfFail on 05/07/2010 18:18:57 Amarr -> Augoror (capacitor) Caldari -> Osprey (shields) Gallente -> Thorax (armor) Minmatar -> Scythe (tracking links)
/me hopes for a kind GM to sticky this
yes well its not the thorax my friend, its the exequror
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AtheistOfFail
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Posted - 2010.07.07 04:20:00 -
[14]
Thank you. Updated with current info.
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Gorenaire
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Posted - 2010.07.07 19:46:00 -
[15]
Don't forget to mention how to setup your overview correctly so you don't end up shooting your gangmates, also how to get out as fast as possible out of the battlefield once you're in your pod. New players once their ship is destroyed dont have the reflex to target some celestial objects and mash the warp button asap so they are back at the cloning station .
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Fallen Kell
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Posted - 2010.07.07 20:41:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Beki 250 I didn't think about it at the time, but it seems that I read that the tighter the orbit gets the more transverse velocity YOU have, too. I could see overcoming that with skills or modules that give you better tracking speed.
This is a game mechanic that I think is wrong. If you are orbiting in a tight orbit, the same side of your ship will be pointed at the enemy ship (more or less). Which means, once your guns align with the enemy ship, the movement of your own ship in keeping the enemy ship in the same approximate alignment would mean that your guns don't need to move as much to stay aimed (as your ship's orientation is assisting).
I mean think about it. If you are performing a perfect circle around a fixed point in space, all you need to do is turn the turrets in a 90 degree angle perpendicular to your movement towards the side that your are turning and they will always be aimed directly at the center of the circle and you don't have to move them at all (like a radius of the circle).
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Baka Lakadaka
Gallente Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
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Posted - 2010.07.09 15:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Fallen Kell
Originally by: Beki 250 I didn't think about it at the time, but it seems that I read that the tighter the orbit gets the more transverse velocity YOU have, too. I could see overcoming that with skills or modules that give you better tracking speed.
This is a game mechanic that I think is wrong. If you are orbiting in a tight orbit, the same side of your ship will be pointed at the enemy ship (more or less). Which means, once your guns align with the enemy ship, the movement of your own ship in keeping the enemy ship in the same approximate alignment would mean that your guns don't need to move as much to stay aimed (as your ship's orientation is assisting).
I mean think about it. If you are performing a perfect circle around a fixed point in space, all you need to do is turn the turrets in a 90 degree angle perpendicular to your movement towards the side that your are turning and they will always be aimed directly at the center of the circle and you don't have to move them at all (like a radius of the circle).
Real world physics don't always apply in Eve. This may seem incorrect, but it actually works to balance the game. ______________________ Agony Unleashed Home of the PvP University |
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