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Eragon Recart
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Posted - 2010.07.25 03:00:00 -
[1]
Ok, so we all know that we can control weither our drones are passive or aggressive, weither or not they focus fire, and etc. Well, how about a system that allows you to set criteria for your drones to follow when being attacked? For example, the other day I lost a Kronos the other day in a mission because i couldn't warp out. Now, what if you could tell your drones to attack the smallest enemy shooting at you first? so, instead of having to target those small frigates in a Battleship, they'll just go after those first and let you focus on the bigger enemies or on aligning so you can get outta there before your backside gets whooped.
What's your opinions
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Urgg Boolean
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Posted - 2010.07.25 03:36:00 -
[2]
Yup, drone AI is the opposite of intelligent. There are so many problems with it. Worse than just limited, and at times can be down right counter productive.
Yes - we need to be able to specify rules of engagement for our drones, or at least specify target priorities, like "attack scramming frigs first", "return to bay when shield has 15% remaining".
I think they would worry that with robust drone AI, we could AFK missions and such. But guess what, BattleClinic has many Loadout designs for AFKing L4 missions in a Rattlesnake, via the ship's huge passive shield tank, and s strategy of 1 armor reppers per drone.
Certainly, with a little thought, drone AI could be greatly improved without encouraging any AFK play styles.
I'd be happy with additional hot keys assignable to defined groups of drones.
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Saelie
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Posted - 2010.07.25 08:18:00 -
[3]
I've got more than one proposal in here for more advanced drone AI, but there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of interest in it. Most people just don't seem to care.
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darius mclever
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Posted - 2010.07.25 14:02:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Eragon Recart Ok, so we all know that we can control weither our drones are passive or aggressive, weither or not they focus fire, and etc. Well, how about a system that allows you to set criteria for your drones to follow when being attacked? For example, the other day I lost a Kronos the other day in a mission because i couldn't warp out.
I doubt that it would have saved you.
Quote: Now, what if you could tell your drones to attack the smallest enemy shooting at you first? so, instead of having to target those small frigates in a Battleship, they'll just go after those first and let you focus on the bigger enemies or on aligning so you can get outta there before your backside gets whooped.
smaller drones will go for smaller targets first and bigger drones for bigger targets. even if your bigger drones went for the tackling frigate first they might have had a very hard time to kill it in time for warping out. so if you had some ogre II or hammerhead II out, you would have wanted to switch down to hobgoblins anyway, to kill those tackling frigates fast.
Quote: What's your opinions
1. use the e-war indicator on the overview. I guess you missed the tackling frigate on you and just noticed it when you had to run. just as in pvp. any kind of e-war has to be killed first.
2. drones should require some micro managing for best effectiveness. Good micro managing of drones is what differs good drone users from the bad ones.
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Tarasina
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Posted - 2010.07.25 19:35:00 -
[5]
Would be nice if we could tell drones the attack order, frigate-size first, then cruisers, BC and last BS (and structure turrets somewhere in there).
A priority list.
Drones need to enter the future.
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Gray Pawn
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Posted - 2010.07.25 20:16:00 -
[6]
Drones already "sense danger" and auto attack ships which are attacking you. Why not be able to set them to engage ships depending on type and behavior? Beyond the suggestions that good drone control should require physical skill, or that no one cares about drones beyond how they exist now, can anyone think of ways that giving drone such abilities could unbalance the game or be exploited? Like one poster said, there are already AFK mission drone ships. So what are the real drawbacks?
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Spazdaro
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Posted - 2010.07.25 20:40:00 -
[7]
so you want to kill every thing in the pocket with your drones while your ship tanks everything and the dones go around and kill everything? how about you do a little work like your turret ship friends and manually target and tell your drones to kill things if they start to go after the wrong things?
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Gray Pawn
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Posted - 2010.07.25 21:10:00 -
[8]
Auto-running level 4 missions already occurs in game.
I personally fly a Tempest and I use my guns and cruise missles along with my drones. All I'd like to do is set my drones to priority levels and have the drones all attack the same target. In other words; I would set first priority to ships which web/scram/neut/etc., second priority would be frigates, third priority would be cruisers, fourth priority would be battleships, etc. Obviously, you could control your drones exactly as you do now. The difference is, instead of having five drones get split up over three random targets when you destroy a target, your drones would all go after the same ship of the type you pre-designated.
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Caldari 5
Amarr The Element Syndicate Hand That Feeds
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Posted - 2010.07.26 00:34:00 -
[9]
Yes Drone AI is in serious need of a revamp, agreed that they currently apear to have some kind of priority, normally attacking the trigger ships first. Normally my drones try to solo Battleships. Yet Everytime I do that flamming Damsel in distress mission, I can't stop the drones from attacking Krull, and Krull is a Cruiser/BC.
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Cyrus Doul
Infinite Covenant
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Posted - 2010.07.26 14:40:00 -
[10]
oh yes. If you guys think your drones are bad. wait till you get into a carrier. those fighters are PILOTED and they are even more ******ed then regular ones. as far as i can tell they only ever attack things ewaring you unless you tell them to.
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Eragon Recart
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Posted - 2010.08.11 00:00:00 -
[11]
The drones either need to be able to learn who we want them to attack first, or we need to be able to give them criteria. maybe a script that we insert into the drone(like the tracking computers) that tells them who to attack first. It'd use the skill Drone Intelligence Scripting.
Drone Intelligence Scripting 20% increase that drones will follow additional scripting per level with a 100% at level 5.
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Ydyp Ieva
Caldari Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2010.08.11 07:34:00 -
[12]
So requesting more complex drone AI, when they can't keep the current working? No thanks the settings we got are enough, I don't have any problems with my drones except that they don't respond on direct commands from time to time or just ignore the target I set them on and return to their previous one.
And fighters are indeed fully borked as I still haven't found to much of a pattern when they auto-attack in aggressive behaviour. ---------------------------------- None of yet! |
it440
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Posted - 2010.08.11 08:57:00 -
[13]
drones already have aggresive option which is alot already, excluding fof missles you cant turn on weapons module and they auto target and fire, drones are just another weapons system that need to be activated on selected target. do we want to start eve and sit back and watch ai do everything for us?
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Slimy Worm
Cyan Wolf
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Posted - 2010.08.11 09:22:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Slimy Worm on 11/08/2010 09:23:36
Originally by: Eragon Recart the other day I lost a Kronos the other day in a mission because I didn't tell my drones to attack the warp scrammer
Fixed for you
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Eragon Recart
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Posted - 2010.08.11 13:55:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Eragon Recart on 11/08/2010 14:01:16 Slimy, dont twist my words around and think your being cute.
Well, back on topic. The AI wont be doing everything for us. What im thinking of wont be much different than setting up a ship to tank a mission, aggroing the entire pocket, launching drones, and sitting back and relaxing. This will just have your drones attack a certain target first, you have to do all the other stuff, it'll just make the drones a wee bit smarter.
Like i said earlier, maybe a skill that let's us set a script into the drone that tells it who it's primary target is(frigate, cruiser, etc.). the higher that skill is, the more chance your drones will follow that script before it's basic AI functions.
It isnt like im suggesting that we have scripts for the ships that tell it to go out and mine, mission, pvp for us.
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Ydyp Ieva
Caldari Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2010.08.11 14:02:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Ydyp Ieva on 11/08/2010 14:05:04
Originally by: Eragon Recart Slimy, dont twist my words around and think your being cute.
Well, back on topic. The AI wont be doing everything for us. What im thinking of wont be much different than setting up a ship to tank a mission, aggroing the entire pocket, launching drones, and sitting back and relaxing. This will just have your drones attack a certain target first, you have to do all the other stuff, it'll just make the drones a wee bit smarter.
Like i said earlier, maybe a skill that let's us set a script into the drone that tells it who it's primary target is(frigate, cruiser, etc.). the higher that skill is, the more chance your drones will follow that script before it's basic AI functions.
And before you know it you get rogue drones, when you tweak to much with their AI. Oh wait Gallente already got that part covert.
The AI is enough, at least once they fixed it to work again as intended.
And Slimy is right, CCP gave you the option to set your drones on that scrambling frigate if it was in your way. So it was YOU being lazy instead of using the options available to you. ---------------------------------- None of yet! |
Eragon Recart
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Posted - 2010.08.12 02:15:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Eragon Recart on 12/08/2010 02:18:35
Originally by: Ydyp Ieva Edited by: Ydyp Ieva on 11/08/2010 14:05:04 [And Slimy is right, CCP gave you the option to set your drones on that scrambling frigate if it was in your way. So it was YOU being lazy instead of using the options available to you.
I wasn't being lazy. I only just found out i was jammed by the time i knew i needed to get out, but the 14 seconds it took for my **** to target the frigate was too long. If you want to turn the forum into a hate fest, go ahead. But keep it off this forum. The title of this forum isn't 'Your thoughts on how you think Eragon REALLY lost his ship'.
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Ydyp Ieva
Caldari Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2010.08.12 06:16:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Eragon Recart Edited by: Eragon Recart on 12/08/2010 02:47:02 Edited by: Eragon Recart on 12/08/2010 02:18:35
Originally by: Ydyp Ieva Edited by: Ydyp Ieva on 11/08/2010 14:05:04 [And Slimy is right, CCP gave you the option to set your drones on that scrambling frigate if it was in your way. So it was YOU being lazy instead of using the options available to you.
I wasn't being lazy. I only just found out i was jammed by the time i knew i needed to get out, but the 14 seconds it took for my ship to target the frigate was too long. If you want to turn the forum into a hate fest, go ahead. But keep it off this forum. The title of this forum isn't 'Your thoughts on how you think Eragon REALLY lost his ship'.
It hasn't anything to do with hate, just for players asking to dumb down the game after they get in an easy to avoid situation as this. You could have checked your overview for scrambler icons and blown up those frigates in the first place. I remember times where we didn't had those icons and had to know the names of possible scramblers and blow them up first.
I'm all for progression, but not in those ways the game can be automated to much. If you don't like micromanaging drones, then don't fly a droneboat. Oh wait a gunboat or missile boat also has to decide what to shoot first, and they don't have the option to just go full tank and let their weapons do the job after aggroing the whole pocket. Except perhaps a fof missileboat, but their dps is mostly not enough to kill everything. ---------------------------------- None of yet! |
Avion Saberis
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.08.12 06:37:00 -
[19]
personally i feel that drones are okay as they are. Though usually when i have a group of drones with me, i don't try to get close to my enemy and snipe them out on my myrm. (Drone sniper oh, yea!) The big thing about drones is you have to keep on top on what they are killing, and you have to look out for whats attacking you. I mostly use small and medium drones, just cause i don't face too many BS, and even if i do, my mediums are t2 and ripe through there hp like crazy.
Maybe the drones are a little messed up, but i usually don't notice it. Though i guess it depends on how you play this game. -------------------------------------------
I like to hide, then when the right moment comes, i go pew, pew, pew, then i go back to hiding, :) |
Caldari 5
Amarr The Element Syndicate Hand That Feeds
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Posted - 2010.08.12 07:37:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Ydyp Ieva If you don't like micromanaging drones, then don't fly a droneboat. Oh wait a gunboat or missile boat also has to decide what to shoot first, and they don't have the option to just go full tank and let their weapons do the job after aggroing the whole pocket. Except perhaps a fof missileboat, but their dps is mostly not enough to kill everything.
I would just like my drones to shoot what I have targeted, not run off on their own and shoot whatever the hell they want. Unless I happen to be Jammed, they they can continue to shoot what they want(hopefully the Jammer)
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Dr Karsun
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.08.12 22:04:00 -
[21]
AFKing level 4 missions is not really a problem, since people do it already (I admit it, I did it a long time ago when I was still running a lot of missions), just dual rep domi with right hards and cap stableness and launch your drones. Work a bit on the agents, get only serpentis blockades and tehy will never even aggro your drones, just use the stopper to measure time till you have to come back to farm it, not blow the last BS.
So, as we've got the afk mission running problem solved since it won't get any worse... Advanced drone AI would benefit everyone in pvp combat. For example being able to set a lot of cryteria for their attack... Or even if they just LISTENED to when you order them to 'focus fire', that'd help... Usually drones in pvp combat scatter them selves and shoot everything after 2-3 ships killed or they do nothing at all...
Give drones love. Stop boosting industry and think a bit of the drone interface (or rather the lack of it). Make drones a real, nice weapon and allow people to use f-keys to use them like weapons.
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Di Mulle
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Posted - 2010.08.13 00:16:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Eragon Recart Edited by: Eragon Recart on 12/08/2010 02:47:02
I wasn't being lazy. I only just found out i was jammed by the time i knew i needed to get out, but the 14 seconds it took for my ship to target the frigate was too long.
You chose big ship which is slow to target frigates. That is all. That is how it should be.
Originally by: Eragon Recart Edited by: Eragon Recart on 12/08/2010 02:47:02
If you want to turn the forum into a hate fest, go ahead. But keep it off this forum. The title of this forum isn't 'Your thoughts on how you think Eragon REALLY lost his ship'.
This forum title neither is "How to eliminate core EVE features because I want everything easy".
That said, drone control needs some serious love. But not for the purposes you say, and not in the way you say.
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SXYGeeK
Gallente do you -Mostly Harmless-
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Posted - 2010.08.13 17:26:00 -
[23]
What I would like to see for drone control is improvements to make it easier for us to micromanage the drones. the ability to assign groups of drones to a hotkey (like a fitting slot) so that we can send to attack and recall groups of drones on a target just like we are activating and deactivating a module. the ability to setup hotkeys to launch and dock groups of drones so we can switch out drone types without fudling through accordion menu's in the drone window.
as far as the AI goes, drones are already very powerful autonomous killing machines. I ran two plexes recently where we warped in a tank, warped in a remote repper, then 3 drone boats. establish tank, launch all drones and set to defend tank. then afk as the entire plex is wiped clean by ruthless drones.
maybe if the AI for the rats where more powerfull it would warrent more powerfull drone AI... -We So SeXy |
Alazontez Gallenteur
Gallente Wolf-Monkey Bastards WolfMonkey Bastards
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Posted - 2010.08.13 19:56:00 -
[24]
Honestly they just need to fix the damned AI so the drones actually work as intended. I can't tell you how many times I've issued the return to drone bay order with my hotkey and sat there watching my drones show "Returning" in the little drone menu they the still orbit and shoot their target for anywhere between 10 sec and 2 minutes (literally had this happen for two minutes before) before finally start to come back. A lot of Ogre II's have met their demise because of this.
There's also serious issues with the focus fire option when using aggressive behavior. And like others said, why do drones go for the trigger like 9 times out of 10.
And don't get me started on fighters.
---------------------------------------------- There is no honor in war, only victory and defeat
Not needing a fleet and not bringing a fleet are 2 completely different things. - Lana Torrin |
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