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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Faolan Fortune
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Posted - 2010.08.17 14:29:00 -
[1]
Okay so this has probably been suggested a few dozen times, it's not the most original idea and I don't know how popular the idea is because I searched but couldn't find any previous posts on this. So I'm just throwing this out here, flame or post constructive feedback at will
Basically the Primae description reads:
Quote: Initially devised as a deep space salvage vessel for large-scale ore retrieval from destroyed ORE fleets in pirate-occupied areas, its previous incarnation was made all but obsolete by the arrival of capsuleers on the interstellar scene
Capsuleers all but made this ship obsolete? Bull, we fly ships in game that are at least a few decades old. So just like it's PI modification, I think there should be another version of this ship with it's original purpose in mind of deep space salvage (Another version so we still have the ever so special PI Primae). We already have an awesome unique model, all it needs is a different texture to the Primae we have now and that's it, a brand new ship class. So the art part is pretty much done.
As for fittings, well we'd need 8 hi slots to fit 5 tractor beams and 3 salvagers, of course there wouldn't be any turret or launcher hardpoints so this ship would be no pwnmobile. I don't know about low slots or mid slots, but some defensive systems and cargo space would be a huge plus.
As for ship bonuses, well maybe something along the lines of increased tractor beam range/velocity with each level, maybe even an increased salvage chance with each level?
As for skills/prerequisites I'm honestly not sure, the Primae is similar in mass and volume to a Battlecruiser/Mining Barge, so maybe something you can't get on day one but nothing hard to get.
Of course why a dedicated salvage ship when we have Destroyers and Marauders?
- Destroyers and Marauders don't have a huge cargo space, the salvage Primae could be fitted with a generous hold
- Marauders are missioning ships, not exactly something disposable you can take into wormholes or 0.0
- Destroyers have no ship bonuses to salvaging in any way and the Marauder only has a tractor beam bonus
- Wouldn't a real ship version of the Primae be awesome? I mean, it's a really nice ship that's hardly used... seems like such a waste
Like I said, none of this would affect the current Primae present we have now, and a dedicated 'deep space' salvage ship wouldn't be so bad.
So thoughts, suggestions, flames?
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Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
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Posted - 2010.08.17 16:17:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Jint Hikaru on 17/08/2010 16:20:02 I agree!
I would be happy with a destroyer slot layout, with a little more tank (its an ORE mobile after all, they have experience in building ships that can fly in roid fields) and a larger hold (than a destroyer).
A bonus to tractor range/speed like the Orca.
Not sure if salvaging chance is necessary, I think that should stay as it is.
I would sure use one as a salvage/looting ship when I am running missions.
Edit: I own 2 Primae ships and they wont leave the station because they have no use appart from being a grief magnet! All that work on such a great design wasted on simply spinning it in the station.
------------------------ Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer "I've got a couple of Strippers on my ship... and they just love to dance!" ------------------------ |
Scorpionidae
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Posted - 2010.08.17 16:28:00 -
[3]
I like this idea but why not use the frigates: Navitas, Burst, Bantam and Tormentor, because they are the only frigs that don't have T2 versions (other then faction frigs) I know they are used for mining but maybe that be cool.
Sorry for spellings and all that.
Scorpionidae
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Sly Nasty
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Posted - 2010.08.18 11:20:00 -
[4]
I love this idea as well. But I'd prefer one ORE ship, I just love the designs. I'm thinking a sledge-shaped design, maybe with some sort of array for focusing tractor beams. I think I should have tractor beam range and speed bonuses, salvage bonuses, and a T2 version with better tank. Maybe something like a 1000m3 cargo hold.
Also, a change to the way wrecks work. When a mission is ended, the wrecks from the mission become abandoned, or when a wreck has been floating in space for a period of time, it becomes abandoned. Abandoned wrecks can be scanned down using a ships onboard scanner. But, also, when a wreck becomes abandoned it has a change of attracting NPC rats. You quite suddenly cause salvaging to become its own profession as opposed to something people do when they want additional isk.
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Oliver Stoned
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2010.08.18 21:34:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Sly Nasty I love this idea as well. But I'd prefer one ORE ship, I just love the designs. I'm thinking a sledge-shaped design, maybe with some sort of array for focusing tractor beams. I think I should have tractor beam range and speed bonuses, salvage bonuses, and a T2 version with better tank. Maybe something like a 1000m3 cargo hold.
Also, a change to the way wrecks work. When a mission is ended, the wrecks from the mission become abandoned, or when a wreck has been floating in space for a period of time, it becomes abandoned. Abandoned wrecks can be scanned down using a ships onboard scanner. But, also, when a wreck becomes abandoned it has a change of attracting NPC rats. You quite suddenly cause salvaging to become its own profession as opposed to something people do when they want additional isk.
I approve of this idea!
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CCP t0rfifrans
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Posted - 2010.08.18 23:19:00 -
[6]
This is a pretty good idea. If I didn't know better, I'd think you have a spy in our ranks ;-)...
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Ambaseter Doggy
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Posted - 2010.08.18 23:22:00 -
[7]
DEV DOUBLE POST YEA Agent texas is a bit of a badass |
AtheistOfFail
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.08.18 23:48:00 -
[8]
Originally by: CCP t0rfifrans This is a pretty good idea. If I didn't know better, I'd think you have a spy in our ranks ;-)...
That almost looks like... *puts on sunglasses* CCP Likes this. YEEEEEEA!
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2010.08.19 02:05:00 -
[9]
Most salvagers are ninjas who take loot and go flashy to the person they were stealing from.
I have no real opinion on that matter of things. It's an old and popular topic (the missioner versus ninja thing).
But the decision to fire on a ninja is an important one, mainly because they tend to keep a combat ship PWNMobile in the system and they relish in ganking the heck out of the missioner.
Thus, when one decides to shoot the ninja, there should be many options open to the missioner and, while there are variable reasons, the best reason is to get back a mission target (damsels for example).
If a dedicated salvaging vessel has a tank capability, this option is reduced considerably. A missioner should have the option to take the risk of shooting the ninja and getting that mission objective or piece of important loot and then getting the heck out of there. If this is a dedicated tanking salvager, then it's just one more tool for ninjas and griefers to ninja and grief easier, and one more avenue of stacking the deck against missioners.
Hopefully, if there ever is a dedicated salvage ship, it should have no more tank than a Hulk. Give the missioners a chance to pop that ship and get the loot and run before the friends of the ninja show up (which is usually the plan). If the missioner is choosing to take that course of action and still not able to do it, then that is nobody's problem.
I like the idea but please, hold the tank. Should be as easy to pop as a Hulk.
It's only fair - through the application of equal risk/consequence - something everybody prides themselves on (as if it mattered in the real world).
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Alexander Vallen
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.08.19 02:32:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Herzog Wolfhammer
I like the idea but please, hold the tank. Should be as easy to pop as a Hulk.
It's only fair - through the application of equal risk/consequence - something everybody prides themselves on (as if it mattered in the real world).
I like this idea. Seconded.
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Allestin Villimar
Zebra Corp
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Posted - 2010.08.19 02:46:00 -
[11]
I'd like to see one for sure. Maybe something like 20% bonus to tractor beam range/velocity per level, 20% cargo hold per level. 8 highs, 3 mids, and 3 lows.
Also, salvager drones would be awesome. ...in bed. |
Faolan Fortune
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Posted - 2010.08.19 09:20:00 -
[12]
Originally by: CCP t0rfifrans This is a pretty good idea. If I didn't know better, I'd think you have a spy in our ranks ;-)...
Man... well I didn't expect this kind of reply. There maybe a spy, and he might be ordered to send a few truckloads of beer to you guys if this idea became a reality
But seriously I just think the Primae is such a nice ship that looks like it should be in use as much as the other ORE ships and I've always been for the idea of a salvage dedicated ship. The model doesn't need to be changed, you don't even need to add hardpoints as is the nature of tractor beams, salvagers etc effects.
As for ninja salvaging and giving it a good tank... well I honestly don't know. I figured I could suggest things like an increased cargo size per level but fewer low slots and maybe one mid slot... but with t0rfifrans response I'm not sure if there's much point
I just hope if this ship turns out to be a reality, they retexture it with a red theme... I've been watching a lot of Red Dwarf lately, I even called my Incursus 'Starbug'...
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CCP t0rfifrans
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Posted - 2010.08.19 10:00:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Faolan Fortune
But seriously I just think the Primae is such a nice ship that looks like it should be in use as much as the other ORE ships and I've always been for the idea of a salvage dedicated ship. The model doesn't need to be changed, you don't even need to add hardpoints as is the nature of tractor beams, salvagers etc effects.
Indeed, it's a really cool ship and goes to show how far our in-house artist have come in crafting realistic and stylish space assets. I'm not making any promises about stats or fittings related to your post, but all I can say that designers are looking at that very ship and considering salvaging options and thinking about attributes that make sense and are balanced yet interesting and gratifying.
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Faolan Fortune
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Posted - 2010.08.19 10:24:00 -
[14]
Originally by: CCP t0rfifrans
Originally by: Faolan Fortune
But seriously I just think the Primae is such a nice ship that looks like it should be in use as much as the other ORE ships and I've always been for the idea of a salvage dedicated ship. The model doesn't need to be changed, you don't even need to add hardpoints as is the nature of tractor beams, salvagers etc effects.
Indeed, it's a really cool ship and goes to show how far our in-house artist have come in crafting realistic and stylish space assets. I'm not making any promises about stats or fittings related to your post, but all I can say that designers are looking at that very ship and considering salvaging options and thinking about attributes that make sense and are balanced yet interesting and gratifying.
I'm happy as long as the ship is used, I'm an artist myself so when it comes to fittings/attributes... anything involving maths and calculations I just make wild guesses at best, but I figured it could generate some good ol theory crafting from others. Nothing more fun than inventing a new ship after all.
I'm guessing this is the new kind of art style you'll be doing with the rest of the ships? It's pretty damn nice and distinctive.
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Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
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Posted - 2010.08.19 12:24:00 -
[15]
Its great to see some feedback in a thread like this, many thanks CCP t0rfifrans.
I look forward to the new ship!
------------------------ Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer "I've got a couple of Strippers on my ship... and they just love to dance!" ------------------------ |
Razar51
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Posted - 2010.08.20 01:29:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Razar51 on 20/08/2010 01:29:23 yay for feedback!! keep it up please
yay for 'possible more uses for nice ship hulls
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Kobe Sun
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Posted - 2010.08.22 05:05:00 -
[17]
I totally support OP's idea for the most part.
Instead of having no weapons I think 1 weapon slot is necessary. Lets say you just cleared Blockade and you go back with your new Primae to tidy up the 50 or so wrecks. You start salvaging a parasite shows up. You can't possibly salvage all the wrecks before a parasite helps himself to some of the wrecks. I say let the mission runner have 1 weapon so he can destroy as many wrecks as possible.
Every time a player goes into battle he risks his ship and mods. A parasite that just shows up to grab wrecks risked nothing. That's just too lob sided. A player should always have the abilty to destroy the fruits of his labour to deny a parasite an easy meal.
We can get into a long discussion about what type of turret or launcher to put on the ship and what's too powerful ecetera but we can keep it simple. The Primae is a ORE ship. ORE is not a military corp. The Civilian Gatling/Railgun/Pulse turret fits. The Primae can be given bonuses to boost the range of the Civilian gun to 60km with just enough punch to destroy any wreck or can in one hit.
I also like the idea of salvage drones being exclusive to the salvage Primae. |
AtheistOfFail
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.08.22 05:31:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Kobe Sun I totally support OP's idea for the most part.
Instead of having no weapons I think 1 weapon slot is necessary. Lets say you just cleared Blockade and you go back with your new Primae to tidy up the 50 or so wrecks. You start salvaging a parasite shows up. You can't possibly salvage all the wrecks before a parasite helps himself to some of the wrecks. I say let the mission runner have 1 weapon so he can destroy as many wrecks as possible.
Every time a player goes into battle he risks his ship and mods. A parasite that just shows up to grab wrecks risked nothing. That's just too lob sided. A player should always have the abilty to destroy the fruits of his labour to deny a parasite an easy meal.
We can get into a long discussion about what type of turret or launcher to put on the ship and what's too powerful ecetera but we can keep it simple. The Primae is a ORE ship. ORE is not a military corp. The Civilian Gatling/Railgun/Pulse turret fits. The Primae can be given bonuses to boost the range of the Civilian gun to 60km with just enough punch to destroy any wreck or can in one hit.
I also like the idea of salvage drones being exclusive to the salvage Primae.
Ninja salvager whines are that way ----->
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Nebbeshim
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Posted - 2010.08.22 07:05:00 -
[19]
I'm pretty sure you can fit out a tengu with extended tractor range. All they'd need to do is make a subsystem that makes your cargo hold large enough for it to be worthwhile! Yeah! Salvage Tengu!
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Guilliman R
Gallente Northstar Cabal R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2010.08.22 07:05:00 -
[20]
Originally by: CCP t0rfifrans This is a pretty good idea. If I didn't know better, I'd think you have a spy in our ranks ;-)...
Lovely Idea!
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Alara IonStorm
Agent-Orange
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Posted - 2010.08.22 10:05:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Scorpionidae Navitas, Burst, Bantam and Tormentor, because they are the only frigs that don't have T2
Awsome Idea about the Primea, mine sits in the hanger where I got it, took it out once for a Victory Lap(Yay Eye Candy).
Also a tech 2 Bantam exist it was called the Sparrow, it gets Mercoxit minning bonuses. It was removed from the game at the last minute.
There is a way to get it and other ships like it, to appear in the fittings window. Go to notepad(out of game) and copy and paste in
<?xml version="1.0" ?> <fittings> <fitting name="Some name"> <description value=""/> <shipType value="Sparrow"/> </fitting> </fittings>
Then Save it as an .XML in the EVE documents folder labeled fittings. There are a lot of concept ships out there. To name a few, replace Sparrow with any of the following names.
SOCT Cruiser Regulator Elite Raven faction prophecy bloodraider Obsidian Glaive Infested Dominix Dagger Concord Police Cruiser
Tactical Responder who is Organized and a Leading-edge Linguist |
Kobe Sun
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Posted - 2010.08.22 14:35:00 -
[22]
Originally by: AtheistOfFail
Originally by: Kobe Sun I totally support OP's idea for the most part.
Instead of having no weapons I think 1 weapon slot is necessary. Lets say you just cleared Blockade and you go back with your new Primae to tidy up the 50 or so wrecks. You start salvaging a parasite shows up. You can't possibly salvage all the wrecks before a parasite helps himself to some of the wrecks. I say let the mission runner have 1 weapon so he can destroy as many wrecks as possible.
Every time a player goes into battle he risks his ship and mods. A parasite that just shows up to grab wrecks risked nothing. That's just too lob sided. A player should always have the abilty to destroy the fruits of his labour to deny a parasite an easy meal.
We can get into a long discussion about what type of turret or launcher to put on the ship and what's too powerful ecetera but we can keep it simple. The Primae is a ORE ship. ORE is not a military corp. The Civilian Gatling/Railgun/Pulse turret fits. The Primae can be given bonuses to boost the range of the Civilian gun to 60km with just enough punch to destroy any wreck or can in one hit.
I also like the idea of salvage drones being exclusive to the salvage Primae.
Ninja salvager whines are that way ----->
I was talking about maintaining balance and not letting parasites have too easy a time. |
Goumeka Ghalvia
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Posted - 2010.08.22 16:51:00 -
[23]
Thank you Faolan. Had that idea for over a year but never had the time to think it through and post it. Now that there's a new hull from ORE it's even easier to implement. Fully support everything you wrote. It really doesn't need tank. What it needs is either speed or a big tractor beam range bonus. Obviously it would make sense to give it a salvaging bonus and a decent cargo hold. Salvaging drones would be a great addition but it somewhat takes it over the top if it will have 8 high slots. Creation of such of ship would allow to further develop the salvaging profession. There are abandoned stations (Missions, Magnetometric sites), NPC wrecks of capital ships (Epic Arc) and other structures that looks like salvage heaven. In a way it will be a new type of mining. |
Gnean Tyrova
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Posted - 2010.08.22 17:16:00 -
[24]
Agreed.
The ninja salvagers arguement is valid in my opinion ( despite the fact that during my time missioning I never got ninjad ). To counter, give it standard T1 attributes for armor and shield resists, 3 mids and lows ( as previously mentioned ), and perhaps a 15m^3 drone bay ( for protection/wreck destruction ). Furthermore, one could reduce its align speed slightly and reduce its speed slightly. After all, my major understanding was that most ninja salvagers prefer cheap frigs because of their speed and align time.
Tractor bonuses? Fully agreed too. Cargo bonuses? Equally agreed too. Salvage chance bonus? A 3% bonus per level would not push it to 100% even with 3 T2 Salvage rigs which would make it extremely effect in my opinion but not over balanced.
If it is kept T1 and reasonably priced ( say 20mill; about the same amount for a hurricane or slightly less ) then it would make a great addition to the EVE universe.
Glad to see support from CCP and thank you for detailing your idea. |
ImmaSplodeYou
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Posted - 2010.08.22 18:50:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Scorpionidae I like this idea but why not use the frigates: Navitas, Burst, Bantam and Tormentor, because they are the only frigs that don't have T2 versions (other then faction frigs) I know they are used for mining but maybe that be cool.
Sorry for spellings and all that.
Scorpionidae
I agree. They could have default Cargo of ~500m3 with the usual slot ratio and about 4 highs, with bonuses to Salvage rate and Tractor Speed from the Frigates skill, and Cargo capacity and Agility or speed for the T2 Ship book
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it440
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Posted - 2010.08.22 21:33:00 -
[26]
Edited by: it440 on 22/08/2010 21:35:06
Originally by: Sly Nasty I love this idea as well. But I'd prefer one ORE ship, I just love the designs. I'm thinking a sledge-shaped design, maybe with some sort of array for focusing tractor beams. I think I should have tractor beam range and speed bonuses, salvage bonuses, and a T2 version with better tank. Maybe something like a 1000m3 cargo hold.
Also, a change to the way wrecks work. When a mission is ended, the wrecks from the mission become abandoned, or when a wreck has been floating in space for a period of time, it becomes abandoned. Abandoned wrecks can be scanned down using a ships onboard scanner. But, also, when a wreck becomes abandoned it has a change of attracting NPC rats. You quite suddenly cause salvaging to become its own profession as opposed to something people do when they want additional isk.
i like the abandoned wreck suggestion and most of the primae ideas except i dont like the part of salvaging bonus, unless the same salvaging bonus will apply to marauders also, they should get it anyway since its suggested already in the description of marauder info. "While especially effective at support suppression and wreckage salvaging"
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Mashie Saldana
BFG Tech
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Posted - 2010.08.23 00:08:00 -
[27]
That would be pretty neat even though I like the Legion for salvaging and 40km tractors.
18 months |
Kwatokni
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Posted - 2010.08.23 04:48:00 -
[28]
You could always sidestep the bonuses and such to tactors and salvagers by giving it a more ORE like touch: a "strip salvager" that loots and salvages at range in one fell swoop. Add in a 2nd tier salvage skill for it's use, and have it be 100% effective with decreasing cycle time from more skill.
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Sub Prime
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Posted - 2010.08.23 09:45:00 -
[29]
3% bonus per level to analyzing/codebreaking/salvaging.
I would personally prefer to see a T3 type ORE ship that could have a choice of subsystems to cover exploration, mining, & analyzing/codebreaking/salvaging, but any additional ships for this area of play would be great.
I guess until CCP have sorted out the issue with changing subsystems without being in station, they'll be loated to create more T3/subsystemesque type ships.
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Chaotic Mind
Rennfeuer Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2010.08.23 10:06:00 -
[30]
I would love to see a special salvage module where you can add a "autoloot" script, no need to open the wrecks if you really intent to loot everything
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