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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.23 01:47:00 -
[1]
This is a very minor but possibly very important factor that i have noticed while trying to biuld an optimized elite colony. In this system i have 5 colonies, all of them advanced production plants using the same plan.
So i was biulding these colonies, constructing biuldings right up to the power and CPU limites. This plan worked on planet 1, 2, 3 and 4 but not 5. That is very weird!
Now regular PI'ers will know that its a good idea to make transport links as short as possible, so you put the structures close together. There is a limit to how close you can place biuldings, but when you get it right you can make the requirements of the transport link very low.
Now since all the structures require the same about of power and cpu unites on each planet it had to be the links that where causing the problem.
So i looked on the links for planet 1-4 and found the shortest links possibler ranged between 16-24 MWs of power.
Then i went back to planet 5 and found out the links needed 36 MWs of power.
Now I know that isn't a massive different but it adds up and if you are trying to optimize your output you will need to push your colony to its limit.
The reason for this is the size of the planet, which nobody really takes into account since the facilities are always the same size.
So the actual size of the facilities on the planet change depending on the size of the planet and the minimum distance between them also changes.
Because of this glitch i have had to drop a factory which is very annoying and might be causing others problems.
ANYWAY i thought this might help some people who are having problems.
Good luck.
JP.
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Marcus Mannimarco
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Posted - 2010.08.23 02:30:00 -
[2]
My uldings aren't bi, they're straight.
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Captain Torgo
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Posted - 2010.08.23 02:38:00 -
[3]
Actually I noticed this problem as well. On some planets I can get as many as 21 structures built and working. On others I can barely get 15. Even putting them in a close honeycomb pattern and keeping links to a bare minimum it's still not enough PW.
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Jack Norris
Caldari Flux Technologies Inc SRS.
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Posted - 2010.08.23 02:41:00 -
[4]
Ok, who let Joe out of C&P?
Paging Lana, please collect your lost kid
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Joba'Set
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Posted - 2010.08.23 03:00:00 -
[5]
Bet your 5th is on a gas or Larger planet. They have larger min Distance so cost more of everything.
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.23 03:03:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Jack Norris Ok, who let Joe out of C&P?
Paging Lana, please collect your lost kid
RIGHT!!
ok..
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Poldarn Joaq
Red Federation
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Posted - 2010.08.23 09:17:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Poldarn Joaq on 23/08/2010 09:17:41 I seem to remember that this is something to do with planet size. Planet 5 is likely bigger in diameter. So in PI view, even though it looks like you are zoomed in as close as you are on the other planets you are actually further out (optical illusion cos the planet is so big).
I think this is it any way. ---------------
Thats no moon!!
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Guilliman R
Gallente Northstar Cabal R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2010.08.23 10:30:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Guilliman R on 23/08/2010 10:31:02 It's not a glitch.
If a link costs (for example) 1MW per 1,000m, and you build something on a planet with a radius of 4,000m you links wont cost more then 2MW (half a planet) each.
If you build on a planet that's 40,000m in radius, your links will cost up to 20MW (half planet again).
It's very simple logic. Granted because the structures scale with a planet the links will be slightly(VERY slightly) cheaper then the basic math indicates.
*Edit, what previous poster said is true. You're effectively zoomed out more, so the links look like they're the same length, but they are not. Planet size (radius) is everything.
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William Walker
Amarr House Celtae
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Posted - 2010.08.23 10:36:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Guilliman R Edited by: Guilliman R on 23/08/2010 10:31:02 It's not a glitch. [...]Planet size (radius) is everything.
This. The planet is bigger, it costs more since it's farther away. It may not appear to be, but it is. Also bold. ________________________________________________
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heheheh
Ecliptic Refuge
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Posted - 2010.08.23 12:11:00 -
[10]
As said already, more expensive links on bigger planets.
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.23 16:46:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Guilliman R Edited by: Guilliman R on 23/08/2010 10:31:02 It's not a glitch.
If a link costs (for example) 1MW per 1,000m, and you build something on a planet with a radius of 4,000m you links wont cost more then 2MW (half a planet) each.
If you build on a planet that's 40,000m in radius, your links will cost up to 20MW (half planet again).
It's very simple logic. Granted because the structures scale with a planet the links will be slightly(VERY slightly) cheaper then the basic math indicates.
*Edit, what previous poster said is true. You're effectively zoomed out more, so the links look like they're the same length, but they are not. Planet size (radius) is everything.
The GLITCH is that the biulding scale changes, the bigger the planet, the bigger the biuldings.
Thats the only "glitch" here, the link price is just what comes about from this glitch.
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Aessoroz
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Posted - 2010.08.23 16:52:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Aessoroz on 23/08/2010 16:54:59 It's not a glitch. CCP intended for everything to scale with planet size otherwise you would have freaking ant sized colonies at max zoom on the biggest planets.
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Ikserak tai
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Posted - 2010.08.23 17:31:00 -
[13]
The egregious mis-use of scale in PI ranks as the most amateurish aspect in all of Eve, as realistic as putting push-pins into globes and playing "let's make a colony".
YOU'VE NEVER ROCKED 'TIL YOU'VE UNDOCKED. |
Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.23 18:37:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ikserak tai The egregious mis-use of scale in PI ranks as the most amateurish aspect in all of Eve, as realistic as putting push-pins into globes and playing "let's make a colony".
It should be improved soon (hopefully)
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EZ Windy
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Posted - 2010.08.23 18:44:00 -
[15]
I'm not sure if this as been said but I think the link distance (hence power requirement) is a function/proportional to the planet size. In other words, yhe bigger the planet radius the larger the link distance. Remember from your high school geometry that the distance on an arc surface is equal to the Radius of a circle (or planet in this case planet) times the Angel form the beginning of the link to its end (relative to the center of the planet). Anyway, hope this helps.
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Lirinas
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Posted - 2010.08.24 18:32:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Ikserak tai The egregious mis-use of scale in PI ranks as the most amateurish aspect in all of Eve, as realistic as putting push-pins into globes and playing "let's make a colony".
I wholeheartedly agree with this. In fact, I'm fairly certain I've complained about this in the past (along with all of my other gripes with PI). However, with the overly simplistic of "PIVille", this is the only way they can express how much more difficult it is to build on larger planets.
What I was hoping to see was more detail and a more realistic application of astrogeology. The size of a planet wouldn't directly affect the requirements of a link or structures on a planet. Instead it should be a measure of a planet's gravity, atmospheric, and surface topographical features.
A couple scenarios that I had hoped to see with PI:
- Low-gravity planets would be cheaper to maintain.
- A dense, corrosive atmosphere would greatly increase colony maintenance.
- Uneven terrain (mountains, canyons) would be more expensive to build links through than, say an open plain.
Some might say that adding too many factors like that would make PI more complicated. I respond to that saying, "This is EVE! If you want a simple, no-brainer game, go play WoW or Farmville." I want my details. I want my sci-fi game to FEEL like a sci-fi game. PI failed all of my expectations, both from a mechanics standpoint, and an atmosphere//flavor standpoint.
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.25 00:17:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Lirinas
Originally by: Ikserak tai The egregious mis-use of scale in PI ranks as the most amateurish aspect in all of Eve, as realistic as putting push-pins into globes and playing "let's make a colony".
I wholeheartedly agree with this. In fact, I'm fairly certain I've complained about this in the past (along with all of my other gripes with PI). However, with the overly simplistic of "PIVille", this is the only way they can express how much more difficult it is to build on larger planets.
What I was hoping to see was more detail and a more realistic application of astrogeology. The size of a planet wouldn't directly affect the requirements of a link or structures on a planet. Instead it should be a measure of a planet's gravity, atmospheric, and surface topographical features.
A couple scenarios that I had hoped to see with PI:
- Low-gravity planets would be cheaper to maintain.
- A dense, corrosive atmosphere would greatly increase colony maintenance.
- Uneven terrain (mountains, canyons) would be more expensive to build links through than, say an open plain.
Some might say that adding too many factors like that would make PI more complicated. I respond to that saying, "This is EVE! If you want a simple, no-brainer game, go play WoW or Farmville." I want my details. I want my sci-fi game to FEEL like a sci-fi game. PI failed all of my expectations, both from a mechanics standpoint, and an atmosphere//flavor standpoint.
I aggree with you 100%.
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Xereyn
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Posted - 2010.08.25 00:55:00 -
[18]
Wait. Whole post in bold.
Joe...
Did you lose your dramiel to a badger?
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.25 01:13:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Xereyn Wait. Whole post in bold.
Joe...
Did you lose your dramiel to a badger?
?
I have never owned a dramiel and i don't even have the skills to fly one.
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Abdiel Kavash
Caldari Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
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Posted - 2010.08.25 01:22:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Lirinas A couple scenarios that I had hoped to see with PI:
- Low-gravity planets would be cheaper to maintain.
- A dense, corrosive atmosphere would greatly increase colony maintenance.
- Uneven terrain (mountains, canyons) would be more expensive to build links through than, say an open plain.
Orbital bombardment. ___________ EVE is dying! Now for real! |
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.27 02:02:00 -
[21]
That would be cool.
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Ryan Easte
Caldari L.R.O.
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Posted - 2010.08.27 11:23:00 -
[22]
I just started with P.I. today and I will openly admit it was a bit daunting and im still a little unsure if I have done it right.. but at the same time I do feel that alot has been left out of it, I love P.I. in theory but its just not quite there yet I think..
Mining is the path to enlightement. |
mortitia sith
The Adamite Inheritance
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Posted - 2010.08.28 01:25:00 -
[23]
so , in advance , the testers said bigger planets needed more cpu/pwg for links
and a few months later you complain about that ?
sounds like you did not check up on all those guides available 5 mins searching these forums would have given you that answer
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.28 01:34:00 -
[24]
Originally by: mortitia sith so , in advance , the testers said bigger planets needed more cpu/pwg for links
and a few months later you complain about that ?
sounds like you did not check up on all those guides available 5 mins searching these forums would have given you that answer
The thread is about the messed up reason WHY it costs more. Please read.
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Guilliman R
Gallente Northstar Cabal R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2010.08.28 08:49:00 -
[25]
No it doesn't.
If planet is twice as big, a link will cost twice as much to bridge the same "Zoomed out visual distance" of a smaller planets link. Because the link is in fact twice as long in distance(
CCP made structures icons and the zoom function scale so it remains roughly the same on all planets. If they didn't, you'd have to scroll in 4-10 times more on a big planet to find your factories. Let alone linking stuff on that scale. So they made the PI buildings scale in size (remember they're just pins, representations of the buildings). This is easier to manage larger planets then.
Are you expecting a link to cost as much on a planet that's 10x the size of another planet?
There is no issue, there is no glitch. Get it in your head. CCP made PI pins scale for user accessibility. Just because the pins appear to be the same size on a large planet and s small planet doesn't magically change the distance between two points on either planets.
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2010.08.28 23:35:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Guilliman R No it doesn't.
If planet is twice as big, a link will cost twice as much to bridge the same "Zoomed out visual distance" of a smaller planets link. Because the link is in fact twice as long in distance(
CCP made structures icons and the zoom function scale so it remains roughly the same on all planets. If they didn't, you'd have to scroll in 4-10 times more on a big planet to find your factories. Let alone linking stuff on that scale. So they made the PI buildings scale in size (remember they're just pins, representations of the buildings). This is easier to manage larger planets then.
Are you expecting a link to cost as much on a planet that's 10x the size of another planet?
There is no issue, there is no glitch. Get it in your head. CCP made PI pins scale for user accessibility. Just because the pins appear to be the same size on a large planet and s small planet doesn't magically change the distance between two points on either planets.
Oh so the EXACT same biuldings on different planet are 2-3 times bigger for no apparent reason? because some people might be to lazy to scroll in alittle more?
Sounds like a glitch to me
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