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Getting members to contribute to corporation goals

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Sachi Adama	Posted - 2010.09.22 20:44:00 - [1] My corp wants to build an Orca but we are short on some of the minerals. What are some ways to encourage corpmates to help us mine for said minerals? I believe we have to find a way to incentivize the process for them but we're not sure how.
Hanneshannes	Posted - 2010.09.22 20:47:00 - [2] What does your boss do to encourage you to work?
Lazarann Ideal Machine	Posted - 2010.09.22 20:50:00 - [3] Originally by: Hanneshannes What does your boss do to encourage you to work? Signs my paychecks. ---------------- A million faces, each a million lies
Selene Valkros	Posted - 2010.09.22 20:51:00 - [4] I have to admit this is a vexing problem. One I have bumped heads against a number of times. One thing I hear from players is, "I want to join a corporation with some direction and goals." But God help you if you start giving orders to accomplish those goals. You get an earful of variations of "You're not the boss of me!" Okay...so you want a corporation with direction, but aren't willing to work together to accomplish those goals?
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:03:00 - [5] - Pay them near market price for minerals. - Arrange frigate/cruiser free-for-all tournaments to easy tension and alleviate mining fatigue. - Blackmail them with the nude photos you naturally demanded when they joined. There are lots of ways, problem I see is the goal. If people don't want to mine then asking them to do it for a ship meant to support mining might not be the best way
Ruhige Schmerz Valhalla Naval Corp IMPERIAL LEGI0N	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:12:00 - [6] The goals need to benefit the corporation, everyone in the corporation that you want to participate. Padding the corporate wallet does not help individual members. Putting up a POS, on its own, does not benefit corporate members. The list goes on. Most corp 'goals' I've seen are extremely vague. "Get a lowsec pos" or "move to 0.0." The members aren't given any reason to desire either of those things, and unless they're made desirable, participation is going to be low. So, what motivates every player? Fun. Your goals need to provide fun. What's fun for players? Doing what they like to do, be it mining, trading, pvping, missioning, plexes.. whatever. It goes without saying that players generally like to survive as well. Flying somewhere random repeatedly just to blow up doesn't get fun until you can afford to do it, and for some, not even then. So, how can you, as a CEO, make the result of your goals, and the work to achieve them, fun? You can start by making sure the unfun parts are minimized in some cases, eliminated in others. This means straight up no-questions-asked replacement of fitted ships lost during an op. Figure out the insurance details to suit your situation -- they insure on their own and you cover the premium, or you insure it for them. If you're going into lowsec and don't have a dedicated group of PVPers, hire mercs to protect your op, and replace lost mining ships as above. If you do have dedicated PVPers, that's not always the answer anyway. Defending the op needs to be fun for them as well. Rotate them in and out of duty, don't make them sit at the op for hours and hours waiting for someone to show up. PAY THEM, either isk, or a share of the minerals. Speaking of paying them, "100% corp ops" almost always get a lukewarm response, unless they're rare compared to split-income ops. I've seen success with ops that split the mining haul 30/70 corp/pilots. Among the pilots, 80% to miners, 10% to haulers, 10% to pvp defense pilots. Adjust to suit and keep your people happy. Scratch all that if you want, but the basic tenet is the problem with every failed corp goal -- you aren't making the goal appealing enough, and/or the work required to achieve it fun enough.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:15:00 - [7] Edited by: Tippia on 22/09/2010 21:15:22 "100% corp tax! Mandatory kicks to the vegetables if you rat/mission-run less than 6h day!" ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki

CCP Zymurgist Gallente C C P	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:30:00 - [8] Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 22/09/2010 21:15:22 "100% corp tax! Mandatory kicks to the vegetables if you rat/mission-run less than 6h day!" I've been in corps that have had decent success doing 100% tax weekends. Truthfully the best way to get people to mine is to get them together on Ventrillo/Teamspeak then get really drunk. If you aren't having a good time doing what you joined the corp for maybe you should look into leaving or firing some people! Zymurgist Community Representative CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact Us

Shawshanke	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:43:00 - [9] Threaten that if they don't come on the mining op they'll have to listen to 8 hours of goon speak.
Ghoest	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:44:00 - [10] Generally people support what they care about.
Ruhige Schmerz Valhalla Naval Corp IMPERIAL LEGI0N	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:52:00 - [11] Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 22/09/2010 21:15:22 "100% corp tax! Mandatory kicks to the vegetables if you rat/mission-run less than 6h day!" I've been in corps that have had decent success doing 100% tax weekends. Truthfully the best way to get people to mine is to get them together on Ventrillo/Teamspeak then get really drunk. If you aren't having a good time doing what you joined the corp for maybe you should look into leaving or firing some people! Quoting dev saying he prefers TS/Vent over in-game voice.. Also, beer was a better answer than mine.
Bhattran	Posted - 2010.09.22 21:55:00 - [12] Track them down in their favorite/most expensive ship and hold them ransom. *Note this might not work if they don't actually want to be part of the 'team' in which case take them for all you can then boot them after you pod them. -------------------------------------------------------------- Fanboys would make great cult members.
Sachi Adama	Posted - 2010.09.22 22:35:00 - [13] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida - Pay them near market price for minerals. - Arrange frigate/cruiser free-for-all tournaments to easy tension and alleviate mining fatigue. - Blackmail them with the nude photos you naturally demanded when they joined. There are lots of ways, problem I see is the goal. If people don't want to mine then asking them to do it for a ship meant to support mining might not be the best way Paying them at near market price is something we've tossed around in the past couple days. We'll have to see how the members react. I definitely don't think anyone does anything for free nowadays so asking them to do it for free for the long term vision is pointless. WIIFM- What's In It For Me. Totally agree that Vent and Beer acts as a good social lubricant and passes the time. Problem with the miners in our corp is that they prefer text than audio. I hate text as I do enough typing in the day.Can others confirm of audio-shy miners/industrialist in their corp?
King Gore The Church of Sentcha	Posted - 2010.09.22 22:44:00 - [14] Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 22/09/2010 21:15:22 "100% corp tax! Mandatory kicks to the vegetables if you rat/mission-run less than 6h day!" I've been in corps that have had decent success doing 100% tax weekends. Truthfully the best way to get people to mine is to get them together on Ventrillo/Teamspeak then get really drunk. If you aren't having a good time doing what you joined the corp for maybe you should look into leaving or firing some people! Zym with the win. - #DEVOUR# Scream for me. I'll die for you #DEVOUR# Scream for me. I'll die for you #DEVOUR#
dr cisco	Posted - 2010.09.22 23:39:00 - [15] 100% tax weekend, threaten to kick uninvolved members, reward shares to active members. or, if all the corps comes together and accomplishes the goal you set, you can reward the corp with a tax free weekend.
Knockie	Posted - 2010.09.22 23:47:00 - [16] Does really the members in your corp want to build an Orca, or do the leaders want to build an Orca? I don't see the issue, if the members of the corp wanted to build the Orca i would say they would get down to it and get it done. You have to tell them why you want to build an Orca, and what benefits they would get for helping you out, what kind of benefits you should throw at them depends entierly on what they love to do the most. If your corpmembers love to mine, and they dont want to build an Orca, sack them all.
Nicholas Barker Black Nova Corp IT Alliance	Posted - 2010.09.22 23:56:00 - [17] Best way is corp mining ops, and somebody with perfect refine adds a tiny bit of tax on. Eventually you'll have enough for your orca. ------ 0800-LAG-A-NODE
yani dumyat Minmatar Black Storm Cartel The Orca Syndicate	Posted - 2010.09.23 00:12:00 - [18] Have you considered paying for the orca yourself then taxing the returns? EG if your miners usually get X m3 of ore per hour but get X.2 m3 per hour when using the orca you tax them 0.1 until the orca's paid for. If they're not willing to pay the tax they don't get to utilize the orca's benefits and will have to mine at a slower rate than their corp mates. Just a thought though as others have said it all comes down to fun. Perhaps the best answer is to use low SP suicide alts to gank some macros/other miners in your area. It's something different, pays for your orca and drives out competition. _______ Trolls and Tribulations A story of eve, trolls, world domination and dogfighting against starlings in a tiny dramiel.
Vaneshi SnowCrash	Posted - 2010.09.23 00:26:00 - [19] Originally by: Sachi Adama My corp wants to build an Orca but we are short on some of the minerals. What are some ways to encourage corpmates to help us mine for said minerals? I believe we have to find a way to incentivize the process for them but we're not sure how. Why should I, help you build an Orca? What's the long term plan and thinking behind "project: Orca"? I mean you've come to me and just said "Dude, lets build an Orca" and I'm reading your mail going "WTF? They cost like 300mil, how broke ass are we exactly?? Where the hell is my tax going?" and of course the optional "My alliance dues are paying for what exactly?" depending on situation. Now if you were to approach this as "Guys, we're figuring out how to build cap ships, you want a Carrier? You KNOW you do... everyone wants one and you can have one too. So we're going to build an Orca as a test drive of how the hell you do this, then offer heavy discounts across all four races... discount to be based on your participation!". ding I'm suddenly very interested in your project. You get to figure out the mechanics, I begin shopping for capitol ship skill books whilst watching the mining lasers cycle. It's also worth looking at a "mutual back scratching" plan. Send in the mission/anomaly runners, send in a salvager or two behind them. Player gets his bounties/LP, you get all the rat poop to grind down for minerals. It won't net you a lot of minerals compared to a bunch of Hulks roaming around but if your only short by a little bit.... If your building it to sell, do I get a cut of that for my effort? If so what percentage? If not... why not and what the hell are we going to do with the damn thing if it doesn't sell? (unlikely but you know how it goes). In essence tell your corp exactly what the plan is and why this step of the plan is important. You'll get some dissenters sure but most will look at it and go "Ok" before pitching in.
Fkn Arson 0ne Percent.	Posted - 2010.09.23 00:41:00 - [20] Originally by: yani dumyat Have you considered paying for the orca yourself then taxing the returns? EG if your miners usually get X m3 of ore per hour but get X.2 m3 per hour when using the orca you tax them 0.1 until the orca's paid for. If they're not willing to pay the tax they don't get to utilize the orca's benefits and will have to mine at a slower rate than their corp mates. your doing it wrong Originally by: yani dumyat Have you considered paying for the orca yourself then taxing the returns? EG if your miners usually get X m3 of ore per hour but get X.2 m3 per hour when using the orca you tax them 0.1 until the you feel like you've made enough off of the sweat and blood of your serva... err corpmates. If they're not willing to pay the tax they don't get to utilize the orca's benefits and will have to mine at a slower rate than their corp mates.
Sebastiann Kane	Posted - 2010.09.23 01:26:00 - [21] Been there and done that. Its like herding Cats. You start off full of enthusiam and vigor and 3 months later you just want to start up a one man corp with you in it and the rest of EVE on block.
PI Staker	Posted - 2010.09.23 01:39:00 - [22] Originally by: Shawshanke Threaten that if they don't come on the mining op they'll have to listen to 8 hours of goon speak. that violates article 7 section 12 of the Yulai Convention though
Marak Mocam	Posted - 2010.09.23 02:26:00 - [23] If you're not in a mining/industrial corporation it's liable to be/get ugly. If you are, then no big deal -- orca's have good value for mining/industrial type groups. The chat with drinks, etc... However you deal with each other is your gig but the 2 'base' options are to get folks together and obtain the needed minerals or have them individually cough up the stuff. 1) Run a corp sponsored mining op to get what's needed that way. 2) Look at how much stuff you need, send an eve mail out telling corp mates how much of each mineral is needed from them and where to drop it off. How they get it is their business but give a due date. Odds are good that if it's individual based, you'll be filling in missing stuff from some members who won't (or can't) help out in the time window you provide for "deliverables due" so try and plan/compensate for that eventuality.
Ghoest	Posted - 2010.09.23 04:36:00 - [24] this Originally by: Knockie Does really the members in your corp want to build an Orca, or do the leaders want to build an Orca? I don't see the issue, if the members of the corp wanted to build the Orca i would say they would get down to it and get it done. You have to tell them why you want to build an Orca, and what benefits they would get for helping you out, what kind of benefits you should throw at them depends entierly on what they love to do the most. If your corpmembers love to mine, and they dont want to build an Orca, sack them all. and this Originally by: Marak Mocam If you're not in a mining/industrial corporation it's liable to be/get ugly. If you are, then no big deal -- orca's have good value for mining/industrial type groups. Wherever you went - Here you are.
Dr BattleSmith PAX Interstellar Services	Posted - 2010.09.23 04:40:00 - [25] Tell them CCP will ban them and eat their first born if they don't mine for you for the next 15 hours.
Alexander Li Caymen Islands Tax Shelter	Posted - 2010.09.23 04:45:00 - [26] Originally by: Ruhige Schmerz ...you aren't making the goal appealing enough, and/or the work required to achieve it fun enough. Nail. Head.
DeBingJos Minmatar Ethically Questionable	Posted - 2010.09.23 06:23:00 - [27] Set up contracts to your corp for the required minerals/items. Make them small enough: You better make 5 contracts for 1mil trit then 1 contract of 5mil trit. This way all the members can participate as much as they want and hardly no bookkeeping is involved except putting up the contracts.
Ollie Cromwell Caldari Seniors Clan DEM0N HUNTERS	Posted - 2010.09.23 06:39:00 - [28] Originally by: Sachi Adama My corp wants to build an Orca but we are short on some of the minerals. What are some ways to encourage corpmates to help us mine for said minerals? I believe we have to find a way to incentivize the process for them but we're not sure how. This is not as easy as in RL, where you have a job and your boss signs your pay-check ... This is a game that sometimes resembles a job, but the bottom-line is that people are playing the game to have fun. That fact is easily forgotten by some of the (more megalomaniac) CEO's that only keep their eye on the 'long term target' ... But most pilots without having any corporate inside-info on what is going on won't think beyond next week and/or their own personal goals (why should they?). In all honesty I think that as soon as a game starts to become a job, you should be looking for another game imho. Therefore your real challenge is in how you can make building this Orca 'fun', so people will come out and help ... You could achieve this either by all getting on vent/teamspeak whilst bantering away during a mining operation and possibly get drunk as mr. Zymurgist suggests (I know Seniors corp used to do this). Alternatively you can try to get the message across to your fellow pilots why building this orca is so important. Not just for your corporation, but tell them what advantages this Orca will have for them personally. For some getting paid for mining the roids is enough fun in itself (as they would be mining anyway). For those pilots, you could simply make it worth their time by paying them for their time and efforts. Based on my personal experiences, a combination of the above worked for Seniors Corp in the past. Hope this helps a bit... Fly safe. ----------
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2010.09.23 07:50:00 - [29] Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 22/09/2010 21:15:22 "100% corp tax! Mandatory kicks to the vegetables if you rat/mission-run less than 6h day!" I've been in corps that have had decent success doing 100% tax weekends. Truthfully the best way to get people to mine is to get them together on Ventrillo/Teamspeak then get really drunk. If you aren't having a good time doing what you joined the corp for maybe you should look into leaving or firing some people! Zymurgist are you Mitch Taylor? He did everything you say including the drunken part and it was a sweet time being with them! - Auditing & consulting When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2010.09.23 07:55:00 - [30] Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 23/09/2010 07:56:26 Originally by: Sachi Adama My corp wants to build an Orca but we are short on some of the minerals. What are some ways to encourage corpmates to help us mine for said minerals? I believe we have to find a way to incentivize the process for them but we're not sure how. People will do everything if you show them Vision and show them that they can bring in tangible and consistent results. "We need to build an Orca" is something no one would give a toss about. Now make the corp members feel that building the Orca is the only obstacle before your grand adventure begins and important goals may be reached and you'd even find people doing it with no payback, even in the late Sunday. Otherwise, if you prefer to play "boss" and they are "employees", you have to treat them as such and you'll see that in a game it does not work too well. - Auditing & consulting When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz

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