Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Puff Alo
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 04:18:00 -
[1]
Hey guys,
So, this idea just popped out of nowhere when I was doing my day-dreaming.
What do you guys think. Maybe EVE should have a banking system?
What I think is, it can have basic functions of a real bank. People can save ISKs in a Player-owned bank for a certain offered interest, and the bank owner get to invest with the money his clients put into his bank. However, the bank owner must a very good credit. Otherwise why would people lend him the ISK? He might just take the money and run away!
And if the bank owner is unable to pay his clients' interests, his security status will drop or something like the clients get a killright...
Or maybe not "player"-owned. "Player Corporation"-owned banks?
Would you guys like to give some feedback to my ideas?
No flaming please. This is just a suggestion. THere is absolutely no need to get aggressive on the topic.
|
captain foivos
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 04:22:00 -
[2]
Not sure if serious... -- I, for one, welcome the chance to open a bar I can decorate with the corpses of those I have slain. All hail Incarna. |
Orange Lagomorph
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 04:23:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Orange Lagomorph on 11/10/2010 04:26:52
Originally by: Puff Alo So, this idea just popped out of nowhere when I was doing my day-dreaming.
I find that when threads or posts start with someone saying "So," they usually turn out to be terrible.
Also, I suspect "day-dreaming" in your case means sitting around empty-headed for long periods of time, because if you'd thought about this a little longer and/or run a Google/EVE Search check, you'd have realized you're far from the first person to think of such an idea.
Run a search to receive feedback on this idea, as it's been posted by dozens of "daydreamers" already. Repeatedly.
|
Siigari Kitawa
Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 04:27:00 -
[4]
Guys I have an idea.
|
Orange Lagomorph
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 04:32:00 -
[5]
Hey guys I have an idea, and oh damn bros, I bet I'm the first person to think of it. I thought of it today whilst in the midst of one of my frequent super-creative daydreaming session.
Check it out: I was thinking we should remove insurance for gankers, because it makes no sense that insurance companies would pay for a ship destroyed by CONCORD in an act of lawlessness.
P.S.: Don't flame me, bro!
|
Tamahra
Gallente Danke fuer den Fisch
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 04:42:00 -
[6]
I have an idea:
Give me all your stuff, and i mean everyone.
|
Puff Alo
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 04:58:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Orange Lagomorph Edited by: Orange Lagomorph on 11/10/2010 04:26:52
Originally by: Puff Alo So, this idea just popped out of nowhere when I was doing my day-dreaming.
I find that when threads or posts start with someone saying "So," they usually turn out to be terrible.
Also, I suspect "day-dreaming" in your case means sitting around empty-headed for long periods of time, because if you'd thought about this a little longer and/or run a Google/EVE Search check, you'd have realized you're far from the first person to think of such an idea.
Run a search to receive feedback on this idea, as it's been posted by dozens of "daydreamers" already. Repeatedly.
Hmm... I did searched within EVE, but not too hard. To my knowledge, the first page of the search doesn't have post about this, so I just decided to post it.
For those guys who has anger issues assuming that I assumed nobody has thought of this before... Of course I know there's a possibility someone might have suggested the same thing. In fact, it's just so obvious that someone already has that there's no point mentioning "someone might have proposed this already".
Just like how many times your mama has told you to not to do this do that. I am just bringing up a possible idea up until maybe someone decided to try for it. |
Brock Nelson
Caldari Flux Technologies Inc SRS.
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:02:00 -
[8]
Are you ****ing serious? There's at least 4 player run banks since the game started and all of them failed. Check out Market discussion and first page of search result aint gonna be good enough.
Originally by: Brock Nelson OP's question is translated as: Help, I'm a female stuck in a man's body, can Incarna help?
|
Puff Alo
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:11:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Brock Nelson Are you ****ing serious? There's at least 4 player run banks since the game started and all of them failed. Check out Market discussion and first page of search result aint gonna be good enough.
I think they failed because CCP didn't implement an actual system for banking. They were trying to start a bank using the functions of corporation management.
This is just a suggestion.
Besides, instead of complaining on how this "DIDn't" work and how impossible it is, how about try to be an optimist and start brainstorming on how to make this possible?
If EVE is supposed to be as close as to the real economy like it advertises, banking should be part of the game too.
How about his, maybe the players don't own the bank. CCP does. Sort of like the manufacturing function. And in order to start a banking service, the player must meet certain requirements. For example, experience in game, skills...etc. so someone can't that easily run away with the money.
I mean, all investments have risks even in real life.
|
Brock Nelson
Caldari Flux Technologies Inc SRS.
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:14:00 -
[10]
In that case, you need to start digging up some of the existing threads in market discussion because you're trying to beat a dead horse.
This topic has been discussed to death and CCP has stated more than once that they desire to leave the banking system in the game for players to develop and run themselves. I'm not going to dig those quotes up or the countless threadnoughts on this dead topic because you can't get passed the first page of search result.
Originally by: Brock Nelson OP's question is translated as: Help, I'm a female stuck in a man's body, can Incarna help?
|
|
Tifforsia
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:26:00 -
[11]
That last attempt to set up a bank was started by a group of now infamous scammers. It was called ebank, they made off with over a tillion isk. Look it up on MD
|
Brock Nelson
Caldari Flux Technologies Inc SRS.
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:29:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Brock Nelson on 11/10/2010 05:31:37 I guess the scam bank that was posted by the ISD news was missed...
Originally by: Brock Nelson OP's question is translated as: Help, I'm a female stuck in a man's body, can Incarna help?
|
Intense Thinker
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:30:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Brock Nelson Are you ****ing serious? There's at least 4 player run banks since the game started and all of them failed. Check out Market discussion and first page of search result aint gonna be good enough.
the 1 bank worked incredibly well for the one investor. Signature locked for editing a moderator's warning. Zymurgist |
Mme Pinkerton
United Engineering Services
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:36:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Mme Pinkerton on 11/10/2010 05:47:32
off the top of my head:
EIB, Fury Bank, BMBE, EBANK, DBANK, ECR
& numerous small banks/scams that never made it big - "The Bank of EVE" being the most recent example.
EBANK is "EIB done right", ECR is "EBANK done right", and if ECR would ever launch we would most probably see a "ECR done right" within 2 years.
EIB went scam in summer 2006, Cally claimed he had scammed > 700b ISK.
Fury Bank was maybe no bank in the strict sense (didn't hand out loans afaik, switched from deposits to an equity based model later on), but most banks so far have made (or claimed to make) the largest part of their income by trading or industry and not by handing out loans. The CEO FastLearner disappeared after a series of losses in 0.0-based ventures in summer 2008, last reporter NAV was 55b ISK.
EBANK was founded by the former EIB employee Ricdic and held > 2T ISK in deposits by spring 2009. This quickly turned into a 1.2T ISK deficit when the bank was scammed by Ricdic. A few people have been trying to rebuild EBANK (by freezing accounts & interest and writing off accounts of players who don't like to submit their API keys to EBANK) but depositors are still waiting to receive back their cents on the dollar. (During the process of "recovery" the EBAK staff noticed that their lead programmer Mr. Horizontal had credited himself with 90b ISK in January 2009 by faking deposits - apparently he didn't manage to pull out this money after Ricdcs scammed the bank first).
DBANK was founded by Manalapan and probably inspired by EBANK's success. It offered extremely high interest rates at the beginning of its operation to distiguish itself from EBANK. Some time after Iknota who was responsible for the website left, the bank's site was taken down due to a critcal security flaw (sloppy programming meets changed server configuration) and never went operational again. After some time Manalapan stopped giving timelines for recovery and instead took the about 645b ISK in deposits for himself. Outside observers tend to think this was a classical case of burnout (as was Fury Bank), but Manalapan wants it to be a great scam.
BMBE is still running.
ECR is a project by Selene D'Celeste of EOH fame that tried to improve on EBANK's design when flaws in it became more and more apparent. Originaly scheduled to launch in early 2009 the bank never left closed beta testing.
tl;dr the only good reason to invest your time into running a "bank" in EVE is if you want to participate in the premier league of scammers, the only good reason to invest in this type of "bank" is that your RP is more important to you than your ISK.
|
Clown Pron
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 05:59:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Puff Alo Hmm... I did searched within EVE, but not too hard. To my knowledge, the first page of the search doesn't have post about this, so I just decided to post it.
"I have an idea but I don't want to put to much effort in thinking about it, nor do I want to put too much effort in seeing if other people had already discussed this idea"
|
Orange Lagomorph
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 06:09:00 -
[16]
All EVE banking attempts either are scams, or will become scams eventually, probably sooner rather than later. This is due to a combination of two factors, and between the two of them they ensure that no bank will ever be perpetually safe:
- EVE is a game, not real life. Without Maseratis, prostitutes and recreational drugs to show for it, running an investment bank will become a boring chore very quickly. The only consequences for quitting the bank and the game itself are... well, there aren't any.
- Everyone has a price. Everyone has a price. PERIOD. Especially in an anonymous Internet game where everyone has ten characters. Once the numbers get big enough, the money will be stolen (as much as can be stolen if the bank is compartmentalized). No exceptions.
Refer to my signature: In Neminem Crede. That's ecclesiastical Latin for "Trust No One," which aside from being a tagline for The X-Files, is also completely true. Especially in EVE Online.
|
Lance Fighter
Amarr
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 06:14:00 -
[17]
Remind me again - what is the PURPOSE of a bank in eve?
If you answered: To scam people, you are correct.
What purpose does a bank in eve serve other than that?
|
Jim Tudeski
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 06:19:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Orange Lagomorph All EVE banking attempts either are scams, or will become scams eventually, probably sooner rather than later. This is due to a combination of two factors, and between the two of them they ensure that no bank will ever be perpetually safe:
- EVE is a game, not real life. Without Maseratis, prostitutes and recreational drugs to show for it, running an investment bank will become a boring chore very quickly. The only consequences for quitting the bank and the game itself are... well, there aren't any.
- Everyone has a price. Everyone has a price. PERIOD. Especially in an anonymous Internet game where everyone has ten characters. Once the numbers get big enough, the money will be stolen (as much as can be stolen if the bank is compartmentalized). No exceptions.
Refer to my signature: In Neminem Crede. That's ecclesiastical Latin for "Trust No One," which aside from being a tagline for The X-Files, is also completely true. Especially in EVE Online.
What is Chribba's price then?
|
Orange Lagomorph
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 06:22:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Jim Tudeski What is Chribba's price then?
I knew someone was going to bring that up.
I'm sure Chribba has a price, but it's probably too high for anyone to actually pay. Also, keep in mind that Chribba has many alts, most of which are known, but some of which may not be. There's no guarantee he hasn't scammed or stolen in anonymity, or that he won't in the future.
|
kano donn
New Path
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 06:25:00 -
[20]
Reading through the comments has given me an idea. it may take a bit to get this point across, sorry in advance.
CCP wants a sandbox game, so they are really less likely to add features that will full fill roles already possible through current structures. The flaw with this, as many know, is the amount of trust that is required by everyone.
-A possible one time addition/fix/solution- Develop into the corporation structure a sort of "make your own function"
This tool would allow the CEO of a corp to design functions that intelligently already use the functions of a corp, but in a much more automated and secure way, with options to set visibility and transparency.
Example: For the case where a corp wants to become a bank corp, there would be a program (one that the CEO would develop) in place that would read the donated money, and drop it into a sort of secure wallet. At which point, if the CEO/directors wanted to access this account, a group mail would be sent to each of the individuals who donated and the mail could be a vote mechanism where the group decides the outcome.
How this would be implemented: Initially the CEO would open an interface where they select the parameters of the program from a (hopefully) elegant UI. This program, once completed, would be set into action. Once in position, the exact mechanics and operations the program goes though could be publicly available for any individual to see.
Basically this idea would require a massive overhaul with corp control and could very likely be done in a much more elegant way. This is just one possibility to spark creativity discussion
|
|
Puff Alo
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 07:55:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Clown Pron
Originally by: Puff Alo Hmm... I did searched within EVE, but not too hard. To my knowledge, the first page of the search doesn't have post about this, so I just decided to post it.
"I have an idea but I don't want to put to much effort in thinking about it, nor do I want to put too much effort in seeing if other people had already discussed this idea"
Oh, I'm sorry, but I have got a real life to worry about, and I figured it'd take less time for me to wait for someone to xxxxx at me than actually looking for the threads. This shows how many people enjoy putting xxxx in others' faces on this forum instead of being helpful.
Well, I'm sorry for being and idealist. I like the idea from the person above, and I agree this is just a game. In games, scams are possible, but thinking otherwise, total control over player action is also possible. At least it's not like real world where cops just pretend they don't see anything.
My thanks to those that helped me understand more about what happened. Maybe people working for CCP just don't want this. That's why they're not making it happen.
|
Jennifer Starling
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 08:14:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Brock Nelson This topic has been discussed to death and CCP has stated more than once that they desire to leave the banking system in the game for players to develop and run themselves.
I'm not going to dig those quotes up or the countless threadnoughts on this dead topic because you can't get passed the first page of search result.
Very true. Wasn't CCP interviewing players with banking experience just a few months ago?
And of course insurance is part of a banking system. I wonder how much players acting as bankers are willing to payout if you're collecting your insurance money for the 20th time this month ^^
|
Niccolado Starwalker
Gallente Shadow Templars
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 08:25:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Jim Tudeski
Originally by: Orange Lagomorph All EVE banking attempts either are scams, or will become scams eventually, probably sooner rather than later. This is due to a combination of two factors, and between the two of them they ensure that no bank will ever be perpetually safe:
- EVE is a game, not real life. Without Maseratis, prostitutes and recreational drugs to show for it, running an investment bank will become a boring chore very quickly. The only consequences for quitting the bank and the game itself are... well, there aren't any.
- Everyone has a price. Everyone has a price. PERIOD. Especially in an anonymous Internet game where everyone has ten characters. Once the numbers get big enough, the money will be stolen (as much as can be stolen if the bank is compartmentalized). No exceptions.
Refer to my signature: In Neminem Crede. That's ecclesiastical Latin for "Trust No One," which aside from being a tagline for The X-Files, is also completely true. Especially in EVE Online.
What is Chribba's price then?
If Chribba starts a veldspar bank where he would pay out 2 units of veldspar per 1 unit invested, then you should be alert indeed!
Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL. |
Forum Guy
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 08:35:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Puff Alo Hey guys,
So, this idea just popped out of nowhere when I was doing my day-dreaming.
What do you guys think. Maybe EVE should have a banking system?
What I think is, it can have basic functions of a real bank. People can save ISKs in a Player-owned bank for a certain offered interest, and the bank owner get to invest with the money his clients put into his bank. However, the bank owner must a very good credit. Otherwise why would people lend him the ISK? He might just take the money and run away!
And if the bank owner is unable to pay his clients' interests, his security status will drop or something like the clients get a killright...
Or maybe not "player"-owned. "Player Corporation"-owned banks?
Would you guys like to give some feedback to my ideas?
No flaming please. This is just a suggestion. THere is absolutely no need to get aggressive on the topic.
Think you should go back to day-dreaming and come up with a different scam as this one has been done before.
|
gfldex
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 10:02:00 -
[25]
Banks on planet Earth as we have them nowadays are able to stay in business because they are granted a privilege by the government. They are allowed to lend money from the central bank (even more privileges there), that is then lend out by themself for a higher interest rate. In EVE we don't got fiat money. The privilege to create money is my every single player. (Miners are just to stupid to put that privilege into action.)
Banks came about because moving money from city A to city B was very very dangerous. They solved that problem by not moving money but dept. That dept had meaning because the general pulbic was not allowed to make their own money. (They could try but risked to lose their heads in the process.)
As long as dept has no meaning in EVE nor is there a privilege that can be tied to bankes, there is simply no reason why a bank would be needed. There used to be need to finance titan production, but those times are long gone.
|
Mme Pinkerton
United Engineering Services
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 10:31:00 -
[26]
IMO (explicit and implicit) deposit insurance is a far more important factor in the viability of RL banks than fiat money.
Don't forget that banks have to offer (interest-paying) collateral in order to get money from the central bank. Also, in the US many small banks are not members of the Federal Reserve System.
The debt of banks only is better money than - say - my word that I owe you 5$, because it is secured by numerous regulations and government guarantees.
|
David Grogan
Gallente
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 11:02:00 -
[27]
the reason player run banks fail is because they are at the mercy of the player running it. all too often "player run banks" are nothing more than a scam.
in short I nor most of the eve online player base would trust you or anyone else with our hard earned isk. SIG: if my message has spelling errors its cos i fail at typing properly :P |
VanNostrum
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 11:17:00 -
[28]
Too late, I already started an in-game bank.
You give me all your isk, I keep your wallet and you draw money from me. If you don't withdraw money I give 100% monthly interest. You win!
|
Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
|
Posted - 2010.10.11 11:19:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Puff Alo Hey guys,
So, this idea just popped out of nowhere when I was doing my day-dreaming.
What do you guys think. Maybe EVE should have a banking system?
What I think is, it can have basic functions of a real bank. People can save ISKs in a Player-owned bank for a certain offered interest, and the bank owner get to invest with the money his clients put into his bank. However, the bank owner must a very good credit. Otherwise why would people lend him the ISK? He might just take the money and run away!
And if the bank owner is unable to pay his clients' interests, his security status will drop or something like the clients get a killright...
Or maybe not "player"-owned. "Player Corporation"-owned banks?
Would you guys like to give some feedback to my ideas?
No flaming please. This is just a suggestion. THere is absolutely no need to get aggressive on the topic.
1 Realize how banking actually works, and why in EVE it makes little sense to have them 2 Understand banks in EVE can only be for scamming
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |