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Idea to stop griefer wardecs

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Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:07:00 - [1] You already have to pay for the privilege of declaring war on a corp. My simple idea is to either: Make a portion of the money for declaring war go to the corp that is being decced Or: Increase the fee and make the increased portion go to the corp decced (this way is more expensive to the deccer but keeps the ISK sink). I prefer the first option. I figured though that this would be a real show stopped for mindless griefer mechanics. They can grief all they like, but ultimately, even if the other corp can't or doesnt want to fight back, they can just remain logged out or on alts and come away with some money. The amount of money a decced corp comes away with wont be significant enough to warrant just sitting there and not playing, as even the most basic of cash making exercises during a war dec would be more efficient. This also gives at least something for a corp that is being totally outnumbered and just stuck in station. It's not just a free money mechanic either. In any case, the deccing corp has to pay a fee no matter what, so nothing changes here. And it can't be exploited for CEOs to get money as it would be far more efficient for another character to just give the money. The percentage of war dec money can be debated if people think it's a good idea, and I would suggest around 25% of the fee should go into the decced corp's wallet. I think it may even make for more even war decs, despite the sum being sort of trivial when you start looking at some of the larger corps out there. There are usually two reasons for a war dec: 1. Griefing 2. Legitimate, but the aggressor usually feels they have either an even or better chance of winning. In the first example, the war fee immediately hinders the mindless grief. It doesnt make it impossible to grief, so if they really want to, they can. But it does mean they are paying their targets, which I think will really discourage your average griefer. In the second example, it means that the person that is usually the less likely to win, gets something for their troubles. The inspiration behind this post is a recent number of war decs from a 1 man corp. We aren't sure of the reasoning behind this yet. We usually pick up "anti-carebear" wardecs from corps that assume we cant pvp. We usually resolve these quickly :) The one we have now, we are pretty sure the guy is an alt of a guy in a corp we recently beat in our last dec. Both corps had decced us, but then after receiving a beating, the main corp withdrew the war. Since that time, the 1 man corp has decced again and again, but also spends time withdrawing the war dec before it's up as well. We're pretty much just waiting for the time when his "master plan" comes to fruition and he can "sneak" some extra members into the corp. Our other theory is that he wants to make people feel uneasy. In any case, the war dec in itself causes us absolutely no concern, but we are a little exasperated that this asshattery seems to be so easy. Yeah it's costing him every time, but I think it would make him think twice if he knew some of that money was going to us. Therefore, if he really does want to declare war and then not log on, he's not just losing money, he's paying us too. This post has gone on forever, and I'm aware that the more a post goes on, the more holes people find to pick in it. So if you have got this far, please just take away from this the simple idea that a percentage of the war fee goes to the decced corp.
Joe SMASH You Got A Purty Mouth	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:09:00 - [2] No such thing as 'griefing wardec'. You choose to be in a non-NPC corp, therefore you choose to be decced. End of story. ----------------------------------- Originally by: Kali Zero Warp core stabilizers are like condoms. Nice and safe, but they make it a little less fun for everyone involved.
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:11:00 - [3] Originally by: Joe SMASH No such thing as 'griefing wardec'. You choose to be in a non-NPC corp, therefore you choose to be decced. End of story. Please refrain from trolling.
Joe SMASH You Got A Purty Mouth	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:15:00 - [4] Originally by: Senghir Originally by: Joe SMASH No such thing as 'griefing wardec'. You choose to be in a non-NPC corp, therefore you choose to be decced. End of story. Please refrain from trolling. Ummm... How is that in anyway trolling? I was telling you that part of the risk in being in a non-NPC corp is decs. But ofc any and all disagreeing opinion to yours will be trolling? Nice and closed minded of you. Next time you post, think for a minute past your own nose and realise there is a lot more people in the game than you and your corp. ----------------------------------- Originally by: Kali Zero Warp core stabilizers are like condoms. Nice and safe, but they make it a little less fun for everyone involved.
Feilamya Pain Elemental	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:16:00 - [5] Originally by: Senghir You already have to pay for the privilege of declaring war on a corp. /thread
Black Dranzer	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:19:00 - [6] Originally by: Senghir Please refrain from trolling. Well look, he kind of has a point. I mean, obviously nobody likes being wardeced, but that's kind of why they're there. It's probably designed to be a balancing factor for the fact that being in a player corp offers benefits you can't get elsewhere. -------------------------------------------------- Learning skills are an ultimatum, not a choice.
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:22:00 - [7] Originally by: Joe SMASH Originally by: Senghir Originally by: Joe SMASH No such thing as 'griefing wardec'. You choose to be in a non-NPC corp, therefore you choose to be decced. End of story. Please refrain from trolling. Ummm... How is that in anyway trolling? I was telling you that part of the risk in being in a non-NPC corp is decs. But ofc any and all disagreeing opinion to yours will be trolling? Nice and closed minded of you. Next time you post, think for a minute past your own nose and realise there is a lot more people in the game than you and your corp. Ugh okay. Let me explain it to you. Your post was both blunt and brief, and contained an obvious falsehood (that anyone in a non-NPC corp "chooses" to be decced. No they don't. The aggressing corp does that. There are lots of people who dont want a war dec, but they have formed a player corp because they want to be together with like-minded individuals to achieve a common goal). Your reply was also irrelevant. My topic has nothing to do with whether people should be war decced or not. I dont even object to the fact that grief war decs are possible (see original post). So to sum up, your post was: Irrelevant Brief Was factually incorrect Two minutes after mine, giving you scarce time to even read it in full Therefore, I stand by my accusation of your trolling. I count your further reply just an attempt to be belligerent.
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:25:00 - [8] Originally by: Feilamya Originally by: Senghir You already have to pay for the privilege of declaring war on a corp. /thread And that continues to be the case. See option 1 of my OP. This fee does not go up by passing a percentage of it to the decced corp. Will still cost you 50mil a week or whatever.
Joe SMASH You Got A Purty Mouth	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:28:00 - [9] Originally by: Senghir Ugh okay. Let me explain it to you. Your post was both blunt and brief, and contained an obvious falsehood (that anyone in a non-NPC corp "chooses" to be decced. No they don't. The aggressing corp does that. There are lots of people who dont want a war dec, but they have formed a player corp because they want to be together with like-minded individuals to achieve a common goal). Your reply was also irrelevant. My topic has nothing to do with whether people should be war decced or not. I dont even object to the fact that grief war decs are possible (see original post). So to sum up, your post was: Irrelevant Brief Was factually incorrect Two minutes after mine, giving you scarce time to even read it in full Therefore, I stand by my accusation of your trolling. I count your further reply just an attempt to be belligerent. Irrelevant: No. I posted about decs in a war dec thread. That is relevant. Brief: Sure. i did not know I needed to write a novel describing how you are wrong. Factually Incorrect: When you join a player corp, you know that you can be decced. Therefore you choose to accept that risk. 2 min bs: Forgive me for being able to read fast. Next time I will read slower to appease you, oh master of Eve. I hope you know that posting this, then crying all over about the response will net you far more decs than you have had to deal with before. Go back to NPC corps if you cannot hack playing Eve. Better yet, go back to WoW. Is that trolling enough for you **head? ----------------------------------- Originally by:** Kali Zero Warp core stabilizers are like condoms. Nice and safe, but they make it a little less fun for everyone involved.
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:29:00 - [10] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Senghir Please refrain from trolling. Well look, he kind of has a point. I mean, obviously nobody likes being wardeced, but that's kind of why they're there. It's probably designed to be a balancing factor for the fact that being in a player corp offers benefits you can't get elsewhere. Again though, my post doesnt have anything to do with being opposed to war decs. I'm all for war decs. War is fun. What I am opposed to is griefing. This solution: Does not cost the aggressor any more money Does not stop the aggressor from declaring war This solution gives a percentage of the war fee to the decced corp, making it less desirable for someone who has no other reason to dec a corp than actual griefing, to bother because in essence, they are giving their targets ISK from the war fee that was paid.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:33:00 - [11] Edited by: Tippia on 16/11/2010 18:33:36 Originally by: Senghir Your post was both blunt and brief, and contained an obvious falsehood (that anyone in a non-NPC corp "chooses" to be decced. No they don't. Yes they do. it's a choice you may when you create the corp. Corp → Dec. Part of the package. Quote: Your reply was also irrelevant. My topic has nothing to do with whether people should be war decced or not. I dont even object to the fact that grief war decs are possible (see original post). They aren't. "Griefing wardecs" don't exist. Moreover, you certainly are objecting ù after all, the thread is about mechanics to stop it. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:37:00 - [12] Originally by: Joe SMASH I posted about decs in a war dec thread. But completely out of context. That's like me posting about a walktrhough to Worlds Collide in a thread asking for help with The Blockade, simply because both subjects are about missions. Originally by: Joe SMASH When you join a player corp, you know that you can be decced. Therefore you choose to accept that risk. That is completely different to what you wrote originally. Now you are talking about choosing to accept the risk, whereas before you were implying that someone actively requests a war dec simply by existing in a player corp. That is incorrect. Originally by: Joe SMASH Go back to NPC corps if you cannot hack playing Eve. Ah yes, clearly because I am writing about a pvp mechanic, I must hate EVE and pvp in particular. If you knew me at all, you'd realise our corp regularly engages in PVP, and that I myself did faction warfare twice before this, and dabbled in 0.0 with CVA even before that. Given the above, I maintain that you were simply trolling, and that now you're just trying to save face and claw back some sort of integrity. I would just stop if I were you.
Max Cetera Capital Researchs Inc.	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:41:00 - [13] Posting in an Carebear Empire Whine Thread.
Professor Tarantula Hedion University	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:42:00 - [14] Large organized PvP corps who only look for small corps full of month old characters to dec, are griefers. There's no two ways about it. Please don't insult meaningful wars by saying it's the same thing. My Warmest Regards. Prof. Tarantula, Esq.
Vertisce Soritenshi O.W.N. Corp OWN Alliance	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:45:00 - [15] This thread is full of fail. The OP posts complaining of something that does not exist and as soon as someone gives a legitimate reply he accuses them of trolling and then refuses to accept the perfectly logical and common sense responses everybody else gives. Greifer Wardec's DO exist...but thats half the point of a wardec...to grief another corp or alliance. If you don't like it or don't want to be wardec'd then don't create a corp and stay in one of the starter corps. End of story.
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:45:00 - [16] Originally by: Tippia it's a choice you may when you create the corp. Corp → Dec. Part of the package. Don't talk such rubbish. If I walk across a road, I stand a chance of being hit by a car. That doesnt mean that by choosing to cross a road that I choose to be run over. No-one disagrees that being part of a player corp means you run the risk of being warred. Originally by: Tippia "Griefing wardecs" don't exist. From wiki: Wiki link "A griefer is a player in a multiplayer video game that purposely irritates and harasses other players." I don't even need to elaborate.
Alyth Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:45:00 - [17] Originally by: Senghir Originally by: Joe SMASH I posted about decs in a war dec thread. But completely out of context. That's like me posting about a walktrhough to Worlds Collide in a thread asking for help with The Blockade, simply because both subjects are about missions. Originally by: Joe SMASH When you join a player corp, you know that you can be decced. Therefore you choose to accept that risk. That is completely different to what you wrote originally. Now you are talking about choosing to accept the risk, whereas before you were implying that someone actively requests a war dec simply by existing in a player corp. That is incorrect. Originally by: Joe SMASH Go back to NPC corps if you cannot hack playing Eve. Ah yes, clearly because I am writing about a pvp mechanic, I must hate EVE and pvp in particular. If you knew me at all, you'd realise our corp regularly engages in PVP, and that I myself did faction warfare twice before this, and dabbled in 0.0 with CVA even before that. Given the above, I maintain that you were simply trolling, and that now you're just trying to save face and claw back some sort of integrity. I would just stop if I were you. How many people saying the same thing does it take for you to get that you are in fact talking absolute rubbish? 1. 'Griefing' wardecs do not exist, and to a greater extent griefing in EVE does not exist. Just because you don't like having something done to you, it does not constitute being griefed. 2. You chose to be in a player corp so sadly you gotta roll with the punches involved with that choice. 3. There are already countermeasures to being wardecced such as a: fighting back b: getting some friends to counterdec them c: joining an npc corp for the duration. Seriously, I don't know why people who are so PvP adverse continue to play a game that is quite obviously not for them and then complain about there being non-consentual PvP in a PvP orientated game. If you don't like it either adapt or realise that EVE may not be quite the game you are looking for.
Barakkus	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:45:00 - [18] Figure out what made you the target and stop doing that. Problem solved. Originally by: captain foivos Who would recruit someone named Barakkus? Wait a minute...
De'Veldrin Minmatar Green-Core The Obsidian Legion	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:49:00 - [19] I'm curious to know what a "griefing wardec" is - I was under the impression that griefing - as defined by CCP, is: Originally by: Eve Online Support ...consistently maliciously interfering with the game experience for others... Issuing a wardec does not seem to fall into that description. --Vel
Joe SMASH You Got A Purty Mouth	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:50:00 - [20] In case OP wakes up and realises he is playing a PvP game where decs are meant to be the risk of player corps. Then deletes his post to try and save face. Linked OP from Eve-Search ----------------------------------- Originally by: Kali Zero Warp core stabilizers are like condoms. Nice and safe, but they make it a little less fun for everyone involved.
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:53:00 - [21] Originally by: Alyth 1. 'Griefing' wardecs do not exist, and to a greater extent griefing in EVE does not exist. Just because you don't like having something done to you, it does not constitute being griefed. 2. You chose to be in a player corp so sadly you gotta roll with the punches involved with that choice. 3. There are already countermeasures to being wardecced such as a: fighting back b: getting some friends to counterdec them c: joining an npc corp for the duration. Seriously, I don't know why people who are so PvP adverse continue to play a game that is quite obviously not for them and then complain about there being non-consentual PvP in a PvP orientated game. If you don't like it either adapt or realise that EVE may not be quite the game you are looking for. Just what is the point of your post? Are you deliberately just assuming the opposite to everything I've written? Read my posts. I say a lot more than once that I: 1. Like PVP 2. Do not object to wars How can you be so short sighted? I dont understand how your post is even possible. For the last time, my post is about simply making it inconventient for griefers to actually grief. It does nothing what so ever to wars being possible, and it doesnt cost the aggressor anything extra than it does now (under my preferred solution). How can you possibly read this and then arrive at the conclusions you have?
Flesh Slurper	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:55:00 - [22] A terrible idea... If the 1 man corp is "of no concern" then how can he be a griefer?
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation The Chamber of Commerce	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:57:00 - [23] Originally by: Senghir Edited by: Senghir on 16/11/2010 18:47:15 Originally by: Tippia it's a choice you may when you create the corp. Corp → Dec. Part of the package. Don't talk such rubbish. If I walk across a road, I stand a chance of being hit by a car. That doesnt mean that by choosing to cross a road that I choose to be run over. No-one disagrees that being part of a player corp means you run the risk of being warred. Originally by: Tippia "Griefing wardecs" don't exist. From wiki: Wiki link "A griefer is a player in a multiplayer video game that purposely irritates and harasses other players." I don't even need to elaborate. let's put this on very simple words: see the undocking button? by pressing it, you consent to PvP. see the "create corp" button? by pressing it, you consent to receive a wardec from anyone at any given time by any given reason. extortion is as a valid reason as any other, as is making your life miserable, and in EVE, is as legal as scamming, as long as you are doing it within game mechanics. so, in sum, if you can't take the heat, don't come into the kitchen. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Nicholas Barker Diabolus Ex Machina	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:58:00 - [24] OP is troll/******ed/brazilian/an ex wow player. ------ 0800-LAG-A-NODE
Joe SMASH You Got A Purty Mouth	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:59:00 - [25] Originally by: Nicholas Barker OP is troll/****ed/brazilian/an ex wow player. QFT ----------------------------------- Originally by:** Kali Zero Warp core stabilizers are like condoms. Nice and safe, but they make it a little less fun for everyone involved.
panicsteps	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:59:00 - [26] If you can defeat him so easily, and he keeps intermittently deccing you anyway, why not just wardec him? Hunt him with your more capable members.
mergblue Dreddit	Posted - 2010.11.16 18:59:00 - [27] It would be completely nonsensical for an aggressor to have to pay its victim for the pleasure of destroying it.
Indeterminacy THORN Syndicate Controlled Chaos	Posted - 2010.11.16 19:03:00 - [28] Originally by: Joe SMASH Originally by: Senghir Originally by: Joe SMASH No such thing as 'griefing wardec'. You choose to be in a non-NPC corp, therefore you choose to be decced. End of story. Please refrain from trolling. Ummm... How is that in anyway trolling? I was telling you that part of the risk in being in a non-NPC corp is decs. But ofc any and all disagreeing opinion to yours will be trolling? Nice and closed minded of you. Next time you post, think for a minute past your own nose and realise there is a lot more people in the game than you and your corp. Better yet, n'er post again.
Senghir Amarr Estrale Frontiers	Posted - 2010.11.16 19:03:00 - [29] Originally by: Grimpak see the undocking button? by pressing it, you consent to PvP. Fine with me. Originally by: Grimpak see the "create corp" button? by pressing it, you consent to receive a wardec from anyone at any given time by any given reason. Also fine with me. Originally by: Grimpak extortion is as a valid reason as any other, as is making your life miserable, and in EVE, is as legal as scamming as long as you are doing it within game mechanics. so, in sum, if you can't take the heat, don't come into the kitchen. And one more time, also fine me with me. What's your point? See, if you read all my posts you should be able to notice that none of the above gives me cause for concern. What you and several others here have done is fallen into a very common cognitive bias. "Confirmation bias" to be specific. This link fills me with joy as it really helps highlight most of the hostile responses I've received here. Wiki link: Confirmation bias
Niccolado Starwalker Gallente Shadow Templars	Posted - 2010.11.16 19:04:00 - [30] Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 16/11/2010 19:05:23 Originally by: Grimpak Edited by: Grimpak on 16/11/2010 18:57:29 Originally by: Senghir Edited by: Senghir on 16/11/2010 18:47:15 Originally by: Tippia it's a choice you may when you create the corp. Corp → Dec. Part of the package. Don't talk such rubbish. If I walk across a road, I stand a chance of being hit by a car. That doesnt mean that by choosing to cross a road that I choose to be run over. No-one disagrees that being part of a player corp means you run the risk of being warred. Originally by: Tippia "Griefing wardecs" don't exist. From wiki: Wiki link "A griefer is a player in a multiplayer video game that purposely irritates and harasses other players." I don't even need to elaborate. let's put this on very simple words: see the undocking button? by pressing it, you consent to PvP. see the "create corp" button? by pressing it, you consent to receive a wardec from anyone at any given time by any given reason. extortion is as a valid reason as any other, as is making your life miserable, and in EVE, is as legal as scamming as long as you are doing it within game mechanics. so, in sum, if you can't take the heat, don't come into the kitchen. You could also add by signing into EVE you decides to play the game on its 8 years or so old game terms. I do have a feeling though the OP is a troll.. Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL.

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