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Machinist III
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Posted - 2010.12.22 22:12:00 -
[1]
I propose that while a wreck is being tractor beamed the ownership of said wreck becomes that of the (gang/fleet/corp/individual) using the module.
A popular trend at least that my corporation has noticed is while salvaging our missions with a Noctis, ninja salvagers will move in close to the Noctis and wait for it to tractor beam wrecks close and proceed to salvage these wrecks. While I do not particularly care for ninja salvagers, I do understand that nothing can be done to them since it has been previously determined that wrecks floating in space belong to no one, thus making the activity of "ninja salvaging" completely legal.
However, while a wreck is being tractor beamed ownership should become that of the individual using the module and any attempt made by another individual outside the allowed group(gang/fleet/corp) to salvage this wreck becomes an illegal action, giving the tractor beam user full right to engage the offender.
While the goal of this proposal is not to give people the ability to outright destroy ninjas, it does make it so that the job of the ninja does not become a complete cakewalk where everything is brought right to them.
In Summary:
- A tractored wreck falls under the ownership of the person using the module
- Ownership only lasts while the tractor beam is on
- Makes it to illegal to salvage a tractored wreck
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2010.12.22 22:28:00 -
[2]
Your Noctis can salvage faster than the ninja salvager. Use T2 salvagers, use Salvage Tackle rigs, train up the ORE Industrial skill. Salvage the large wrecks first as a priority. Run missions in less crowded systems. These are simple things you can do to beat the ninja salvagers.
EVE is a PvP game, right down to the scavenging on the battlefield.
-- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
Glyken Touchon
Independent Alchemists
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Posted - 2010.12.22 22:28:00 -
[3]
This is where the salvager cycle time bonus of the noctis kicks in. all other things being equal, your salvagers will finish cycling before theirs, so you get the stuff.
It won't work every time and you'll have to adjust your methods and only tractor 1 or 2 wrecks at a time, but it helps.
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Machinist III
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Posted - 2010.12.22 23:08:00 -
[4]
While I do understand that the Noctis should out salvage anything a ninja would use the fact is it doesn't 100% of the time. I don't care as much if the ninja is buzzing around salvaging wrecks, what bothers me is how some will sit right next to your ship or even between your ship and a wreck and salvage as it goes by. The purpose of creating ownership of a wreck in a tractor beam is to prevent those who would use the Noctis' ability against the original salvager. Having ownership would allow the tractor beam user to prioritize large wrecks and salvage those with little worry while still allowing a ninja salvager the chance to salvage the other wrecks in the area.
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Thyme Wasted
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Posted - 2010.12.23 08:40:00 -
[5]
Aw, I was hoping this would be a vote to allow tractoring of wrecks that don't belong to you.
Would have voted for that.
Not supported. If you aren't getting enough salvage in your own missions, try salvaging someone elses.
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2010.12.23 14:37:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Machinist III I don't care as much if the ninja is buzzing around salvaging wrecks, what bothers me is how some will sit right next to your ship or even between your ship and a wreck and salvage as it goes by.
Just wait until you find out that the bounty for NPC kills goes to the pilot who scored the killing blow.
In the meantime, you need to realise that this is a PvP game and ninja salvaging is as acceptable a career as mission running. To many people, mission running is an abomination which must be stopped. To many people, ninja salvaging is an abomination which must be stopped.
You can avoid the PvP aspects to some extent by avoiding the systems with lots of players.
-- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
Distromon
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Posted - 2010.12.23 15:29:00 -
[7]
PvP game, lets look at that call shall we. There is low sec and high sec, the game is built to accomadate both the nonconfrontational person and the person that wants to shoot someone because they can't do that legaly in real life. Calling EVE a PvP game is a shallow concept. Also, if you hate mission running so bad then petition for it to be dropped, I dare you. The fact is that ships like the Noctis were designed with wreck ownership in mind and the 'abandon wreck' feature supports this idea. This one request is not a big leap.
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2010.12.23 21:35:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Distromon PvP game, lets look at that call shall we. There is low sec and high sec, the game is built to accomadate both the nonconfrontational person and the person that wants to shoot someone because they can't do that legaly in real life. Calling EVE a PvP game is a shallow concept.
Hisec is meant to be safeer, not safe. PvP still happens in hisec, witness ninja salvaging, suicide ganking, faction warfare. You consent to PvP action when you undock. To claim otherwise is to hide one's head in a bucket and claim that the world doesn't exist.
Quote: Also, if you hate mission running so bad then petition for it to be dropped, I dare you.
I'm a hisec mission-running carebear. Yet I encourage people to explore ninja salvaging as a career. Perhaps I'm conflicted, or perhaps I just recognise that EVE is the game that everyone makes it.
Quote: The fact is that ships like the Noctis were designed with wreck ownership in mind and the 'abandon wreck' feature supports this idea. This one request is not a big leap.
This one request is a huge leap. I would go exactly the opposite direction and suggest that all wrecks should either spawn as abandoned, or only have "ownership" until the mission-runner hands the mission in.
Just because some people get upset about other people salvaging faster than them, doesn't make ninja salvaging unfair. You need to leave your sense of entitlement at the login screen, and take the required action to protect yourself from having all your wrecks salvaged from underneath you. That required action is (a) salvage faster, (b) run missions in uncrowded systems, or (c) give up on salvaging as a career.
-- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
Machinist III
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Posted - 2010.12.24 03:53:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Mara Rinn
...only have "ownership" until the mission-runner hands the mission in.
This is a great suggestion because it helps both parties. I realize that some people that run missions do not salvage it and just turn the mission in leaving the actual wrecks and loot in their ownership making the ninjas job a pain. Extending "ownership" of the wrecks(including salvage rights) to the mission runner only while the mission is active and not turned in would solve many problems.
I would support a compromise that would make it so that when the mission is turned in the wrecks are considered abandoned. This is an advantage to the ninja salvagers by allowing them to more quickly do their job by allowing them to use tractor beams. It is also an advantage to players and corporations who salvage their missions to gain materials to build rigs. It keeps ninjas out of mission runners hair while still allowing ninja salvagers a clear, safe opportunity to make their own living on abandoned mission wrecks.
It's a win win situation.
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