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Isaac Apylon
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
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Posted - 2011.01.04 17:19:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Isaac Apylon on 04/01/2011 17:19:59 I really, really want to try a Pilgrim vs your fit. It would either go terribly, terribly wrong, or terribly, terribly well.
Edit: I suspect the latter.
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/ |
So Sensational
GREY COUNCIL Nulli Secunda
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Posted - 2011.01.04 18:35:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Conor Todaki
Originally by: So Sensational Edited by: So Sensational on 04/01/2011 08:28:04 lol blasters on a ship without a hybrid bonus
Meh, i have them trained so i use them.
Get ACs, use the same setup, trust me.
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Soldarius
Caldari Northstar Cabal R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.01.05 06:17:00 -
[33]
I would like to point out that with a 400m3 cargohold, your Myrm can only hold 12 Cap booster 800 charges, each one of which completely fills a medium cap booster. Using two medium cap boosters simultaneously, your cap boosting will run out after 132 seconds, including reload time. 400m3/32m3=12.5units. 12units/2modules*(12sec cycle+10sec reload)=132sec of cap boost.
Because one cycle of both cap boosters fills your cap by more than 50%, you must micromanage your cap boosting with extraordinary diligence or you could easily run out of cap. In addition, one must look at the time spent between cycles. Your cap will be completely drained from 100% to absolutely 0 in 34 seconds with everything running.
I'm assuming they reload in the same manner as missile launchers. As in they fire, cycle once, then spend x seconds (10?) reloading? If this is so and my numbers are right, after they both fire once, they will cycle for 12 seconds, then spend another 10 reloading. That is 22 seconds of your total 34 seconds of cap life doing absolutely nothing except discharging, leaving you with only 12 seconds to remember to turn them back on. Is it workable? Sure. Chance of forgetting with everything going on (keeping distance, watching drone hp, other combat tasks)? Significant.
Also, I don't know what stats you are using for speed, but according to EFT with both ships set at all level 5s, no over heat, and using the same meta 4 MWD, the drake gets 1038m/s, while the myrm gets 982m/s.
Also checked on the tank. Myrm would ofc show a great tank with even damage distribution. But in actual combat, that is never the case, most especially against a drake, which will swap right to explosive missiles from kinetic. Even then, the dps gain from using exp missiles is not very big due to the kinetic bonus the drake gets.
The other and arguably the biggest issue with the blaster myrm is range. You have a max range of 5300 meters, 3.8 of which is falloff. You had better land right on top of your target or you are totally and thoroughly screwed, as it will simply kite you to death.
A quick run through of the numbers shows that in a raw slugfest a HAM drake would require roughly 990 seconds to kill your myrm. Myrm can eat through a well resisted active tanked drake in 152 seconds. These numbers were calculated using appropriate damage types and resists. My active tanked HAM drake fit to follow.
BCS II x2 PDS II DC II
MSB II Inv Fld IIx2 YT-8 MWD Warp Disr II MCB II w/400s
AML IIx7 w/Fulmination Rage
Rigs: Anti-EM Ancillary Current Router Field Extender
Drones: Warrior II x5
Originally by: Manowar With dreams to be a king first one should be a man.
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Artemis Rose
Clandestine Vector
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Posted - 2011.01.05 09:22:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Artemis Rose on 05/01/2011 09:22:04 Anything in the BC class that you can catch, you can definitely kill.
Unfortunately, EVE isn't about perfect 1v1, and the inability to disengage from targets will get you killed more often than you'd like.
*** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats |
Korg Leaf
Time Bandits.
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Posted - 2011.01.05 12:09:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Soldarius I would like to point out that with a 400m3 cargohold, your Myrm can only hold 12 Cap booster 800 charges, each one of which completely fills a medium cap booster. Using two medium cap boosters simultaneously, your cap boosting will run out after 132 seconds, including reload time. 400m3/32m3=12.5units. 12units/2modules*(12sec cycle+10sec reload)=132sec of cap boost.
Because one cycle of both cap boosters fills your cap by more than 50%, you must micromanage your cap boosting with extraordinary diligence or you could easily run out of cap. In addition, one must look at the time spent between cycles. Your cap will be completely drained from 100% to absolutely 0 in 34 seconds with everything running.
I'm assuming they reload in the same manner as missile launchers. As in they fire, cycle once, then spend x seconds (10?) reloading? If this is so and my numbers are right, after they both fire once, they will cycle for 12 seconds, then spend another 10 reloading. That is 22 seconds of your total 34 seconds of cap life doing absolutely nothing except discharging, leaving you with only 12 seconds to remember to turn them back on. Is it workable? Sure. Chance of forgetting with everything going on (keeping distance, watching drone hp, other combat tasks)? Significant.
Also, I don't know what stats you are using for speed, but according to EFT with both ships set at all level 5s, no over heat, and using the same meta 4 MWD, the drake gets 1038m/s, while the myrm gets 982m/s.
Also checked on the tank. Myrm would ofc show a great tank with even damage distribution. But in actual combat, that is never the case, most especially against a drake, which will swap right to explosive missiles from kinetic. Even then, the dps gain from using exp missiles is not very big due to the kinetic bonus the drake gets.
The other and arguably the biggest issue with the blaster myrm is range. You have a max range of 5300 meters, 3.8 of which is falloff. You had better land right on top of your target or you are totally and thoroughly screwed, as it will simply kite you to death.
A quick run through of the numbers shows that in a raw slugfest a HAM drake would require roughly 990 seconds to kill your myrm. Myrm can eat through a well resisted active tanked drake in 152 seconds. These numbers were calculated using appropriate damage types and resists. My active tanked HAM drake fit to follow.
BCS II x2 PDS II DC II
MSB II Inv Fld IIx2 YT-8 MWD Warp Disr II MCB II w/400s
AML IIx7 w/Fulmination Rage
Rigs: Anti-EM Ancillary Current Router Field Extender
Drones: Warrior II x5
I think you greatly underestimate the myrmidons tank or how long the cap actually lasts in a real situation
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Lenartowicz
FireStar Inc Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2011.01.05 18:39:00 -
[36]
what the f kind of drake fit is that?
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Indeterminacy
THORN Syndicate Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2011.01.05 21:05:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Lenartowicz what the f kind of drake fit is that?
I know rite? Lol, he really needs to fit some purgers (3x).
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Medidranda Livoga
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Posted - 2011.01.06 00:34:00 -
[38]
Switch to 180mm medium autocannons for improved range and switchable damage types, fit T2 MWD/web/scram and 2 electrochemical injectors with navy charges. I think I would also just go with three nanobot accelerators since cap is plenty for 1vs1 or 1vs2 fight.
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Zarbane
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Posted - 2011.01.07 02:02:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Zarbane on 07/01/2011 02:08:56 [Myrmidon, Double repper] Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Armor Explosive Hardener II Tracking Enhancer II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 400 Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 400 Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Disruptor II Stasis Webifier II
425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M
Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I
Ogre II x2 Hammerhead II x2 Hobgoblin II x1
Alternatively...
[Myrmidon, PvP, TD] Gyrostabilizer II Tracking Enhancer II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Armor Explosive Hardener II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Warp Disruptor II Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I
425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 425mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M
Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Projectile Collision Accelerator I Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Hammerhead II x2 Ogre II x2 Hobgoblin II x1
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Aerilis
Gallente Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.07 02:22:00 -
[40]
Damage Controls are your friends.
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Zarbane
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Posted - 2011.01.07 03:01:00 -
[41]
Think a Damage Control would be better then an explosive hardener in this case?
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Aerilis
Gallente Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.07 03:21:00 -
[42]
Damage Control would be better than nearly any other module you can put in a low slot.
Just play around with the numbers in EFT, you'll see just how much of an improvement it is.
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Korg Leaf
Time Bandits.
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Posted - 2011.01.07 08:46:00 -
[43]
Drop the tracking enhancers on boths fits for a damage control really, possibly drop the guns on the dual rep fit down to 220s and lose that ancillery router rig then
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Jejju
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Posted - 2011.01.07 11:14:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Conor Todaki
(Triple Rep Myrm Fitting)
Has 1000 DPS tank overloaded for 1 minute with exile booster and 830 without Overloaded. It puts out around 500 DPS and can run for awhile with plenty of cap boosters. Compared to the other BCs this owns and could probably fight more than one at a time.
This just seems crazily over powered to me? Tell me if i'm wrong.
You might be right for the mythical 1v1, or on Sisi, but on the real server this fit will get owned.
The problem is that it is too slow. It is slower than any ship it can kill. If your opponent is solo they will run away, if they engage, they have a bunch a friends next door ready to gank you and you have no exit strategy. You might get the occasional kill by luck or from idiots, but that's true of any fit.
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Lugalzagezi666
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Posted - 2011.01.07 11:29:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Jejju ...
Wrong. But it takes some skills to choose/avoid fights in armor tanked bc so is not for noobs and incompetent pvpers. Also managing mars, cap boosters and drones isnt really easy, so i suggest it only to experienced pvpers. Also mythical 1v1s are not so mythical if you know what are you doing.
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Jejju
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Posted - 2011.01.07 14:06:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Lugalzagezi666
Originally by: Jejju ...
Wrong. But it takes some skills to choose/avoid fights in armor tanked bc so is not for noobs and incompetent pvpers. Also managing mars, cap boosters and drones isnt really easy, so i suggest it only to experienced pvpers. Also mythical 1v1s are not so mythical if you know what are you doing.
Just claiming that I'm wrong doesn't really help anyone. Could you explain how to find these 1v1's, how to catch ships with this set-up, and how to avoid getting blobbed?
Being specific would be useful. Could you maybe outline a couple of scenarios?
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Alvia Div
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Posted - 2011.01.07 23:56:00 -
[47]
Edited by: Alvia Div on 07/01/2011 23:58:38 as already suggested, ditch the blasters for autocannons, the ship isn't even bonused for hybrids, and you save loads of cap for the reppers. not to mention the awesomeness of ACs compared to blasters |
Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2011.01.08 00:34:00 -
[48]
Edited by: Omara Otawan on 08/01/2011 00:35:17
150mm rails arent that bad either, dont really eat a lot of cap and are pretty flexible in respect to range.
Some people swear on pulse laser myrms, but they are kinda hard to fit with triple reps.
You'll struggle to get more than 4 FMPs + 2 DLPs on there, eats a bit more cap than the rails, but good deal for ranged damage (given the things you'll struggle to catch are shield tanked BCs). They are quick on the switch to short range as well.
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Kalle Demos
Amarr Hysteria Nexus
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Posted - 2011.01.08 10:11:00 -
[49]
It would be so fun to watch you fight a pilgrim or a curse, I would go with a cane or a double rep myrm tbh, 3 reps is just stupid
Originally by: Kool StoryBro <---
Originally by: CCP Spitfire Spam post removed.
Random forum moments <0> |
Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2011.01.08 10:23:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Kalle Demos 3 reps is just stupid
Blanket statements are just stupid tbh.
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Lugalzagezi666
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Posted - 2011.01.08 11:28:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Jejju ...
Use scouts, intel channels, map/dotlan, alot of safespots /never warp to gate without at least scaning it from ss/, check ppl in local, look at their killboards, analyze scan to find out what ships are they using, dont take obvious baits, when fighting try to fight split them on gates and kill them 1 by 1. Learn when to deagro and jump, learn what you can kill in 1 minute/before you die.
If you are jumping into unscouted system that has 10 kills in last hour according to your map, you deserve to be blobed. If you take bait even guy baiting has absolutely no solo killmail on killboard, you deserve to be blobed. If you engage smaller ship and you are not aligning to ss while you are killing him, you deserve to die.
Dont forget when you are soloing in bc /except maybe 0.0 with bubble or stupid oponents/, you cant force your target to fight you, as he can simply reapproach gate and jump, mwd away or just warp. Think about it before fight and think about ships who can kill you 1v1 - and be very careful when engaging ships that cant do much else than tackle you for some time.
Also when looking for 1v1s go to more quiet systems, jumping into enemy core systems and looking for 1v1s is stupid /not that they need 20 ppl to kill you, they just want to get on your killmail/.
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Conor Todaki
ASTER MINER
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Posted - 2011.01.08 21:29:00 -
[52]
Ok, nice discussions going on, I'll probably cross-train ACs while i'm at it but i'll do it at the end and use myrm with blasters till it's done.
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Kn1v3s 999
Gallente Gung-Ho Guns
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Posted - 2011.01.10 03:36:00 -
[53]
thst' s why everyone use shield Cane and drakes, because Myrm is OP
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Aznwithbeard
Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.01.12 07:10:00 -
[54]
Edited by: Aznwithbeard on 12/01/2011 07:15:10
Originally by: Conor Todaki Here's a bit of EFT warrioring but before I cross-train lemme just see if this looks right:
[Myrmidon, Solo PvP Active] Damage Control II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Scrambler II X5 Prototype I Engine Enervator
Light Neutron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge S Heavy Electron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I
Active Drones Ogre II x2 Hammerhead II x2 Hobgoblin II x1
Inactive Drones Warrior II x5 (Frig killers) Vespa EC-600 x5 (Gtfo)
Has 1000 DPS tank overloaded for 1 minute with exile booster and 830 without Overloaded. It puts out around 500 DPS and can run for awhile with plenty of cap boosters. Compared to the other BCs this owns and could probably fight more than one at a time.
This just seems crazily over powered to me? Tell me if i'm wrong.
LOL blasters on a myrm. Who does that? dual 180s w/ a triple rep+2eanms / 220s with a dual rep + 3x active hardeners. range problem solved. 2x med boosters / eccm + scram and mwd. Everything dies - the end. Guns don't kill people. onowait. |
Schwester 6666
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Posted - 2011.01.21 13:50:00 -
[55]
Surly Triple Rep Myrmidon with Autocannons (Blasters wtf...?) is a Rock but it has 2 weak Points:
1. Range (even with 220 Vulcans) 2. Speed
so there is a good Chance to kill such a Myrmidon with a Hurricane if u fit & fly the Cane the right way. U just need to tweak the Cane little bit nano and utilize it with combat drones to possibly outtake that Monster
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Korg Leaf
Time Bandits.
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Posted - 2011.01.21 13:57:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Schwester 6666 Surly Triple Rep Myrmidon with Autocannons (Blasters wtf...?) is a Rock but it has 2 weak Points:
1. Range (even with 220 Vulcans) 2. Speed
so there is a good Chance to kill such a Myrmidon with a Hurricane if u fit & fly the Cane the right way. U just need to tweak the Cane little bit nano and utilize it with combat drones to possibly outtake that Monster
The triple rep myrm is only really good on gates where you can control the engagement range somewhat, a nano shield cane could kill one eventually but thats only if he starts the fight outside scram range, if not that cane will melt very quickly
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Schwester 6666
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Posted - 2011.01.21 14:06:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Korg Leaf
The triple rep myrm is only really good on gates where you can control the engagement range somewhat, a nano shield cane could kill one eventually but thats only if he starts the fight outside scram range, if not that cane will melt very quickly
Sure but which good Pilot would start the Fight in range of the myrm ? , that Pilot must be crazy...
when i fight a myrm no matter what kind of ship i fly, i expect 2 things of a myrm: 1. maybe neuts 2. maybe scram & web
so when i know i can't tank a lot or i can't deal enough dps to melt the myrm fast enough no matter what tank she has... i start the fight offrange.
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Korg Leaf
Time Bandits.
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Posted - 2011.01.21 14:44:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Schwester 6666
Originally by: Korg Leaf
The triple rep myrm is only really good on gates where you can control the engagement range somewhat, a nano shield cane could kill one eventually but thats only if he starts the fight outside scram range, if not that cane will melt very quickly
Sure but which good Pilot would start the Fight in range of the myrm ? , that Pilot must be crazy...
when i fight a myrm no matter what kind of ship i fly, i expect 2 things of a myrm: 1. maybe neuts 2. maybe scram & web
so when i know i can't tank a lot or i can't deal enough dps to melt the myrm fast enough no matter what tank she has... i start the fight offrange.
Yeah you dont always get that choice though, which was kinda my point. You catch a myrm on a gate in your cane, he will just burn back to the gate tanking you unless hes an idiot
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Wolodymyr
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Posted - 2011.01.23 08:09:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Conor Todaki Myrmidon seems to own everything of it's size.
Every fly a Drake? |
DarkAegix
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Posted - 2011.01.23 14:37:00 -
[60]
Nerf all Gallente ships! This is outrage! I cannot believe!? CCP fix the broken! What is happen!? Why Gallente good!?! Make stop! |
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