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joshua boston
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Posted - 2011.01.05 06:01:00 -
[1]
1. Everyone thinks everyone in militia chat is a "spy" 2. 96% of the people in militia chat are only there because their corps decided to join FW despite their apparent high population of sissies unwilling to part with internet spaceships 3. *******s in Player Corps deciding it's better to war dec fellow militia corps instead of the *******s living on the other side of the border. 4. Very few people willing to change the status quo.
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Mina Lott
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Posted - 2011.01.05 07:04:00 -
[2]
1. Theoretically, the people who normally talk in the militia chat are Statepro pilots or 1 man corp pilots. The larger corps hold themselves away from the main channel because of lack of rules. There is no way to control an ignorant/stupid/annoying statepro pilot. At least by absorbing a potential member into a organised body, discipline can be reinforced and behaviour curbed to match the corps behaviour.
2. Part of the problem is from 1 man corps with a couple of sad hanger ons. See above.
3. I assume you're talking about the largest militia corp who willingly recruits everyone in sight as long as they can fly drakes =p. Only rejections being total ******s. I assume they are roleplaying and believe that the rest of militia are being traitorous scum. The other two largish independant corps being Wolf's brigade(and allies) and The Lost Legion. (if i missed any other largish corps I apologise.)
4. Believe me, many have tried. But how do you make people you have no hold over obey you? It's EvE. Someone has to willingly agree to follow you, regardless of reason else they will just laugh loudly and make you look dumb. We have a number of capable FC's and we're slowly building up. It's just about time.
Mina
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Mutant Miner
Caldari Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.05 09:21:00 -
[3]
Originally by: joshua boston 1. Everyone thinks everyone in militia chat is a "spy" 2. 96% of the people in militia chat are only there because their corps decided to join FW despite their apparent high population of sissies unwilling to part with internet spaceships 3. *******s in Player Corps deciding it's better to war dec fellow militia corps instead of the *******s living on the other side of the border. 4. Very few people willing to change the status quo.
1.) That's because they usually are. Then again, spaiz aren't hard to implant into a player corp anyway. 2.) Try joining a militia not populated by moronic carebears. 3.) Some people just ask for it. 4.) See the post above mine.
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2011.01.05 10:55:00 -
[4]
Originally by: joshua boston ...4. Very few people willing to change the status quo.
Goddess knows I tried. Mankind is generally opposed to change, genetic survival thing, so unless it is forced like an act of God (or CCP) status quo is all you get.
Problem is that people do not question what is, when it comes to FW it is merely a massive wardec and most are happy with that .. even though it is available practically everywhere. All the points you make apply to all of Eve and are not specific to FW in any way.
CCP has abandoned FW, just like they did COSMOS back in the day. Best we can hope for is bug-fixes and new bugs as they seem to appear every time CCP changes anything anywhere - blame the stupid mash-up code they used for FW.
If you are planning a crusade to "fix" FW then good luck but I'd advise you to give up .. Two years we have tried with the backing of almost all significant RP factions, we have intentionally abused flawed mechanics, we have posted walls of text, we have *****ed and moaned .. and still get nothing but a bug-fix once in a while.
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Bluejacket CT
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.05 14:17:00 -
[5]
THAT'S WHAT A SPY WOULD SAY! ~
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Oathborne
Caldari Genstar Inc
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Posted - 2011.01.05 15:36:00 -
[6]
Congratulations on starting a interesting and informative thread! I've never seen it's like before.
A+
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Bad Messenger
draketrain
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Posted - 2011.01.05 15:41:00 -
[7]
These problems has nothing to do with game mechanics. Ccp can not fix players.
This is good game but players suck !
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Bad Messenger
draketrain
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Posted - 2011.01.05 15:47:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Mina Lott
3. I assume you're talking about the largest militia corp who willingly recruits everyone in sight as long as they can fly drakes =p. Only rejections being total ******s. I assume they are roleplaying and believe that the rest of militia are being traitorous scum. The other two largish independant corps being Wolf's brigade(and allies) and The Lost Legion. (if i missed any other largish corps I apologise.) Mina
You are making wrong assumptions here.
Draketrain wardeced 2 corporations because those were demanding that draketrain should stop shooting gallente militia. It has nothing to do with rolepaying. We do recruit everyone, you do not have to fly drake. Draketrain is biggest independent Caldari militia corp, i would say that even wolfbrigade is tied to work more under terms of other militia corporations than draketrain.
It is fine to see that you believe all propaganda that is trolled in forums.
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Merdaneth
Amarr Angel Wing.
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Posted - 2011.01.05 17:30:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Bad Messenger These problems has nothing to do with game mechanics. Ccp can not fix players.
This is good game but players suck !
It has everything to do with game mechanics.
Players are predictable.
A. It is easy to insert spies in a channel B. There is no way to remove spies from a channel even if recognized C. Most people will stop using the channel to relay info D. A dead channel creates a high barrier of entry for new players
This is something that can be easily anticipated. A good game designer takes such human behaviour into account and designs the game around it. Eve is designed to allow a certain level of cheating, scamming, spying etc., but only to a certain extent.
What would you think would happen if you couldn't kick people from a corp? Game mechanics allow for kicking people from corps, because otherwise many corps would soon be dead corps. ____
The Illusion of Freedom | The Truth about Slavery |
Bad Messenger
draketrain
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Posted - 2011.01.05 18:07:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Merdaneth
Originally by: Bad Messenger These problems has nothing to do with game mechanics. Ccp can not fix players.
This is good game but players suck !
It has everything to do with game mechanics.
Players are predictable.
A. It is easy to insert spies in a channel B. There is no way to remove spies from a channel even if recognized C. Most people will stop using the channel to relay info D. A dead channel creates a high barrier of entry for new players
This is something that can be easily anticipated. A good game designer takes such human behaviour into account and designs the game around it. Eve is designed to allow a certain level of cheating, scamming, spying etc., but only to a certain extent.
What would you think would happen if you couldn't kick people from a corp? Game mechanics allow for kicking people from corps, because otherwise many corps would soon be dead corps.
FW mechanic is quite good infact. NPC corp allows every one to join, it do let spies etc in but 'team killers' will be kicked out quite soon.
Corporations who join militia can use tight recruitment policy and ensure that spies can not enter important positions, this is hard on every corporation or alliance are they in militia or not.
In practice new player may have hard time joining fleets because there has been lot of spies who have done lot of troubles in fleets, so if new member want to be seriously involved FW he should join to some player corporation or do longer career in NPC militia and get some trust.
Draketrain has open recruitment policy because our ways to work does not give much information for spies, we do not have corporation hangars to flip etc. If you want to know our fleet setups or something you can just look our killboard.
Allowing internal wardecs gives one tool to handle internal issues. Only issue is NPC militia corporation which can include lot of spies etc, that is why member will be treated badly, but that is the cost of the fact that no one can kick people out of militia for example to prevent competition in Faction Warfare missions and selling LP shop items. NPC corporation is also way to participate FW without 3th party wardecs.
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Othran
Ad Infernum
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Posted - 2011.01.05 19:07:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Othran on 05/01/2011 19:07:51
Originally by: Bad Messenger
FW mechanic is quite good infact. NPC corp allows every one to join, it do let spies etc in but 'team killers' will be kicked out quite soon.
I disagree that the "FW mechanic" is in any way "good".
You can have an alt in the opposing militia repping you and your buddies and it has NO EFFECT on that alts standing to the faction. In fact if the opposing militia try to kill your repper THEY take the standing hit as they have killed a "friendly"
Its not an exploit and its totally nonsensical.
Thats FW.
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Von Kroll
Caldari Kroll's Legion
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Posted - 2011.01.05 22:31:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Othran Thats FW.
That's one very niche hypothetical. Sure, its possible--perhaps even prevalent in your experience, but not mine. The fleets and combat I've been engaged in have been very competitive, and very much conforming to the intent of the mechanics. I agree with BM, that the overall mechanics of FW are good and work to create good PvP.
To the OP, I'd suggest getting some more experience in FW before you make up your mind. There are plenty of corporations that will accept new guys into fleets. Just don't have the expectation that a simple "x" in militia chat will instantly get you into a fleet to go out and pound bad guys.
And, Devil Dog, look me up if you want to join a fleet. I just don't actively solicit on the militia channel.
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Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2011.01.05 22:48:00 -
[13]
The problem with FW is that CCP's lead game designer hates it, wishes it was never added, and wants you all to stop playing it.
Coupled with the fact it's the best part of the whole game.
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Dirk Smacker
United Space Marine Corp
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Posted - 2011.01.05 23:07:00 -
[14]
Originally by: joshua boston 1. Everyone thinks everyone in militia chat is a "spy"
I think I'm a spy? Maybe I do think I am a spy. Who said that? Hey, stop controlling my brain!
Originally by: joshua boston 2. 96% of the people in militia chat are only there because their corps decided to join FW despite their apparent high population of sissies unwilling to part with internet spaceships
96% of people don't know how to drop corp roles? Protip: You need to drop roles before leaving a corp. That comes in handy when you are forced into faction warfare and/or surrounded by sissies.
Originally by: joshua boston 3. *******s in Player Corps deciding it's better to war dec fellow militia corps instead of the *******s living on the other side of the border.
I was there when that poop first went down. It's amazing how warped that story has become. And I approve. People getting along is boring.
Originally by: joshua boston 4. Very few people willing to change the status quo.
In a 2008 chronicle, CCP made Tibus Heth out to be Space Obama (at least space policy-wise). How's that hope and change working out for you?
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Bad Messenger
draketrain
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Posted - 2011.01.05 23:54:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Othran Edited by: Othran on 05/01/2011 19:07:51
Originally by: Bad Messenger
FW mechanic is quite good infact. NPC corp allows every one to join, it do let spies etc in but 'team killers' will be kicked out quite soon.
I disagree that the "FW mechanic" is in any way "good".
You can have an alt in the opposing militia repping you and your buddies and it has NO EFFECT on that alts standing to the faction. In fact if the opposing militia try to kill your repper THEY take the standing hit as they have killed a "friendly"
Its not an exploit and its totally nonsensical.
Thats FW.
They do not lose standing if repping guy is flashing red after repping target they were shooting.
You can always shoot your own militia members if they are flashing red.
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