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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2011.01.28 07:53:00 -
[1]
I really hate it when CCP puts no thought into new items and just sets them all at 6%. We had the same with the Epic arc implants that where worse than the standard implants for a long time.
Now we have the new Concord implants which are just so rubbish on the whole. The Epic arc Shield implant gives more DPS tankable then the Concord implant. Why spend months grinding up a Concord 6% hitpoint implant when a weekend at the Epic arc will give you a better shield implant?
As for the KYA3000 why would anyone grind up all that LP just to gain well under 20DPS extra to their tank over a KYA2000. Many of the other implants are just as bad.
Months grinding 250k LP to add 1% to shield recharge is not balanced.
Months grinding 250k LP for the 6% hitpoint implant to add less to your shield tank then an easy to get over a weekend Epic Arc implant is not balanced.
I am sure lots of the other implants are just not worth the grind or worse then other implants in game.
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How to Passive Shield Tank T2
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Aessoroz
Nohbdy.
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Posted - 2011.01.28 07:59:00 -
[2]
Months for 250k LP? My main has around 100k already, quit ya whining
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2011.01.28 08:02:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Pottsey on 28/01/2011 08:04:57
So even if I got the timeframe for LP's wrong you think it's ok for the best 250k Concord implants to be next to useless as there are easier to get better implants?
You think 250k of LP's is worth 10dps tankable extra to your ship? If its even that much, most ships will see far less.
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How to Passive Shield Tank T2
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.28 09:14:00 -
[4]
For the majority of them the 6% implants will just be best in their class, so they will be worth selling. I would however be surprised if 2% and 4% implants ever become useful.
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
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Posted - 2011.01.28 09:14:00 -
[5]
Exponential costs for an extra edge? I fail to see the problem here.
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"Just because I seem like an idiot doesn't mean I am one."
~Unknown |
Aline Kia
Caldari
FireStar Inc
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2011.01.28 10:03:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Aline Kia on 28/01/2011 10:04:16
 Originally by: Pottsey
As for the KYA3000 why would anyone grind up all that LP just to gain well under 20DPS extra to their tank over a KYA2000. Many of the other implants are just as bad.
Months grinding 250k LP to add 1% to shield recharge is not balanced.
You'd be surprised. I think your thinking too small. 1% may be nothing for smaller ships, but for a supercap... now you're talking.
EDIT:
seems this LP store is more geared to capital ships now that i think about it some more.
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2011.01.28 11:08:00 -
[7]
ShahFluffers ôExponential costs for an extra edge? I fail to see the problem here.ô
The problem is some implant(s) are exponential costs for a worse edge. Some of the implants lower tanks for exponential costs. Anyway can you really call 10dps tank a real edge?
Aline Kia said ôYou'd be surprised. I think your thinking too small. 1% may be nothing for smaller ships, but for a supercap... now you're talking.ö
If I recall correctly 1% recharge gives even less to supercaps then it does to smaller ships.
I just did the math. One of the 250k Concord implants lowers a supercap tank by 3dps. The other implant gives you 25 more DPS. Not bad for 300k of implants 
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How to Passive Shield Tank T2
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2011.01.28 11:22:00 -
[8]
The Arcs are one-shot deals whereas Concord store can be raided continually.
In a few weeks when the incursions are reduced to grindable content by exploiting whatever flaws there are the LP stuff will flood the markets.
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2011.01.28 12:39:00 -
[9]
Arcs are not a one shot deal. I ran the Gallante one a fair few times now.
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How to Passive Shield Tank T2
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n00n3r
Caldari
Malicious Destruction
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Posted - 2011.01.28 18:29:00 -
[10]
don't forget that the pre-reqs for the concord implants are lower. that alone sets them apart.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2011.01.28 20:56:00 -
[11]
they look like they were pretty lazily added to me, but I think the big draw is the meta cap mods. but hey, that doesn't stop me from wanting a set of 6% hardwires in my head
and I love that you make the whole thing about passive shield tanking....
but hell, using your logic why grind away at the epic arc for that one implant that is only a bit better than the 5% one in that slot.
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Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.01.28 21:08:00 -
[12]
I am looking forward to the 6% missile hardwirings. :)
-Liang
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Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
On Twitter
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Swynet
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Posted - 2011.01.28 21:31:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Swynet on 28/01/2011 21:31:23
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
In a few weeks when the incursions are reduced to grindable content by exploiting whatever flaws there are the LP stuff will flood the markets.
You will allways find stupid people to put billions for 1% or peanuts, not because the 1% will make their ship better, just to show and say to others the price they've puted in. They feel important.
I love those.
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Zhim'Fufu
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Posted - 2011.01.28 21:37:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Swynet
Edited by: Swynet on 28/01/2011 21:31:23
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
In a few weeks when the incursions are reduced to grindable content by exploiting whatever flaws there are the LP stuff will flood the markets.
You will allways find stupid people to put billions for 1% or peanuts, not because the 1% will make their ship better, just to show and say to others the price they've puted in. They feel important.
I love those.
Or possibly they are just so rich they don't see any reason to not use them. Do you really think its going to matter to Bill Gates that his $500,000 exotic sports car is only a bit faster or nimble than a first class mass produced car costing hundreds of thousands less? To people like him the the money is irrelivant which is why that exotic sports car costs $500k. I would simply be the one selling to him and smile. 
Originally by: Response to bitter carebear tears in local
[19:44:46] CCP Incognito > sorry i can't talk about game mechanics. you need to use your brains and figure it out.
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Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.01.28 21:37:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Swynet
You will allways find stupid people to put billions for 1% or peanuts, not because the 1% will make their ship better, just to show and say to others the price they've puted in. They feel important.
I love those.
First off, it's an extra 2.2% DPS. Furthermore, what if that 1% more raw damage combined with "1%" better damage application (remember its a curve) is what means your missiles 1 volley instead of 2 volley something?
A series of 1% bonuses is what makes the difference between 50M ISK/hr and 100M ISK/hr.
-Liang
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Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
On Twitter
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Ephemeron
Lubricous
Rebel Alliance of New Eden
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Posted - 2011.01.28 21:41:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Ephemeron on 28/01/2011 21:41:25
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Ephemeron
Lubricous
Rebel Alliance of New Eden
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Posted - 2011.01.28 21:43:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Swynet
You will allways find stupid people to put billions for 1% or peanuts, not because the 1% will make their ship better, just to show and say to others the price they've puted in. They feel important.
I love those.
When economy is based on stupid people, you get an economic crisis.
Case in point: USA 2007
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Val'Dore
Word Bearers of Chaos
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Posted - 2011.01.28 22:41:00 -
[18]
I vote for 10% implants.
~No matter what happens, somebody will find a way to take it too seriously.~ |
Ephemeron
Lubricous
Rebel Alliance of New Eden
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Posted - 2011.01.28 23:04:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Val'Dore
I vote for 10% implants.
8% would be more reasonable
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Sokratesz
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Posted - 2011.01.30 07:29:00 -
[20]
Woah, a pottsey thread. Long time no see.
Vote Sokratesz for CSM-6! |
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SFX Bladerunner
Minmatar
Aperture Science inc.
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Posted - 2011.01.30 11:57:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Val'Dore
I vote for 10% implants.
YES! because there isn't already enough of a rift between newbies and veteran players.
The problem with extreme bonus implants is that they make it possible for vets to just own newbies in similar or even bigger ships.
It is impossible to know what kind of implants someone has in other than experiencing first hand (by being shot or shooting).
All this does is make pvp even less fun for new players as where before a vet in a rifter could own a newbie's rupture, with 10% implants we're going to see rifters taking on battlecruisers (figuratively speaking naturally).
Imagine being a newbie, not being able to gauge an enemies' potential simply because shiptype has become an increasingly smaller factor.
Seriously, anything beyond +5% in my books is OP and game breaking. Discuss.
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History is much like an endless waltz, the three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.. |
Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2011.01.30 15:19:00 -
[22]
SFX Bladerunner said " Seriously, anything beyond +5% in my books is OP and game breaking. Discuss."
It depends on the implant. A 6% bonus to weapons does not have the same impact as 6% bonus to shield recharge. 6% cap recharge then some of the other 6% implants.
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How to Passive Shield Tank T2
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Lindsay Logan
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Posted - 2011.01.30 17:06:00 -
[23]
Tbh, KYA already suck on non passive setups anyways.
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De Guantanamo
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Posted - 2011.01.30 17:12:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Pottsey
SFX Bladerunner said " Seriously, anything beyond +5% in my books is OP and game breaking. Discuss."
It depends on the implant. A 6% bonus to weapons does not have the same impact as 6% bonus to shield recharge. 6% cap recharge then some of the other 6% implants.
Do you think it makes you special to quote people differently than everyone else?
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Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.01.30 17:35:00 -
[25]
Originally by: SFX Bladerunner
All this does is make pvp even less fun for new players as where before a vet in a rifter could own a newbie's rupture, with 10% implants we're going to see rifters taking on battlecruisers (figuratively speaking naturally).
Eh, I don't think that's even remotely close to true. The situation you describe is primarily caused by insufficient support skills and the player's inexperience - the vet's experience, implants, and deadspace gear has relatively little to do with it.
-Liang
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Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
On Twitter
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Kastsumi Kobayariel
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Posted - 2011.01.30 22:07:00 -
[26]
Mostly because I haven't checked at all, but I wonder if the 2%/4%/6% fitting implants will open a whole new ship fittings range.
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2011.01.30 22:16:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Eh, I don't think that's even remotely close to true. The situation you describe is primarily caused by insufficient support skills and the player's inexperience - the vet's experience, implants, and deadspace gear has relatively little to do with it.
-Liang
Let's take the extreme example shall we: Slaves.
Ever tried taking down a BC/BS using those appalling things? If you do not have them and the opponent does you lose.
Implants and modules have a lot of impact on the outcome of a fight, If that was not the case then the Angel ships would never have been omni-present, 30km points wouldn't sell and T3's would never be used for anything other than boosters.
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Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.01.30 22:51:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
Let's take the extreme example shall we: Slaves.
Ever tried taking down a BC/BS using those appalling things? If you do not have them and the opponent does you lose.
Implants and modules have a lot of impact on the outcome of a fight, If that was not the case then the Angel ships would never have been omni-present, 30km points wouldn't sell and T3's would never be used for anything other than boosters.
Yes, yes I have. If you'll notice, none of those things are 1-2% differences - and most of them require completely different ship hulls. Adding 6% (or 7 or 8% or 10%) hardwirings aren't really going to make that huge of a difference. We won't really be seeing rifters taking out BCs then that wouldn't already be taken out now.
Yes, it will make a difference. No, its not that big of a difference.
-Liang
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Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
On Twitter
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Aamrr
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Posted - 2011.01.31 02:29:00 -
[29]
A full slave set constitutes a 53.63% increase in armor hit points. Comparing that to the CONCORD implant sets is a joke.
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Headerman
Minmatar
Metanoia.
Test Alliance Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.01.31 05:10:00 -
[30]
Who would PVP with 6% implants anyway?
How much money would be wasted if ya get podded? Keep the 6% implants for PVE only.
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