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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.13 18:22:00 -
[1]
I hear if you add "devs please read" to your post you are entitled to a dev response.
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.13 19:00:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: DarkTemplarCrimsonWolf
Originally by: Tippia
It makes complete sense: it's competitive PvE ù you need to do it better than the other guys. It's the way PvE in EVE should work.
Really? It makes complete sense? You'd be moaning like a fog horn if that happened to you and I find it ludicrous for you to say such imbecilic things when no aspect of EVE is even remotely competitive (PVP? 60-70% tactics the rest luck, mining? grindtastic but needs to be done, PVE/missions? slightly less grindtastic than mining but even level 4s aren't that profitable if you don't have the mental resilience for 7-8 hours of click, bang, boom then rinse and repeat for the next 10 battleships). Incursions as they are are poor copies of other MMO raids and only serve to do one thing: **** people off, the entry level for them isn't even remotely noob-friendly, the reward system is borked and don't even get me started on the fact that incursions in and of themselves weren't required, get the damn treaty system out (ya know the one that was pulled from Dominion at the last second), add a few more wormhole classes (so that can get more fun), something to those degrees, not something maybe 20-30 % of the player population will ever participate in ( you try getting a decent fleet together without an alliance ).
Why do you have an active subscription if you dislike the game so much?
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 13:53:00 -
[3]
Edited by: XXSketchxx on 14/02/2011 13:53:00
Originally by: Tippia
They're a limited resource among a huge number of people hunting for them, so getting there first, getting the good ones, and getting the actual goods is all a matter of beating everyone else.
Originally by: Idiot
Point 2: Find a region where few people roam with that intent.
Swing by lonerek some time and start exploring. I fit a dead space afterburner for the sole purpose of overheating and beating competitor explorers that I find in complexes to the loot.
Why is it so hard to believe everything in Eve is competitive?
Eve is a pvp game. Player vs. Player. In all aspects. If you don't like it but you still want to "play" eve...head on over to the test server.
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 14:23:00 -
[4]
Originally by: CrimsonRockWolf
Also the whole exploration thing isn't well explained, exploration is the activity by which you could get free (or next to free) stuff which ordinarily would cost you quite a bundle thus the competition that exists is out of greed if nothing more (wanting to get that Pith X-type for free for example).
I donÆt know about you but I value my time. Nothing I find in exploration is ôfree.ö My time costs money and that cost is reflected in the sale price of my goods.
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Cost/benefit considerations aside incursions should be a bit more accessible than they already are and the only way that will come about is by instancing them
Why should one of the most challenging forms of PvE be noob friendly?
And instancing is not going to happen. Its not Eve. As Tippia pointed out, everything in Eve is interconnected. Instancing would ruin that.
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it should be possible for another fleet to go in and try to oust the current fleet (hell that might even make me interested in it again ^^).
Go to low sec incursions? Then you can waste the other fleet before you finish the mothership off and you will be guaranteed the loot (provided you survive).
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 15:42:00 -
[5]
Edited by: XXSketchxx on 14/02/2011 15:42:05
Originally by: Kepakh
Originally by: Tippia
There are no consumers, only traders.
The system cannot consist of traders/producers only as there would be no faucet for goods, no one buying final products.
Tell CCP that their Consumer Pirice Index they keep monitoring is bull**** because there are no consumers in EVE.
Hopeless dumbass...
You're being pedantic you moron.
Obviously people consume goods, but before they do so, they trade (i.e. acquire) those goods. This is competition because they may be using buy orders to get the best price they can or they may be buying from sell orders, but still going after the cheapest one they can get.
The point is there is competition in the entire circle.
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 16:42:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Kepakh
Originally by: XXSketchxx
You're being pedantic you moron.
I am might tend to be pedantic, maybe a moron but Tippia has no idea what she talks about.
Enough said:
Originally by: Tippia
Because CPI is the name of the metric, not of the functionality.
Did you like just finish up an Econ 101 class and are now trying to prove your prowess?
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 17:52:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Valarre
Originally by: Tippia
It makes complete sense: it's competitive PvE ù you need to do it better than the other guys. It's the way PvE in EVE should work.
This in my opinion is utter nonsense. This is a gawd damn game, it's not like you are competing to be a ceo of a damn fortune 500 company in real life.
yeah cause games can't be competitive 
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People need to be getting the rewards they diserve for the time they put in. The payout system for incursion is by far the worst system I've seen put in place since this game first started.
Go to low sec and do incursions then. I'm sure the payout system will work much better there considering there will only be one fleet alive (if any) at the end
In high sec, things are going to be very competitive and rewards tight. The most efficient fleets will get the rewards. Get over it.
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 18:07:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Valarre
Listen, you guys are wrong. It is not right to stiff 60 man fleets from pay for their efforts just because another fleet came in and ganked a mothership at the last second. That is dead wrong. They did all the work, the other fleet didn't. It amazes me that CCP has put in such a bastardly bass ackwards system that allows this type of thing to happen. You guys who agree with this system, remove your mouth from the dev's weenus and look around at all of threads posted on the forums about how terrible of a system it is. Maybe if you weren't so far up CCP's bum eating hershey kisses you'd figure it out.
What are you 12 years old?
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 18:41:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Jacquelin Ayalin
Well, Id have to disagree about pvp, everything about it is just cheap tactics, not competitive gameplay.
Very rarely is pvp a mutual activity between both parties.
Most of the time, pvp is some cheeseball ambush initiated by someone who is camping a stargate (ironically, they usually go after the ones who are autopiloting and are in some sort of indy ship). Of course, there is also the cheeseballs that will attack a miner because they know that miners are always vastly outgunned compared to a decent killing vessel.
If pvp in Eve were competitive, we would see some sort of battlegrounds where competitions were held to allow for people to mutually dual each other. A mechanic could exist in the game where I could '/duel' someone and the game would allow us to fight in high sec with no penalties provided the other person agreed to the dialog box that would pop up (the fight would stop automatically when one player had one HP left on their hull - thus preventing the other ship from being blown up) and if people wanted to duel to the death, a '/duelhc' option could exist.
Im sorry, pvp isnt competitive, its about people ganking other unsuspecting players in 99% of all situations.
'Que all the gankers to start their defensive rants now'
You are describing ship combat pvp, which is one of the many forms of pvp in Eve. You consent to it every time you undock a ship on Tranquility.
Pvp is player versus player. This is not limited to ship on ship violence.
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 19:04:00 -
[10]
Edited by: XXSketchxx on 14/02/2011 19:04:43
Originally by: Jacquelin Ayalin
First, I know exactly what pvp is.
Secondly, "You consent to it every time you undock a ship on Tranquility." is simply BS.
Thats like saying, every time you walk out of your house onto public property, you consent to being ****d, murdered or robbed.
And Im sorry, I just dont buy that EVERYTIME you yourself undocks that you are saying to the world, 'ok, I consent (which means 'to agree') to anyone in the game to begin attacking'. There are probably more occasions than you would care to admit where you cross your fingers and hope you get from point A to point B without any incident. It happens all the time in corps (for example, moving fuel for a POS from a locale it was purchased to the POS - escorts arent always available).
consent: to give assent or approval : agree <consent to being tested>
You're either new to the game, or deluded.
By consent, I mean that you consent to the inherent risks associated with flying a ship in Eve.
And obviously you don't know what pvp is, because you only addressed ship combat pvp. What about market pvp? What about mining pvp? What about exploration pvp?
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 19:30:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Tippia
It's like willingly moving to ****-murder-robber-ville where the way to say good morning to your neighbour is to ****, murder, and rob him and where, since that is the tradition, all of it is legal (and the reason you move there because you're quite fond of ****, murder and robbery).
àand then stepping out of your house.
Best post in these threads all day.
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.14 20:47:00 -
[12]
Quote:
"Mining PvP: I steal "your" asteroids; you get nothing. I make bank; you get ganked (because I want to make them my asteroids)."
Yea, except this isnt really PVP. There is more than enough ore for everyone in the game. No real competition for ore. It gets to busy in my system? No problem, there is 7000+ other systems to move to.
I was thinking in terms of rare ores/gas harvesting.
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"Exploration PvP: I take "your" sites and drops and escalations and you're left empty-handed."
Again, more than enough sites for everyone, again, no real competition.
This is actually a great example of pvp. Sites, and subsequently drops, are rare. I'm pretty sure if I snag a 400 mil isk prize out from under you after you have completed a site, you will be pretty mad. Player versus player? Check.
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"Market PvP: I steal your trade and force you to come down in price (or spend more for the same stuff) until you have to buy or sell at a loss."
Player versus player? Check
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Competition isnt pvp.
Yes it is. Competition implies two or more players are competing, i.e player versus player.
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For the love of God, lets stop making up new words just for EVE. PVP is generally used for combat and should remain as such (unless you can convince all the other mmo's to coin the term for every other aspect of their game that 'might' encompass competition.
Yes in other games pvp is a term used for combat between two players. Its not in eve. In eve, everything can be traced back to pvp on some fundamental level.
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This is what I dont understand. The whole system does NOT fall apart without competition. There doesnt have to be competition in every aspect of the game and this notion of 'he who does the most damage during the incursion gets 100% of the loots" is absurd. I am glad I read this, I have no interest in taking part in the incursion and no offense CCP, this aspect of the game is poorly thought out.
waaaah
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