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tla s'hpyt
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Posted - 2011.03.02 10:02:00 -
[1]
First let me make this clear. By aligning I mean pointing in the direction of the target you want to warp to and not moving at all. aligning at speed (any speed) obviously helps.
I've been told to align and just stay at 0 as it helped you warp faster for so long I just do it automatically now. Yet for some reason I decided to consider this with what I know of eve physics and it seems like a load of crap. Eve doesn't have a turning rate, all it has is time to get to speed. I even looked at the time to warp formulas and couldn't find any way the direction your ship is pointing at 0 m/s would make a difference (not that I fully understood those formulas).
So I decided to do some tests. I got 2 characters with the same ship and same skills then I got a third pilot to act as FC making them group warp (best way I could think of to make them warp simultaneously).
Test 1 (control): both ships pointed towards target both at speed 0. Result: They both warp at same time in same warp bubble (able to see each other in warp).
Test 2 (theory): 1 ship pointed directly away from target 1 pointed towards both at speed 0. Result: They both warp at same time in the same warp bubble (able to see each other in warp).
Test 3 (blarg): 1 ship pointed directly away traveling at 1/10 speed, 1 pointed towards at speed 0. Result: ship traveling towards arrives just barely first (they couldn't see each other in warp).
Test 4 (Yarr): 1 ship pointed directly away traveling at 0, 1 pointed towards at 1/10 speed. Result: ship traveling towards arrives just barely first (they couldn't see each other in warp).
In closing, I am an idiot. I've either been wasting time pointing my ship all these years when it doesn't help or I am just too tired and brain fried atm to think properly. Which kind of idiot am I?
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El'Niaga
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2011.03.02 10:08:00 -
[2]
You leave out some important information, like what sort of ship you used and what skills they had.
Ships with higher agility and lower mass will suffer less from being pointed in wrong direction than ships with lower agility and high mass.
Thus if you used a frigate and/or cruiser then the test would probably come as you state.
If your in Battleships, Battlecruisers, Mining Barges etc then the impact of such is much greater.
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Jupix
Minmatar MuroBBS United
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Posted - 2011.03.02 10:08:00 -
[3]
This is most apparent when you fly a carrier or larger. If you're not aligned, the ship will warp sideways (takes longer to turn the ship than to jump to warp).
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CCP Spitfire
C C P C C P Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.02 10:15:00 -
[4]
Moved from 'EVE General Discussion'.
Spitfire Community Representative CCP Hf, EVE Online |
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tla s'hpyt
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Posted - 2011.03.02 10:15:00 -
[5]
Originally by: El'Niaga You leave out some important information, like what sort of ship you used and what skills they had.
Ships with higher agility and lower mass will suffer less from being pointed in wrong direction than ships with lower agility and high mass.
Thus if you used a frigate and/or cruiser then the test would probably come as you state.
If your in Battleships, Battlecruisers, Mining Barges etc then the impact of such is much greater.
ships: both where bestower unfitted
Evasive maneuvering, spaceship command and navigation where all at 5 on both characters. 1 character has amarr industrial 4, 1 has it at 5. That's the best I could do in that regards with me and my alts
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Cygnus Zhada
Custodians of Athra
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Posted - 2011.03.02 10:25:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Cygnus Zhada on 02/03/2011 10:26:25 The game engine sees ships as points, both in regards to tracking (no use trying to "turn" your ship/guns towards a target) as movement. The time it takes to get into warp (or to "active align") has nothing to do with where the ship is pointing, all that matters is in what direction it is moving. The ship pointing and turning is just the model being adapted to what vector it is doing, the speed at which the turning is happening is just mimicking it's inertia.
Quote: I've either been wasting time pointing my ship all these years when it doesn't help
Yup.
--- Stultorum infinitus est numerus.
EVE tutorials
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Jowen Datloran
Caldari Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2011.03.02 10:26:00 -
[7]
When your speed is ZERO the initial direction of the ship has NO effect on the time it takes to enter warp.
People flying freighters are experiencing this all the time, as it takes exactly the same time to enter warp no matter what direction the ship is facing after entering a new system using a star gate. Undocking the ship from a station and make it turn to enter warp, on the other hand, is extremely time dependent on the direction of the ship upon undock.
-- Mr. Science & Trade Institute - EVE Lorebook - Mysteries of W-space |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.02 11:13:00 -
[8]
Originally by: El'Niaga You leave out some important information, like what sort of ship you used and what skills they had.
Ships with higher agility and lower mass will suffer less from being pointed in wrong direction than ships with lower agility and high mass.
Thus if you used a frigate and/or cruiser then the test would probably come as you state.
If your in Battleships, Battlecruisers, Mining Barges etc then the impact of such is much greater.
Nop, passive alligning or whatever FCs call it is a myth and does not help in any way.
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Trader KUGA
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Posted - 2011.03.02 11:35:00 -
[9]
Ships doesn't have to look in the direction that they will warp to in order to get in warp speed...
Best example of this are big ships like carriers dreads or better freighters...
You can see lots of freighters warping sideways :) for short distances, some freighters can't even point straight even they come out from the warp bubble
So for ships staying in 0 speed, there is no align+warp time difference... however, if a ship is moving reverse direction of the point it will warp, it will have to stop first in order to thrust in the reverse direction. But like I said, in order to perform a thrust in the warp direction, ship doesn't always have to point the thrust direction... Turn of the ships are basically an illusion, what matters is in which direction the ship boosting its thrust... That's why you can see lots of nano ships doing stunts like donuts or drifts :) especially nano machs
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Corporal Punishment08
NosWaffle Nostradamus Effect
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Posted - 2011.03.02 22:19:00 -
[10]
When you put your speed to 0, and funny thing happens, and your ship falls out of alignment in many cases, which is odd since we're in space...
_____________________________________ Real men corpse tank. |
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Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2011.03.02 22:26:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Furb Killer
Nop, passive alligning or whatever FCs call it is a myth and does not help in any way.
Yet it still is done regularly. The hostile FC will certainly appreciate it though
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.03.03 00:05:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 03/03/2011 00:05:21
Originally by: Omara Otawan
Originally by: Furb Killer
Nop, passive alligning or whatever FCs call it is a myth and does not help in any way.
Yet it still is done regularly. The hostile FC will certainly appreciate it though
I've heard that FC's call for passive alignment because: a) Don't know better, and think it helps. b) Understand it makes no difference, but request it to see who is paying attention by watching which ships move.
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Cygnus Zhada
Custodians of Athra
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Posted - 2011.03.03 00:21:00 -
[13]
Option B makes sense if you're dealing with idiot zombies, one of the reasons I stay out of 0.0 |
Bluejacket CT
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.03.03 20:55:00 -
[14]
"Passive alignment" usually means burning at less than full speed towards a celestial, not completely stopped. While the effect is minimal, on slower ships it can buy you an extra second or two in acceleration time which could pay off if you really need to bail.
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Daool
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Posted - 2011.03.04 05:50:00 -
[15]
'passive alignment' also has the benefit of focusing everyones attention on 1 point, particularly if a large fleet may be stationary for a few minutes.
2-3 minutes of nothing, and then the FC wants everyone warped to one point in a hurry is easier when everyone is already focused on 1 point.
So it helps the 'wetware' (ie the player) not the game mechanic.
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Jagga Spikes
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2011.03.04 09:26:00 -
[16]
passive alignment is next to useless. ships can't insta warp, and fleet is losing coherence. so, all the disadvantages, and no advantages. either properly align, or stay put. ________________________________ : Forum Bore 'Em : Foamy The Squirrel - [jedi handwave] "There is no spoon." |
1600 RT
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Posted - 2011.03.05 12:30:00 -
[17]
to start a warp you need two things: 80% of your speed and being pointed in the right direction
if the time your ship to aling in the right direction is higher than the time it take to get up to 80% of its speed the passive align will help you a bit to warp faster
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Jitaherp Derp
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Posted - 2011.03.05 12:46:00 -
[18]
Originally by: 1600 RT to start a warp you need two things: 80% of your speed and being pointed in the right direction
if the time your ship to aling in the right direction is higher than the time it take to get up to 80% of its speed the passive align will help you a bit to warp faster
You will just warp not aligned
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Valentina Vasilev
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Posted - 2011.03.05 13:12:00 -
[19]
Originally by: 1600 RT to start a warp you need two things: 80% of your speed and being pointed in the right direction
if the time your ship to aling in the right direction is higher than the time it take to get up to 80% of its speed the passive align will help you a bit to warp faster
75%, not 80. And it doesn't matter where your ship is pointing, what matter in which direction it is moving (this is not necessarily the same thing). Passive align won't help one bit.
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Cypher V
Minmatar Critical Mass Technologies
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Posted - 2011.03.14 03:27:00 -
[20]
I had my CEO try and convince me of this.
Fact is, NO, it doesn't change a damn thing.
Test: Need a freighter and a rapier
1) Jump freighter into a system - You're now perfectly still, and not really aligned to anything 2) Warp freighter to an object 3) The INSTANT that freighter decloaks, whack 3-4 webs on it with the rapier. 4) See that insta warping freighter go.
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