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NinjaSpud
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Posted - 2011.03.24 21:40:00 -
[1]
I've seen a few 'stop mining bots' threads pop up recently. I could resurect my old stop macro mining thread, but instead, I have a new idea.
What if, after you can fly hulks, you can deploy mobile mining platforms. That act in the same way moon harvesters work. they constanlty run, brining in a little ore each cycle, but can be set to run all day. They could be like mini pos's w/ out the shields or defences. They could be destructable by enemyies so high sec wars might have a new twist in controlling certian astroid belts.
Couple this with more gave site spawns, and I think the usefullness of bots would be eleminated. IDK what do you guys think?
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Mimiru Minahiro
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Posted - 2011.03.24 22:12:00 -
[2]
More passive income streams you say?
Nothing could ever go wrong with that!
I totally support.
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Admiral Leviathan
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Posted - 2011.03.24 22:31:00 -
[3]
more people going afk while mining? awesome idea.
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Barbara Nichole
Cryogenic Consultancy Black Sun Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.24 22:40:00 -
[4]
Let me get this straight, you're saying that the answer to botting is to add an in game botting method? That is the same stupid argument people who want to smoke pot make when they say we can cut down on crime by legalizing recreational drug use.
You are completely ignoring the issues that make botting a deleterious activity. Making the botting ok to do is not going to relieve any issues. Let's look at the issues that plague us due to botting:
1. Mineral prices suck for "honest" miners who take the same risks as botters.. but don't have the time compete.
Adding offical bots will force much worse pricing; minerals would tank to their lowest level in history.
2. Botters are often blamed for eating up available asteroids.
Good luck finding anything to mine if sudden everyone with half a brain realizes that mining offline and afk or even while doing other activities in eve is allowed and necessary to "keep up with the Jones'".
3. Botting by it's nature is an AFK activity. CCP and other players want people to play the game not absentee themself to eve riches. It's an mmo..the idea is to play with others in the world.
Having approved botting in the game would end up reminding me of the scene in the movie, "Real Genius", where all the students in the school stop going to the lectures and instead put recorders at their desks to get the info.. and finally, the teacher too does the same thing, playing a tape of his lecture instead of standing there talking.
Mining is supposed to be a real time activity.. If you want to mine afk there is moon mining. I'm not sure will ever need to add more offline mining ability.
At any rate, I don't see your proposed change addressing any of the bot issues that frustrate people.
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EDISON CLONE
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Posted - 2011.03.27 21:17:00 -
[5]
Sorta like his idea...when was the last time they changed mining? Ocra was what TWO YEARS AGO? I think we can all agree that we need more high end mining ships (high sec one's). What about a very expensive automated in belt ore processor? as an extension to the Ocra meme?
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RaptorXL
Caldari Tax Evasion R US
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Posted - 2011.03.27 21:29:00 -
[6]
I have an idea, why not get rid of security hit to ganking mining ships? You could then warp to belt with miner in a destroyer and if he warps out you flag him as a real person, and if he doesn't and continues to fill up, leaves and comes back, you flag as bot and proceed to gank.
I know this is a stupid idea with thousands of things wrong with it, but it's the exact idea these stupid legalize bot threads deserve.
Besides, it saves me the time of having to wait for the wardec or pay for the wardec on the botters I find...
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EDISON CLONE
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Posted - 2011.03.28 18:04:00 -
[7]
There are thousand of game bots making money in game 14-20 hours a day...couldn't you just flag account that are on more that 80plus hours a week for more than 2-3 weeks at a time? Since game bots are making sooo much money they would put up a huge huge bounty on you 5 times a week.
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Hentes Zsemle
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Posted - 2011.03.28 19:00:00 -
[8]
This could be the only way to stop macros, CCP made a smart move already with selling ingame money directly, they could take it one step further. A proper tool for automating mining could also be optimized for server load, everyone wins.
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Kabaal S'sylistha
Caldari Technomage Trilogy Valor Empire
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Posted - 2011.03.28 20:57:00 -
[9]
The only real solutions are complicate the mining process, or automate it. I always thought the idea of hiring NPC miners to do the same simple task would equate it to what PI will be in the future - A passive income stream that can be attacked and destroyed. The player would still have to hunt down grav sites and tell them where/what to mine, and the mining mechanics could be left the same as an introductory level industrial activity.
I just don't see how it could be made complicated enough without converting it to PI-on-Asteroids anyway, so automation options and being able to have npc fleets of miners would at least even out the game a bit. -More Pewpew, Less QQ- |
NinjaSpud
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Posted - 2011.03.29 15:56:00 -
[10]
MEH, maybe not my best idea. Just wanted to know your guy's oponion.
I do wish mining was more profitable. I mean, in RL people who mine make tons o money. It should reflect that.
We'll see what these anti bot updates do. Im not gonna lie, if mining is actualy profitable I might dust off my old hulk and get'r done
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EDISON CLONE
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Posted - 2011.03.29 16:11:00 -
[11]
This topic was handled by Tu Ko on the 25th march quite well. I would just like to add that in game mining bots are here to stay...we have had to deal with them for YEARS now...it's way, way, past time for CCP to ACT NOW!
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Deliceous
EXPCS Corp SpaceMonkey's Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.29 19:37:00 -
[12]
For passive in come you have PI and Data Cores the Semi laid back of income of mining is needed. I am a group Miners, Direct of group of individuals in Null sec and we go mining as a group, some times as many a 20 Players, some of these people play alts, meaning a total of about 50 accounts (characters) active at once. We have Tanks in the belts, Scouts up the Pipe, Keeping an eye on the intel channel People Boosting, and Compressing the ore People Hauling the ore, People Moving the Compressed or to Refine People Mining.... A lot of people Mining People Scanning down the Hidden Belt in the Upgraded system Everyone Socializing talking about their Opinions of issues in eve or CSM topics
some days this is for the alliance's Ship replacement program and some times it is for profit. it is quite a nice social event.
Most miners mine solo. Sadly they are missing out I thing. So having sanctioned bots I think would ruin this type of game play.
For those PVPer's who can't understand what would be so cool about group mining, gate camping is very similar Except you have Roids that spawn less frequently and shed tears the odd time.
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GizzyBoy
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Posted - 2011.03.30 00:10:00 -
[13]
Originally by: NinjaSpud MEH, maybe not my best idea. Just wanted to know your guy's oponion.
I do wish mining was more profitable. I mean, in RL people who mine make tons o money. It should reflect that.
We'll see what these anti bot updates do. Im not gonna lie, if mining is actualy profitable I might dust off my old hulk and get'r done
people who mine in rl dont make tons of money, they move mtn's of earth to make reasonable money, a ton of gravel aggregate or sand, may cost as little as $1 to the end user with refined crushed rock to a spec anywhere from $2.50 to $5 and for sand if you live where there's a shortage of sand from $3.50 up.
to produce said rock you can easily spend $$$ on hardware alone, then comes permits if you can get them. to get a permit these days is easily a 5-20 year operation to get approval. and no gaurentes of actually getting a quarry / mine even approved.
from time to time i like to jump in on corp mining with couple of orcas 5+ hulks and strip those belts.. it can be fun, and catching up on whats up is fun.
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Faust Paramore
Praetorian Black Guard Frater Adhuc Excessum
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Posted - 2011.03.30 03:12:00 -
[14]
I came into this thread ready to flame, but I actually think there is some merit to this idea. I especially like how these platforms could become war targets.
Of course, balance is the issue--but set up right, it could work. The yield would have to be far less per hour than what a live miner could do, but the gains could be in the fact that it could be left to do itĘs business forą letĘs say, 24 hours max.
ąAnd maybe allow anyone to steal from itĘs cargo hold if itĘs not defended.
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Cassus Temon
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Posted - 2011.03.30 04:35:00 -
[15]
Originally by: GizzyBoy
Originally by: NinjaSpud MEH, maybe not my best idea. Just wanted to know your guy's oponion.
I do wish mining was more profitable. I mean, in RL people who mine make tons o money. It should reflect that.
We'll see what these anti bot updates do. Im not gonna lie, if mining is actualy profitable I might dust off my old hulk and get'r done
people who mine in rl dont make tons of money, they move mtn's of earth to make reasonable money, a ton of gravel aggregate or sand, may cost as little as $1 to the end user with refined crushed rock to a spec anywhere from $2.50 to $5 and for sand if you live where there's a shortage of sand from $3.50 up.
to produce said rock you can easily spend $$$ on hardware alone, then comes permits if you can get them. to get a permit these days is easily a 5-20 year operation to get approval. and no gaurentes of actually getting a quarry / mine even approved.
from time to time i like to jump in on corp mining with couple of orcas 5+ hulks and strip those belts.. it can be fun, and catching up on whats up is fun.
I'm sorry, but when was the last time; you saw somebody make a car out of crushed rock, or sand. Logic Fail. We're talking about precious minerals here.
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GizzyBoy
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Posted - 2011.03.30 04:49:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Cassus Temon
Originally by: GizzyBoy
Originally by: NinjaSpud MEH, maybe not my best idea. Just wanted to know your guy's oponion.
I do wish mining was more profitable. I mean, in RL people who mine make tons o money. It should reflect that.
We'll see what these anti bot updates do. Im not gonna lie, if mining is actualy profitable I might dust off my old hulk and get'r done
people who mine in rl dont make tons of money, they move mtn's of earth to make reasonable money, a ton of gravel aggregate or sand, may cost as little as $1 to the end user with refined crushed rock to a spec anywhere from $2.50 to $5 and for sand if you live where there's a shortage of sand from $3.50 up.
to produce said rock you can easily spend $$$ on hardware alone, then comes permits if you can get them. to get a permit these days is easily a 5-20 year operation to get approval. and no gaurentes of actually getting a quarry / mine even approved.
from time to time i like to jump in on corp mining with couple of orcas 5+ hulks and strip those belts.. it can be fun, and catching up on whats up is fun.
I'm sorry, but when was the last time; you saw somebody make a car out of crushed rock, or sand. Logic Fail. We're talking about precious minerals here.
do you know where steel or al or even ti come from? it comes from ore, which any layman would call rock, its mined by removing overburden then blasted, Crushed to fit through a 2 inch sieve, stockpiled then hauled for further processing, all before it even gets to steel. in the case of glass, it literally is made from sand. so your fail?
so yes cars ultimately come from rock.
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EDISON CLONE
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Posted - 2011.04.02 21:07:00 -
[17]
new people at CCP explain the new anti-bot effort at CCP. please start at 23:20...... Q & A near the end...very interesting
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDSNd_w86Hw&feature=related hopefully all types of game bots will slowly ramp down now
"at the end of the day" ...he must say that about 13 times.. At the end of the day I hope their won't be a buying panic in the minerals market.
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GizzyBoy
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Posted - 2011.04.03 00:08:00 -
[18]
Originally by: EDISON CLONE new people at CCP explain the new anti-bot effort at CCP. please start at 23:20...... Q & A near the end...very interesting
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDSNd_w86Hw&feature=related hopefully all types of game bots will slowly ramp down now
"at the end of the day" ...he must say that about 13 times.. At the end of the day I hope their won't be a buying panic in the minerals market.
ive noticed the market buy and sell orders arnt doing the .1 thing so much so i think some of the trader bots have left the building, which funnily enough has lowered my min buy prices, YAH! only on some mins..
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Gun Hog
Caldari APEX ARDENT COALITION Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2011.04.03 09:36:00 -
[19]
Here is the real problem and the reason I see why people heavily use bots for this: MINING IS BORING! You warp to asteroid field. Target desired asteroid. Flip on lasers and wait until ore comes in. Jettison the ore and fill the container. Rinse and repeat for hours.
The problem here is doing mindless repetitive tasks for an extended period of time. If mining were somehow *fun* like PvP is, while still making a decent amount of ISK, this issue would slowly fade away into the background of space.
I do know what would make mining fun, but something needs to be done to make it more interesting. _______________________________________________
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Ioci
Gallente Morrigna Order
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Posted - 2011.04.03 12:15:00 -
[20]
What you are suggesting wouldn't come in to effect for a very long time. Its a nice idea but it would require huge code rewrites.
Asteroid belts are at specific moons and making mineral mining like moon mining or PI would be something they could do. Add the asteroid to the moons resource tree. Of course to do this you would need to allow for high sec moon mining and that would require they change up moon mats in high sec or simply allow all out high sec moon mining.
Putting a POS online requires you to be in a player corp so you are vulnerable to war dec. The same could be done for Ice belts. For anomoly and mission belts they could be mined with Hulks and the lesser versions of them. Maybe enhance some of the belts to justify the SP put in to a full skilled hulk. Recode mining missions or just get rid of them. They serve no purpose in thier current state in any case.
That's a long way away in any case. Years. I don't see them dedicating Dev team to it. They would rather do shiny stuff for the 10% who live in null.
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EDISON CLONE
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Posted - 2011.04.03 19:56:00 -
[21]
Maybe CCP will buy the pre made bot program and incorporate that into the eve mothership? (buy the source code or the software engineer out) Model what Microsoft did with e-mail...they bought out the entire company? No problems with talent or up grading for 2-3 years that way. I would be very suprised if we are talking about more than a few man months of development time here. Still you have a point about losing time.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zrzr4R3LpsQ
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