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Vheri Hareka
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Posted - 2011.04.06 17:41:00 -
[91]
Originally by: Patient 2428190
Originally by: Copine Callmeknau Because I get 1.5k dps, better tracking than any other gun, and 19km range with void.
for a megathron he has a point. the mega with large neutrons and using null/void charges has better tracking than megapulses with t1/navy ammo (whilst also fitting a tracking computer/tracking script script!) if you use t1 blaster ammo you will have better tracking than even autocannons with say depleted uranium. just don't sit at 0km. blasters are actually quite powerful (on the mega). use a web to keep the target at range and melt.
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Ebrey mark2
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Posted - 2011.04.07 06:57:00 -
[92]
Just remove hybrids. Give Gallente Projectiles and Caldari Lazors. I¦d rather have bonused autocannons on any Gallente hull except the Taranis, but I could live with that.
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Wolfy2449
Gallente WE CAN HAZ CHEEZBURGER
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Posted - 2011.04.07 07:32:00 -
[93]
Isnt armor tank another weakness for blasters?? most gallente shisp use armor tank to be effective, that take all the low slots where a hurricane can just use shield tank and use 3x gyrostabalizers and 2 tracking enchancers to do ridiculous dps since msot range modules give 30% failoff... Plus blasterships have very few mid slots+plus u have to have an afterburner/mwd and other things making the tracking computer even more rare Signature removed for being not EVE related. Zymurgist |
Jerick Ludhowe
Tri-gun
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Posted - 2011.04.07 11:34:00 -
[94]
Too many clowns saying a dmg buff is the solution... Issue has to do with relative fitting requirements, active rep rig draw backs and poorly designed ammo types. Fix these three issues and I think you will say a large swing in favor of Gallente close range pvp.
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Ste Weiss
modro R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:43:00 -
[95]
It's not that difficult to understand the ins and outs of the turret types and their usefulness'.
Hybrids obviously lack range compared to any other turret. However they have awesome potential.
Say your in a Mega and you land on another BS but you have neutron cannons / scram / web? You will kill it no matter what it is. Blasters do have the most DPS in game.
BUT that requires you landing directly on top of it or at least within scram and web range, and they don't help cap, so you do need to cap boost whilst maintaining a tank.
Rails are most likely the worse dps in game, unless you are working with a ship bonus to hybrid dps...the harpy for instance is great at sniping.
Rails are also the general rule of thumb for large scale combat with fleet fights as they easier to change distance etc, but even long range they lack dps.
Maybe CCP should do something to hybrid ammo if they refuse to do anything to hybrid's themselves.
If you fly gallente you dont need to just stick with hyrbids.
Myrmidons work well with autocannons, producing a better tank as well cause they don't require cap. If your ship is a drone boat primarily, means you can actually ignore the bonus to hybrids, generally drone boats are fitted with as much tank as you can. I.E the ishtar.
Blasters are good for solo work, ranis' solo wise, are great blasterboats, plus with the 2 drones u can pull away to rep if need be whilst maintaining damage.
Ste
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Ste Weiss
modro R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:50:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Wolfy2449 Isnt armor tank another weakness for blasters?? most gallente shisp use armor tank to be effective, that take all the low slots where a hurricane can just use shield tank and use 3x gyrostabalizers and 2 tracking enchancers to do ridiculous dps since msot range modules give 30% failoff... Plus blasterships have very few mid slots+plus u have to have an afterburner/mwd and other things making the tracking computer even more rare
They dont have as much problems as the Amarr boats, (apart from arty fit abaddons) lasers use more Cap than Blasters (well i thnk) yet they are use a lot for solo and fleet fights, cause of the dps.
Armour tanking like shield tanking requires a lot of SP work with your background skills then you will find it easier, plus using some drugs to help repping means you are repping more = less cap
Armour is the strongest tank type for fleet fights as it soaks up more damage but in turn your slow as hell.
Shield is strong for solo work as u can nano it to make it faster...harder to track, but using an MWD makes your sig ridiculously high, but does well shield boosting for solo work.
ste
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Yankunytjatjara
Amarr Blue Republic
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:20:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Too many clowns saying a dmg buff is the solution... Issue has to do with relative fitting requirements, active rep rig draw backs and poorly designed ammo types. Fix these three issues and I think you will say a large swing in favor of Gallente close range pvp.
QFT. If that is not enough, then, after a test period, add a damage buff.
And don't forget the tactical overview option for solo/small gangs: Ship Velocity Vectors |
NightmareX
Infinitus Odium Scum Alliance
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Posted - 2011.04.07 15:06:00 -
[98]
Edited by: NightmareX on 07/04/2011 15:13:33
Originally by: Cambarus GTFO-ability is exactly what makes minmatar so good. The ability to disengage (which matar still have more than any other race) equates to the ability to not lose your ship when facing someone with bigger guns. If gallente had that ability they would be just fine as a race, but being FORCED into web/scram range the vast majority of the time is yet another nail in the gallente coffin.
Ok, here is the problem. You guys have turned into weak ***** online where you don't have any balls to make a hard choice of getting into a fight or not with a Blaster ship.
You guys just need to HTFU and risks some ships in a fight instead of going omgwtf, someone is hurting my ship, RUN!11111one!. Ofc, losing ships isn't directly fun, but being on the safe side all the time by having the ability to run all the times if the fight doesn't go you're way will get extremely boring.
It's something called risk vs reward.
With a Mega for example, you just have to think a bit harder if you should take it into a fight or not. Ofc, if you are getting blobbed by a 20 man cruser gang, you wont survive that, but it will be the same with an Armageddon, Abaddon, Hyperion or any of the normal BS'es.
The only thing i see as a little problematic sometimes is that you have to change ammos in the middle of the fight. To like longer ranged ammo like Null L.
So except for that, there shouldn't be any problems with a Mega as long you are fighting on a gate (the big regional gates are excluded here) or a station or anywhere else where you are warping in on top of their asses.
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Michael RGZ
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Posted - 2011.04.10 06:25:00 -
[99]
I use Medium Neutron Blasters T1's. I use them on a Thorax to assault serpentis battle-cruisers, cruisers, and battleships. I use 4 to assault the battle-cruisers and cruisers. I use a full rack to destroy the battleship.
The tactical maneuver here is that the battleships are setup to do maximum damage in the 15km to 35km range, or so. not 500m or 1.500m range. when u add rigs that boost ur turrets rate of fire and tracking speed. u can receive 150 to 200 dps per shot fired on the target at those short ranges. I myself use a mwd, that when active increases my speed to 1500 m/s when in orbit of 500m,my actual orbit is 1700m to 2100m. makes me harder to hit. with the bc and the cruisers its a bit different, they're range is shorter, they can fire excellent dps per shot at really close range. so on them I use the same tactical maneuver as on the battleship, but this time I activate my shield recharger or my armor repairer, they are more than capable of holding them off for a while when I activate my cap booster, which increases battle time. All in all blasters are a excellent turret to use in ratting scenarios or celestial hunting. if pvping, use same setup just T2's instead, also add webifier and warp disruptor modules, with one warp-core stabilizer.
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The Djego
Minmatar Hellequin Inc.
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Posted - 2011.04.10 09:18:00 -
[100]
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Too many clowns saying a dmg buff is the solution... Issue has to do with relative fitting requirements, active rep rig draw backs and poorly designed ammo types. Fix these three issues and I think you will say a large swing in favor of Gallente close range pvp.
Fitting was allways hard on blaster ships. There is no reason to redesign the ammo, everything worked fine the way it was before QR. The main difference is that blaster ships are not worth flown if they can't deal damage at point blank reasonable well in small gang/solo pvp(what you can't without proper range/transversal control with the 60% webs today).
I would agree that one issue is the armor rep/resist rig drawback what makes you basically a brick for no reason.
Also you need more damage in the end, before you consider it as useful turret(ie not getting shredded at point blank by a missle/ak/laser ship). ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
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Songbird
Gallente T.I.E. Inc.
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Posted - 2011.04.11 15:06:00 -
[101]
solo warfare is nearly extinct.
Blasters are good for solo work, and in fact no matter how much you raise their dps and tracking they will always be good for solo work and little else.
Group warfare requires some mid ranged DPS from the guns so the whole group can shoot at the same target without spending 13 hours to get into effective attack range.
Blasters don't fit the bill and changing them would completely destroy their uniqueness - they'd turn into lasers or auto cannons.
The solutions as I've posted 100 times before is to give rails a real punch - the 425 should have the dps of a tachyon.
As a compensation their range should be severely cut down , making them the shortest ranged long range guns - similar to blasters which are the shortest range, highest damage short range guns. Their tracking should be somewhat raised to compensate for their short range.
This would make caldari ships, which have no damage bonuses but range bonuses for hybrids actually worth flying.
This would make gallente ships useful in mid range group engagements and give em plenty of dps to compete with the short range with extreme reach guns i.e. AC/PL.
The downside of the solution would be gallente ships extreme vulnerability at extremely short ranges - so the change won't be all roses and rainbow unicorn farts.
You'd see a gall ship and would think - is he using blasters? in which case you can kite it, or is he using rails in which case you'd have to hug it.
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Copine Callmeknau
Kangaroos With Frickin Lazerbeams The KWFL Republic
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Posted - 2011.04.11 18:06:00 -
[102]
Originally by: Michael RGZ I use Medium Neutron Blasters T1's. I use them on a Thorax to assault serpentis battle-cruisers, cruisers, and battleships. I use 4 to assault the battle-cruisers and cruisers. I use a full rack to destroy the battleship.
The tactical maneuver here is that the battleships are setup to do maximum damage in the 15km to 35km range, or so. not 500m or 1.500m range. when u add rigs that boost ur turrets rate of fire and tracking speed. u can receive 150 to 200 dps per shot fired on the target at those short ranges. I myself use a mwd, that when active increases my speed to 1500 m/s when in orbit of 500m,my actual orbit is 1700m to 2100m. makes me harder to hit. with the bc and the cruisers its a bit different, they're range is shorter, they can fire excellent dps per shot at really close range. so on them I use the same tactical maneuver as on the battleship, but this time I activate my shield recharger or my armor repairer, they are more than capable of holding them off for a while when I activate my cap booster, which increases battle time. All in all blasters are a excellent turret to use in ratting scenarios or celestial hunting. if pvping, use same setup just T2's instead, also add webifier and warp disruptor modules, with one warp-core stabilizer.
-2/10
Stunning EVE Online Theme for PS3 |
Tyme Xandr
Gallente Dark Circle Enforcement
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Posted - 2011.04.11 23:23:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Michael RGZ I use Medium Neutron Blasters T1's. I use them on a Thorax to assault serpentis battle-cruisers, cruisers, and battleships. I use 4 to assault the battle-cruisers and cruisers. I use a full rack to destroy the battleship.
The tactical maneuver here is that the battleships are setup to do maximum damage in the 15km to 35km range, or so. not 500m or 1.500m range. when u add rigs that boost ur turrets rate of fire and tracking speed. u can receive 150 to 200 dps per shot fired on the target at those short ranges. I myself use a mwd, that when active increases my speed to 1500 m/s when in orbit of 500m,my actual orbit is 1700m to 2100m. makes me harder to hit. with the bc and the cruisers its a bit different, they're range is shorter, they can fire excellent dps per shot at really close range. so on them I use the same tactical maneuver as on the battleship, but this time I activate my shield recharger or my armor repairer, they are more than capable of holding them off for a while when I activate my cap booster, which increases battle time. All in all blasters are a excellent turret to use in ratting scenarios or celestial hunting. if pvping, use same setup just T2's instead, also add webifier and warp disruptor modules, with one warp-core stabilizer.
You PVP with stabs? [≡v≡] |
Misstress Iteron
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Posted - 2011.04.12 02:09:00 -
[104]
I don't have issues with blasters
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Headerman
Minmatar Metanoia. Test Alliance Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.04.12 02:58:00 -
[105]
sooo... what would win: torp and AC phoon or blaster mega?
And i think the idea of changing or removing the drawbacks for active armour tanking rigs is an awesome idea
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Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
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Posted - 2011.04.12 07:39:00 -
[106]
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Too many clowns saying a dmg buff is the solution... Issue has to do with relative fitting requirements, active rep rig draw backs and poorly designed ammo types. Fix these three issues and I think you will say a large swing in favor of Gallente close range pvp.
This does not address the problem of ACs and Pulse being almost as good as blasters at being blasters. Why would you use blasters when ACs and Pulse deal close to blasters' damage at blasters' optimal, but have immensely superior DPS projection? For weapons designed to operate at longer range, ACs and Pulse track far too well.
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Sutskop
PILSGESCHWADER Monkey Circus
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Posted - 2011.04.12 08:24:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Headerman sooo... what would win: torp and AC phoon or blaster mega?
torp and neut phoon
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Swynet
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Posted - 2011.04.12 08:43:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Too many clowns saying a dmg buff is the solution... Issue has to do with relative fitting requirements, active rep rig draw backs and poorly designed ammo types. Fix these three issues and I think you will say a large swing in favor of Gallente close range pvp.
Maybe some changes like fitting requirements improvements: -base 10% increase of the recharge rate to hybrid platforms would help? - Gallente are supposed to be the race where mega corps can do whatever they want, but they can't build a ****ing capacitor that works properly, useful blasters, rails doing dmg and drones that ARE the ubber ultra dmg drones? -wtf?
-add one middle slot?
-reduce armor riggs drawbacks or just add a mwd bonus: when hybrids are active 35-50% reduction consumption capacitor/PG for mwd.
-reduction of fitting requirements for armor reps?
Once this is done only dps it's left, lets see:
Middle slot for warfare or cap?-check Better fitting due to +cap recharge rate and less consumption by rep and mwd -check Do we still have to change Rails/blasters ? -maybe not
Is it enough to apply the 10% dmg blasters are supposed to do? -maybe, 10%+ dps is not that important when every cat/his mother and dog from cruiser to BC can already overall do the same dps because of they r better dmg projection/application/type since they don't miss that much has blasters do.
The important stuff is to be able to apply that +dps in any situation in blasters (total?) range op+fall off and we still have the problem vs T2 stuff, heavy kin/thermal base resists. K kill newbies or overkilled ships but at the gate 1v1 the chances the cane will kick your mega's ass with no effort at same skill/experience is very high.
Do I still think blasters should get some +dps? -yes, blasters are the close range arty's so yes they should have a volley increase higher by ammo tweek or dmg selection with no tracking/capacitor drawbacks.
Is it the perfect solution? -nah, but this would help for sure.
________________________________________________
Originally by: Goose99 In EVE, PVE can happen anywhere, anytime. Whenever you undock, you subject yourself to involuntary PVE.
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Flex Nebura
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.04.12 08:58:00 -
[109]
Originally by: Swynet
Gallente are supposed to be the race where mega corps can do whatever they want.
Thats Caldari you are thinking of.
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Swynet
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Posted - 2011.04.12 09:02:00 -
[110]
Edited by: Swynet on 12/04/2011 09:03:54
Originally by: Flex Nebura
Originally by: Swynet
Gallente are supposed to be the race where mega corps can do whatever they want.
Thats Caldari you are thinking of.
Nah, Caldari are under military so if that should be true than your engineers are worst than junky galenteen ones since your cap is worst
The true galenteen government is made by/for all the corrupted ultra rich mega corps
Edit: Some storylines tell you a lot more about this and how the "president" is elected corrupted etc ________________________________________________
Originally by: Goose99 In EVE, PVE can happen anywhere, anytime. Whenever you undock, you subject yourself to involuntary PVE.
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freshspree
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Posted - 2011.04.12 13:57:00 -
[111]
This is how and why you use blasters.
BLASTER PWNAGE
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Jargo Stonecutter
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2011.04.12 14:49:00 -
[112]
IMHO its not the blasters themselfs where the main problem is but at the ships.
Sure blasters have a bunch of problems like fitting requirements BUT the main problem is getting into range to apply their DPS, a problem i really dont want to see solved by increasing their optimal/falloff. From my pov the easiest solution would be to change the bonuses on the gallente blaster-boats, like getting rid of that MWD-bonus (o/c with a buff to cap) and giving it something usefull that helps to get in range. Sadly the web bonus is already in the hands of the Serpentis and i think you will agree that a speed bonus is out of question but how about a range bonus to warp scramblers? This would enable gallente blasters-boats to actually catch up with their targets as those couldnt use their MWDs.
May you live in interresting times. |
Lubomir Penev
Dark Nexxus S I L E N T.
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Posted - 2011.04.12 14:53:00 -
[113]
Originally by: Lazer Bear I know blaster are up but i would like to ask people who use blasters why exactly they use them?? I mean autocannons or lazers have pretty close dps to blasters but they also start their damage a lot earlier due to range, making the overall damage of the blasters very low compared to the other weapons.
Because your covops warpin let you land straight at optimal?
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ValentinaDLM
Minmatar Zaratha Zarati Shaktipat Revelators
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Posted - 2011.04.12 18:31:00 -
[114]
Originally by: Jargo Stonecutter IMHO its not the blasters themselfs where the main problem is but at the ships.
Sure blasters have a bunch of problems like fitting requirements BUT the main problem is getting into range to apply their DPS, a problem i really dont want to see solved by increasing their optimal/falloff. From my pov the easiest solution would be to change the bonuses on the gallente blaster-boats, like getting rid of that MWD-bonus (o/c with a buff to cap) and giving it something usefull that helps to get in range. Sadly the web bonus is already in the hands of the Serpentis and i think you will agree that a speed bonus is out of question but how about a range bonus to warp scramblers? This would enable gallente blasters-boats to actually catch up with their targets as those couldnt use their MWDs.
I think this is a reasonable idea, after all Gallente alread have a few ships with point range bonuses such as the keres and arazu. This would fit in with the race more than say a velocity bonus.
The only problem though, is that would mean gallente would then get to field it's secondary ewar on combat ships with a bonus, and that would be a bit off balance as we wouldn't have say vagabonds with a web range bonus or zealots with a neut bonus. Though to be fair the primary ewar from gallente was nerfed so hard back in trinity something needs to compensate for it...
But yeah, I would be all about that solution, but minmatar players would probably whine about lack of balance, even if they forget caldari don't even have a secondary ewar (which is why I don't whine about falcons much), so it isn't like every race should mirror the others in bonuses.
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Gabriel Karade
Gallente Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.04.12 19:29:00 -
[115]
Originally by: freshspree Edited by: freshspree on 12/04/2011 14:20:03 This is how and why you use blasters.
BLASTER PWNAGE
Do I really need to point out the errors in this line of argument? Or just assume you are trolling?... --------------
Video - 'War-Machine' |
Jerick Ludhowe
Tri-gun Auctorita Alliance
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Posted - 2011.04.12 19:39:00 -
[116]
Originally by: The Djego
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Too many clowns saying a dmg buff is the solution... Issue has to do with relative fitting requirements, active rep rig draw backs and poorly designed ammo types. Fix these three issues and I think you will say a large swing in favor of Gallente close range pvp.
Fitting was allways hard on blaster ships. There is no reason to redesign the ammo, everything worked fine the way it was before QR. The main difference is that blaster ships are not worth flown if they can't deal damage at point blank reasonable well in small gang/solo pvp(what you can't without proper range/transversal control with the 60% webs today).
I would agree that one issue is the armor rep/resist rig drawback what makes you basically a brick for no reason.
Also you need more damage in the end, before you consider it as useful turret(ie not getting shredded at point blank by a missle/ak/laser ship).
You need to just give up on the whole old school blaster ideals BS. We are not going to get 90% webs back and we are not going to get the ratio of gank over tank that we had before the hp buff and void nerf. To be quite frank, blaster ships were IMBA back then and that is not what we should be striving for today.
I stand strongly by my 3 major points and think that these are the core issues that need to be addressed before a large sweeping dmg buff. We have seen what a broad weapon type increases can do (look at lasers) and I'd rather this issue be worked in a far more precise manor.
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Jargo Stonecutter
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2011.04.12 22:09:00 -
[117]
Originally by: ValentinaDLM
Originally by: Jargo Stonecutter
....
.... But yeah, I would be all about that solution, but minmatar players would probably whine about lack of balance, even if they forget caldari don't even have a secondary ewar (which is why I don't whine about falcons much), so it isn't like every race should mirror the others in bonuses.
I think its quite balanced even for the minmatars as they have enough mid slots in general to allow for AB/MWD-dual fits if they want to, those work at frig class already and i honestly dont see why it shouldnt on bigger ships. Actually the more i think about it the more i like the idea to force the minmatar to choose between securing their speed advantage and more tank/utility.
May you live in interresting times. |
Violine Ming
Gallente Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2011.04.12 22:32:00 -
[118]
In general, based on ship usage statistics - they don't use blasters. I'm current crosstraining to winmatar now.
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Lusian
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Posted - 2011.04.13 00:26:00 -
[119]
I have an idea. This will let most of us know what those ogf us who have flown Gallantian ships or the other ship x pilot is talking about and tell us what happened to your ship in X experience and we can all see what is going on. I will give an example.
Number 1 = who were you fighting? and where?
2 = what were you fitted with and what was happening to you while you were enguaged
3 = tell us what happened with your target and why they poped your ship.
4 = how does this apply to the arguement and what is it your trying to prove?
5 = EFT or paperwork will not amount to actual competence. Actual ingame loss or kills that prove your point for said situation.
If you all can agree to this maybe this will help everyone on this thread and ccp balance the problem out.
Or just continue to thow in eft and paperwork.
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The Djego
Minmatar Hellequin Inc.
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Posted - 2011.04.13 14:19:00 -
[120]
Edited by: The Djego on 13/04/2011 14:20:24
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe You need to just give up on the whole old school blaster ideals BS. We are not going to get 90% webs back and we are not going to get the ratio of gank over tank that we had before the hp buff and void nerf.
A blaster ship in skilled hands was very lethal, however this is correct for many ships and pvp styles in eve. Without a proper web strength however it is pretty bad outside of frigs at close range for solo/small gang pvp(and for anything above this anyway).
I wouldn't even change base damage as long as damage application is as poor at it is today for point blank. *shrugs*
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe To be quite frank, blaster ships were IMBA back then and that is not what we should be striving for today.
Compared to cap **** multispec domis? Compared to the first nano BS that did nearly ignore webs by her mass? Compared to targets going 2-4 times as fast as blaster ships during the time the nano HACs where common?
Help me a bit out here, I can't remember a single nerf blaster pvp thread from like the last 5 years, even if anybody did fap about the DPS and getting face melted at point blank, everybody serious did know that anything around this concept(fitting, cap use, range, gtfo, cost efficiency, skill requirements etc.) where basically crap.
Did we play even the same game over the last 5 years?
---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
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