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Mocam
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Posted - 2011.05.09 03:56:00 -
[1]
First, I realize that this is just the first-pass change. Whether it will changer further or not, I have no clue.
Next, this is only from a couple dozen missions testing. There may be chances for other mission types to pop up but they seem very small. Also payout stuff... hard to determine when I haven't shifted agents in a while.
Overall; I see it as a mixed bag of changes. Somethings good, some not so good. This set of changes will effect a great deal of the current game in many ways. From locator agent access, used to find others across EVE; through T2 production. Lots of subtle changes from this.
Agent Quality removal:
- R&D agents are all -20 quality for RP earnings. Plain and simple: Ouch.
- The current effective quality of all agents is -20 so those used to higher pay from agents, may find it differs a bit. I have 10.0 standings with an agent and I didn't really notice a payout difference from TQ to SiSi for missions - this may indicate a change in how standings effect pay vs agent quality in the formula. Unknown and needs testing.
- If you can access a group's agents of a level, you can access ALL their agents of that level.
Consolidation of divisions: The collapse of corporate divisions, again, will cause some rather serious mutters among many though it "looks cool". Change anything and someone gripes: It's how many that make it a big or small issue.
Examples: - Gicodel is a popular SoE hub for mission running. That L4 agent's division is now Distribution so only gives out courier missions - no more combat missions.
- Center for Advanced Study has 1 corp division - distribution. Only courier missions from any of their agents - no more kill missions at all.
Conversely many will like other changes - R&D corporations have 3-4 different divisions. Security being among them (kill missions) with Distribution (only courier missions) and some with Mining divisions (only mining missions) - along with the R&D.
This change will allow additional players to work towards R&D without having to getting missions they aren't trained (SP wise) towards.
The types of missions by new divsions: Distribution = courier Mining = mining Security = encounter (kill missions)
(the old rough percentages are based upon 'well know collected information' - I adjusted a bit for the 0.xx% up to 1% type stuff but it shouldn't make a big difference for "general" information. itallic = "different focus" for main mission types. Underline = the current primary types.)
All the following move to Distribution:
- Advisory (47% Courier, 52% Encounter, 1% Trade)
- Personnel (34% Courier, 56% Encounter, 1% Mining)
- Public Relations (38% Courier, 61% Encounter, 1% Mining)
- Accounting (91% Courier, 9% Encouter)
- Archives (92% Courier, 6% Encounter, 1% Mining, 1% Trade)
- Distribution (79% Courier, 20% Encounter)
- Financial (70% Courier, 30% Encounter)
- Marketing (56% Courier, 43% Encounter)
- Production (90% Courier, 6% Encounter, 2% Mining, 1% Trade)
- Storage (79% Courier, 19% Encounter, 2% Trade)
All the following move to Security:
- Administration (23% Courier, 76% Encounter, 1% Trade)
Command - (4% Courier, 95% Encounter, 1% Mining)
- Intelligence (11% Courier, 89% Encounter)
- Internal Security (2% Courier, 98% Encounter)
- Legal (16% Courier, 84% Encounter)
- Security (3% Courier, 96% Encounter, 1% Trade)
- Surveillance (7% Courier, 93% Encounter, 1% Trade)
All the following move to Mining:
- Astrosurveying (37% Courier, 58% Encounter, 2% Mining, 2% Trade)
- Manufacturing (82% Courier, 11% Encounter, 4% Mining, 3% Trade)
- Mining (41% Courier, 24% Encounter, 28% Mining, 7% Trade)
Hopefully this helps a bit.
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Kamikaze jihawt
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Posted - 2011.05.09 10:27:00 -
[2]
I do not like -20 for all agents. To me this is a ***** move by CCP. What is also a ***** move is removing all skills increasing LP payout. This is plain and simple, THE BIGGEST NERF TO MISSIONS! I'm not just saying to lvl 4 high sec missions, I'm saying to ALL missions, it doesn't matter the lvl, or system sec rating, it's a tragedy imo. Maybe I'll just unsub and wait for swtor so that I can reexplore the five year old in me while I swing around a bright and shiny sword.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.09 11:23:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Mocam
Agent Quality removal:
- R&D agents are all -20 quality for RP earnings. Plain and simple: Ouch.
I have tested this and I get different results.
Note that you need to contact every R&D agent to get the update values. If you don't do that you get different values.
My results with level 4 agents, 5 in the relevant science fields and 5 in negotiation is 97.20 RP. That give the agent an effective quality of 20 after negotiation is applied.
That number is a bit strange as negotiation should add +5 each level to the agent effective quality. so apparently the R&D agents start at -5 EQ or the skill is applied differently.
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Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
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Posted - 2011.05.09 19:56:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Jennifer Starling on 09/05/2011 19:56:52
Originally by: Mocam
All the following move to Distribution:
- Advisory (47% Courier, 52% Encounter, 1% Trade)
- Personnel (34% Courier, 56% Encounter, 1% Mining)
- Public Relations (38% Courier, 61% Encounter, 1% Mining)
That's a lot of ouch! A lot of corporations only have highsec Personnel, PR or Advisory agents, now they will cease to have any combat agents. No more Amarr Navy (!!!!) or Royal Amarr Institute (semi-)combat agents left!
Can't they just split those agnets in two new agents, one combat and one distribution?
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2011.05.09 20:11:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Kamikaze jihawt I do not like -20 for all agents. To me this is a ***** move by CCP.
I think, "-20" is an exaggeration, or a "meaningful approximation", if you wish. In terms of game mechanics, with upcoming changes (read again: agents don't have quality now at all) this solely means that you can access any agent of a given level once you reach given corporation standing towards you, and your personal standing with agent means... more? I think so. That'd be the only limiting factor in agent accessibility, when you loose corp standing. Unless they remove agent personal standing, like they did it to R&D agents previously.
Speaking of R&D agents, I'd take a close look at 'em once I get auth on SiSi. And patcher finish it's work. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Valerie Valate
Amarr Church of The Crimson Saviour
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:01:00 -
[6]
changing the "personnel" division to 100% courier has quite a big effect to the 0.0 pirate faction corps. _________________________________________
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Kate Bear
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:11:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Mocam
Agent Quality removal:
- R&D agents are all -20 quality for RP earnings. Plain and simple: Ouch.
I have tested this and I get different results.
Note that you need to contact every R&D agent to get the update values. If you don't do that you get different values.
My results with level 4 agents, 5 in the relevant science fields and 5 in negotiation is 97.20 RP. That give the agent an effective quality of 20 after negotiation is applied.
That number is a bit strange as negotiation should add +5 each level to the agent effective quality. so apparently the R&D agents start at -5 EQ or the skill is applied differently.
According the formula on eve wiki it's agent quality and not effective quality that's used in the current RP formula. It would seem from what you're saying that they're now using EQ to calculate it. Looks like I'll have to do those R&D missions after all
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Glyken Touchon
Independent Alchemists
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:18:00 -
[8]
could someone with access to the datadump work out how this will affect the total number of kill agents for each faction?
I'm thinking some of the strange looking consolidation may be to work on the faction balance
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Seamus Donohue
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:41:00 -
[9]
Most likely, this is a first draft. I doubt CCP is going to push the current Singularity setup onto Tranquility, so we probably have time to recommend changes.
Some agents will need to have their divisions manually adjusted so that the distribution of mission types makes more sense. I think all of the school corporations (Center for Advanced Studies, Republic Military School, and so on) are currently Advisory only and it might be a good idea to make some of them Distribution and some of them Security.
For corporations that have very few agents of a particular level, it might be a good idea to add a few extra agents to their stations. |
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2011.05.10 00:37:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Kate Bear According the formula on eve wiki it's agent quality and not effective quality that's used in the current RP formula. It would seem from what you're saying that they're now using EQ to calculate it. Looks like I'll have to do those R&D missions after all
Check again the equation for Effective Quality before telling us that it's not used in RP calculation. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
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Richard Koslinsky
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Posted - 2011.05.10 02:16:00 -
[11]
Has anyone even thought how this is going to screw with the market? If people get less LP, than anything faction at all's prices are going to go through the roof. Even just faction ammo.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.10 06:37:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Venkul Mul on 10/05/2011 06:38:23
Originally by: Kate Bear
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Mocam
Agent Quality removal:
- R&D agents are all -20 quality for RP earnings. Plain and simple: Ouch.
I have tested this and I get different results.
Note that you need to contact every R&D agent to get the update values. If you don't do that you get different values.
My results with level 4 agents, 5 in the relevant science fields and 5 in negotiation is 97.20 RP. That give the agent an effective quality of 20 after negotiation is applied.
That number is a bit strange as negotiation should add +5 each level to the agent effective quality. so apparently the R&D agents start at -5 EQ or the skill is applied differently.
According the formula on eve wiki it's agent quality and not effective quality that's used in the current RP formula. It would seem from what you're saying that they're now using EQ to calculate it. Looks like I'll have to do those R&D missions after all
It as always been agent effective quality. Simply, till relatively recent times, only your social skill affected R&D agent quality. Some time ago CCP changed it so that running R&D missions increase your standing with the agent, and if that get high enough you get a higher EQ.
Edit: EVE Wiki formula: ((Agent Skill + Your Skill)^2 * (1 + Effective Quality / 100)) * Area Bonus
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Kate Bear
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Posted - 2011.05.10 12:33:00 -
[13]
I've been using:
Quote:
The RP that you will accumulate are based on only three factors: your field-specific skill level, base quality of the agent, and the agent level.
RP/day = Field multiplier * (1 + (AQ + 5*N)/100) * (SS + AL)^2
AQ = Agent Quality N = character's Negotiation skill level SS = character's specialist science field level (eg "Quantum Physics") AL = Agent Level
From the Evelopedia here. This doesn't seem to take standings into account so you can see where my confusion comes from. Or I just can't read, which is always a possibility.
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The Huffarunier
Gallente Airport Monkeys
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Posted - 2011.05.10 13:14:00 -
[14]
Thank you for doing all that research. I do not operate out of mission hubs so I'm looking at having to relocate two JCs about 5 jumps from their current location to a new mission location with the proper agents.
Sucks...
About the R&D agents; do you mean the R&D agent itself or the corporation. I only have one R&D agent that makes 195.51 Rp per day ( I ignore his requests for daily missions) who is in the R&D division of the corporation. Many R&D corporations have more than just the R&D division.
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2011.05.10 13:50:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Kate Bear I've been using:
Quote:
The RP that you will accumulate are based on only three factors: your field-specific skill level, base quality of the agent, and the agent level.
RP/day = Field multiplier * (1 + (AQ + 5*N)/100) * (SS + AL)^2
AQ = Agent Quality N = character's Negotiation skill level SS = character's specialist science field level (eg "Quantum Physics") AL = Agent Level
From the Evelopedia here. This doesn't seem to take standings into account so you can see where my confusion comes from. Or I just can't read, which is always a possibility.
(1 + (AQ + 5*N)/100) is THE Effective Quality formula. Look: http://wiki.eve-id.net/Equations#Mission_Equations The very first equation: EQ = AQ + 5 + Neg + PersonalStanding With absence of Personal standing from R&D agents, it is brought down to EQ = AQ + 5 + Neg Also look one equation up there. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Kate Bear
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Posted - 2011.05.10 14:16:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Tonto Auri
Originally by: Kate Bear I've been using:
Quote:
The RP that you will accumulate are based on only three factors: your field-specific skill level, base quality of the agent, and the agent level.
RP/day = Field multiplier * (1 + (AQ + 5*N)/100) * (SS + AL)^2
AQ = Agent Quality N = character's Negotiation skill level SS = character's specialist science field level (eg "Quantum Physics") AL = Agent Level
From the Evelopedia here. This doesn't seem to take standings into account so you can see where my confusion comes from. Or I just can't read, which is always a possibility.
(1 + (AQ + 5*N)/100) is THE Effective Quality formula. Look: http://wiki.eve-id.net/Equations#Mission_Equations The very first equation: EQ = AQ + 5 + Neg + PersonalStanding With absence of Personal standing from R&D agents, it is brought down to EQ = AQ + 5 + Neg Also look one equation up there.
thanks for clearing that up for me.
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Destamon
Azure Freelancers
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Posted - 2011.05.11 11:59:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Richard Koslinsky Has anyone even thought how this is going to screw with the market? If people get less LP, than anything faction at all's prices are going to go through the roof. Even just faction ammo.
That's what I'm fervently hoping for. In reality, the changes to LP are probably not enough to significantly affect the market.
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CCP Soundwave
C C P Alliance
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Posted - 2011.05.11 13:54:00 -
[18]
All agents will pay out like +20. If you have a specific agent that's broken, please tell me which one so we can verify.
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Sarmatiko
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:04:00 -
[19]
Originally by: CCP Soundwave If you have a specific agent that's broken, please tell me which one so we can verify.
Nothing wrong with payouts. What about broken Personnel/Advisory divisions? Converting them from "combat with courier" to "only courier" type is strange and frustrating for many of us.
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larry hotter bigpants
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Posted - 2011.05.11 17:05:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Sarmatiko
Originally by: CCP Soundwave If you have a specific agent that's broken, please tell me which one so we can verify.
Nothing wrong with payouts. What about broken Personnel/Advisory divisions? Converting them from "combat with courier" to "only courier" type is strange and frustrating for many of us.
I'd say move them into a new category called logistics with a 50%/50% chance of combat courier.
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Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
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Posted - 2011.05.11 17:35:00 -
[21]
Is there anyone (a Dev would be great) who can clarify or summarize what exactly is being changed? Or what the general idea being tested is?
I hadn't heard anything about agent mechanics being changed till a corp member starting going off last night about LP payout nerfs, removal of connection skills, and agent quality being reset to -20....
So far all I've found on the forums is panicked and/or hazy responses to changes that apparently just appeared on Sisi. I'm not a Sisi veteran, so maybe stuff like this happens all the time and doesn't always make it to Tranq.
However, I'm also used to little bulletins at least saying "we're thinking about changing _______ go check it out". Anyways, not trying to gripe, just trying to cut through all the number-crunching and get to the big picture on this issue. Messing with LP payouts has rather crazy market and gameplay ramifications, so naturally I'm with the crowd that's uneasy about something like this just slipping through without the major EvE player base who's NOT on Sisi forums being informed....
This sounds like a rebalancing/streamlining, and not an across-the-board nerf as people assuming the worse fear, but it would be nice to know where CCP is headed with this. Thanks guys!
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ivar R'dhak
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.05.11 17:36:00 -
[22]
Edited by: ivar R''dhak on 11/05/2011 17:46:39
Originally by: larry hotter bigpants I'd say move them into a new category called logistics with a 50%/50% chance of combat courier.
I think you¦re slightly missing the point of this whole drama.
As does CCP btw, with moving 50%+ encounter divisions into courier.
BAD CCP! *rolls up paper
Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen This sounds like a rebalancing/streamlining, and not an across-the-board nerf as people assuming the worse fear, but it would be nice to know where CCP is headed with this. Thanks guys!
Yes.
That¦s what it¦s supposed to be judging from the announcements at fanfest and from recent Dev posts.
The ultimate reason was to remove the annoying mechanic of wanting to do kill missions only but suddenly having a mining mission etc. The other main reason was to break up the current high-sec mission hubs and give the player the freedom to choose his agents.
Though currently it looks like high sec hubs will be replaced by 0.5 sec hubs.
______________ Mal-¦Appears we got here just in a nick of time. What does that make us?¦ Zoe-`Big damn heroes, sir.` Mal-¦Aint we just.¦ |
Mocam
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Posted - 2011.05.11 20:17:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Is there anyone (a Dev would be great) who can clarify or summarize what exactly is being changed? Or what the general idea being tested is?
I hadn't heard anything about agent mechanics being changed till a corp member starting going off last night about LP payout nerfs, removal of connection skills, and agent quality being reset to -20....
So far all I've found on the forums is panicked and/or hazy responses to changes that apparently just appeared on Sisi. I'm not a Sisi veteran, so maybe stuff like this happens all the time and doesn't always make it to Tranq.
However, I'm also used to little bulletins at least saying "we're thinking about changing _______ go check it out". Anyways, not trying to gripe, just trying to cut through all the number-crunching and get to the big picture on this issue. Messing with LP payouts has rather crazy market and gameplay ramifications, so naturally I'm with the crowd that's uneasy about something like this just slipping through without the major EvE player base who's NOT on Sisi forums being informed....
This sounds like a rebalancing/streamlining, and not an across-the-board nerf as people assuming the worse fear, but it would be nice to know where CCP is headed with this. Thanks guys!
I'm sure they have something together on this but the changes may be documented at a later stage than what is currently out on SiSi to be reviewed.
As the changes are rolled out, we'll probably/hopefully see documentation on what is going on. That is why I put at the start of my post the "early" stuff and that I'd only been able to test it in a limited fashion.
Prior to release, I think we'll see most of this explained - it's a lot to change and will impact a large portion of the community.
Some stuff is a bit flaky - as with the R&D agents and RP earnings. A quick chat with the agent, remote or in person, will adjust it but it showed in my log as having bottomed out. So on and so forth. As I said: A it was a quick check and running batches of missions -AND- looking up on the web what the agents "were" vs what they now are; that took a while and I'm not QA for CCP, just a player, with other things in life to deal with.
Display & effects may vary a bit and this will come out more *IF* people log in and check it out.
BTW - any change to anything and the forums panic over "hazy" info: even if it's stated "this isn't totally accurate"... Human nature stuff and yes, there are things that show here that never make it live. Some would have been appreciated (new toolbar), others not so appreciated - have never made it live.
This one, I think will go live - probably tweaked a bit more.
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Ghurthe
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Posted - 2011.05.11 20:40:00 -
[24]
Hrm... I wish CCP would give us a heads up about what's going on with this.
I'd very much like to know how extensive this nerf is what it will mean for LP pay out and such. Can we get a little more feedback from CCP?
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King Rothgar
Path of the Fallen
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Posted - 2011.05.11 20:45:00 -
[25]
I haven't posted in this thread but since it seems to be the main one on this topic, I'll summarize what I've said elsewhere as I have done some testing with it.
The lvl5 agent in auga (0.4 sec) on TQ pays a bit over 73k LP per mission with lvl5 connection skills. On sisi without connection skills it pays 60483 LP per mission. Since the connection skills are still availible in the LP store, I repurchased and retrained them using the reimbursed SP. They did not increase the LP awarded. Additionally, it appears standings in no way affect payouts. So that hasn't changed.
The agent's standing requirements have been set to that of -20 agents but as previously said, their actual quality has been boosted to 20. This incidentally is probably why lvl5's didn't take the full 33% LP hit from the loss of the LP skills. All lvl5's on TQ are currently Q12 so the increase to Q20 partially compensates (though not fully as shown). The exact LP reduction appears to be 17-18% for the lvl5 agents tested. I have not tested how lvl4 agents faired yet.
System security status does still impact LP payouts. The lvl5 agent in saghtogas (0.3 sec) pays 65k LP on sisi while the previously mentioned auga (0.4 sec) agent pays 60k. This seems to hold with how TQ currently handles it. On TQ the sahtogas agent pays 78k LP while the auga agent pays 73k LP. Thus far you shall read, but no further; for this is my sig. |
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2011.05.11 21:08:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Ghurthe Hrm... I wish CCP would give us a heads up about what's going on with this.
I'd very much like to know how extensive this nerf is what it will mean for LP pay out and such. Can we get a little more feedback from CCP?
Not much of a nerf. You can count it by taking out relevant variables from equation. All data is in this topic already, the most bital was just given out by CCP. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
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Posted - 2011.05.11 22:31:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Mocam
BTW - any change to anything and the forums panic over "hazy" info: even if it's stated "this isn't totally accurate"... Human nature stuff and yes, there are things that show here that never make it live. Some would have been appreciated (new toolbar), others not so appreciated - have never made it live.
This one, I think will go live - probably tweaked a bit more.
Oh yeah, I'm not panicking myself either, I just mean that's what everyone will do in the meantime without a clear statement of what the intention is behind this, and what exactly they plan to change... I hope the eve community at large gets an announcement that the changes are even being tested, I think at the moment only the fraction of players who read forums or play with SiSi, or who went to fanfest, have noticed that this is even on the table for discussion. I'm right there with you in that this needs to be cleared with the broader public first, as we're talking about most players' primary isk income here.
Even IF they nerf LP payout, you could make the case that supply and demand will mediate some of the potential income worries. Less LP SHOULD translate into higher prices for LP goods on the market, but who knows.
And thank you Mocam, and everyone else, who can spare the time to look into this.
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Voddick
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Posted - 2011.05.11 22:39:00 -
[28]
Since we are looking at agent bugs here. How about adding a single storyline agent to 'The Interbus' faction. You can mission all you want for them and never get a storyline mission, because they forgot to make one.
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Grimpak
Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point
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Posted - 2011.05.11 23:42:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Grimpak on 11/05/2011 23:42:21 advisory, personnel and public relations should be moved to kill missions tbh and production to mining too.
as it is, this means pretty much 50% of the agents will become courier agents.
afaik? ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Kuronaga
Kantian Principle
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Posted - 2011.05.12 00:07:00 -
[30]
so theres no point in doing lowsec/nullsec missions then?
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Glyken Touchon
Independent Alchemists
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Posted - 2011.05.12 00:11:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Vod**** Since we are looking at agent bugs here. How about adding a single storyline agent to 'The Interbus' faction. You can mission all you want for them and never get a storyline mission, because they forgot to make one.
It's not a bug, it's deliberate. Missioning for Interbus was deemed too easy a way to get all empire faction standings up (can't find the quote but IIRC it was soon after I started playing, so a while ago).
I just wish they had 1 station with an LP store..
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Aoki Ayumi
University of Caille
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Posted - 2011.05.12 01:17:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Aoki Ayumi on 12/05/2011 01:17:52 All the following move to Mining:
* Astrosurveying (37% Courier, 58% Encounter, 2% Mining, 2% Trade)
Why?
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Grimpak
Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point
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Posted - 2011.05.12 03:38:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Aoki Ayumi Edited by: Aoki Ayumi on 12/05/2011 01:17:52 All the following move to Mining:
* Astrosurveying (37% Courier, 58% Encounter, 2% Mining, 2% Trade)
Why?
well, astrosurveying is supposed to be a mining agent afterall. ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.12 06:50:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Venkul Mul on 12/05/2011 06:53:18
Originally by: CCP Soundwave All agents will pay out like +20. If you have a specific agent that's broken, please tell me which one so we can verify.
R&D agents. They give out RP as if they had -5 quality before negotiation. Already bug reported.
Edit: Why some agent has been removed? First thing I noticed is that the 4 Quafe agents in Iro have been moved away from that system or removed from the game.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.12 07:47:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Vod**** Since we are looking at agent bugs here. How about adding a single storyline agent to 'The Interbus' faction. You can mission all you want for them and never get a storyline mission, because they forgot to make one.
It is a intended feature as it would give positive standing to all the empire factions, something that CCP don't like. That was several times by Devs around the forum, but the relevant posts are old and searching for them is a pain.
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Cathy Drall
Amarr Royal Amarr Institute
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Posted - 2011.05.12 11:20:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Sarmatiko Nothing wrong with payouts. What about broken Personnel/Advisory divisions? Converting them from "combat with courier" to "only courier" type is strange and frustrating for many of us.
It's disturbing indeed, as a lot of corporation only have L4 mixed bag division agents, which now all will become low reward couriers. What about making 2 replacement agents instead for these divisions: one courier and one combat?
Originally by: Kuronaga so theres no point in doing lowsec/nullsec missions then?
Isn't it so that security of the system still counts??!
Originally by: CCP Soundwave All agents will pay out like +20. If you have a specific agent that's broken, please tell me which one so we can verify.
This is very nice to hear! Finally my Khanid Navy agent wil be +20 and not -16!!
Any news about the "X connections" skills? Will they just be removed and we get our SP reimbursed?
"Im not nearly as paranoid as people think I am" |
Aoki Ayumi
University of Caille
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Posted - 2011.05.12 11:48:00 -
[37]
I thought astrosurveying was to keep the security of the mining belts, not mining them directly.
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Doddy
Excidium. Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2011.05.12 12:40:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Aoki Ayumi I thought astrosurveying was to keep the security of the mining belts, not mining them directly.
Astrosurveying = surveying asteroids. No idea why ccp had them only giving 2% mining mission before, was always a bit strange.
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stoicfaux
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.12 14:22:00 -
[39]
Edited by: stoicfaux on 12/05/2011 14:23:37
Originally by: Cathy Drall
This is very nice to hear! Finally my Khanid Navy agent wil be +20 and not -16!!
So? With the LP skills gone, you'll probably be making less LP. You might want to see what the LP payout is on the test server.
Quote: Any news about the "X connections" skills? Will they just be removed and we get our SP reimbursed?
From what I saw in Sisi, the skillpoints were reimbursed. Of course, I also saw that while the LP skills were removed from my character, you could still buy the LP skillbooks and train them.
I guess they're still deciding what to do with the LP skill books: either get rid of them, or replace them with fewer LP skillbooks now that we have just three agent types?
----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
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Gondebine
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Posted - 2011.05.12 14:24:00 -
[40]
I really hate the changes. What's the point? It just forces people to move to new mission hubs (0.5 sec, many kill agents, no low sec systems around). And it takes a fair bit of "depth" away from mission running. LP skills gone => less possibility to "specialise" in it. Divisions gone => no more fun finding "your" best system for missionrunning and so on. For a mission runner Eve will become much more boring.
Hey, are the devs trying to simplify the game to make it more appealing? Bad idea. The people who like EVE sure dont do so because it's so simple...
Please don't let these changes go live. Pleeease DOOOON'T!
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Aoki Ayumi
University of Caille
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Posted - 2011.05.12 14:39:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Gondebine I really hate the changes. What's the point? It just forces people to move to new mission hubs (0.5 sec, many kill agents, no low sec systems around). And it takes a fair bit of "depth" away from mission running. LP skills gone => less possibility to "specialise" in it. Divisions gone => no more fun finding "your" best system for missionrunning and so on. For a mission runner Eve will become much more boring.
Hey, are the devs trying to simplify the game to make it more appealing? Bad idea. The people who like EVE sure dont do so because it's so simple...
Please don't let these changes go live. Pleeease DOOOON'T!
Signed. Missions mechanics are very simple. No changes are needed. What do you want CCP? that every mission player do missions in the same solar system? 5000 players using the same agent?
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Von Kroll
Caldari Kroll's Legion
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Posted - 2011.05.12 14:53:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Von Kroll on 12/05/2011 14:54:50 IMO, the sec status of the system will need to be addressed, otherwise, everyone dogpiles the high-sec agents in .5 systems just like they do now with the high quality agents. So, no modifier for high-sec, regardless of sec rating, some sort of flat modifier for low-sec agents, and a higher modifier for null-sec agents.
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2011.05.12 15:18:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Aoki Ayumi Signed. Missions mechanics are very simple. No changes are needed. What do you want CCP? that every mission player do missions in the same solar system? 5000 players using the same agent?
Noone changed missin mechanics, as far as I can tell. The agent choice, on other hand, was a problem. They addressed it. A bit rude, i'd say, but the change as I see it is mostly for good. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Omnara
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Posted - 2011.05.12 15:49:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Von Kroll Edited by: Von Kroll on 12/05/2011 14:54:50 IMO, the sec status of the system will need to be addressed, otherwise, everyone dogpiles the high-sec agents in .5 systems just like they do now with the high quality agents. So, no modifier for high-sec, regardless of sec rating, some sort of flat modifier for low-sec agents, and a higher modifier for null-sec agents.
Yes. clearly doing so would not make the highsec-bears dogpile in the missionhubs with high security and close to tradehubs...
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Kadesh Priestess
Scalding Chill
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Posted - 2011.05.12 16:17:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Kadesh Priestess on 12/05/2011 16:20:07 Make hisec-losec transition a bit more evident to reflect actual security change (eg by making hidden agent quality different, -20 for hisec and +20 for lowsec or whatever other numbers, just keep'em different).
0.0 space agents do no need such adjustment as they reside just in 0.0 (with few exceptions like Thukker Mix agents, which also may have their quality aligned towards better payouts in 0.0 space), and their payouts may be regulated only according to desired final isk price of lp store items in the market.
kthxbye _____ EVE Fit |
Cathy Drall
Amarr Royal Amarr Institute
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Posted - 2011.05.12 17:20:00 -
[46]
Originally by: stoicfaux With the LP skills gone, you'll probably be making less LP. You might want to see what the LP payout is on the test server.
I may, but as it now gives 1/3 of what a Q18 gives even with lower system security, hardly more than a L3 Q15 agent .. I can't imagine it gives even less.
"Im not nearly as paranoid as people think I am" |
Saluvatar
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.12 17:30:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Kadesh Priestess Edited by: Kadesh Priestess on 12/05/2011 16:20:07 Make hisec-losec transition a bit more evident to reflect actual security change (eg by making hidden agent quality different, -20 for hisec and +20 for lowsec or whatever other numbers, just keep'em different).
I support this idea.
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Barbelo Valentinian
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.05.12 19:11:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Gondebine I really hate the changes. What's the point? It just forces people to move to new mission hubs (0.5 sec, many kill agents, no low sec systems around). And it takes a fair bit of "depth" away from mission running. LP skills gone => less possibility to "specialise" in it. Divisions gone => no more fun finding "your" best system for missionrunning and so on. For a mission runner Eve will become much more boring.
Hey, are the devs trying to simplify the game to make it more appealing? Bad idea. The people who like EVE sure dont do so because it's so simple...
Please don't let these changes go live. Pleeease DOOOON'T!
/signed
Seems like a sledgehammer to crack a nut. What sort of idiot complains about not having only one type of mission given out anyway? The courier missions and mining missions were negatives that were part of a balance of having to make a choice.
Does CCP seriously think that many people are actually going to use any of these courier-only or mining-only agents AT ALL? Of course not, everyone will just crowd in the areas where there are combat only mission-givers.
Maybe one or two dedicated miners and hauler types will enjoy the change, but the rest of us (I presume I'm not speaking for myself) actually enjoyed having to work out a balance between the various factors to pick our "home" agent, and took the negatives of the occasional courier mission or whatnot as part of that equation.
This is a bit of dumbing-down that seems totally unnecessary.
And not just that, but from the roleplaying point of view, it actually gave a nice illusion of background complexity to have the different departments. Now agents will seem even more like Pez dispensers.
*****
"To wake up is to wake the world up" - D.E. Harding |
jyppy
Under Heavy Fire
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Posted - 2011.05.12 20:39:00 -
[49]
Edited by: jyppy on 12/05/2011 20:46:31 Just checked some figures on sisi.
For the lvl 4 q18 agent in Irjunen (0.5 sec system) for missions like Angel Ex., Worlds Collide etc..
Current reward (with good connection skills) - 8255LP Singularity reward (no connection skills) - 5993LP
Edit;
Whoa, just found a new skill in the LP store;
Security connections
Understanding of military culture.
Improves loyalty point gain by 10% per level when working for agents in the Security corporation division.
Looks like you'll be able to earn as much LP as before, if not a little more..
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King Rothgar
Path of the Fallen
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Posted - 2011.05.12 21:18:00 -
[50]
I can confirm 2 new LP related skills have been added. One is security and available at navy-ish LP stores, the other is mining (I assume at industry LP stores but I didn't check). The price for security connections is 15k LP and 10M isk. It has a 2x training modifier (the old LP skills had 1x) and gives a +10% increase per level (old was 5% but with two skills). As such, this should result in absolutely no change in pay for a Q20 agent. It does however raise the LP rewards for agents that were not Q20 originally it appears. Thus far you shall read, but no further; for this is my sig. |
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Arkady Sadik
Minmatar Electus Matari
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Posted - 2011.05.12 21:32:00 -
[51]
There's now "Security Connections", "Mining Connections" and "Distribution Connections" as described above.
Also, please, pretty please, remove system security effects on mission payout. Or rather, make security of 0.5 and above have the same effect as 1.0 right now, and security of 0.4 and below have the same effect as +0.0 right now. Thank you.
(Oh. And can we please have a fourth division that gives out faction encounter missions and have security give out only pirate encounter missions? Please? :-D)
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Proats
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.05.12 23:00:00 -
[52]
Where are the patch notes for 257559? Clicking on "view patch notes" here only shows the notes for old patches.
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Amdor Renevat
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Posted - 2011.05.12 23:59:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Arkady Sadik There's now "Security Connections", "Mining Connections" and "Distribution Connections" as described above.
Also, please, pretty please, remove system security effects on mission payout. Or rather, make security of 0.5 and above have the same effect as 1.0 right now, and security of 0.4 and below have the same effect as +0.0 right now. Thank you.
(Oh. And can we please have a fourth division that gives out faction encounter missions and have security give out only pirate encounter missions? Please? :-D)
The problem with making high sec the equivalent of -20 is that the majority of players are in high sec and they don't want a reduction from what they currently get. At a guess I'd say most high sec mission runners look for agents between 12-19 quality, so dumbing all high sec down to -20 is a bad idea. If you really want low sec to get a boost, just ask for +30 level. High sec should stay very close to current payout if not a slight increase. After all, who likes getting nerfed?
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Mnengli Noiliffe
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Posted - 2011.05.13 00:43:00 -
[54]
Originally by: ivar R'dhak
Though currently it looks like high sec hubs will be replaced by 0.5 sec hubs.
also all people from gicodel will move to osmon which is already pretty crowded :)
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Periapt
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Posted - 2011.05.13 04:41:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Venkul Mul Edited by: Venkul Mul on 12/05/2011 18:09:04 Edited by: Venkul Mul on 12/05/2011 08:13:42 Edited by: Venkul Mul on 12/05/2011 06:53:18
Originally by: CCP Soundwave All agents will pay out like +20. If you have a specific agent that's broken, please tell me which one so we can verify.
R&D agents. They give out RP as if they had -5 quality before negotiation. Already bug reported.
Edit: Why some agent has been removed? First thing I noticed is that the 4 Quafe agents in Iro have been moved away from that system or removed from the game.
Edit 2: After some further thought, probably R&D agents don't apply the negotiation skill at all. The payout will be consistent with the "all agents quality has been set at 20" and no negotiation bonus.
I checked only with characters with negotiation 5. Will check with a character with less negotiation as soon as I am home.
Edit 3: confirmed, Negotiation don't affect RP point production.
I also did test with negotiation. I trained it from 3 to 4 and it didn't have any change in RP point production. On TQ it has a small change.
If it doesn't effect RP agents, I would assume it doesn't effect mission agents either. Are they planning on changing skill or removing it? |
Scarlet des Loupes
Gallente University of Caille
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Posted - 2011.05.13 04:50:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Arkady Sadik Oh. And can we please have a fourth division that gives out faction encounter missions and have security give out only pirate encounter missions? Please? :-D
^This!!
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Lost'In'Space
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Posted - 2011.05.13 05:46:00 -
[57]
Originally by: CCP Soundwave All agents will pay out like +20. If you have a specific agent that's broken, please tell me which one so we can verify.
LP will pay out as +20 as well, and quality is not dynamic?
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.13 06:41:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Venkul Mul on 13/05/2011 06:45:46
Originally by: King Rothgar I can confirm 2 new LP related skills have been added. One is security and available at navy-ish LP stores, the other is mining (I assume at industry LP stores but I didn't check). The price for security connections is 15k LP and 10M isk. It has a 2x training modifier (the old LP skills had 1x) and gives a +10% increase per level (old was 5% but with two skills). As such, this should result in absolutely no change in pay for a Q20 agent. It does however raise the LP rewards for agents that were not Q20 originally it appears.
Tow 5% skills at maximum 1.25*1.25=1.5625 One 10% skill at maximum 1.50
Not much but not "no change". Most of the time more than compensated by the quality increase.
That is, if the other things affecting agent effective quality still work (i.e. if your standing with teh agent has a positive effect when it is high enough).
Originally by: Periapt
I also did test with negotiation. I trained it from 3 to 4 and it didn't have any change in RP point production. On TQ it has a small change.
If it doesn't effect RP agents, I would assume it doesn't effect mission agents either. Are they planning on changing skill or removing it?
I would not call a "small effect" a difference of more than 20 RP for 3 agents and 10 for 2. It is a 9-10% reduction in datacore production.
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HiyaVata
Gallente The KUM
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Posted - 2011.05.13 08:04:00 -
[59]
I'm not sure if I'm repeating someone here, read the first 10+ replies and fell asleep :P I see most of you are talking about R&D's (makes sense), but here's my beef with this whole change... I do missions in Ansen sys. fribrodi const. The agents there are all lvl4 Q20 - Personel (4 of them). Now, I have a "pvp-pve" character, not a "driving Miss Daisy - corp bus boy" char. That's 1. 2, all the courier missions that I do get (which I decline all the time) have been nerfed in the previous patch, in the way that 6 dolls are now a weird 6K cargo !??! How big are these dolls!??!?! and 9 out of 10 times I have to haul these items from low sec to high sec. If you haven't recently looked at the star map, I would like to point out a certain system called Hagilur! Try jumping in and out of that system in a hauler any time of the day.... Now do you understand why all this nerfing sugz!? And I'm sure there are many more areas in eve with this same problem....
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Noxyra
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.05.13 11:11:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Noxyra on 13/05/2011 11:14:11
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Tow 5% skills at maximum 1.25*1.25=1.5625 One 10% skill at maximum 1.50
Afaik, the two current connection skills work additively not multiplicative on the base amount.
So, each skill to 5 adds 25% more from the base, with two of them adding exactly 50% more. So, thus, there is no change in LP pay from the modification of the skill.
And yeah, being a rank 2 skill, you can take all the sp from those two skills and put it into this one, but you'll still lose out on the money/lp you paid for the other skills :)
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Daniela Darr
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Posted - 2011.05.13 11:17:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Noxyra And yeah, being a rank 2 skill, you can take all the sp from those two skills and put it into this one, but you'll still lose out on the money/lp you paid for the other skills :)
Stealth ISK sink detected!
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Mya Klingofer
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Posted - 2011.05.13 15:49:00 -
[62]
Can someone confirm that on SISI the current way storylines are handed out remain unchanged?
What i mean is that there has only ever been a single storyline pool that everyone gets regardless of the division they run for. I was wondering as they are branching out these agent divisions like this, are they also branching out the storylines as well?
So if you are doing a courier only agent, are you now only getting offered courier storylines? And if so is the faction gain consistantly low?
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Jamie Banks
Quantum Horizons
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Posted - 2011.05.13 18:11:00 -
[63]
Well, I just checked my R&D agents, and just for comparison:
On one char, all highsec Lai Dai Lvl IV agents (not the best skills either):
Tranq (which takes into account agent quality and security status): RP/Day 1: 77.44 (0.7, Q 0) 2: 57.33 (0.8, Q -4) 3: 85.12 (0.5, Q 12) 4: 86.40 (0.7, Q 14) 5: 77.44 (0.5, Q 0)
Tranq Total: 383.73 RP/Day
Singularity (only takes into account security status): RP/Day 1: 76.80 (0.7) 2: 58.80 (0.8) 3: 76.80 (0.5) - WTF 4: 76.80 (0.7) 5: 76.80 (0.5) - WTF
SiSi Total: 366.00 RP/Day
So, for a bunch of random sample agents in high-sec, my datacore production will be less, and one would think this would result in a higher price for Datacores in the future. However, if you have more agents which are in lower sec systems, this could end up being a boost. But these numbers seem buggy as a 0.5 agent is giving the same RP/Day as a 0.7 agent.
Also just talking to the agent, changed/updated my standings with them and changed the amount of RP/Day I was getting. So if you haven't talked to your agent in a while... Do it! my total RP/Day jumped by about 30 (on Tranquility).
tldr: My R&D agents, will give me less RP/Day if changes on SiSi are final.
_______________________________
Join in-game Channel 'Aussies'
AU/NZ Corp Register |
stoicfaux
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.13 18:17:00 -
[64]
Live: Q14 agent in a .5 system with both LP skills at IV * 7,127 lp max
Test: Without new social skill * 5,989 lp max
Test: With new social skill at IV (40% boost) * 8,385 lp max
That's a 8,385 / 7,127 = 17.7% bump in LP when that agent gets bumped from Q14 to Q20.
Argh.
----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
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Linda Shadowborn
Gallente Dark Steel Industries
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Posted - 2011.05.13 22:37:00 -
[65]
Jamie Banks: do you have different personal standings with those agents that explains the difference?
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Vincent Athena
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Posted - 2011.05.13 23:15:00 -
[66]
One thing to think about: When PI rolled out we were all ready in our w-system, having noted what planet types we had. Then it came out and all the planets changed type.
The same may happen with agents. What we see for types right now, on TQ and on Sisi, may not be any indication of that types will be where after the patch.
On a worrying note: I have a small industry op selling stuff at Gicodel. If that agent does become courier only, Im out of business there.
Well, adapt or die.
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Jamie Banks
Quantum Horizons
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Posted - 2011.05.14 00:15:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Linda Shadowborn Jamie Banks: do you have different personal standings with those agents that explains the difference?
When I talk to all of the agents, they all have 'Effective Standing: 7.0'. (Due to my corp standings) _______________________________
Join in-game Channel 'Aussies'
AU/NZ Corp Register |
Borza Slavak
Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2011.05.14 09:36:00 -
[68]
Surely changes to LP payout will have minimal difference.
LP value is elastic, nerfing LP payout would increase isk value of LP while buffing LP payout will have the opposite effect.
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C0mbat W0mbat
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Posted - 2011.05.14 17:50:00 -
[69]
Edited by: C0mbat W0mbat on 14/05/2011 17:50:32 I dearly hope that they will chagne agent divisions, not based on their old divisions, but in a meaningful way.
1. Who does mining missions in low-sec? They pay bad per m¦. If I do them to get standings up, I do them in high-sec. Save some database space and remove mining agents from low sec (or make them courier/security).. Maybe even remove them from 0.0, cause honestly, there is better stuff to mine there...
2. let every empire corp have at least 1 lvl4 fight agent in high-sec, with the exception of R&D. R&D should not have fight agents above lvl2 in high-sec at all. Its too easy to grind standing up to 5.0 (after changes all R&D lvl4 agents should be available with that standing, right?) if you have lvl3 fight agents available
3. let every corp have at least one fight agent in 0.1 or 0.2. So there is the temptation to get more LP in low sec
4. re-distibute agent clusters in low sec (this is against my very own interest, but i think its better for the game) As it is now, you have some low sec systems that have all the agents you need (Annancale, Aranir, Arzi, can't remember the name of that minmatar griefers paradise and some others). Shuffle those agents around, so ppl can choose the quieter system and don't have to pile up for the pirates. e.g. Annancale will have 3 fight agents and 9 mining agents after this patch goes live (see pt. 1)
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2011.05.14 18:33:00 -
[70]
While I do agree with you that agent divisions should be retossed, your points making little sense from a game balancing perspective. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.14 22:08:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Jamie Banks Well, I just checked my R&D agents, and just for comparison:
On one char, all highsec Lai Dai Lvl IV agents (not the best skills either):
Tranq (which takes into account agent quality and security status): RP/Day 1: 77.44 (0.7, Q 0) 2: 57.33 (0.8, Q -4) 3: 85.12 (0.5, Q 12) 4: 86.40 (0.7, Q 14) 5: 77.44 (0.5, Q 0)
Tranq Total: 383.73 RP/Day
Singularity (only takes into account security status): RP/Day 1: 76.80 (0.7) 2: 58.80 (0.8) 3: 76.80 (0.5) - WTF 4: 76.80 (0.7) 5: 76.80 (0.5) - WTF
SiSi Total: 366.00 RP/Day
R&D have never been affected by security status of the system.
My R&D agents payout (Hi and low sec) on SISI 97.20 for 5 of them = 486
On Tranquility 113.40/115.83/90.72 (q -15)/115.83/102.87 = 538.65
Even with a q-15 agent in the mix the RP loss is 52.65, almost 105 of the production.
No idea if it will make some real change in datacore costs.
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Dawne Xi
Minmatar 3D Salvage and Acquisitions
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Posted - 2011.05.15 07:46:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Noxyra Edited by: Noxyra on 13/05/2011 11:14:11
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Tow 5% skills at maximum 1.25*1.25=1.5625 One 10% skill at maximum 1.50
Afaik, the two current connection skills work additively not multiplicative on the base amount.
So, each skill to 5 adds 25% more from the base, with two of them adding exactly 50% more. So, thus, there is no change in LP pay from the modification of the skill.
And yeah, being a rank 2 skill, you can take all the sp from those two skills and put it into this one, but you'll still lose out on the money/lp you paid for the other skills :)
Noxyra you are correct, the two connections skills gave 50% not the 56.25% that Venkul said. I tested this with my two accounts while one had the two connection skills at L5 and the other only had them at L3.
At L3 in both connection skills, a mission gave 2459 LP At L5 in both connection skills, the exact same mission from the exact same agent gave 2838 LP
2459 / 1.30 = 1891.5 (base LP) 2838 / 1.50 = 1892.0 (base LP)
If what Venkul said was true the math doesn't work out
2459 / (1.15 * 1.15) = 1859.4 (base LP) 2838 / (1.25 * 1.25) = 1816.3 (base LP)
I had to go back and dig up my spreadsheet on it for an example
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Von Kroll
Caldari Kroll's Legion
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Posted - 2011.05.15 08:21:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Omnara
Yes. clearly doing so would not make the highsec-bears dogpile in the missionhubs with high security and close to tradehubs...
People will spread out if there's no artificial motivator for them to go to one place. In this case, it seems as though you think they'll drift to agents closer to Jita, and that may happen. But at least the guy 15 jumps from Jita can make the same isk and LP as the other guys, and if he wants to get away from the hordes of ninja salvagers and gank squads, he can. Look, basically CCP said their intent is to reduce the "mission hub" effect. So what's your solution?
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Gondebine
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Posted - 2011.05.15 15:57:00 -
[74]
Can we have a statement by CCP on where you are going with that changes? Do you plan to put it live the way it is on the test server now? Will there be additional changes? Will the agents be balanced "manually"? Because, for example, as it is now there would be NPC corps with no kill agents at all... Makes little sense.
The way it works on Sisi now it makes little sense at all tbh. There just will be new mission hubs replacing the old ones. People will just move to 0.5 systems with good agents and few low sec systems around (and there would not be many of those, so...). I can see no positive effects.
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Super Failure
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Posted - 2011.05.15 19:10:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Von Kroll
Originally by: Omnara
Yes. clearly doing so would not make the highsec-bears dogpile in the missionhubs with high security and close to tradehubs...
People will spread out if there's no artificial motivator for them to go to one place. In this case, it seems as though you think they'll drift to agents closer to Jita, and that may happen. But at least the guy 15 jumps from Jita can make the same isk and LP as the other guys, and if he wants to get away from the hordes of ninja salvagers and gank squads, he can. Look, basically CCP said their intent is to reduce the "mission hub" effect. So what's your solution?
I doubt people would pile into 0.5 systems as bad as they would systems close to trade hubs if the sec bonus is removed. It's generally more profitable to run in 0.5 with a bit worse quality agent as it is, yet there aren't many people in most of them as you get further from trade hubs, especially Jita.
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Drago Misharie
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Posted - 2011.05.15 21:15:00 -
[76]
I wouldn't mind if they make agent missions specific to the division type as long as every NPC Station maintained the same mix of missions offered.
I have moved 100k m3 of equipment to specific stations for mining missions for LP and ISK, If CCP Flushes my investments in specific systems without an alternative game mechanic to supply the same thing, I can't garrentee that I will keep playing without a significant isk compensation and/or skill point cashout.
With this change, it sounds like the entire tech1 market is going to collapse and only will be worth their reprocessed value.
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Test1 Mileghere
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Posted - 2011.05.19 09:14:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Drago Misharie I wouldn't mind if they make agent missions specific to the division type as long as every NPC Station maintained the same mix of missions offered.
I have moved 100k m3 of equipment to specific stations for mining missions for LP and ISK, If CCP Flushes my investments in specific systems without an alternative game mechanic to supply the same thing, I can't garrentee that I will keep playing without a significant isk compensation and/or skill point cashout.
With this change, it sounds like the entire tech1 market is going to collapse and only will be worth their reprocessed value.
How exactly will a mission change collapse the T1 market? |
pez66
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Posted - 2011.05.19 12:54:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Von Kroll
Originally by: Omnara
Yes. clearly doing so would not make the highsec-bears dogpile in the missionhubs with high security and close to tradehubs...
People will spread out if there's no artificial motivator for them to go to one place. In this case, it seems as though you think they'll drift to agents closer to Jita, and that may happen. But at least the guy 15 jumps from Jita can make the same isk and LP as the other guys, and if he wants to get away from the hordes of ninja salvagers and gank squads, he can. Look, basically CCP said their intent is to reduce the "mission hub" effect. So what's your solution?
well ye this will bring seasoned players closer to the action instead of camping gates in low sec, and assisting with missions and skills to the more newer players,to let the game grow as to more movement in lower systems.
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Rigg O'Mortis
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Posted - 2011.06.10 13:08:00 -
[79]
The changes to the agents are appauling, driving people to new agents, restricting security/distribution and mining missions to a fixed point, as these agents no longer provide a spread of mission types. come on CCP. what were you thinking.... your just cramming mission runners into fixed locations, that are even more limited now, get a grip on what eve was all about choice and spreading characters around. dont force the runners into specific locations....
Change the system back, I'm sure not that many people complained about the original system...
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