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MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.05.09 18:27:00 -
[1]
Hi , In connection to this new feature I propose a better one.
Now we can choose between 30 days of game time or PLEX for a buddy program. Thank you CCP for this upgrade !!!
My proposition is to add a third choice. Instead of game time or PLEX you can choose a free amount of skill points for one of your characters. This amount should not be bigger than the maximal amount you can get for 30 days of training time. For those who have a subscription 30 days of game time or a plex arent a big deal but skill points are.
Please comment
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Emperor Salazar
Caldari Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2011.05.09 18:34:00 -
[2]
No.
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Annasys
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.09 18:39:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Emperor Salazar No.
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Danika Princip
Minmatar Tactical Narcotics Team
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Posted - 2011.05.09 19:48:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Annasys
Originally by: Emperor Salazar No.
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Nieusha
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Posted - 2011.05.09 20:41:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Danika Princip
Originally by: Annasys
Originally by: Emperor Salazar No.
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Josef F
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Posted - 2011.05.09 20:41:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Nieusha
Originally by: Danika Princip
Originally by: Annasys
Originally by: Emperor Salazar No.
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RDevz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.09 21:41:00 -
[7]
The ability to instantly add just under 2m skillpoints to my main for just 350m ISK and an email address? SIGN ME UP.
Wait, no, that's a stupid idea. Hang your head in shame. |
MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.05.09 21:59:00 -
[8]
Please more constructive comments. Just "No" or "yes" are not arguments.
There is no real diffenrence between 30 days of game time or a PLEX. But for people who subscribe, for them it would be better to get 2 millions of skillpoints (max. amount of skillpoints you can get in 30 days) instead of game time or PLEX. This will simply spare a huge amount of time and CCP win - more happy newbies and old players. The game has only one weak point - waiting time. Adding my proposition old players would be also more motivated to bring new players in the game .
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Annasys
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:26:00 -
[9]
Originally by: MorliDots22 Please more constructive comments. Just "No" or "yes" are not arguments.
There is no real diffenrence between 30 days of game time or a PLEX. But for people who subscribe, for them it would be better to get 2 millions of skillpoints (max. amount of skillpoints you can get in 30 days) instead of game time or PLEX. This will simply spare a huge amount of time and CCP win - more happy newbies and old players. The game has only one weak point - waiting time. Adding my proposition old players would be also more motivated to bring new players in the game .
Let me show you how broken this is.
1) This idea is activated. 2) I send out 10 buddy invites to myself. 3) I buy 10 plex, one for each account and apply them 4) I then use those 10 buddy subs to buy 10 months of subscription. 5) I sell each of the 10 characters on the Character Bazaar for 1b after 51 days.
I have effectively given myself 10 months bonus sp for doing nothing at all. The price I get from selling the 10 characters covers not just the cost of the plex used to activate them, but also the cost of the 2 plex needed to transfer the characters.
At this point, it would simply be easier to just offer a flat 2m sp for plex, since that is basically what you are doing.
NO!
is more than sufficient of an answer for this horrible idea.
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MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:46:00 -
[10]
5) I sell each of the 10 characters on the Character Bazaar for 1b after 51 days.
I have effectively given myself 10 months bonus sp for doing nothing at all. The price I get from selling the 10 characters covers not just the cost of the plex used to activate them, but also the cost of the 2 plex needed to transfer the characters.
Your argumentation has one weak point. With my idea implemented the prices for accounts would fall like shares on a black friday. RMT and Ebay-sellers goodbuy. Nobody will pay billions for accounts then.
Why punish players with either long waiting time or exorbital prices for characters ? Yes, you can invite yourself but there is a limit now 3 invitations pro account in a month. You have to buy plex or farm them to upgrade the invitations. On one hand my idea improves the waiting time, the stream of new players and and on another is against RMT and Ebay-sellers destroying the speculation of ISK and Characters.
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Nieusha
Gallente the lazy corp
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:57:00 -
[11]
Originally by: MorliDots22 Please more constructive comments. Just "No" or "yes" are not arguments.
There is no real diffenrence between 30 days of game time or a PLEX. But for people who subscribe, for them it would be better to get 2 millions of skillpoints (max. amount of skillpoints you can get in 30 days) instead of game time or PLEX. This will simply spare a huge amount of time and CCP win - more happy newbies and old players. The game has only one weak point - waiting time. Adding my proposition old players would be also more motivated to bring new players in the game .
no
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Annasys
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.09 22:59:00 -
[12]
Originally by: MorliDots22
Your argumentation has one weak point. With my idea implemented the prices for accounts would fall like shares on a black friday. RMT and Ebay-sellers goodbuy. Nobody will pay billions for accounts then.
Why punish players with either long waiting time or exorbital prices for characters ? Yes, you can invite yourself but there is a limit now 3 invitations pro account in a month. You have to buy plex or farm them to upgrade the invitations. On one hand my idea improves the waiting time, the stream of new players and and on another is against RMT and Ebay-sellers destroying the speculation of ISK and Characters.
Let's take your ideas.
First, that you think that prices for characters would fall like shares on a black friday is something that someone who has no idea how character trading works. You are always going to get at least 1b isk for a character that has 51d of training on it.
Second, "Nobody would pay billions for accounts" is also incorrect. As the ability to simply add sp with plex is added to the game, the price of characters would actually increase, since CCP would be making sp into a tangibly tradable object. 2m sp = 350m isk.
Third, you are limited to 10 buddy invites per month, not three.
Fourth, Plex are cheap. I make 700m per day goofing off in space with my friends. That is 2 plex every day, and it would give me a significant advantage over someone who doesn't play as much as I do.
Fifth, sure, you can remove the waiting time for skills to progress. I would quit playing at that point, since it is a part of the reason I play eve in the first place. I am pretty sure that large numbers of other players would also feel the same. This would end up destroying CCP's core revenue stream: existing players.
Lastly, this change would only help to strengthen RMT/eBayers as they'd be getting a premium for their isk since it would inevitably go up in value.
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MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.05.10 00:07:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Annasys
Originally by: MorliDots22
Let's take your ideas.
First, that you think that prices for characters would fall like shares on a black friday is something that someone who has no idea how character trading works. You are always going to get at least 1b isk for a character that has 51d of training on it.
Second, "Nobody would pay billions for accounts" is also incorrect. As the ability to simply add sp with plex is added to the game, the price of characters would actually increase, since CCP would be making sp into a tangibly tradable object. 2m sp = 350m isk.
Third, you are limited to 10 buddy invites per month, not three.
Fourth, Plex are cheap. I make 700m per day goofing off in space with my friends. That is 2 plex every day, and it would give me a significant advantage over someone who doesn't play as much as I do.
Fifth, sure, you can remove the waiting time for skills to progress. I would quit playing at that point, since it is a part of the reason I play eve in the first place. I am pretty sure that large numbers of other players would also feel the same. This would end up destroying CCP's core revenue stream: existing players.
Lastly, this change would only help to strengthen RMT/eBayers as they'd be getting a premium for their isk since it would inevitably go up in value.
First, show me somebody who is "clever" enought to pay 1b for a 51 old day char.
Secondly, the prices of characters are now only so high because you have to wait a year to achieve 24millions sp and this is only if you had a perfect skill plan in one direction. You are a free person, if you want to spent several hours a day farming plex its your choice.
You are right the ISK would be more valuable because 2 millions sp for a plex is a great advantage comparing to now. But this is exactly the thing against RMT - the price for plex would rise which means it will be much harder to sell it outside. Simultaneously the price for a char would fall because its easier to achieve a higher sp amount.
All in all :
1. ISK will be much more valuable. Its always good for a currency be valuable instead of inflation.
2. According to 1. plex will also more valuable so you have to spend much more time farming for it. Conclusion - less RMT, Bots and Ebay
3. Prices for characters will fall. Also very good against Ebay.
4. According to 2. it will be very hard to get a plex through farming so "automatic skilling" which I think you fear will not appear.
5. Now a official GTC 60 days alias 2 PLEX costs 30 Euro. A billion of ISK on a black market costs about 20 dollars. With my idea implemented, ISK value will rise - higher price on a black market. Conclusion - why risk being banned if the prices are the same ?
The discussion continiue..
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Annasys
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.10 01:16:00 -
[14]
Originally by: MorliDots22
1. ISK will be much more valuable. Its always good for a currency be valuable instead of inflation.
2. According to 1. plex will also more valuable so you have to spend much more time farming for it. Conclusion - less RMT, Bots and Ebay
3. Prices for characters will fall. Also very good against Ebay.
4. According to 2. it will be very hard to get a plex through farming so "automatic skilling" which I think you fear will not appear.
5. Now a official GTC 60 days alias 2 PLEX costs 30 Euro. A billion of ISK on a black market costs about 20 dollars. With my idea implemented, ISK value will rise - higher price on a black market. Conclusion - why risk being banned if the prices are the same ?
The discussion continiue..
1) Isk won't be more valuable. Dollars will be more valuable, since it will require more isk/dollar.
2) According to my point about purchase price of plex, the more it goes up, the more RMT that will happen.
3) Prices for characters will go up. Thus helping ebay. They go up because the value of the sp will go up, thus the value of the character will go up.
4) It is not hard at all to farm money for plex. I really do make 700m per day doing basically nothing but chatting with my friends about horrible pubbies like yourself.
5) You are still mistaken on the value of isk. If plex starts selling for 500m each, that will be 30 Euro for 1b isk. It is still going to be 20 dollars for the same amount of isk. Incidentally, this will push MORE people to RMT than before.
Seriously, before you post again, you should really try reading some economics books.
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Zevran Arainai
Free Space Tech Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.10 03:10:00 -
[15]
For the god's love NO!
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Nieusha
Gallente the lazy corp
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Posted - 2011.05.10 04:10:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Zevran Arainai For the god's love NO!
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MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.05.10 09:28:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Annasys
1) Isk won't be more valuable. Dollars will be more valuable, since it will require more isk/dollar.
2) According to my point about purchase price of plex, the more it goes up, the more RMT that will happen.
3) Prices for characters will go up. Thus helping ebay. They go up because the value of the sp will go up, thus the value of the character will go up.
4) It is not hard at all to farm money for plex. I really do make 700m per day doing basically nothing but chatting with my friends about horrible pubbies like yourself.
5) You are still mistaken on the value of isk. If plex starts selling for 500m each, that will be 30 Euro for 1b isk. It is still going to be 20 dollars for the same amount of isk. Incidentally, this will push MORE people to RMT than before.
Seriously, before you post again, you should really try reading some economics books.
To your 3rd Argument The value of SP and chars will not go up but fall. The chars are now so expensive because of a long skill time. If players can get 2 millions SP for a buddy programm - shorter skilltime - low char prices. Iron logic.
According to it costs for PLEX will rise , maybe over a 500m ISK or even 1b. So you will need more ISK than before to farm to pay for it. Thus makes the life of RMT and Botusers harder.
To your 2nd and 5th argument :
Let look closely at your example:
Now a 80m SP char costs at least 1000 dollars in USA or about 1000 Euro in Europe ( 1b ISK - 3 PLEX official price )
Now we have : ca. 700m for 2 PLEX - 35 Dollars / 1b - 20 dollars on black market.
My idea implemented (2m SP for a upgraded buddy program) :
1b for a 2 PLEX - 35 dollars / 1b - 20 dollars on a black market (as you say). The price is going to same level. When it reaches the point GTC - 35 dollars - 2b / 1b - 20 dollars on a black market the RMT is dead.
The disadvantages of my idea :
1. Many of old players will be sad because now a new player can achieve SP much faster then he did. You fear " automatic skilling" but thus will not happen.
2. You will need much more time to farm for a PLEX
The advantages of my idea :
1. Shorter skill time for bringing new players to the game
2. Explosive cost rising for PLEX and extreme cost fall for characters.
3. RMT with ISK for PLEX will stop.
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Lemming22
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Posted - 2011.05.10 17:12:00 -
[18]
The idea is not bad. The only thing is to make sure not to give more than 2m SP instead of 30 days game time.
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Azhpol
Gallente Casa Del Wombat
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Posted - 2011.05.10 17:36:00 -
[19]
This idea is terrible and someone needs to be beaten with an econ textbook.
Even if economically for the game it was a good idea, it would be a bad idea for CCP because old players would quit in droves. Those old players are basically guaranteed income for CCP, because face it, if your gonna quit eve its gonna be in the first year or 2, if you last longer you are irredeemably trapped in its web(unless CCP screws you, which really doesn't happen often)
Additionally, you think we have too many supercaps now? When I can buy SP with both isk and real world money, at 6mil SP a month(given your figure of 3 max invites a month), I can have any skill I want in very little time at all. And, even tho I notice you are ignoring this point, I can vouch for the claim of 700ml a day, I do about 100mil a day, and I hardly spend time making money at all(an hour or 2 a day)
Not an inherently flawed idea, but one that would never survive contact with the eve playerbase, we as a group would abuse it so hard that eve would never recover. ----------------------------------------------- I don't post on an alt, I post on my forum main! |
Gericht22
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Posted - 2011.05.10 18:01:00 -
[20]
Hello, Im a new casual player.
If it would be possible to get 2m SP for a upgraded buddy program Im for it. Why some of you say that old players would quit the game? The idea seems not being stupid.
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr Spricer WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.05.10 18:08:00 -
[21]
If you're going to pick an alt to try and upvote your idea with, try one with a less conspicuous name.
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Pudel22
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Posted - 2011.05.11 07:42:00 -
[22]
Its a good idea. Both economical and friendly to all casual players.
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Ajurna Jakar
Gallente Jian Products Engineering Group Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.05.11 08:22:00 -
[23]
and another alt? way to fail at alt posting.
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Annasys
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.11 11:12:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Nieusha
Originally by: Danika Princip
Originally by: Annasys
Originally by: Emperor Salazar No.
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MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.05.11 17:43:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Azhpol
Even if economically for the game it was a good idea, it would be a bad idea for CCP because old players would quit in droves. Those old players are basically guaranteed income for CCP, because face it, if your gonna quit eve its gonna be in the first year or 2, if you last longer you are irredeemably trapped in its web(unless CCP screws you, which really doesn't happen often)
Not an inherently flawed idea, but one that would never survive contact with the eve playerbase, we as a group would abuse it so hard that eve would never recover.
1. Sorry, could you please explain why old players would " quit in droves" ?
2. Thank you for a constructive criticism about the economic part of my idea.
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Stegas Tyrano
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Posted - 2011.05.11 17:54:00 -
[26]
This is quite a bad idea but I do think people should be able to get other rewards for inviting newer players.
Maybe a little LP(500-1000)?
Also...
LOL at all the alt posts. Shtop... |
Damia Vanszar
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Posted - 2011.05.11 21:06:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Emperor Salazar No.
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr Spricer WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.05.11 23:00:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Stegas Tyrano This is quite a bad idea but I do think people should be able to get other rewards for inviting newer players.
Maybe a little LP(500-1000)?
Also...
LOL at all the alt posts.
Free month of gametime not enough?
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Azhpol
Gallente Casa Del Wombat
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Posted - 2011.05.12 05:44:00 -
[29]
Originally by: MorliDots22
1. Sorry, could you please explain why old players would " quit in droves" ?
Because the ability to effectively buy SP would kill the game for older players who can make all the isk they want. Its really that simple. Once you reach a certain point, the only non-pvp challenge is having enough patience to wait for SP. Take away the last major challenge, and people get bored and quit.
Also, there are already more than enough supercap pilots in game, tyvm. Fleet tactics should not have to be designed around forcing fights where supers can't come :P ----------------------------------------------- I don't post on an alt, I post on my forum main! |
MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.05.12 12:51:00 -
[30]
I bring another easy example - Missionrunning : To have a 100% output there at least in Empire I have to skill all this skills to 5 :
social,connections,negotiation,military connections,leadership.
Plus all gunnery and battleship including support skills.
With situation as it is now you shouldnt be surprised of RMT and botting, because its clear : 20 dollars - 1b ISK on black market - 60m SP Char - 8b ISK - we have 160 dollars for a 60m SP Char illegal.
Through legal way : GTC 60 days aka 2 PLEX- 35 dollars - now ca 700m ISK. Same Char costs 1142 dollars then. See the diffence now ? With my proposal implemented, PLEX would rise to 1b. It means that the price for PLEX in dollars would be lower than on black market: GTC 60 days aka 2 PLEX - 2b ISK. So players would by PLEX through legal way. Its better for CCP and whole player base.
I still dont get why the ability to gain 2m SP for a buddy program would kill the game for older players. The more SP you have and the faster you can get them the better. You have more options to fly and can use more devices.
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