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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 31 post(s) |
FellRaven
Minmatar Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:51:00 -
[1531]
Originally by: rcs619 The amount of b'awwing and doom-saying in this thread is amazing.
You guys DO realize that they aren't removing jump bridges from the game, right? They're still going to be there. You can still have a large, far-reaching jump bridge network, you'll just only be able to have one jump bridge per system. All it will mean is reshuffling and optimizing the jump bridges already in place. Instead of being able to jump bridge to the system right next door, the bridge network may just be limited to connecting key systems together, or connecting various constellations. You'll still be able to travel around fairly quick, this will just mean that you'll need to travel through a stargate between every jump bridge.
Honestly, it isn't even that much of a change, and most of the people in this thread are acting like the sky is falling.
At worst, this change won't do anything. At best, it will encourage more skirmishes at the gates between jump bridge systems, and lead to more opportunities for everyone to PvP.
For all the people talking about how it will be a ganker's paradise, just look at the current jump bridges. The only effective way to camp a jump bridge is with bombers. Ganking is all there is. You sit there, and hope to catch some lone hauler or battlecruiser. This will encourage people to not travel alone, and maybe even create more instances of the travel fleets coming into contact with the roaming skirmish gangs that are out looking for kills.
Also, all you NC people that are complaining, imagine how many billions of isk will be freed up if the NC sheds some of its extraneous jump bridges. That's more isk for ship reimbursment, POS fuel, ammo, and so on. Assuming it doesn't wind up just padding someone's pocket.
Come on people, stop running around and screaming like some kind of streetcorner bum with a tinfoil hat, and maybe this thread could get a decent discussion going.
So why not wait to apply these changes until after our little SOV war? Timing is everything you know. CCP have not offered any explanation of why they need to do this now and not in say 2 months time.
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bitters much
Nekkid Inc.
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:51:00 -
[1532]
Originally by: knobber Jobbler
Originally by: Alissa Solette Edited by: Alissa Solette on 11/05/2011 11:13:09
Originally by: Miso Hawnee DRF pro PVP? Which server are you playing eve on? GG you are out of touch...
I didn't say they're pro anything but they're definitely out-perfoming you guys at every turn. They also seem to be fielding a lot more supers then you guys... come to think of it perhaps there is some causal relationship between those two statements?
Question: Why is CCP making these changes? Answer: To much ISK in game.
Question: Why is there to much ISK in game? Answer: Because of Bots and RMT.
Question: Why does DRF have so many super capitals? Answer: Botted ISK.
Question: Why is DRF outpeforming the NC Answer: Botted ISK to pay PL and replace losses without issue.
Question: Why is DRF leaving the South to take over the North? Answer: Because there bot accounts are being banned and they want the tech moons to make income.
Everyone else living in Null Sec knows this, the only people who seem to be ignoring the effects of ill gotten ISK is CCP. CCP then makes changes because there is to much ISK and to many capitals in null sec so they make changes affecting all players rather than dealing solely with the players who have to much ISK.
Now you're gonna say this is tears, its not, its just a game. Its pointing out that without the ill gotten gains of botting the DRF wouldn't have been able to pay PL to fight for them and wouldn't be able to field supercapital blobs at will.
I know others are also guilty of botting and RMT so its not all on DRF's shoulders but lets face facts for a moment.
One of the few who read the daily Plaque Black newsletter about the state of the BFFism.
Free advice to you: Resist to read it.
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Avar Davola
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:52:00 -
[1533]
all these juicy tears, never stop being yourself CCP
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Rumpelstilski
Caldari Blood Covenant Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:53:00 -
[1534]
Edited by: Rumpelstilski on 11/05/2011 14:55:04 Is 0.0 industry currently geared to support the population living there?
All meaningful 0.0 industry is geared toward cap and supercap production, all other stuff is bought in Jita, because it's THAT easy, even for non-sov holding entities living in deep 0.0, jump freighters, capital proliferation and disposable cyno accounts are solely responsible for that
Is the relationship between 0.0 and empire balanced well enough?
They don't have a relationship tbh, risk vs reward.... Rewards in 0.0 surpass those of lvl4 whoring, but only if you take advantage of it. Belt npcing won't get you far, titan plexing will.
Does the current sovereignty system meet our goals?
No, far too static. Only entities that lost sov in the last year where
a) obliterated through overwhelming force in all timezones through consistent grinding b) failed to pay bill c) were griefed into not wanting that space anyway
Also, pretty much all invasions start from npc stations, the lack of npc stations in certain parts of space contribute greatly to their static sov history.
I'd suggest that rfing a station into it's first cycle (drop shields) makes the station a free port, this will give more incentive for dying entities to continue fighting after stations fall (to get assets out), will allow invading entities a forward beachead and will force the defenders to react on the first rf as if it mattered anything.
Are there enough incentives for conflict/pvp outside sov?
There are incentives, there aren't opportunities. Locals always have a logistical advantage and are capable to deploy in any part of their domain in too short time to have any meaningful small gang fights before blobs arrive.
Are we happy with movement/player interaction?
Depends on play style, those who want to move and interact do so, those who do not have all the game mechanics in place to not move and not interact with each other, sov benefits made joining awful bloated 0.0 alliances little more then npc corps.
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bitters much
Nekkid Inc.
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:54:00 -
[1535]
Originally by: FellRaven
So why not wait to apply these changes until after our little SOV war? Timing is everything you know. CCP have not offered any explanation of why they need to do this now and not in say 2 months time.
What does it matter, in 2 month another war will be on and your JB network is history.
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KFenn
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:54:00 -
[1536]
Originally by: Furb Killer So what you are saying is that you want a pvp arena?
I never said 'Arena'. I don't want some system where fixed numbers of pilots fight other pilots, unrestricted PvP is best. But jumpbridges effectively ruin any sort of fleet maneuvering. Trying to move your fleet around a constellation becomes meaningless if the enemy can just zip light-years away in an instant, and removes some of the more tactical side of fleets.
Back in my day we had to warp to gates at 15, and we had no jumpbridges. We managed just fine, with some smart piloting and general common sense.
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AntISGhey
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:58:00 -
[1537]
Originally by: KFenn
Originally by: Furb Killer So what you are saying is that you want a pvp arena?
I never said 'Arena'. I don't want some system where fixed numbers of pilots fight other pilots, unrestricted PvP is best. But jumpbridges effectively ruin any sort of fleet maneuvering. Trying to move your fleet around a constellation becomes meaningless if the enemy can just zip light-years away in an instant, and removes some of the more tactical side of fleets.
Back in my day we had to warp to gates at 15, and we had no jumpbridges. We managed just fine, with some smart piloting and general common sense.
Back in my day we had warp @ 10, but i suppose you were 'special'.
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KFenn
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:59:00 -
[1538]
Originally by: AntISGhey
Originally by: KFenn
Originally by: Furb Killer So what you are saying is that you want a pvp arena?
I never said 'Arena'. I don't want some system where fixed numbers of pilots fight other pilots, unrestricted PvP is best. But jumpbridges effectively ruin any sort of fleet maneuvering. Trying to move your fleet around a constellation becomes meaningless if the enemy can just zip light-years away in an instant, and removes some of the more tactical side of fleets.
Back in my day we had to warp to gates at 15, and we had no jumpbridges. We managed just fine, with some smart piloting and general common sense.
Back in my day we had warp @ 10, but i suppose you were 'special'.
Was it 10? Eh, that was like 4-5 years ago, my memory fails me. Still, the point still stands.
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FellRaven
Minmatar Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2011.05.11 14:59:00 -
[1539]
Originally by: bitters much
Originally by: FellRaven
So why not wait to apply these changes until after our little SOV war? Timing is everything you know. CCP have not offered any explanation of why they need to do this now and not in say 2 months time.
What does it matter, in 2 month another war will be on and your JB network is history.
It matters because people can plan for it and have it in place in advance they don't need to wait for the change. Still haven't heard a compelling reason to do it now and not in 2 months.
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AntISGhey
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:00:00 -
[1540]
Does it? The game I remember 5 years ago was a lot different to what it is today.
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Bagehi
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:01:00 -
[1541]
Edited by: Bagehi on 11/05/2011 15:06:08
Originally by: KFenn ITT: Unholy 0.0 carebear rage. Seriously, 0.0 should be a PvP area, not somewhere to farm sites to make your pretty wallet numbers numbers grow bigger. Don't like it, farm Level 4s in Highsec, or learn to PvP.
GJ on the plan to finally nerf carebear 0.0 CCP, it's long overdue.
Hard to PVP without ships. It doesn't matter how much isk you have saved up running lvl 4s on alts if there aren't ships for sale. Unless you think people should have to go back to empire to buy ships on a regular basis. Because no one in their right mind is going to mine low-ends in null sec, so anything CCP does to make it more difficult to move around null is going to drive up the price of low ends and thus ships.
Originally by: AntISGhey Does it? The game I remember 5 years ago was a lot different to what it is today.
Null sec had a couple thousand characters living in it 5 years ago. Now there are tens of thousands.
Originally by: AntISGhey Back in my day we had warp @ 10, but i suppose you were 'special'.
Back in my day, I had hundreds of bookmarks because it gave me an edge, in that I could travel faster than my prey. That wasn't a good game mechanic. It was cheating, but sanctioned cheating.
This signature is useless, but it is red.
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Jenn aSide
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:04:00 -
[1542]
Edited by: Jenn aSide on 11/05/2011 15:04:48
Originally by: Bagehi
Hard to PVP without ships. It doesn't matter how much isk you have saved up running lvl 4s on alts if there aren't ships for sale. Unless you think people should have to go back to empire to buy ships on a regular basis. Because no one in their right mind is going to mine low-ends in null sec, so anything CCP does to make it more difficult to move around null is going to drive up the price of low ends and thus ships.
lol, CCP, masters of unintended consequences.....
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Rastigan
Caldari Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:04:00 -
[1543]
Originally by: knobber Jobbler
Question: Why is CCP making these changes? Answer: To much ISK in game.
Question: Why is there to much ISK in game? Answer: Because of Bots and RMT.
Question: Why does DRF have so many super capitals? Answer: Botted ISK.
Question: Why is DRF outpeforming the NC Answer: Botted ISK to pay PL and replace losses without issue.
Question: Why is DRF leaving the South to take over the North? Answer: Because there bot accounts are being banned and they want the tech moons to make income.
Everyone else living in Null Sec knows this, the only people who seem to be ignoring the effects of ill gotten ISK is CCP. CCP then makes changes because there is to much ISK and to many capitals in null sec so they make changes affecting all players rather than dealing solely with the players who have to much ISK.
Now you're gonna say this is tears, its not, its just a game. Its pointing out that without the ill gotten gains of botting the DRF wouldn't have been able to pay PL to fight for them and wouldn't be able to field supercapital blobs at will.
I know others are also guilty of botting and RMT so its not all on DRF's shoulders but lets face facts for a moment.
+9000
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AntISGhey
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:06:00 -
[1544]
CCP should really post their vision of what they think nul-sec should be like and save themselves threads like this and the playerbase the time their wasting on Supercaps online.
I personally dont believe they have any vision for any area in EvE and never will, else after 8 years wouldn't we be there by now?
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:08:00 -
[1545]
The DRF actually bots minerals, just an FYI. Although I guess with Vale and Geminate back in their hands they'll be botting ISK too.
Fix Lag! |
KFenn
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:08:00 -
[1546]
Originally by: Bagehi Edited by: Bagehi on 11/05/2011 15:02:40 Hard to PVP without ships. It doesn't matter how much isk you have saved up running lvl 4s on alts if there aren't ships for sale. Unless you think people should have to go back to empire to buy ships on a regular basis. Because no one in their right mind is going to mine low-ends in null sec, so anything CCP does to make it more difficult to move around null is going to drive up the price of low ends and thus ships.
Well, then you need people who will mine low-ends. Do mining ops where people get paid the same, no matter what they mine. Your issue there isn't that the things you need are unavailable to you, it just you have no willing pilots. Make them willing with incentives.
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bitters much
Nekkid Inc.
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:08:00 -
[1547]
Originally by: FellRaven
Originally by: bitters much
Originally by: FellRaven
So why not wait to apply these changes until after our little SOV war? Timing is everything you know. CCP have not offered any explanation of why they need to do this now and not in say 2 months time.
What does it matter, in 2 month another war will be on and your JB network is history.
It matters because people can plan for it and have it in place in advance they don't need to wait for the change. Still haven't heard a compelling reason to do it now and not in 2 months.
Because Hilmar loves NC tears is my guess
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Svennig
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:09:00 -
[1548]
Originally by: FellRaven
It matters because people can plan for it and have it in place in advance they don't need to wait for the change. Still haven't heard a compelling reason to do it now and not in 2 months.
Screw two months. Delay it until the already-identified and timetabled 0.0 review. Still haven't heard a compelling reason why it has to be done now and not then.
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Bagehi
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:10:00 -
[1549]
Originally by: AntISGhey CCP should really post their vision of what they think nul-sec should be like and save themselves threads like this and the playerbase the time their wasting on Supercaps online.
I personally dont believe they have any vision for any area in EvE and never will, else after 8 years wouldn't we be there by now?
This might be true. Their "plans" seem to have a worse attention span than a kid with ADD on crack.
This signature is useless, but it is red.
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SmashTech
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:10:00 -
[1550]
Originally by: KFenn Well, then you need people who will mine low-ends. Do mining ops where people get paid the same, no matter what they mine. Your issue there isn't that the things you need are unavailable to you, it just you have no willing pilots. Make them willing with incentives.
Hell if I wanted to do this I'd live in highsec where nobody can shoot at me without getting killed--
Wait that's what already happens.
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KFenn
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:12:00 -
[1551]
Originally by: SmashTech
Originally by: KFenn Well, then you need people who will mine low-ends. Do mining ops where people get paid the same, no matter what they mine. Your issue there isn't that the things you need are unavailable to you, it just you have no willing pilots. Make them willing with incentives.
Hell if I wanted to do this I'd live in highsec where nobody can shoot at me without getting killed--
Wait that's what already happens.
Well if an alliance doesn't want to facilitate ship building, then they get no ships. It's easy to produce in nullsec, so long as you have a semi-decent industrial win who is supported properly by the alliance.
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Messy Beaver
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:12:00 -
[1552]
NC were the biggest factor in shaping the way our game plays today and yet they have the audacity to start whining when it backfires on them.
A long time ago when small roaming gangs were viable, whether they be from hostile neighbours or roams from empire, the NC(average member had poor pvp knowledge) they had the option of engaging the enemy in similar ships and similar size fleets, thus learning and getting better.
Instead they chose to get as many members in fleet as possible, in the biggest ship possible they could. I was a member of the NC then and all too often a small sized roam would enter our space, only to find us undock a fleet of bs's and carriers to engage their frig/cruiser gangs. Guess what the NC never got better at pvp and the style of bring your biggest ship/most members became the weapon of choice.
However having more members in your fleet means having to have more systems for the average members to make isk. With the size of alliances needed you had to have vast amounts of space to keep them all happy. With so much space you become far too dependant on having that JB network keeping your alliance/power bloc moving.
Even now with this diluted JB nerf you won't get the hint. You won't trim the fat, optimise your logistics by reducing member numbers and amount of space you hold. You won't raise your skill level and try to fight smaller entities with higher pvp knowledge thus raising your own(not when the people at the top are making so much isk)
So am I mad? Not at all I'm finding it ****ing hilarious that the game you helped to shape is coming to bite you on the ass. Here's hoping that those members in the NC that would love it to be so much more, actually gain a foothold in the alliances but I wouldn't hold my breath. |
Bagehi
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:13:00 -
[1553]
Edited by: Bagehi on 11/05/2011 15:16:19
Originally by: KFenn
Originally by: Bagehi Edited by: Bagehi on 11/05/2011 15:02:40 Hard to PVP without ships. It doesn't matter how much isk you have saved up running lvl 4s on alts if there aren't ships for sale. Unless you think people should have to go back to empire to buy ships on a regular basis. Because no one in their right mind is going to mine low-ends in null sec, so anything CCP does to make it more difficult to move around null is going to drive up the price of low ends and thus ships.
Well, then you need people who will mine low-ends. Do mining ops where people get paid the same, no matter what they mine. Your issue there isn't that the things you need are unavailable to you, it just you have no willing pilots. Make them willing with incentives.
If you pay the same for mining low ends/hr as high ends/hr, you will increase the price of ships dramatically. That is the issue. The higher the cost of ships, the higher the replacement cost, the less PVP.
Originally by: Messy Beaver NC were the biggest factor in shaping the way our game plays today and yet they have the audacity to start whining when it backfires on them.
A long time ago when small roaming gangs were viable, whether they be from hostile neighbours or roams from empire, the NC(average member had poor pvp knowledge) they had the option of engaging the enemy in similar ships and similar size fleets, thus learning and getting better.
A long time ago the same amount of null sec space was populated by a fraction of the characters currently living in it. Population density is up, therefore numbers fielded is up. If you want low numbers, the population density has to go back down. Either people have to quit or there has to be more space.
This signature is useless, but it is red.
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Cellistara
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:13:00 -
[1554]
Originally by: Fix Lag The DRF actually bots minerals, just an FYI. Although I guess with Vale and Geminate back in their hands they'll be botting ISK too.
They run combat bots and kill drones, then their salvager bots scoop the drone poo. Then they RMT the hell outta everything.
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Mibad
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:14:00 -
[1555]
CCP do you have any lipstick? Cause I'd like to atleast look pretty before you F*** me again.
First the anom nerfs and now jb nerfs. All you are doing is driving more players away from null sec, I expect even more people to rage quit over the endless nerfs you have been throwing out recently. You claim you want more people living in nullsec, but in reality you are just driving them away.
This doesn't hurt alliances, this hurts the average pilot. Force projection is made with titan bridges and cyno blobs.
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Bagehi
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:19:00 -
[1556]
Originally by: Cellistara
Originally by: Fix Lag The DRF actually bots minerals, just an FYI. Although I guess with Vale and Geminate back in their hands they'll be botting ISK too.
They run combat bots and kill drones, then their salvager bots scoop the drone poo. Then they RMT the hell outta everything.
Look at Zydrine prices. Back in my day, when we farmed a drone 5/10 plex to build ships, zydrine sold for around 5000/unit. Takes a lot of high end mining/drone plexes farming to get it this low. You'd think someone in CCP would notice how the balance of minerals has dramatically changed.
This signature is useless, but it is red.
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Megy Feel
V.L.A.S.T. V.L.A.S.T
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:19:00 -
[1557]
Originally by: Cellistara
Originally by: Fix Lag The DRF actually bots minerals, just an FYI. Although I guess with Vale and Geminate back in their hands they'll be botting ISK too.
They run combat bots and kill drones, then their salvager bots scoop the drone poo. Then they RMT the hell outta everything.
Ironyoverload... check your alliance mates, then check the drama on your own forums.
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Medarr
Amarr Vengance Inc. Wayfarer Stellar Initiative
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:22:00 -
[1558]
pffft do you guys at CCP even listen to your playerbase??? Stop messing with our 0.0
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Naomi Wildfire
Amarr Spricer WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:24:00 -
[1559]
Edited by: Naomi Wildfire on 11/05/2011 15:25:17 Sorry to say boys, but i welcome these changes.
While in the NC, traveling was fast and very safe (its already safe enough if you know how to without JBs), now you just need to add 1 jump per previous 2 jumps.
Its also a little boost to non space holders since you just need to keep an eye on 1 JB, also you dont need to worry about the opponent to bridge capitals into a cyno jammed system.
The only thing i want to add is, If BOs are allowed to use JBs, JFs should too. Those two are the only exceptions of jump drive equipped ships who can use jumpgates.
Quote: pffft do you guys at CCP even listen to your playerbase??? Stop messing with our 0.0
What exactly is "your" 0.0, i thought its CCPs game. Just because you claim stuff doesnt make it yours in the end.
I say 0.0 is mine and i like the changes.
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raging star
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Posted - 2011.05.11 15:25:00 -
[1560]
Edited by: raging star on 11/05/2011 15:25:26 OK i don't know why i am doing this since CCP has proven time and time again that they don't give **** what we think or want, but here it goes. Leave 0.0 alone you are just F**King it up! don't touch it, don't look at it, if you have IDEA about tweaking something slap yourselves outside the head and walk away. The sactums where good, the jump bridge network was good. Places that required your attention and are completely ignore are HIGH SEC AND LOW SEC (specially low sec), low sec has no real incentive to be there and is really just pointless. This little tweak you guys have being doing have completely screw it up, we HAD a balance 0.0 and where having fun so why F**K with it!. we where fat and happy killing each other and having good fights but that slowly going away thanks to CCP you are a bunch of idiots
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