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Vico Dean
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Posted - 2011.05.14 11:44:00 -
[1]
greetings,
I'm fairly new to eve and about to finish training for cov ops to do exploration. But I haven't grasped the whole 'stealth' thing yet.
only thing I know so far is, you can't be scanned and are decloaked if you bump into another ship.
Now I try to find out what the rules of stealth are in detail.
Most important poins to me are: 1. Things that decloak you, so I don't lose my first ship to being oblivious. 2. Are cloaked ships absolutely invisible or are they just transparent (like getting out of a gate) 3. Are there weapons that can be fired into a directon without a target. 4. can I use codebreaker and/or analyzer while cloaked (and ignore possible spawns at exploration sites) 5. are there npcs that can see through stealth (sleepers ? I came across some of them and they're mean )
And I also would appreciate advice if a tengu is a good long term goal in terms of exploration sinse it can be fit to be like a cov ops but with more firepower so you don't have to switch ships all the time (or is that a bad idea to fit like that ?)
PS: please disregard any grammar mistakes or typos, english is not my native language but correct me if you like
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Mister Rocknrolla
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Posted - 2011.05.14 12:56:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Mister Rocknrolla on 14/05/2011 12:57:51
Originally by: Vico Dean greetings,
I'm fairly new to eve and about to finish training for cov ops to do exploration. But I haven't grasped the whole 'stealth' thing yet.
only thing I know so far is, you can't be scanned and are decloaked if you bump into another ship.
Now I try to find out what the rules of stealth are in detail.
Most important poins to me are: 1. Things that decloak you, so I don't lose my first ship to being oblivious. 2. Are cloaked ships absolutely invisible or are they just transparent (like getting out of a gate) 3. Are there weapons that can be fired into a directon without a target. 4. can I use codebreaker and/or analyzer while cloaked (and ignore possible spawns at exploration sites) 5. are there npcs that can see through stealth (sleepers ? I came across some of them and they're mean )
And I also would appreciate advice if a tengu is a good long term goal in terms of exploration sinse it can be fit to be like a cov ops but with more firepower so you don't have to switch ships all the time (or is that a bad idea to fit like that ?)
PS: please disregard any grammar mistakes or typos, english is not my native language but correct me if you like
Exploration and stealth do not necessarily go hand-in-hand. That's a bit of a misconception because CovOps ships get a scanning bonus. But I believe that goes back to combat scanning, rather than anomaly scanning.
Combat scanning (using combat probes) is scanning for ships--for which you probably want stealth. Anomaly scanning (using core probes) is for locating sites and wormholes--stealth not needed unless you head into a WH. . To your questions: 1) getting within 2500m (2000?) will cause you to decloak. Pretty much any object in space. 2) if you mean visually: the transparency effect is just for your reference. You are invisible and essentially unscannable. 3) smartbombs, bombs 4) no. No modules can be activated while cloaked. 5) I don't think so. (Confidence level 80%.)
I use an Anathema to scout/probe and switch out as needed. But my understanding is that a Tengu can do what you want.
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Serpents smile
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Posted - 2011.05.14 13:42:00 -
[3]
Adding to the above:
5 Confirming its no.
And a exploration tengu sucks, at least in the way you want it. Use the exploration tools, being able to push out damage and cloak.... The cloak simply will kill your DPS.
What will work for low sec exploration is a force recon ship like the Pilgrim, but for serious sites like in 0.0 you're back to using 1 ship to probe and then swap to a ship to kill.
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ISD IonCharge
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Posted - 2011.05.14 16:03:00 -
[4]
Decloaking range is 2000m. Overview distances are used, i.e. for large objects such as stations or stargates, the range will be counted from the edge of their radius, not the centre of the model as it would be for some smaller objects. This means you can sit in "jump range" of a gate, or in access range of a container (both 2500m) while remaining cloaked.
Proximity is the only way to detect a cloaked ship. Cloaked ships will take damage from AoE weapons (bombs, smartbombs) however the attacker will not receive a damage readout if they hit a cloaked ship, so these weapons cannot be used to extend the range at which you can detect cloaked ships past 2km.
NPCs will act as though they cannot to see cloaked ships though you may find them drifting in your direction nonetheless. NPC spawns at gates in low security space have been known to appear near cloaked ships, even if they are significantly off the gate (read: 200km+) which gives an indication that a cloaked ship is present in that general area. This is fairly rare though.
Modules may not be activated while your ship is cloaked (including local modules such as hardeners). Any active modules will deactivate when you activate your cloak, so make sure to turn them back on as required.
You may use your ship's various scanners while cloaked. This includes directional scanner, onboard scanner, and if you launched any scan probes, you may continue repositioning and scanning with them while your ship remains cloaked.
If you had any drones out in space when you cloaked, they will become disconnected from your ship, much as if you had warped out.
You cannot cloak if any ship, drone or other object (e.g., starbase) has you targeted. You can cloak while they are targeting you though you have no way to know if someone is targeting you or not. When someone has targeted you you will see them have flashing yellow brackets around their overview icon, unless they are using a passive targeter. --- ISD IonCharge Lt. Commander ISD STAR |
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.05.14 19:31:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Serpents smile And a exploration tengu sucks, at least in the way you want it. Use the exploration tools, being able to push out damage and cloak.... The cloak simply will kill your DPS.
What will work for low sec exploration is a force recon ship like the Pilgrim, but for serious sites like in 0.0 you're back to using 1 ship to probe and then swap to a ship to kill.
With a Tengu you simply carry a different offensive subsystem with you, and fit it at a NPC station when you arrive in system.
I'm too lazy though, and just do sites in my unprobeable Tengu. It is low in DPS, but it is enough to get the job done.
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Mister Rocknrolla
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Posted - 2011.05.14 20:18:00 -
[6]
Originally by: ISD IonCharge Modules may not be activated while your ship is cloaked (including local modules such as hardeners). Any active modules will deactivate when you activate your cloak, so make sure to turn them back on as required.
You may use your ship's various scanners while cloaked. This includes directional scanner, onboard scanner, and if you launched any scan probes, you may continue repositioning and scanning with them while your ship remains cloaked.
OP Just in case it's not clear: You have to uncloak to launch your probes. But you can then cloak up, scan and recover them while cloaked.
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Vico Dean
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Posted - 2011.05.14 21:07:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Vico Dean on 14/05/2011 21:07:36 Thank you for all the helpful answers I get it now :)
@ Tau Cabalander could you give me a example fitting ?
I'm not crazy about optimal dps and stuff so would a tengu with scan/cloak modules be able to handle rats at sites found in highsec ? I mainly want the cloak because I'm a little paranoid about suicide ganks.. (can't gank what you can't see right ?)
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Tel'me Am Peur
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Posted - 2011.05.14 21:16:00 -
[8]
If you're too poor to go mucking about in tengus just yet a stealth bomber (i'd reccomend all of them save for the nemesis, which is a pain to fit without perfect skills) is a great starting point. Relative low sp to use, can rat like a champ, and if you learn how to use it right can be a very effective solo pvp ship.
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Irulan Corinno
Caldari 714th SQN - Snowflakes
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Posted - 2011.05.14 22:39:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Vico Dean I'm not crazy about optimal dps and stuff so would a tengu with scan/cloak modules be able to handle rats at sites found in highsec ?
A Tengu is more than sufficienty for highsec exploration. DPS may be lower when you're fully exploration fit but a Tengu's tank is superior
Originally by: Vico Dean I mainly want the cloak because I'm a little paranoid about suicide ganks.. (can't gank what you can't see right ?)
Just keep in mind that ganks usually happen while undocking or near gates, not when you're exploring. Best is to make instawarp-out-of station bookmarks and never autopilot.
And no, you can't really rat or mission like that as you can't use modules when cloaked.
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