Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
CHOSER
|
Posted - 2011.05.18 23:41:00 -
[1]
Hi
Wanting to get back into the game and though I'd try some Incursion runs.
I heard that a Legion could be good .... does anyone have a good fit for the job with out costing an arm or leg ?
Or is there other ships & fits that would be better ( including Faction ships ) ... am just looking to do DPS atm.
Many thanks .. just looking for some general info to get me started.
|
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
|
Posted - 2011.05.18 23:46:00 -
[2]
For armor, bhaalgorn or paladin will get you into fleets the fastest. Abaddon is also nice if you're looking to do assaults or HQ sites (the 20 and 40 man sites respectively) |
Falin Whalen
Gallente GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 02:03:00 -
[3]
AB Beam Zelot. Small sig and great resists, next question?
|
Aamrr
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 02:09:00 -
[4]
Why would you ever cripple your ship by fitting beams? Pulses have more than enough range, even when loading multifrequency. It saves a ton on powergrid and capacitor, while improving DPS and tracking.
|
Crabs Collector
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 04:54:00 -
[5]
Absolution, Paladin and Bhaalgorn are the best ships, depending on the fleet and what type of incursion youre doing.
|
EnslaverOfMinmatar
Amarr
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 07:20:00 -
[6]
Avatar uʍop ǝpısdn ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ ƃuıpɐǝɹ ǝɹɐ noʎ |
The Djego
Minmatar Hellequin Inc.
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 07:42:00 -
[7]
Edited by: The Djego on 19/05/2011 07:45:27 It is awesome against all the frigs, and with damage imps you still looking at 750 DPS @ 17km with conflag in a 700m/s quick hull that offers good abilities to pin the Cruisers down quick. I actually prefer it a lot over the absolution since the 52km force projection is a lot more useful than the extra 100-150 DPS the Absolution brings in a ideal scenarios(getting within 10km of the cruisers etc).
[Legion, Incursion] Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink True Sansha Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Armor EM Hardener II Armor Thermic Hardener II
Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Medium Ancillary Current Router II Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II Medium Anti-Kinetic Pump I
Legion Defensive - Augmented Plating Legion Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Legion Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Legion Offensive - Liquid Crystal Magnifiers Legion Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
Edit: You don't need the powergrid rig in this setup but it enables you to swap to a rep setup for WH/other stuff with just changing one sub and a T1 rig. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
|
Aamrr
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 11:18:00 -
[8]
That legion fitting isn't bad, but it's a little light on buffer. Armor reps don't come til the end of the cycle, and the legion doesn't have much in the way of base armor hit points (it comes from that 50% subsystem bonus and the nice resists).
A plate adds a lot of hit points, so it's worth looking into. You can swap out the EM hardener and use an anti-EM rig to compensate.
Also, I'd definitely throw on another locus coordinator II where that ancillary current router is. That'll let you swap the scripts on those tracking computers, giving you much more reliable hits.
|
Amar Azaph
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 12:11:00 -
[9]
Originally by: The Djego Edited by: The Djego on 19/05/2011 07:49:59 It is awesome against all the frigs, and with damage imps you still looking at 750 DPS @ 17km with conflag in a 700m/s quick hull that offers good abilities to pin the Cruisers down quick. I actually prefer it a lot over the absolution since the 52km force projection and higher speed is a lot more useful than the extra 100-150 DPS the Absolution brings in a ideal scenario(getting within 10km of the cruisers etc).
[Legion, Incursion] Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink True Sansha Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Armor EM Hardener II Armor Thermic Hardener II
Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Medium Ancillary Current Router II Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II Medium Anti-Kinetic Pump I
Legion Defensive - Augmented Plating Legion Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Legion Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Legion Offensive - Liquid Crystal Magnifiers Legion Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
Edit: You don't need the powergrid rig in this setup but it enables you to swap to a rep setup for WH/other stuff with just changing one sub and a T1 rig.
The thing about this fitting that i don't understand, Isn't there supposed to be a penalty for fitting two or more of the same things? 3x Imperial Navy Heat sink for example, three of them, surely there must be some sort of penalty? Two tracking computers etc etc Sent from a campfire using smoke signals. |
Elesaar
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 12:43:00 -
[10]
Originally by: EnslaverOfMinmatar Avatar
This
|
|
The Djego
Minmatar Hellequin Inc.
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 12:56:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Aamrr That legion fitting isn't bad, but it's a little light on buffer. Armor reps don't come til the end of the cycle, and the legion doesn't have much in the way of base armor hit points (it comes from that 50% subsystem bonus and the nice resists).
A plate adds a lot of hit points, so it's worth looking into. You can swap out the EM hardener and use an anti-EM rig to compensate.
Also, I'd definitely throw on another locus coordinator II where that ancillary current router is. That'll let you swap the scripts on those tracking computers, giving you much more reliable hits.
The buffer is good if you can trust your logis(fit a plate if you don't know them) so I prefer to stick with a bit more DPS and speed. Like I sayed the pg rig mostly serves another purpose, however if you want to fit a 800mm on it you will need a T2 pg rig or a T1 and a grid imp.
I often swap around the scripts. Most of the time I try to take the frigs with Scorch and double tracking script at 30-40km ranges and move to optimal scripts + conflags against the cruisers and BS.
Originally by: Amar Azaph The thing about this fitting that i don't understand, Isn't there supposed to be a penalty for fitting two or more of the same things? 3x Imperial Navy Heat sink for example, three of them, surely there must be some sort of penalty? Two tracking computers etc etc
Yes there are penalty's but after all, you want to maximize the damage and damage application in a good incursion fitting after getting a suitable buffer. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
|
Zakua Sabot
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 13:10:00 -
[12]
Amar Azaph I believe is wondering why you would stack things like heat sinks, nano plates and so on. Amar, I do not know the penalty curve and percentages but for easy math if one heat sink gave you 10% damage modifier then adding another one will give you a penalty BUT the end result is STILL better then 10%....Say 1 HS gives 10%, 2 gives a total of 15% and 3 gives a total of 17% damage modifier...so yes u get penalized but the sum still out wieghs the penalty.
Very rough, simple math explanation...there are people in here who have this down to a science but I know your question...I asked it my self about 10 months ago.. Cheers!
|
Tobiaz
Spacerats
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 13:15:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Tobiaz on 19/05/2011 13:15:20
Originally by: Amar Azaph
The thing about this fitting that i don't understand, Isn't there supposed to be a penalty for fitting two or more of the same things? 3x Imperial Navy Heat sink for example, three of them, surely there must be some sort of penalty? Two tracking computers etc etc
The penalty stacks, but it's not like the penalty is that harsh it totally nullifies the effect of a third module. I see a lot of mission setups even use four damage mods (though that seems to be the limit).
|
Crabs Collector
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 13:24:00 -
[14]
I get much better results in the absolution than in the legion. For vanguards you just dont need any speed modules on the abso, so you can just fit 3x tracking computers (or maybe a TP) and get big hits.
|
Wannabehero
Wayward Ventures
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 13:40:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Amar Azaph The thing about this fitting that i don't understand, Isn't there supposed to be a penalty for fitting two or more of the same things? 3x Imperial Navy Heat sink for example, three of them, surely there must be some sort of penalty? Two tracking computers etc etc
There is a standard stacking penalty in Eve Online. It has literally been years since I revisited the numbers, but the rule of thumb I can remember off the top of my head is
1st effect - 100% effective 2nd effect - ~82% effective 3rd effect - ~54% effective 4th effect - ~20ish% effective
With the penalties being applied in order from most effective (highest numerical mod) to lowest.
Using damage mods as an example, a standard tech II damage mod provides +10% damage and -10.5% duration (x0.895 RoF). This equates to a 22.9% DPS increase. For a stack of damage mods, these effective values translate into:
1st mod - 22.9% from this mod 2nd mod - ~18.79% from this mod 3rd mod - ~12.37% from this mod 4th mod - ~4.6% from this mod
If we multiple them to get the actual DPS increase of your weapon system, this list becomes
1 mod - 22.9% DPS increase 2 mods - 46.0% DPS increase 3 mods - 64.1% DPS increase 4 mods - 71.6% DPS increase
This is why, even though there is a stacking penalty, people still use multiple mods with the same effect, such as damage mods and resistance mods.
Hope this helped. ---
≡√≡ Don't harsh my mellow |
Mara Kashuken
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 19:09:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Falin Whalen AB Beam Zelot. Small sig and great resists, next question?
I run mine with T2 pulse. I'll give the beams a try next outing. Zealot rocks.
|
Tenzeck
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 22:01:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Crabs Collector Absolution, Paladin and Bhaalgorn are the best ships, depending on the fleet and what type of incursion youre doing.
You left out the Nightmare. Shame on you!
Of course, this requires a shield fleet to be worth running over a Paladin or Bhaalgorn. Nightmares are great in any incursion site, however. They have plenty of room for multiple webs/TCs for Vanguard sites while still having a gigantic shield buffer with high resists. Additionally, changing from pulse to beams and swapping webs for sensor boosters turns you into an excellent sniper for the longer ranged sites.
The hull is expensive but you can fit it fairly cheaply, other than faction webs for range. As you make money running incursions, you can get fancy with the mods if you want.
|
Traejun DiSanctis
Caldari
|
Posted - 2011.05.19 22:34:00 -
[18]
DRAEK...obviously.
|
Drexit
|
Posted - 2011.05.20 12:12:00 -
[19]
legion, paladin, guardian
I think the legion is better than the abso, despite -100 dps. Its faster, smaller sig, and longer range on the same weapons.
Paladin has great dps and versatility - it can drag around a sniper fit for assaults or mom fits.
Guardian, duh.
|
Khory Thunderstar
The Single Scam
|
Posted - 2011.05.20 13:08:00 -
[20]
Both the Bhaalgorn and the Harbinger can do pretty mean Shield Tanks (!!!) for vanguards.
If you are talking about assault / HQ, you should probably be looking at Apoc / Abbadon. Or again, Bhaalgorn.
I know you are just looking for DPS, but where? Vanguard necessities are much different from assaults and HQs.
|
|
Sturmwolke
|
Posted - 2011.05.20 17:00:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Sturmwolke on 20/05/2011 17:01:29 You can run in Harbingers, but its a little squishy imo. For armor tankers, you'd be generally looking for 7-8 low slots for any sort of decent tank & dps.
The best value Amarr ship for starters is the Armageddon. Good dps, good tank if configured for tanking, drone bay flexibility which allows the use of sentry drones for added dps against cruiser/BS targets and extra utility high for a variety of mods like cap transfers/drone aug/auto target.
The rule of thumb when fitting ships for Incursion is >= 70% all round resist, and have at least 15K armor points for BS size sig. You can run around with 10K armor points, but some logistic pilots might get a good scare to see your armor dropping to half under 10 secs For higher difficulty sites like Assault/HQ/Mom sites, ~20K >= armor is preferable if your resists are average. I don't use the normal ehp reference because it doesn't reflect accurately what's needed due to ship variations.
One other thing when running incursions in BSes, specifically Vanguard sites - please make sure you fit at MINIMUM, 1 web. The better fits usually run with double faction webs. There's a variety of ways to fit the tank for the Armageddon, but there's one thing to keep in mind - you need to skew the resist higher for Kinetic & Explosive to better resist the Sansha torp damage (which will be more than Sansha laser damage).
See below :
[Armageddon, Incursion - Vanguard Starter] Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Kinetic Hardener II Armor Explosive Hardener II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I (or a Tracking Enhancer II) Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Tracking Computer II Stasis Webifier II (faction preferable) Stasis Webifier II (faction preferable)
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L (or T2 Mega Pulse Laser II) Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Auto Targeting System I (or T2)
Large Anti-Thermic Pump I Large Trimark Armor Pump I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I (or another Large Trimark Armor Pump I)
stats : roughly 15-16K armor 74/73/80/79 resist 680-798 turret dps using faction MF
edit:grammar
|
Amar Azaph
|
Posted - 2011.05.21 03:18:00 -
[22]
Thanks for the responses to my question guys. Wish I had asked the question sooner, now i can start sticking a few heat sinks on myself :)
Sent from a campfire using smoke signals. |
katmortusis
|
Posted - 2011.05.21 09:07:00 -
[23]
vanguards: Absolution/Legion/(Zealot) Assaults: Absolution/Legion/NavyApoc/Zealot HQs: NavyApoc Kundalini: NavyApoc All: Paladin/Nightmare/Bhaalgorn/Guardian
i tried the Abaddon as well but it lacks one important thing for everything but vanguards (and in vangs it is suboptimal) and this is cap-stability. it is a pain to use heavy cap boosters, there are ppl who use their orca as booster-transport but imo cap boosters in pve are not effective.
all other amarr ships are inferior to the ones mentioned imo
|
Sturmwolke
|
Posted - 2011.05.21 11:56:00 -
[24]
A properly fit Abaddon with T2 pulse is a terror in vanguard sites (if your team has enough webs), I'd hardly call an Abaddon suboptimal in vanguards. The Armageddon is the better choice for low skills, but the Abaddon wins hands for folks with higher skills. The cap issue is solved by fitting a T2 Elutriation rig.
As for assault/HQ sites, the Abddon is better suited for mid-range dps, but you can also refit for sniper that shoots up to 150km by running Meta4 Megabeams if pressed for it - doing roughly 300dps with faction Microwave (and cap stable to boot). There are folks that insists on fitting Tachs for the Abaddon, well, it's doable, but you'll lose a low slot and possibly a rig slot for minor gains - which isn't worth it as most of the sniper targets run around 100-130km ish ... well within the Megabeam's capability.
Above all, these ships can be had for a reasonable cost and it won't break the bank if you lose one. A tip for for those casual folks meaning to try their hands in Incursions, go cheap (but effective) until you get the hang of the environment. You WILL lose your ship. not if, but just a matter of when. Factors that contributes to you loosing your ship :
* server lag/disconnect/network problems. If you're scrambled in a site and half the fleet DCed, say bye bye to your billion isk ship.
* noob FCs. Typically runs in standard T1 non-faction ships, badly fitted, bad fleet mix when picking up folks, not in control of the fleet and gives vague orders, under estimating OTAs and takes unecessary risks with 2 logis, etc etc.
* war target incidents/griefing where folks shoot up triggers/logis.
* leeroy suicided cases where you misclicked and warped into a site without the rest of the fleet. * noob miscommunication where they shot up the wrong triggers.
* noob miscommunication where they failed to do a confirmation d-scan and warped into the wrong site (when the fleet is elsewhere).
* drama when logis/dps disconnect mid-fight when they decided they don't like someone.
.... etc. etc.
So really, run cheap and effective until such time you know the people you're flying with and have built up a reserve isk bank to cover your loses. When the time comes and you decide to invest in more expensive ships, yes, the T2/faction ships above are the current FOTM. Personally, I prefer Paladins/Bhaal for armor.
|
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
|
Posted - 2011.05.21 12:02:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Amar Azaph The thing about this fitting that i don't understand, Isn't there supposed to be a penalty for fitting two or more of the same things? 3x Imperial Navy Heat sink for example, three of them, surely there must be some sort of penalty? Two tracking computers etc etc
Yes, there is a penalty. Which stall making it advantageous to stack a number of modules that boost the same attribute. To some extent. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Althea Agathon
|
Posted - 2011.05.22 00:26:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Althea Agathon on 22/05/2011 00:26:34
Originally by: Crabs Collector Absolution, Paladin and Bhaalgorn are the best ships, depending on the fleet and what type of incursion youre doing.
This guy is correct.
Paladin is best IMO followed by Absolution and to a lesser extent the Bhaalgorn (long range webs are nice, but it doesn't put out enough damage). Armageddon Navy Issue is good, Abaddon is good but hard to make cap stable. Legion is OK if you can't fly an absolution or one of the better BSs.
For vanguard sites, you need at least 2 webs on a BS.
Please don't use a beam zealot.
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |