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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.05.29 02:10:00 -
[61]
CCP ignoring their customers for months on end?
Neva........
This is standard CCP now, they only listen to feedback after things fail.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.05.29 02:12:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Soden Rah on 29/05/2011 02:13:25
Originally by: Zoroa Aulx-Gao
Originally by: Soden Rah
Originally by: Zoroa Aulx-Gao
Also re-fitting/shipping will go like, dock > walk over to terminal, re-fit/ship, walk over to pod/click undock. Hardly qq worthy.
Talk about gross exaggeration.
no it will go like this; dock, wait for CQ to load, minimise all windows covering screen so you can see your char and the terminal, walk to terminal, click on terminal which now opens the fitting screen that recovers CQ, you decide you need a fit other than one you have stored so you open/un-minimise you items hanger, CQ is now totally invisible, you finish fitting your ship and simply hit the undock on the neocom. You never bother minimising your windows again and thus never see CQ except when really bored while docked and unable to ship spin.
You could probably arrange 1 to 4 windows comfortably while retaining the functionality of the CQ stuff, surely. If you're bored enough to ship spin you should probably just log off and go outside anyways.
I've yet to get onto duality and look for myself.
I run on 2560x1024 and still don't have enough space to use CQ properly without minimising all/most of the windows I need to actually do stuff I do in station. I 'could' make all the open windows smaller to give me enough space to just about make it work, and gimp myself in the process, but what's the point? All the new UI does is open the same old windows, but make it take longer to get in range of the buttons when I already have them duplicated on the neocom.
CCP would be much better off making CQ and WIS totally separate from flying in space, by having the regular hanger when you dock and then having a 'leave ship, enter CQ button' that put you in station. That way they wouldn't need to have the old neocom there at all. Leaving your pod to go walking about in station should be a different experience from being in pod and flying ships. It should take longer to do things, with you having to actually go places yourself and push buttons, there should be a disconnect.
but they can't do it while CQ is ALSO your hanger view because your supposed to be able to pretend your not in CQ at all and use everything like normal.
To make Incarna work they need a proper 3d UI working FIRST that lets you do everything you need to do in incarna in the 3d environment, so if you get information from a screen it is there ON the screen not in a pop-up window ect.
And it needs to be disconnected from flying in space, (different graphix settings, different window layout [still have chat windows?], different short-cuts etc...) so you can role-play the world they have built. and so when they put desirable content in incarna you have to weigh up the costs of leaving your pod. If something urgent happens you really will have to run all the way back to your quarters to get to your pod to undock.
This would fit in with the in game lore, keep Incarna optional, but hopefully desirable, and allow people to set different settings for the different environments and have different window layout for the different environments.
When you leave your pod to go walking in stations it should be for a reason, and you should be wanting to do different things while in the station rather than in your pod. Its in trying to get us to do both at the same time that it lands up doing neither well. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Da'iel Zehn
Caldari Sick Tight Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2011.05.29 02:17:00 -
[63]
I think its a bad choice to force a pod pilot to leave the pod everytime they dock. We should keep the current functionality of being docked in your ship.
Think about courier missions. We don't dock at a station to exit the pod, unload, enter the pod 5 seconds later.
I also think we should have the option to exit our pod when we wish and enter the CQ and station.
If its not optional, I think we'll have to roll up the short yellow bus to CCP headquarters. That is USA for "handicapped or mentally ******ed."
<3
--
Got a problem? Talk to my gun.
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.05.29 03:53:00 -
[64]
Crossposting a collection of good points in favor of making CQ optional, WHICH ARE NOT RELATED TO PERFORMANCE AND DO NOT INCLUDE WHINING:
Preface: I am not afraid of change. I have been looking forward to Incarna ever since it was first mentioned, before it even became known as WIS or Ambulation. What I am afraid of is a loss of immersion, which would be tragic as an effect of an expansion meant to increase immersion, and the high likelihood (at this point) that CQ will not live up to its potential simply because CCP is being stubborn and blinded by their excitement.
Originally by: Logan LaMort For once CCP, stop guessing at what people want and actually make some options available for users.
Originally by: Ciar Meara The thing that disturbs me most is the big "undock" button on the gantry. What is that supposed to do? From the video's shown so far we have some sort of "unpod" chamber. That is where we should have to go to interact with ships and pod. The gantry should be eyecandy for shipspinning (and perhaps later a lookout over the stationsactivities?).
Originally by: Mirabi Tiane
Originally by: Fix Lag There was one thing people asked to not have with Captain's Quarters, and that was being forced to use it instead of the hangar screen.
So of course it's going to replace the hangar screen.
YOU WERE DOING IT RIGHT.
NOW YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG.
I put it in nice big letters so you can't say you weren't told.
Quoted for justice. A capsuleer doesn't eject their pod from their ship and get out of their pod every time they dock. Some capsuleers probably stay in their pods 99% of the time. The following options MUST be implemented: [ ] Always show hangar when docking. [ ] Always show quarters when docking. [ ] Prompt to choose between hangar and quarters.
Originally by: Barakkus You don't though, you can just leave your character standing there and access the normal functions of being in station with the regular station UI.
The purpose of Incarna is enhancement of immersion. As a roleplayer, I foresee it damaging immersion if it is not made optional. Capsuleers do not get out of their pods every single time they dock. There are very few aspects of EVE's game mechanics that an immersionist has to "filter out" in order to maintain their immersion; CCP should not add another thing like that, especially when doing so would be ridiculously contrary to their own stated purposes and the solution is both utterly simple and completely harmless. |
Soma Khan
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.29 04:04:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Sarmatiko
Originally by: Culmen
I'm typing this up because the captains quarters have slowed down my in-station experience so much I have time while my damn fitting screen loads.
Hauler pilots for mining ops can't possibly like this. They have to wait for the environment to load, search around for the cargo hold button, and then open up the station hanger.
You mean macro miners and bot haulers now will have more problems? Good to hear!
Because on my 3 years old computer CQ loading faster than undock counter expires not to mention Duality is still work in progress and not optimized. It doesn't matter how fast you can refit ship or reload your cargo if you still can't undock in 30 seconds. CQ not related to this in any way, but you can keep whining.
you sound happy. now that your macro competition with substandard hardware are in trouble your rmt operation will finally take off __
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Culmen
Caldari Vigrior The Dominion Empire
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Posted - 2011.05.29 07:40:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Da'iel Zehn Edited by: Da''iel Zehn on 29/05/2011 02:23:05
I think its a bad choice to force a pod pilot to leave the pod everytime they dock. We should keep the current functionality of being docked in your ship.
Think about courier missions. We don't dock at a station to exit the pod, unload, enter the pod 5 seconds later.
I also think we should have the option to exit our pod when we wish and enter the CQ and station.
If its not optional...
Never really saw it as an immersion breaker, you bring up a good point.
My biggest beef with CQ is this, if you don't like ship spinning, you uncheck the load station environment box and save some cycles. If you don't like CQ, well you just have to suck it.
I don't see any realistic reason why such a feature should not exist. All the negative responses have been variation on "Bitter-vet detected, quit playing now" or "It's not that bad"
Let me pose this question to you, why do you fear such a feature? Please tell me, I'm interested.
and further more why do i even need a sig? |
FuzzyLogik360
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.29 09:11:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Culmen I don't see any realistic reason why such a feature should not exist.
All the negative responses have been variation on "Bitter-vet detected, quit playing now" or "It's not that bad"
Let me pose this question to you, why do you fear such a feature? Please tell me, I'm interested.
I think it's a bit strong to claim that all whines are from "bitter-vets". Rather, I think there are a great deal of sensible, both casual and serious, players who just want a little something called FLEXIBILITY.
Enforcing CQ is not flexibility.
While I agree that loading times are not really an issue (toolbar UI is still accessible while CQ loads), I think this completely misses the point. CQ, once up and running, is a signifcant drain on the GPU and for older machines* this will be an issue.
Ok, so "just turn down the graphics" I hear you all cry. Ok sure, but then that will completely render the CQ "immersion" experience completely pointless - which is exactly what CCP don't want.
I favour the old docking station view as default, with a shiny button that says "Enter Captains Quarters". Problem solved, and many on this thread have already suggested this excellent idea so it has support.
Perhaps when CCP get round to adding more "walking in station" content, will this feature actually have a proper use. Until then, please don't enforce this pointless feature upon us**.
*Actually it isn't just older machines that will be affected. Currently I have a fairly good GPU, but I under-clock it to reduce heat output. CQ is an unwanted complication in that equation.
**Just to clarify, I like CQ, but not at the moment as it seems rather redundant. Looking ahead I am keen to see it working properly, which is why I have taken the time to submit a bug-report on some graphical issues I encountered.
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Dante Marcellus
Minmatar Nightmare Brigade
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Posted - 2011.05.29 09:38:00 -
[68]
You know what would really be funny though? If everyone at CCP were atheist. And if you're reading this, you've fallen into a signature trap. You owe me 1m ISK. |
Kappas Katamara
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Posted - 2011.05.29 09:56:00 -
[69]
Good news is it will cripple botters that were using vmware to run multiple clients. Swings and roundabouts.
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Saint Schala
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2011.05.29 10:27:00 -
[70]
i just want to play internet spaceships!
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MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2011.05.29 10:44:00 -
[71]
Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 29/05/2011 10:48:36
Originally by: Scorpii Orion Look bitter vets, world is changing. Adapt.
Look little peon, it's got nothing to do with change and not wanting to deal with it. Grow some brains.
People are concerned because right now docking at a station to get **** done is fast, reliable and pretty. That'll no longer be the case come Incarna because devs are not thinking stuff through.
It doesn't make sense to load up the CQ every single time you dock at a station. What is actually supposed to happen is: You dock, see the hangar view as it is right now, click a button, enter CQ. First login for a newbie starts in the CQ for the tutorial and ****. Why in the hell would I exit my pod to dump my cargo every single time I dock at a station? Waste of time and pod goo. It doesn't make sense from a lore perspective *and* from a gamedesign perspective.
CQ is great. The way it works right now isn't. It kills the hangar view. I like the hangar view. Why take it away?
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Deviana Sevidon
Gallente Panta-Rhei Butterfly Effect Alliance
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Posted - 2011.05.29 10:54:00 -
[72]
Atheist here and I have enough of the CQ whine threads.
Quote: Disclaimer: All mentioned above contains my opinion and is therefore an absolute truth (for me anyway, my universe, muhahaha.....ok, done
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Shade Millith
Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2011.05.29 11:32:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Vice Admiral Spreadsheet Furthermore, those who disable CQ will never, ever enable it again. Deal with it.
This is an amazing revelation.
Those of use who will deliberately turn off the useless fluff because we don't want the useless fluff, will never, ever re-enable the useless fluff.
/Supported
I didn't like the idea of CQ when I heard about it, and I don't like it now.
You like it, go ahead. Just don't include me in this. ------------------------
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SketS47
Minmatar Alpha Intellectual Military Solutions Alpha Intergalactic Mythogenesis
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Posted - 2011.05.29 11:40:00 -
[74]
/Not signed!
Change is for the better, stop crying!
Let CCP create the world they invision! Only idiots quote themselves -SketS47- |
Adunh Slavy
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Posted - 2011.05.29 11:42:00 -
[75]
/signed
Please make it optional for me to not be subjected to subtle Aurum advertising.
Oh wait, no wonder it is not optional.
The Real Space Initiative - V7
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Black Dranzer
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.29 11:47:00 -
[76]
The reason the CQ interface loads by default and can't be disabled is most likely because they want to encourage you to use it but they know full well that there's no real reason to use it. If they thought they could get away with removing the regular interface entirely without the existing playerbase ****ting itself, they would.
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Jada Maroo
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Posted - 2011.05.29 11:49:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Black Dranzer The reason the CQ interface loads by default and can't be disabled is most likely because they want to encourage you to use it but they know full well that there's no real reason to use it. If they thought they could get away with removing the regular interface entirely without the existing playerbase ****ting itself, they would.
There's an easy way to get people to use it AND make them re-buy things they've lost.
ADD GUNS!
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.05.29 11:59:00 -
[78]
Originally by: SketS47 /Not signed!
Change is for the better, stop crying!
Let CCP create the world they invision!
CCP are, by making CQ a replacement for the hanger instead of as originally promised and envisioned the next step after the hanger. Forcing themselves to do a load of extra coding and work to try to make CQ run silently in the background so those who just want to dock and change fits don't get slowed down, and so it simultaneously runs TWO UI's at the same time.
This is not only unnecessary time spent that could have been spent on something else but means that the end product will be something trying to be all things to all people which is impossible.
If they had simply made CQ an option after docking once in the hanger as originally promised, no-one would be particularly worried about it.
As it is it does take more resources than the old hanger, it does mean that if ever a patch causes a failure of Incarna people will be stuck every time they try to dock.
It does mean that those who care about immersion will be stuck wondering how the hell these mighty pod pilots who disdain the very idea of leaving their pods somehow land up dressed and pressed and walking around 5 seconds after docking every time they dock.
And to cap it off the new UI, as is, is totally useless as the buttons in the environment just open windows that cover that environment.
So all in all, We are not crying, Not all change is for the better, This isn't CCP's original vision, thus their vision is flexible and can be changed, they asked for our feedback, and you are a troll. Good day. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Better Than You
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Posted - 2011.05.29 12:06:00 -
[79]
I am all for Captain Quarters and it being default is a good idea. If EVE-Online is to have any chance to compete with other MMORPGs out there like World of Warcraft, we need something that will attract players away from those games to this game. Captains Quarters is the first step in the right direction.
The sooner you mouth breathing, still living in your grandmothers basement, dwellers realize there is more to this game that over hyped PvP the better off you will be.
- **Friendship will always trump the desire to fight!** |
Calathea Sata
State War Academy
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Posted - 2011.05.29 12:14:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Better Than You I am all for Captain Quarters and it being default is a good idea. If EVE-Online is to have any chance to compete with other MMORPGs out there like World of Warcraft, we need something that will attract players away from those games to this game. Captains Quarters is the first step in the right direction.
The sooner you mouth breathing, still living in your grandmothers basement, dwellers realize there is more to this game that over hyped PvP the better off you will be.
But your name is still wrong.
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ExcalibursTemplar
Caldari Citadel Enterprises
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Posted - 2011.05.29 13:34:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Better Than You I am all for Captain Quarters and it being default is a good idea. If EVE-Online is to have any chance to compete with other MMORPGs out there like World of Warcraft, we need something that will attract players away from those games to this game. Captains Quarters is the first step in the right direction.
The sooner you mouth breathing, still living in your grandmothers basement, dwellers realize there is more to this game that over hyped PvP the better off you will be.
Eve is an incredibly complicated game that can litterally take years of skilling up and learning to be effective in certain roles. So just by its very nature Eve will always be a niche game. It doesnt matter how much eye candy is added to eve not many people are going to be willing to invest all those years into eve.
Incarna and walking in stations might get more people to try the game. Once they realize though how incredibly hard Eve is and how they will never be able to catch up to older players. They'll just unistall the game and put in down to Eve being to crazy hardcore. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.05.29 13:51:00 -
[82]
Originally by: SketS47 Change is for the better, stop crying!
So when you get your legs cut off in a freak boating accident, you'll stop crying too, because change is for the better, right? When CCP turns removes the trinity engine and moves back to DX7, it will be for the better because it's a change, right?
No. Change is not for the better. Good change is for the better. Removing options in a game ù especially one where you're meant to have a high degree of control over your gaming experience ù is never good.
Quote: Let CCP create the world they invision!
You mean a world where we are semi-immortals with the power to destroy worlds and with zero regard for the irrelevant wills of the podless insectsà a world where, for some reason, Scotty suddenly forces us to unpod every time we dock and we have no ability to exterminate him and his entire bloodline for his impudence.
The world CCP envisions would include the option not to leave your ship. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2011.05.29 16:52:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Jada Maroo
Originally by: Black Dranzer The reason the CQ interface loads by default and can't be disabled is most likely because they want to encourage you to use it but they know full well that there's no real reason to use it. If they thought they could get away with removing the regular interface entirely without the existing playerbase ****ting itself, they would.
There's an easy way to get people to use it AND make them re-buy things they've lost.
ADD GUNS!
Well, or any kind of content, actually.
I can't believe the general hostility in this thread at a simple request to add an option to stay in your ship. ...
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.29 17:20:00 -
[84]
Reasons to sort of maybe like CQ:
* it MIGHT provide newcomers with a sense of "identity" with their characters - can be achieved even if CQ is optional, as long as it's enabled by default
* it MIGHT eventually have some purpose beyond giving you a chance to look at your avatar move around - but right now, it doesn't
* it gives CCP time to finetune and testdrive the tech for when Incarna hits - but for the love of god, why make it mandatory from the start as opposed to just optional ? do you really think it's THAT horrible that most people would turn it off ? then WHY LAUNCH IT now if you're aware it's so crappy ?!?
Reasons to DISLIKE CQ as seen on Duality at this time: (some of those will hopefully go away or be less bad, but I would not put my hopes up ; that is, not even considering bugs that need to be fixed, just stuff that's "wrong")
* THERE IS NO SEPARATE GRAPHICS DETAIL SETTING for CQ and the space part - at the same graphics settings, the FPS is even worse than the character creator/recustomisation, and much lower than the current hangar view - this means either than you get horrible FPS (on older machines) EACH AND EVERY TIME YOU ARE DOCKED, or for newer machines, you're heating up your graphics card for no good reason
* at this time, the lighting is all "wrong" - the shadows are way too hard, the light comes in at the oddest of angles, characters generally look horrible in almost any location inside the CQ except a few select places ; not that the character creator itself had it much better, pretty much the same problems (HEY, CCP DEVS, ever heard of ambient/diffuse/scattered light levels ? you might want to ramp them higher than practically zero, and you might want to ramp down the spotlight levels) - here's a thought, if your artsy project looks worse illumination-wise than snapshots taken at random by a person with a decent digital camera everywhere he's walking around (where there's no professional to set up the lights, and you just take whatever's there), than you NEED TO WORK ON YOUR LIGHTING SYSTEM SOME MORE
* the camera positions are restrictive - there's actually just ONE zoom level (no zoom in, no zoom out) and two panning positions (character centered is not even the default, character on the left of the screen is). Well, at least you can rotate the camera at will, haw haw haw. /facepalm
* the characters FEEL artificial when moving. VERY artificial. You couldn't notice it in the character creator, because the characters were standings still, but when characters move around in CQ, it feels ALMOST like you're controlling a very fresh and somewhat limber zombie, not a living, breathing human being. The gait is all wrong, the shoulders don't move, the arms don't flap right, and a zillion other little things. AND FOR THE LOVE OF JEEBUS, DAMMIT, CHARACTER, MOVE FASTER THAN A LEISURELY STROLL THROUGH THE PARK. Oh, and there's no "fine movement", it's all sit still in your small almost grid-like space or move at full (very slow) speed. It just "feels" wrong. And it's responding poorly to controls anyway. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Nuhm DeAra
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Posted - 2011.05.29 17:27:00 -
[85]
For the love of flying spaghetti monster!
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Doc Fury
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.29 17:29:00 -
[86]
They are forcing CQ down our throats simply because someone at CCP finally realized that making it optional (like they have been telling us for years) would mean more people would opt-out then they are comfortable with. Supporting more than one station environment is also hard to justify when all your coders are working on other stuff, and you are short on cash.
Where else would CCP then get paying beta testers for CQ if a majority of us opted-out?
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.' |
Rakamy
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Posted - 2011.05.29 17:29:00 -
[87]
Supported, I don't want to have to run to my console every time I want to refit my ship. Nothing wrong with the way the interface is now |
Kaede Kimura
Epsilon Inc STORM.
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Posted - 2011.05.29 17:43:00 -
[88]
Didn't read anything but OP, but I just want to say that this game is going to evolve as the devs plan to to keep it running forever. System requirements are going to go up and you will have to deal with it if you want to continue. |
Fore Khaos
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Posted - 2011.05.29 17:56:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Deviana Sevidon Atheist here and I have enough of the CQ whine threads.
Jesus loves you.
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Geddings
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Posted - 2011.05.29 18:08:00 -
[90]
I think as others here most likely have already said I believe that it will be optional and the old environment will still be able to be loaded.
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