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Seminole Sun
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Posted - 2011.06.04 16:30:00 -
[1]
The salvage market is pretty inextricably broken. The fact that there's very limited regionalization to the components combined with the fact that certain rigs are inferior to others makes certain bits of salvage essentially worthless.
At the same time, we have a relatively (but not completely) unhealthy PI market with relative stagnation.
I propose permitting limited, relatively inefficient alchemy to convert upper end PI products and T1 salvage to be converted into T2 salvage. I would suggest that they should also not be done as strict upgrades (I.E don't convert tripped power circuits into Power Circuits).
Pros: introduces some market economics and opportunities for emergent game play (a system with a certain type of spawn that has a higher preponderance of dropping a certain salvage at the same time with a certain planet that allows easy production of a certain P3 product, etc)
Cons: It cracks the "immersion" a little bit when I look and see that the recipe for Power Circuits is 1000 Broken Drone Tranceivers and 50 genetically enhanced livestock... what are they doing? peeing on it?
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Adunh Slavy
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Posted - 2011.06.04 16:39:00 -
[2]
Introducing substitution into the economic landscape would help Eve's economy be less two dimensional. However, with out an accompanying adjustment in demand, substitution will simply increase prices in one area and lower them in another until there is a new equilibrium. Also, it would reduce volatility in those markets.
Less volatility, though perhaps good for producers and consumers, would impact large segments of Eve and reduce opportunity for lots of players that do the traditional entrepreneurial task of speculation and transport - "traders" if you will. Granted I have a vested interest in the trade profession of Eve, but on a more objective note, reduction in player options in a sandbox is not a good thing.
So if you can also suggest a way to increase demand, and perhaps more complimentary goods that can not be satisfied with substitution effects, so as to maintain the necessary market volatility, then substitution might be a good thing.
The Real Space Initiative - V7
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Seminole Sun
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Posted - 2011.06.04 17:27:00 -
[3]
I'll give some thoughts to increasing demand. I'm not sure I grant your premise that the market would be less volatile however. The salvage market has pretty much zero volatility (other than downward). I think the PI market would become MORE volatile not less as some form of alchemy was introduced.
The other component that would be incredibly useful is greater regionalization of everything... but that's a longer term dream of mine ;)
I may take a stab at looking at what PI items and what salvage items might be convertable.
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Melchiades Seti
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Posted - 2011.06.04 22:23:00 -
[4]
Most of this is beyond my perview, but you mention something very important. Regionalization of products. It is essential to a diverse economy, and would add depths to hauling (importing/exporting)that would add so many interesting aspects. (Monopolies, control of territory, etc.) I hadn't given it much thought before. I hope the developers look into it.
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Seminole Sun
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Posted - 2011.06.05 03:32:00 -
[5]
There's some regionalization but, sadly, not enough.
The act that kernite and plagioclase are spread out means that isogen and pyerite are slightly regionalized... but it's not significant (especially since a single freighter can pretty much supply an entire region worth of isogen).
PI isn't nearly as regionalized as it could/should be... but at least its created some strategic "geography" to an otherwise flat landscape.
i agree that more regionalization would be great.
IIRC, there was a time when the major empire regions were all seperated by low-sec... i'm not certain that going back to that wouldn't be a bad thing.
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Vierego
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Posted - 2011.06.05 04:08:00 -
[6]
One thing that can be done to improve is give the specialized items a boost for rigs.
I understand there are stacking penalties, but if I am trying to maixmize cap, and I have a shield boat with actives, Im always going to choose CCC or one of the other ones, besides the shield one that reduces amount shield hardeners take.
I buy mission loot in bulk at above buy order prices! (sinq laison) |
Avraham Avinu
Children of Noah
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Posted - 2011.06.05 04:25:00 -
[7]
Wouldn't alchemy from T1 to T2 products make T1 rigs almost the same in price to T2 rigs then?
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Florestan Bronstein
draketrain Test Alliance Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.06.05 08:43:00 -
[8]
perfect substitutes are dead-boring.
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Seminole Sun
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Posted - 2011.06.05 12:47:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Avraham Avinu Wouldn't alchemy from T1 to T2 products make T1 rigs almost the same in price to T2 rigs then?
If the conversion was cheap (like 10-1) it would... but I was thinking of something significantly more expensive. Something like
100 Fried Interface Circuits + 30 Genetically Enhanced Livestock + 1 Hermetic Membrane Yields 1 blahblah
Refine 1 blahblah to get 1 Power Circuit and 9 Tripped Power Circuits
With the current market, that would cost about 300,000 to create something costing 2mil... but as the Fried Interface Circuits came off the market (in huge quantities) that margin would shrink back to the standard 5-20%
Some of the alchemies wouldn't be touched at all most likely... But some of them would get used regularly
A new "Alchemy" skill could be added to to make it more interesting (effecting the current alchemy reactions as well)
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Tobiaz
Spacerats
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Posted - 2011.06.20 11:45:00 -
[10]
Spreading out the required types of salvage for producing a rig over more types then the current three will probably help the salvage market as well.
Currently salvage blueprints only require three types of salvage materials, so the huge demand for rigs like Trimarks, Rigors and CCC cause a bottleneck in salvage like Armor Plates and Tripped Power Circuits while a lot others aren't even worth picking up.
I also support the idea of making T2 salvage out of of T1 salvage and maybe some additional materials. I think it will help some of the lacking prices for T1 salvage while tempering the prices for T2.
But it should be an ineffective process in materials, production time and required skills. Not meant as the sole supplier for T2 salvage, but more as a check on prices.
Localization of salvage is also a nice idea. I'm have a bit of gut feeling that this already the case to some extent, with Guristas being a lousy source of Armor Plates in my experience. But it probably could use a bit more work so it becomes a bit more pronounced and noticable.
Aside from some industry dabbling, I'm no expert on production, but I am quite intimate with the salvage market and I think it could use some serious tweaking from team BFF.
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