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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.09 21:49:00 -
[1]
I am planning to start doing some PVP and wanted to know what would be best for me to (as a noob to it) gain skill (actual not SP)that would be best utilized;
- Drake - trained to run just about any fit on a Drake - BlackBird - can run the fit below and have decent ECM skills to make it work - just no practical knowledge
What would be my best initial ship to make this transition?
I am going to continue to mission in High Sec in my Drake until I get better at PVP.
[Blackbird, BlackBird] Signal Distortion Amplifier II 800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Y-S8 Hydrocarbon I Afterburners F-90 Positional Sensor Subroutines, Targeting Range ECM - Spatial Destabilizer II ECM - Phase Inverter II ECM - Ion Field Projector II ECM - White Noise Generator II
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Auto Targeting System II
Medium Particle Dispersion Augmentor I Medium Particle Dispersion Projector I Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
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Wensley
Minmatar Gunpoint Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.06.10 12:46:00 -
[2]
I would honestly tell you that neither of these ships will really help you gain "skill". Sure, you'll be able to sit in a gang and shoot/jam targets to order but you won't learn a lot more. If you want to be developing skill then your best bet is to look at skirmishing ships. Either tackling frigates or heavier nanoHACs and battlecruisers. You will learn so much more doing this than in an ECM boat or brick Drake.
That said the Drake can make a very competent PvP ship and, especially in the nanoconfiguration, will help you learn a lot about PvP. Not so convinced by that Blackbird fit but I know pretty much nothing about ECM and don't have EFT to mess around with it.
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Makko Gray
Nexus Aerospace Corporation
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Posted - 2011.06.10 13:28:00 -
[3]
You're not going to have much luck in that blackbird. If the target can warp away they most likely will unless they can kill you, and then you'd be stuffed.
If you're exclusively caldari trained maybe try fitting out a Kestrel or Merlin to start, or if you want to risk a bit more work on a Caracal or Moa.
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Cephelange du'Krevviq
Caldari Seventh Exploration and Engagement Command
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Posted - 2011.06.10 13:40:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Cephelange du''Krevviq on 10/06/2011 13:42:09 Everything I've read suggests that a Blackbird is not a solo PvP boat. If you try to fit a point, you are getting too close and gimping your jamming capabilities.
Drakes are fairly forgiving for the new PvP-er. I say this as someone that is new to PvP, myself.
Depending on your skills/preference, you may like this fit for a Drake (I can't use T2 launchers yet):
[Drake, HAM PvP] Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Damage Control II Type-D Power Core Modification: Reaction Control
Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Scrambler II F-90 Positional Sensor Subroutines
XT-2800 Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile XT-2800 Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile XT-2800 Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile XT-2800 Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile XT-2800 Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile XT-2800 Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile XT-2800 Heavy Assault Missile Launcher I, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile [empty high slot]
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior I x5
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Mona X
Caldari Missions Mining and Mayhem Merciless.
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Posted - 2011.06.10 14:06:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Delucian I am planning to start doing some PVP and wanted to know what would be best for me to (as a noob to it) gain skill (actual not SP)that would be best utilized;
- Drake - trained to run just about any fit on a Drake - BlackBird - can run the fit below and have decent ECM skills to make it work - just no practical knowledge
What would be my best initial ship to make this transition?
Rifter.
Join Eve-Online, meet interesting people, grief them.1 |
Othran
Brutor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.06.10 14:09:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Othran on 10/06/2011 14:10:34 Do people actually use T2 racial jammers? I've never seen anything other than meta 4 racials due to their reduced cap usage. Edit heh its got an AB too - not good.
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achoura
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Posted - 2011.06.10 14:21:00 -
[7]
Tbf, I've killed a ratting raven in a 0.1 system just to see if I could. Sometimes comedy fits work well. Ccp must have though so when they buffed the rook. ***The EVE servers and their patches***
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Loey Lloyd
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Posted - 2011.06.10 14:32:00 -
[8]
Hey I run a PVP training Corp, if you're looking for some help with ship choices, fittings, and PVP mechanics, send me a message in game. Our pilots learn to kill solo and in groups of two within a day or two.
Also, Drake is great. Maybe try to fit up a couple Merlins as well.
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.10 14:56:00 -
[9]
Loey, I will try to contact you in game when I get back into town.
I would prefer the Drake due to my skills (nano not a brick).
I want to keep my PVP'ing on the cheap side, so Merlin/Kestrel/Drake are better for me (so I will fit some up).
I have another buddy who wants to do this too, so we will not be doing it solo.
I tried out the Blackbird last night with my bud and was marginally successful. However, I had to have 3 jammers running to lock him out (T2 assalt ship).
I probably need the training Loey noted first. Will definitely be in contact.
Thanks all.
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NoLimit Soldier
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Posted - 2011.06.10 15:23:00 -
[10]
1. Join a PVP corp. 2. Stop using caldari. 3. Never, ever, ever, try to solo in a blackbird unless its a 1vs1 and you have a rack full of their racial jammers.
While everyone on here will suggest using the drake as its a good pvp ship is right in theory, but wrong in practice. Drakes are almost never soloed. All you will get is people you can't catch or ganks. You have to understand you will look like bait to the others, they will bring friends.
Train a different race and use ships that can actually win in their class (that don't look like bait) (Rifter/Incursus/Rupture/Vexor/etc.)
PvP has a pretty steep learning curve and there is no way to get over the hump without 1. joining a pvp corp, or 2. losing ALOT of ships.
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.11 03:05:00 -
[11]
So, after reading the above, doing a bit more research and considering my core skills, I would prefer to run a missile boat.
I am taking to heart what is noted here about using a Drake. So, taking the low cost entry level approach, I am considering the Kestrel and the Maledicton. However, I would like to run webbers and rockets. Is this foolhearty for just getting in to PVP? Do I need the range of standard missiles?
I used to fly the Kestrel, early in, and liked it. I have been using a rocket based Hookbill for some missions and really liked it. I guess what I need to know is being less than 10km out in a PVP fight a problem?
Also, not planning in doing this alone. So no, or very little, solo.
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Makko Gray
Nexus Aerospace Corporation
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Posted - 2011.06.11 06:45:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Delucian ...I guess what I need to know is being less than 10km out in a PVP fight a problem?
Also, not planning in doing this alone. So no, or very little, solo.
A lot of people will be looking at fighting at 10km and under particularly if they're using warp scrams as they'll need to be in this range to shut down MWDs, personally I like a weapon that allows me to be equally effective at 25km as I am at 5km mainly so that I be sure to apply DPS whenever I'm in warp disrupt or scram distance but that's not aways possible so failing that being able to control range is the better option which means being the quickest, both in raw speed and in reaction time.
Also if you're not soloing then the blackbird fit becomes more viable. But blackbird in itself is a support role. Best thing to do is play with a few different fits, price ways that will be cheaper on the wallet with frigs and cruisers at first if your wallets not fat enough to support the lose of the more expensive ship classes.
And if you share fits also try and share what ship you friend(s) will be in as it will help people look at your fit in context.
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Rebbecca Black
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Posted - 2011.06.11 12:19:00 -
[13]
Honestly if I were you, I'd get into a corp that does small gang ops in order to learn. People who chest beat and talk about 1v1's are living in a fantasy land. If you're getting into a 1v1, you're doing it wrong, and the guy you're fighting is doing it wrong. Always stack the deck in your favor. That's not to say it won't happen when you're dodging gate camps in 0.0 and have to fight off an interceptor or cane, but once you actually get the experience flying, and understand how your opponents are fitted and how they're going to engage you, 1v1's lose their luster.
Fly with an FC that has a fair amount of experience. Shop corps, lurk their killboards, find a corp that actively is fighting opponents who don't have fail-mails. You will learn more from staying quiet in the corner and soaking up the tidbits of information the FC throws around than sitting in a rifter and just hitting your head against a wall for a few hours. RvB might be a good place to look for starting out, and Faction Warfare might be another possibility.
-Learn to mitigate your opponents damage through piloting -Learn your enemy combatants roles, and how they're going to engage you -Plan ahead and counter your opponents before you ever even undock
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.11 12:29:00 -
[14]
Ok, I can understand the range management concept. And if I am warp scrambling someone I will need to be close (so rockets would work), but that leads me to two questions;
1. Since I am paper thin and speed tanking do people use webs often in PVP? 2. If I need to use range more effectively, then it seems that the use of a HM boat would be more effective.
Course, as you say, I guess it depends in the role I am in. I guess I need to pick a role to play in PVP.
Last question; if I use a rocket based Kestrel, with a web, is it fast enough with am MWD and strong enough to web and hold a ship while I others take it out?
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.11 13:43:00 -
[15]
Nevermind, I did some more research and answered my own questions.
Going to start with the Kestrel rocket and web fit and work my way into other stuff. It should be a good cheap platform fo what I want to do.
Thanks for the help.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2011.06.12 10:25:00 -
[16]
Starting out small is the way forward. PVP is an entirely different set of reflexes. Later on - I find the Drake is one of the best Caldari Pvp choices. Blackbird is excellent, provided you have a gang to support with it. Otherwise it's toast.
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.12 13:41:00 -
[17]
Ok, I decided on using the Kestrel for now. Please tell me how I can improve on this setup. My concern is that it is paper thin, but it is completely stable. Should I opt for some shield modules instead?
[Kestrel, Kestral] Cross-linked Bolt Array I Cross-linked Bolt Array I
Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Micro Brief Capacitor Overcharge I, Cap Booster 25
'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket
Small Bay Loading Accelerator I Small Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I [empty rig slot]
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.12 15:20:00 -
[18]
Ok, I need some help with this fit;
The micro cap booster is crazy expensive, a small I do not have grid for.
What do I need to change?
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.12 15:40:00 -
[19]
Reworked this a bit so that it all fit. My main question is, while I expect that a microwarp is needed, the AB keeps my signature small and hard to hit. In PVP is that more reasonable than a MWD (especially considering that I might get scrammed)?
I swapped the Ballistic Controler as it gave me 12 only a bit more damage for a Nanofiber II to increase my speed.
Am I off track?
[Kestrel, Kestral] Cross-linked Bolt Array I Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Small Shield Extender II
'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Arbalest' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket
Small Bay Loading Accelerator I Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I [empty rig slot]
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Cephelange du'Krevviq
Caldari Seventh Exploration and Engagement Command
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Posted - 2011.06.12 19:52:00 -
[20]
[Kestrel, Rocket-Fu (PvP)] Micro Auxiliary Power Core I Damage Control II
Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters Warp Scrambler II Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
'Malkuth' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Malkuth' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Malkuth' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket 'Malkuth' Rocket Launcher I, Caldari Navy Thorn Rocket
Small Core Defence Field Extender I Small Core Defence Field Extender I Small Core Defence Field Extender I
Try this.
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Delucian
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Posted - 2011.06.12 21:01:00 -
[21]
Ok, I will try anything as I am getting chewed to pieces even testing this setup in PVE.
One question - Why Malkuth's over Arablast? I noticed that in almost every build, but cant figure out why.
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Cephelange du'Krevviq
Caldari Seventh Exploration and Engagement Command
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Posted - 2011.06.13 01:31:00 -
[22]
I'm sure I had a good reason when I built it; I think Malkuths were what I had on hand.
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